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MTaylor

How does 'The Force Awakens' affect your FFG game?

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The science in the UC Timeline of Mobile Suit Gundam is consistent and based on real world knowledge!

 

*ducks head as he runs for cover*

 

Gundam is based on Star Wars! Don't blast me!

 

 

UC Timeline only, The Seed/Wing/00/AGE stuff plays it fairly loose and is meant for a younger audience.

 

Funny that you mention Gundam, since the storyline of the Force Awakens seems to have some similarities to that of ZZ Gundam. The New Republic is like the Earth Federation, the Resistance is like the AEUG and the First Order is like Neo Zeon...

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I can name three important changes I would have to consider in GMing my games.

 

#1. We see the Millennium Falcon make a jump to hyperspace from the interior of a ship.

 

#2 We see the Falcon exit hyperspace inside the atmosphere of a planet.  When the lore we grew up on told us that a hyperdrive would yank you out automatically as soon as you drew too close to a mass shadow in hyperspace.

 

#3. The Falcon plowing through a forest of trees and seeming to take very little damage.

 

Along with ships docking/traveling together in the same stream (?) of hyperspace that we've seen in Rebels, I think there's been a significant change to Star Wars physics lore in the past year.

 

Agreed. These are the main concerns for me. As my game is set prior to Death Star v1 the plot doesn't impact my game. But things like that theoretically do. On your list my answer to #1 is that Old Han can pull this off, but it's going to be an upgraded Formidable check so good luck with that everyone else. For #2 I'm just going to close my eyes and go "La-la-la." . #3 did also occur to me whilst watching but I reckon I'm okay with that. The Falcon can take a hit from actual weapons like lasers and survive the odd asteroid bashing into it. I'm going to assume that Star Wars level technology can produce weapons that are more destructive than a tree being thrown at you and by inference, that if the Falcon can survive these other things, it can survive the trees. It's a bit hand-wavy, but not by much.

 

Of greater concern might be Ben Solo's upgraded Force powers. I was okay with it a little at first as I thought this character must be some super-powerful Force user. But when it was revealed he was just Han's son with a modicum of training by Luke, it started to jar with me that he was pulling off greater-than-yoda style effects. I mean mechanically suspending the bolt in mid air isn't really much more than Protect, but visually in the film, freezing it, walking around and having a conversation whilst just keeping it there... That makes Vader's little deflection of Han's shot or Yoda's catch the Force Lightning stuff look pretty weak. Ditto for lifting people up and freezing their limbs compared to Yoda or Qui Gon force-pushing people backwards.

 

I could really hear Abram's voice as I watched the film saying: "yeah, but this one goes up to eleven!"

 

Like I said in my other post, I just count #2 as new technology.

 

As far as Kylo Ren's force display, I didn't find that too jarring. One thing from both the books and movies is that we see different characters with different strengths in the Force. Kylo's talents may have simply been in different areas than previous movie characters (which parallels the books where Jacen Solo had a number of force skills that were not known to most other Jedi). Vader was very good at levitation and force choking people but despite him being this powerful force user, we never see him use force lightning.

 

Also, it may actually have been a pretty inefficient method. We see him freeze one blaster bolt in midair. Vader absorbs multiple blasts in rapid succession. Could Kylo Ren have done the same with his power? Maybe or maybe his method is really only good for one shot but it serves the purpose of being a highly visual effect (good for intimidating both his troops and his enemies).

 

Lifting people up and freezing them doesn't seem that over-the-top when you consider that we've seen force levitation and force choking. You're just putting pressure on their limbs instead of their neck. We never saw Obi-Wan doing it but we never saw him force-choking people either.

 

Finally, I wouldn't discount the "modicum of training" aspect. Luke never completed his training with Yoda but he was still able to advance his skills to be able to beat Vader. Even before that, he was able to figure out some basic force use beyond what we saw Obi-Wan train him on. Rey had no training at all but raw talent, instinct, and hearing stories of what the force was able to do was enough for her to pull off some simple tricks. And of course it's also fair to say that Kylo probably received at least some additional training from Snoke.

Edited by bonenaga

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It doesn't really affect our game. The only EU stuff I've included has been Thrawn and the Black Sun, though I do plan to introduce Mara Jade. So far, the existence of those characters is not contradicted by the new material. If we ever get far enough along in the timeline (right now we are still between ANH and ESB) to where the actions of those characters may come into conflict with canon, I'll make a decision then. Chances are that their storylines will be altered to let them exist with their EU personalities but without being too disruptive to the new canon.

 

Sabine's friend in a recent episode of Rebels said she was working for the Black Sun, and isn't Rebels canon?

 

Also, wasn't Shadows of the Empire canon by George Lucas's approval? Prince Xizor and the Black Sun were in that. I know the Force Unleashed games were semi canonical. Maybe I'm confusing the two or they're both canon at the time or whatever.

 

I don't watch Rebels so I wasn't aware of that. SotE was canon before Disney took over. Now like the rest of the EU it is not until they specifically choose to include it. If they have included the Black Sun in Rebels I guess it is safe to say that the organization is canon again but that does not mean that the rest of the Shadows of the Empire storyline will also be canon.

 

I'm not too hung up over it though, my campaign pretty much uses the original trilogy plus WEG lore. Disney can make whatever they want to be canon but since I haven't seen any of the post-Lucas material other than Force Awakens it has zero chance of affecting my game right now.

 

The Black Sun actually appeared in the Darth Maul arc in The Clone Wars' fifth season and in Dark Disciple, so they were already canon before they were mentioned in "Blood Sisters."

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The point isn't whether or not someone with a high Brawn can fight with a lightsaber effectively, but whether or not someone will training in melee weapons (as it appears all Stormtroopers have) could use that training to be better at fighting with a lightsaber. 

 

 

Maybe. But not in the way you might think. The trained Melee character could easily have applicable talents that would help him use a lightsaber even though he has 0 skill when he first picks it up. Imagine a melee-oriented PC Marauder. Probably high Melee skill, high Brawn, and several talents that could be interpreted as usable with a lightsaber. Brawn 4 with Frenzied Attack, Feral Strength, Lethal Blows, Knockdown, if allowed to be used with a lightsaber by your GM*, makes you a very formidable opponent even though you have 0 skill.

 

*As is most of these skills in EotE state use with only "Melee" and "Brawl", but they are from a book before the Lightsaber skill was launched. An open-minded GM would be needed to use these with a lightsaber.

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Hyperspace mass shadow contradiction can be retconned without much problem. This takes a bit and may be confusing, sorry.

 

1. Per Force Awakening canon, you can hyperspace near to a planet, even if it's considered extremely dangerous.

 

2. Per Rebels canon, an Interdictor uses EXTREME gravity (it can crush a ship) to pull a craft out of hyperspace.

 

So, your anti-collision detector kicks you out of hyperspace when it senses a mass of say 0.01 G or higher so you don't accidentally fly into a planet or star. It's sensitivity is set pretty low so it kicks you out of hyperspace when you are a safe distance from the stellar object and thus have time to react. You can turn this completely off or up the sensitivity if you want to do something crazy like Han does. But, even with the detector turned completely off, hyperspace travel itself collpases when encountering higher gravities, perhaps 5G or higher. So, you can still hyperspace in close to a typical Star Warzy planet (1G surface gravity), but an Interdictor can project even higher gravities that can yank you out of hyperspace even if you shut down your detector.

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The point isn't whether or not someone with a high Brawn can fight with a lightsaber effectively, but whether or not someone will training in melee weapons (as it appears all Stormtroopers have) could use that training to be better at fighting with a lightsaber. 

 

 

Maybe. But not in the way you might think. The trained Melee character could easily have applicable talents that would help him use a lightsaber even though he has 0 skill when he first picks it up. Imagine a melee-oriented PC Marauder. Probably high Melee skill, high Brawn, and several talents that could be interpreted as usable with a lightsaber. Brawn 4 with Frenzied Attack, Feral Strength, Lethal Blows, Knockdown, if allowed to be used with a lightsaber by your GM*, makes you a very formidable opponent even though you have 0 skill.

 

*As is most of these skills in EotE state use with only "Melee" and "Brawl", but they are from a book before the Lightsaber skill was launched. An open-minded GM would be needed to use these with a lightsaber.

 

Excellent point! Especially since some talents from the EotE CRB which say melee attack, also mean a brawl attack. Knockdown for example, says only melee, but can be used with brawl, too.

I hadn't considered this, but I guess I will play it so.

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I'm coming late to this thread, but I only saw the movie yesterday afternoon.

 

I don't think I'm ready to set a campaign in the FA era yet, I personally want to wait for more information.  I do actually remember back to when A New Hope came out and it was the only thing I knew about Star Wars.  We knew nothing about who Vader was, what a Dark Lord of the Sith was, what any planets were beyond Tattooine, and Yavin.  Never even heard of Coruscant.  There's no way I had enough information to run a game.  Of course I was 6, so that wasn't an issue.

 

I feel kind of like that again now.  It's a great thing, but leaves me a bit uncomfortable setting a game in the time frame.  I'm thinking the next campaign we start will probably be in the classic era (our current one is Old Republic).  Hopefully by the time we're done with it there will be enough material out there for me to feel a bit better about placing something in the newer time frame.

 

As far as some of the issues people are raising.  I'm keeping Light Saber as it's own brawn related skill.  Yes, anybody can probably pick one up and swing it around if they're a good melee fighter, but I don't think they'll get as much out of it without a full skill.  From a nuts and bolts standpoint, balance.  Our marauder is deadly enough as it is with just melee, I don't need to hand her a lightsaber.  Sometimes you just have to do things for balance or rules reasons.

 

Hyperspace and gravity wells.  I'm perfectly willing to let my characters try to pull a Han Solo and jump into a planets atmosphere.  That said, the difficulty will be 5 or 6, with several reds, and if they get a despair they're all going to die.  Keep that in mind.  If they succeed with despair they'll survive, but there ship will probably never fly again.  Interdictors will still work because science. 

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I have come to consider the lightsaber skill a kind of martial art.  Practice and techniques that allow for greater efficiency when wielding a saber as a weapon. 

 

It is certainly the most focused of any of the skills in this game (other than maybe Astrogation). 

 

You could argue that just cause your character is a track star and can run a 5 minute mile doesn't mean they can swim.  Even though they are covered by the same skill, Athletics.

 

I think the main reason that they are covered by different skills is because of game mechanics design choice not lore consistency.

 

If the mechanics are not supportive of this, for the style of game you play, then you should certainly consider changing them.

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When we get more info on the era, I may be tempted by at least Gming a mini campaign as I do like some elements (the mix between a pre Phantom Menace feel with Cold War/Galactic civil war themes is quite interesting).

I may change a few general things in my current campaign, though, like the additionnal hyperspace stunts Solo pulls throughout the movie, but that's a minor thing that would require passing quite the difficult roll. One thing I'm not sure about though is changing hyperspace travel times. It may be because the movie didn't want to dwell on it or slow its pacing, but hyperspace travel seems almost instantaneous now. I kinda like longer travel times, but I do try to adapt to the current canon as much as I can/want. What are your thoughts on this?

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I'm hoping to find FA material that can be used in a Rebellion or even earlier setting. Something to tie into the future setting. There may not be much, but even a few snippets would be nice:

 

  • Maz Kanata and her Castle. Easily placed earlier. A shadowport perhaps.
  • A variety of the First Order lander appears to be coming to Rogue One. Perhaps it's an earlier model?
  • New planets.
  • A Rebel adventure that has the PCs saving the schematics to a new, prototype X-wing from an Imperial raid.
  • Receiving help from the (much younger) famed explorer Lor San Tekka to retrieve an artifact.
  • More?

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When we get more info on the era, I may be tempted by at least Gming a mini campaign as I do like some elements (the mix between a pre Phantom Menace feel with Cold War/Galactic civil war themes is quite interesting).

I may change a few general things in my current campaign, though, like the additionnal hyperspace stunts Solo pulls throughout the movie, but that's a minor thing that would require passing quite the difficult roll. One thing I'm not sure about though is changing hyperspace travel times. It may be because the movie didn't want to dwell on it or slow its pacing, but hyperspace travel seems almost instantaneous now. I kinda like longer travel times, but I do try to adapt to the current canon as much as I can/want. What are your thoughts on this?

I agree, I'm not real concerned with any mechanical impacts on the game play, but I'm hesitant to move towards using the background until we have a firmer idea of some details of the political geography and organizational structures.

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I'm hoping to find FA material that can be used in a Rebellion or even earlier setting. Something to tie into the future setting. There may not be much, but even a few snippets would be nice:

 

  • Maz Kanata and her Castle. Easily placed earlier. A shadowport perhaps.
  • A variety of the First Order lander appears to be coming to Rogue One. Perhaps it's an earlier model?
  • New planets.
  • A Rebel adventure that has the PCs saving the schematics to a new, prototype X-wing from an Imperial raid.
  • Receiving help from the (much younger) famed explorer Lor San Tekka to retrieve an artifact.
  • More?

 

Yeah i agree that would be cool

 

besides, in my long-time running campaign (in WEG d6 system), one of the PC has an heavily modified X-Wing, partly because they had extensive contacts with former Incom engineer and saved a group of them, using improved engines (1), more powerful weapon, etc.

And it's already black painted

 

So i guess he's the first prototype for new X-Wing models :)

 

(1) in old WEG system, XWing is slower than TIE...

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I'm hoping to find FA material that can be used in a Rebellion or even earlier setting. Something to tie into the future setting. There may not be much, but even a few snippets would be nice:

 

  • Maz Kanata and her Castle. Easily placed earlier. A shadowport perhaps.
  • A variety of the First Order lander appears to be coming to Rogue One. Perhaps it's an earlier model?
  • New planets.
  • A Rebel adventure that has the PCs saving the schematics to a new, prototype X-wing from an Imperial raid.
  • Receiving help from the (30 years younger) famed explorer Lor San Tekka to retrieve an artifact.
  • More?

 

FIFY

 

But in all seriousness, Lor San Tekka would be around 50 years old during the OT timeline and 30 at the end of the clone wars. Granted this only applies if you take Max von Sydow's actual age (86) as a template for his. I only hit that part of your post since much younger implies to me that he would be around his 30s.

 

Apart from that I agree 100% with you.

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One thing I'm not sure about though is changing hyperspace travel times. It may be because the movie didn't want to dwell on it or slow its pacing, but hyperspace travel seems almost instantaneous now. I kinda like longer travel times, but I do try to adapt to the current canon as much as I can/want. What are your thoughts on this?

Hyperspace has always been at the speed of plot anyway but keep in mind that this is 30 years later. Consider the changes we saw from WWII to the 1970s. We went from prop-planes to fighter jets, ICBMs, and sending people into space. My phone has more computing power than the computers we used to send people to the moon. So I'm totally cool with not revising hyperspace times for an OT-era game. On the other hand, if your game is approaching the TFA-era then that's another matter.

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- it won't affect anything; we play in the original time-period or some other era like Clone Wars or Old Republic or Legacy Era

 

Has no effect as it takes place 30+ years after Endor which is decades away from any game I've ever run or played in.

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After a little more thought, SWTFA has convinced me that I should go ahead with my alternate timeline where Endor was a pyrrhic victory for the Alliance that cost them much of their leadership, including all of the Heroes of Yavin. I'll start the game up in 5 ABY, one year after Endor. The Alliance needs new heroes now, and canon doesn't matter.

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After a little more thought, SWTFA has convinced me that I should go ahead with my alternate timeline where Endor was a pyrrhic victory for the Alliance that cost them much of their leadership, including all of the Heroes of Yavin. I'll start the game up in 5 ABY, one year after Endor. The Alliance needs new heroes now, and canon doesn't matter.

Was it that bad for you how they handled the big three?

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TFA doesn't affect anything. Our game is set during the Early Imperial Period (12 BBY) and focuses on a surviving Jedi Knight and their Padawan. They are currently seeking out other Jedi who survived the purge. They are bent on changing the canonical timeline - and may succeed. Its an alternate universe game, anyways. Namely: Yoda is a force ghost, and Padme is alive under an assumed name and heading the nascent rebel network. That already sets a different set of outcomes in motion. Luke, Leia, Han and Co. aren't the heroes. We'll see what happens.

Edited by Vondy

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