Sword-thain

[Strategian 20]

Several allies have text that reads, "At the end of the round, discard [name] from play." Would transforming them from ally into hero with Sword-thain cancel that effect?

[cmabr002 292]

No, they would still be discarded from play. 

[PocketWraith 553]

To elaborate, they would still be discarded because the effect telling you to discard them refers to them by name without any mention of whether they're a hero or an ally. Ally Elrond or ally Galadriel are still Elrond and Galadriel regardless of you playing Sword-Thain on them, and the text simply says "At the end of the round, discard Elrond/Galadriel from play."

 

By contrast if you put an ally into play with Sneak Attack or To me! O my kinsfolk! during the Planning phase then play Sword-Thain on them they would remain in play because the text on both those cards specifically says "if the ally is still in play", so if they become a hero it doesn't trigger.

[Lecitadin 282]

To elaborate, they would still be discarded because the effect telling you to discard them refers to them by name without any mention of whether they're a hero or an ally. Ally Elrond or ally Galadriel are still Elrond and Galadriel regardless of you playing Sword-Thain on them, and the text simply says "At the end of the round, discard Elrond/Galadriel from play."

 

By contrast if you put an ally into play with Sneak Attack or To me! O my kinsfolk! during the Planning phase then play Sword-Thain on them they would remain in play because the text on both those cards specifically says "if the ally is still in play", so if they become a hero it doesn't trigger.

 Like ally Beorn... in play for 1 resource!!!

 

Did not think of that effect... genius!!!!

Edited December 23, 2015 by Lecitadin

[PocketWraith 553]

To elaborate, they would still be discarded because the effect telling you to discard them refers to them by name without any mention of whether they're a hero or an ally. Ally Elrond or ally Galadriel are still Elrond and Galadriel regardless of you playing Sword-Thain on them, and the text simply says "At the end of the round, discard Elrond/Galadriel from play."

 

By contrast if you put an ally into play with Sneak Attack or To me! O my kinsfolk! during the Planning phase then play Sword-Thain on them they would remain in play because the text on both those cards specifically says "if the ally is still in play", so if they become a hero it doesn't trigger.

 Like ally Beorn... in play for 1 resource!!!

 

Did not think of that effect... genius!!!!

5 resources with the cost of Sword-thain as well. It's a neat trick, to be sure, but it's still something you should only really do if you're definitely going to be getting use out of having that ally be a hero.

[Lecitadin 282]

I tought Sword-thain was a 1 resource card. Well, then, like you said, you'd better put it on an ally that's worth it. Ally Gimly (comboed with Dain Ironfoot) comes in mind.

[PsychoRocka 1,189]

Yeah I think ally Gimli is potentially the best target for this combo. In sphere with sneak attack, worth making a hero with his stats and inbuilt readying (can boost both his attack or defense and willpower with hero only attachments but still get use from both) and you can always use more leadership resources! 

[Sin21 8]

So up to now i can think of a few ways to get out your 4th hero first turn.

• Arwen/Grima with Sneak Attack and Treasures of Gondor(you need a gondor hero)
• in 2 handed one Player could Play with reinforcements allowing the other Player to sword-thain any ally brought into Play
• Arwen and Caldara in a typical Caldara deck

Edited December 24, 2015 by Sin21

[NathanH 350]

The ally needs to be Unique, so of the ones you can cheat in for free, Emery is the only candidate I think.

 

Legacy of Numenor can provide the required resources.

[cmabr002 292]

You can also try getting Sword-thain into play for free with Well-equipped

[Seastan 1,324]

You can also try getting Sword-thain into play for free with Well-equipped

 

I am really itching to get my hands on Sword Thain. My Caldara deck already runs Stargazer, Well Equipped, and Bofur, making it the perfect setup for this.

[Seastan 1,324]

 

So up to now i can think of a few ways to get out your 4th hero first turn.

• Arwen/Grima with Sneak Attack and Treasures of Gondor(you need a gondor hero)
• in 2 handed one Player could Play with reinforcements allowing the other Player to sword-thain any ally brought into Play
• Arwen and Caldara in a typical Caldara deck

 

 

If you have both Arwen and Grima, all it takes is Henamarth and Sword Thain in your opening hand to get it into play. In this case though you are really only going to be using his hero status for resource generation rather than stats, so might as well just play Resourceful.

[Sin21 8]

 

You can also try getting Sword-thain into play for free with Well-equipped

 

I am really itching to get my hands on Sword Thain. My Caldara deck already runs Stargazer, Well Equipped, and Bofur, making it the perfect setup for this.

 

 

But if you quest succesfully i think you would still have to return him to your Hand right?

So you would have to quest unsuccesfully.(shouldnt be too hard in single Player)

[Lecitadin 282]

Sword-thain : FINALY a card that will make Brok Ironfist awesome. 

[Sin21 8]

the day they release *Dwarf Friend* will be the day of Brok.

He will be awesome and he will say: I came back to you now, at the turn of the tide.

Jay..

[PocketWraith 553]

Dwarf-friend on Caldara!

There is already stuff you can do if you really want Brok to work, but it may get a bit convoluted.

 

Sword-thain isn't necessarily that great for him though. True, you could Sword-thain an ally then kill them to bring in Brok, but you'd probably be better off just keeping the Sword-thained ally you already had.

[Slothgodfather 270]

The main issue with Sword Thain is the resource cost.  If your doing it just for more resources, Resourceful is a better option and takes 4 turns to pay for itself.  However, if your deck typically generates plenty of resources, you could use ST on your friend's unique ally to help with their resource generation - something you can't do with Resourceful.  

 

It also seems like it would be neat in a Caldara focused deck.  Giving you access to 3x allies every time you trigger her and still 3x resources when she isn't immediately rezzed. 

 

Merry (tactics) and Pippin both get stronger if you add another hobbit hero to the pack.  Make Farmer Maggot a hero with Sam, Merry and Pippin on the Fellowship Saga and you've got 5 hobbit heroes...  Could be a lot of fun, especially for solo.

 

 

There are a few attachments that can only go on heroes, but if your including them it's likely you already have regular heroes for your chosen targets to receive those attachments.  There are a few that could be considered.  Healing Herbs comes to mind since you typically don't want to pay the cost of exhausting a hero to include this card.  It could make it more bearable.  But healing is already so efficient, I can't see that happening.  Keeping Count could become more useful since I typically only have 1 hero that attacks anyways, adding ST to someone mid-late game and another Keeping Count could be a serious boost to attack/dmg.  More targets for Love of Tales maybe?

 

It also gives a few more targets for beneficial events that only hit heroes but also makes a few events - like Advanced Warning - potentially harder to play.

 

I like the idea of making Gwaihir a Sword Thain and then giving him Support of the Eagles.   That's a ton of cards for little effect, but it is amusing at least.

Edited December 29, 2015 by Slothgodfather

[Seastan 1,324]

Not that it needs it, but I guess it makes the Gandalf-Elrond deck even stronger, since you can get Sword Thain out for free with Vilya or Well-Equipped, and it would open up another sphere for playing cards from the hand. 

[krokodiler 24]

(...)

 

Merry (tactics) and Pippin both get stronger if you add another hobbit hero to the pack.  Make Farmer Maggot a hero with Sam, Merry and Pippin on the Fellowship Saga and you've got 5 hobbit heroes...  Could be a lot of fun, especially for solo.

 

(...)

 

Yeah, it was fun I gave Spirit Bilbo Sword-thain during one saga game, so I had hobbits from 5 spheres (with Fellowship Frodo) Merry was a beast with 9 attack with 2 Daggers of Westernesse, also it was nice to draw 5 cards with Frodo's Intuition