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Desslok

The Spoilerrific Super Duper Episode Seven Megathread!

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I guess there are eleven other incarnations out there to find...

Captain Harlock
Korben Dallas?Animated image of Bruce Willis panicking in a gun fight in The Fifth Element
This might be a bit of a stretch....

John Wick?

EDIT: I have a better one;

The Transporter "Frank Martin"

Edited by Serif Marak

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I guess there are eleven other incarnations out there to find...

Captain Harlock
Korben Dallas?Animated image of Bruce Willis panicking in a gun fight in The Fifth Element
This might be a bit of a stretch....

John Wick?

EDIT: I have a better one;

The Transporter "Frank Martin"

I haven't seen The Transporter movies so maybe - can't comment. But I think John Wick isn't an incarnation. Or it's the "War Doctor" version of the character if it is. The essential elements of the character as I see it are:

* Competent and skilled - Yet somehow permanently out of their depth

* Confrontational demeanour - Yet a good heart.

* Roguish and a liar / cheat / thief - Yet loyal to his friends.

* A charmer and a ladies man.

It's an archetype that goes back to Aladdin (the myth, not the Disney horror).

John Wick is a bit too in control of the situation and downright mean, imo, violating a couple of essential elements of the character. Plus they all get the girl. Another essential element. Poor John Wick doesn't even get the dog.

I could see Corben Dallas, Star Lord and Han Solo all having a beer together. John Wick would rather sit in a dark corner drinking alone, I imagine. But there's definitely overlap.

EDIT: I like this idea more and more. We need an artist to draw Solo, Star Lord and Corben Dallas in a bar together.

Edited by knasserII

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I haven't seen The Transporter movies so maybe - can't comment. But I think John Wick isn't an incarnation. Or it's the "War Doctor" version of the character if it is. The essential elements of the character as I see it are:

* Competent and skilled - Yet somehow permanently out of their depth

* Confrontational demeanour - Yet a good heart.

* Roguish and a liar / cheat / thief - Yet loyal to his friends.

* A charmer and a ladies man.

 

 

Funny you mention Harrison Ford as the War Doctor. According to the trailer for the 50th Anniversary of American Doctor Who, well - you nailed it.

 

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The in-universe director is to be commended for how much they stuck to the actual historical facts surrounding the destruction of the first Death Star.  It's almost a documentary.

 

They couldn't resist jazzing it up a bit with bigger explosions, bigger weapons and skipping over the slow bits, though. ;)

 

I haven't seen The Transporter movies so maybe - can't comment. But I think John Wick isn't an incarnation. Or it's the "War Doctor" version of the character if it is. The essential elements of the character as I see it are:

* Competent and skilled - Yet somehow permanently out of their depth

* Confrontational demeanour - Yet a good heart.

* Roguish and a liar / cheat / thief - Yet loyal to his friends.

* A charmer and a ladies man.

 

Funny you mention Harrison Ford as the War Doctor. According to the trailer for the 50th Anniversary of American Doctor Who, well - you nailed it.

 

That. Is. Magnificent.

They got it spot on - such good choices, such a good selection of clips. And great match-up of Doctors: Christopher Walken as the (Sixth) Doctor? Perfect. Vincent Price? Sam Rockwell? Wonderful stuff. :D :D :D

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I don't read vanity Fair but apparently this is a photo in it of the aliens from Maz's place.

 

So... Quiggold has now established the Vogons as being part of Star Wars ;)

 

 

Money on even the cook and pet dog getting an new-EU novel. And each of them will be legendary in some way...their abilities, what they did, what they were involved in.  :rolleyes:

 

Well, of course, that's on par for Star Wars in general :)

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They got it spot on - such good choices, such a good selection of clips. And great match-up of Doctors: Christopher Walken as the (Sixth) Doctor? Perfect. Vincent Price? Sam Rockwell? Wonderful stuff. :D :D :D

 

 

I shall forever weep for the Gene Wilder Fourth Doctor we never got. . . . .

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I saw the film for the 3rd time this weekend, and though I already liked it to begin with, I think I'm liking it more each time. And I just figured out why:

 

This movie has heart. Like, it's just bursting with it.

 

At the risk of sounding horribly naïve, I should say that when it comes to Star Wars, I don't care about plot and structure too much. If I want a water-tight plot and deep, complex, mature characters, I'll watch something geared more toward grown-ups. But TFA has everything that six-year-old me fell in love with back in 1977: 

  • Making new friends
  • Leaving a hum-drum life and going on an exciting adventure
  • Overcoming one's fears and shortcomings
  • Doing the right thing, even (especially?) when it's difficult

Looking back, I think that this is what the prequels (which I don't hate) were lacking: the heart. I really like this movie, and I'm so happy for the little kids who are being taken to it, because I bet they're feeling just like I did back in '77. :)

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Whoa boy, 21 pages. Nope, not gonna read all of those. My take on it:

 

I liked the premise. I like that Star Wars once again mirrors a plausible and current political climate. I like the Empire and New Republic being two legit entities and at peace initially, and I like that some yet not fully known elements within them are waging covert wars by proxy parties (First Order/Resistence). For all the overt black and white, the setup is pretty grey, which makes the good, the bad and the ugly just stand out more.

 

I liked Starkiller Base. I absolutely loved that they clearly showcased that old, WMD tech that has been around for five decades is no longer anything more than a typical military problem, even if it is extremely devestating. I like how they hint at the dangers of using such weapons in what amounts to galactic terrorism and that it is in the end, all they're good for: A one-shot suicide bombing. I also like the difference in propaganda and reaction to Starkiller Base from the First Order, who, despite nazi imagery, in rhethoric could be any obsolete extremist faction out to simply stir things up on the basis of ultimately crazy ideology and belief. I like that in contrast, Snoke seems perfectly sane and even bland.

 

Another high point for me was the re-mystification of the force. Now that the dreadful DnD-wizardrdy of codified force powers has finally been deleted, we once more have a cosmic force which takes no clear side and constantly tests and pushes its chosen few not only into growth, but also conflict. The will of the force is inscrutable and seemingly self-contradictory again, which makes it a better circle of life analogy than it was in the very scientific, christian monk approach of the Jedi order. By removing the stereotypical "magical spell" and power level ****, Disney has once again made the force magical. It's about time.

 

Further high points for me were dialogue, humour, believability of a cast of either overtly or subtley flawed characters and that it, despite making us feel familiar, had the guts to experiment and variate themes. We have a genuine "villains journey" now. That is extremely brave for a big name family movie.

 

I honestly sound like I have nothing bad to say about it, don't I? Well, there are some things which bothered me, but more in regards to future movies:

I would like to have a 'real' Snoke and not just a CGI one. I do not mind his hologram looked out of place. It was very reminiscent of the wizard of Oz. If we actually get a 'man behind the curtain', it will be awesome. If we don't, in hindsight, I am going to have to say "No, this could have been done better".

Another thing that bothered me a bit was the lack of radiation protection scavangers had. Those are wrecks full of defunct, volatile materials that are probably supremely unhealthy. Bits of protective cloth and nothing more kind of bugs me a wee bit. For me, it harkens back to the much too 'clean' slavery of The Phantom Menace. It'd have been perfectly fine to see Daisy Ridley get genuinely dirty. People like watching women play in the mud, or rather sand, after all.

Edited by DeathByGrotz

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He sounds more playful than really critical. I'll toss Sam some credit in that, from what he says and how he says it, he seems to get them not being total swordmasters from the get go was kind of, y'know, the point.

 

I have no doubt people who know nothing about melee combat are going to use that clip as fodder to continue their incessant praise of the dance numbers that we saw in the prequels. People like to take things out of context unfortunately.

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Came back from my second viewing yesterday, understanding the movie and its nuances a bit more. I think it's a good movie. A strong, 7/10, maybe 7.50 even. The story is character-driven, which is always a plus, especially with great characters like Finn, Rey, and Poe. I really want to see the Finn/Poe bromance ramp up in the next Episode. The villains are still more convincing than the Galactic Empire, because they're undoubtedly evil and crazy, while the Empire was more in a grey area. All in all it was a good movie, and I felt invested, because I actually cared about the characters, related to them.

But,

The movie could've been great. It could've been the best Star Wars movie. But the movie has one big flaw. I may be biased in saying so, because I actually really liked the Prequels, but Force Awakens suffers a lot by trying to appeal WAY too much to the OT elitists. This results in two problems:

 

1: The story has way too many parallels with ANH, which sometimes makes it feel like a reboot, or reimagining, instead of a sequel. I like those little elements like Finn grabbing the training lightsaber ball while searching for bandages, or the dejarik table, but when you can start predicting exactly where this is going because you've "seen" it before in the same movie series, there's a problem. It is to A New Hope what Home Alone 2 is to Home Alone, while not being as honest about it.  

2: I can't understand what the hell is happening. Or I wouldn't, if I didn't researched the Galactic's current state of affairs for two hours after my first viewing. The crawl tells you of a Resistance, secretly supported by the Republic, fighting against the First Order, which is basically a reform of the Imperial Remnants. And then they talk about Luke for two minutes. You get so many questions from that. Why a Resistance? Isn't the Republic the ruling power in the Galaxy now? And why is the Republic only supporting it in secret? And who is that First Order? A political party akin to the Nazi Party? Another state? A boy scout club? What, how, why. And that's the result of Abrams and Disney seeing the Prequels haters ranting about "too much politics, Star Wars is supposed to be dumb fun". So they cut all the exposition and the political aspects. Problem is, we needed more politics. Now, I'll say that I'm a sucker for space politics, that's the main thing I loved in the prequels. I wouldn't even mind a whole movie about space politics. But honestly, we didn't even needed a lot, just enough to actually figure out what's going on. Just add a couple lines between Snoke and Hux maybe, explaining the First Order's situation in the Galaxy, or maybe a scene with the Senate on Hosnian Prime, mentionning the Galactic Concordance treaty (which not only would explain the Republic's lack of reaction and the existence of the Resistance, but also familiarized ourselves with the new rulers of the Galaxy and Hosnian Prime in general, which would make its destruction later way stronger emotionally). Sadly, I feel like I'm watching the sequel to a book that I didn't read. And that's really disappointing, as I think this new setting is really interesting.

Edited by Necrovoker

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"Undeniably crazy and evil" doesn't exactly hit my "convincing villain" button.

At least they're villains, while you can argue (and I did multiple times in the past) that the Galactic Empire are actually the good guys in the story. Hard to root for the protagonists when you think they're the bad guys.

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"Undeniably crazy and evil" doesn't exactly hit my "convincing villain" button.

 

At least they're villains, while you can argue (and I did multiple times in the past) that the Galactic Empire are actually the good guys in the story. Hard to root for the protagonists when you think they're the bad guys.

 

 

Hard to argue that people who go around blowing up disarmed planets to "make a point", encourage slavery, promote "species hate", and routinely "disappear" political opponents are the "good guys".  

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maybe a scene with the Senate on Hosnian Prime, mentionning the Galactic Concordance treaty (which not only would explain the Republic's lack of reaction and the existence of the Resistance, but also familiarized ourselves with the new rulers of the Galaxy and Hosnian Prime in general

 

That's one of the big problems with the Superduper weapon - the targets are all redshirts. When Alderaan was nuked we at least had some build up to it. The name had been dropped a couple of times, we had tiny nuggets of information, we had a tie to it through Leia. Here, hell, I didn't even know the planets had names until I read the ancillary material. The bad guys might have been blowing up a Starbucks in Tallahassee for all I cared. 

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maybe a scene with the Senate on Hosnian Prime, mentionning the Galactic Concordance treaty (which not only would explain the Republic's lack of reaction and the existence of the Resistance, but also familiarized ourselves with the new rulers of the Galaxy and Hosnian Prime in general

 

That's one of the big problems with the Superduper weapon - the targets are all redshirts. When Alderaan was nuked we at least had some build up to it. The name had been dropped a couple of times, we had tiny nuggets of information, we had a tie to it through Leia. Here, hell, I didn't even know the planets had names until I read the ancillary material. The bad guys might have been blowing up a Starbucks in Tallahassee for all I cared. 

 

It's actually funny but during my first viewing I was convinced it was Coruscant (big city, and Hux said that they wanted to hit the heart of the Republic or whatever) and it hit me super hard. But then after I learned it was actually Hosnian Prime ("whooo?" in that perfect Guardians of the Galaxy voice), so that scene, during my second viewing, had next to zero emotional impact on me ("oh no that nameless but beautiful woman is gonna die. Oh well").  

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The bad guys might have been blowing up a Starbucks in Tallahassee for all I cared. 

 

 

I assumed they did. Just before Christmas, I was in my local coffee shop and I felt a great disturbance, as if a dozen hipsters suddenly cried out in horror at the price of their skinny lattes, and were suddenly silenced. I feared something terrible had happened. 

 

Then there was a brilliant flash from the direction of Tallahassee.  I live in the UK, but the explosion was so awesome it could be seen from anywhere in the galaxy.  

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The bad guys might have been blowing up a Starbucks in Tallahassee for all I cared. 

 

 

I assumed they did. Just before Christmas, I was in my local coffee shop and I felt a great disturbance, as if a dozen hipsters suddenly cried out in horror at the price of their skinny lattes, and were suddenly silenced. I feared something terrible had happened

 

Then there was a brilliant flash from the direction of Tallahassee.  I live in the UK, but the explosion was so awesome it could be seen from anywhere in the galaxy.  

 

Would that really be so terrible?

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