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Desslok

The Spoilerrific Super Duper Episode Seven Megathread!

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Lock the thread?!?!?!?

 

But no one has explained why Star Lord is in Jabba's Palace yet!

Undoubtedly he wants a copy of the Max Rebo band for his Awesome Mix Tape.

Alternately, he and Han Solo are in fact the same character at different points in their life and he just popped back down the timeline for a look. After all, it was a Long Time Ago....

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Alternately, he and Han Solo are in fact the same character at different points in their life and he just popped back down the timeline for a look. After all, it was a Long Time Ago....

 

 

My head canon is now this ...

 

Han Solo ... Time Lord.

 

Chewbacca ... Companion.

 

Millennium Falcon ... Tardis.

Edited by Kyla

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At this point, locking the thread would be a good thing.

 

Any real discussions have pretty much been drowned out by the back-and-forth petty bickering on both sides of the fence.  If anything, 2P51 has been the most reasonable poster in this entire thread.  The haters want to hate the film because it didn't live up to their expectations, and the folks that loved the film love it warts and all.  Like most of the extremely screwed-up Star Wars fandom, there's not much middle ground.

There's an irony in calling for the thread to be closed in the same paragraph you dismiss any critics as "haters" who just want to hate the film. That's neither accurate nor conducive to civil discussion. You say you want the thread locked and help provide ammo to do so with incendiary statements like that (amongst all your previous). You can't distance yourself from the fact that you are one of the primary culprits of what you now call "petty bickering". You seem to want to have the thread locked. A better alternative, if it no longer has value for you, would logically be to just leave the thread as it still has value for others. People want to discuss the film. There are still those who haven't seen it. There needs to be a thread for that and this one contains the history of everyone's reviews so far. So let's NOT call for the thread to be locked and instead, if it's not of interest, just let alone for those for whom it is. It doesn't cost you anything to do so.

 

Bravo.

 

Dude makes backhanded snide remarks about everyone who doesn't agree with him, either generally or individually, then when he doesn't like what I've said, accuses me of personal insults (when I've done nothing of the sort...him on the other hand...).  After that, says he's ignoring me...but still replies to me, then makes more personal attacks when I point this out.  Then, when more and more people come to discuss, but have less than his own glowing opinions, he calls for all discussion on the topic to be closed down?  

 

Look, I've never made a claim that I was the most friendly person on the internet, but I try to avoid letting disagreements, even extreme ones, on any topic color my overall judgement of a person (heck, you and I, knasser, have had serious differences of opinion even pretty recently, and we certainly have fairly incompatible personalities based on our approaches to various situations...but just because I am your polar opposite on some other issue doesn't mean I want to be nasty to you here).  If someone wants to ignore me, that's fine...do what you've got to do to keep your own chi centered, but don't expect everyone else around you to change what they're doing to protect your "safe zone".  (On that note, I'd hope to think that if the mods *do* feel that something I've said consists of a personal attack, that they'd let me know that, as opposed to locking a thread because of me, or jumping straight to a punishment of some sort.)

 

While this discussion has certainly been impassioned, most have been mature enough not to extend their attacks from aspects of the movie onto the people expressing them.  The only ones that haven't been able to maintain that level of decency are the very ones calling for thread closure, now that there's a significant portion of participants who don't share their views.

 

I do find it ironic, though, that the user calling for thread shutdown thinks that the most reasonable poster is the one who bases the worth of any dissenting opinion from their own on whether or not their dissatisfaction carries any meaning to Disney...then when they have that same rationale turned on them, has nothing to say but "So".  

 

Oh well, I guess to each his or her own.  I, for one, am glad to see the mods let this one ride.  There's been plenty of tangents...from Star Trek, to Van Halen, to Star Lord, and Disney's overall motives, goals, and plans for the franchise...I think it's been a pretty lively, interesting, and sure, occasionally heated discussion (as is to be expected for something this community has anticipated for so long), but as a whole, it's more or less stayed on-topic, and despite the best efforts of some, hasn't yet completely devolved into personal attacks on people who disagree.

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I like this theory of who Rey is related to. And this Dad's theory would be an interesting twist.

The Dad's theory is interesting. If I remember correctly Jacen Solo became a Sith because he had a Force vision of him killing Luke if he didn't. So he thought it was the right thing to do.

However, I don't think Luke is on board with this. Kylo is doing it on his own if he is doing it.

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Alternately, he and Han Solo are in fact the same character at different points in their life and he just popped back down the timeline for a look. After all, it was a Long Time Ago....

 

My head canon is now this ...

 

Han Solo ... Time Lord.

 

Chewbacca ... Companion.

 

Millennium Falcon ... Tardis.

I am chuckling at the idea of Chewbacca as the latest "beautiful companion". Martha Jones, Amy Pond, Clara Oswald and... the wookie. But different time lords, different companions, no doubt. I like it.

And it would certainly explain how the Millenium Falcon completed the Kessel Run in less than 12 Parsecs. "Time And Relative Dimensions In Space" and all that. Or how the companions were able to hide from the searching Storm Troopers when they came aboard. Or why it seems to be so much more complicated to maintain than any other ship. ;):)

I like it. I like it a lot. Now I want to pinpoint all the different regenerations of Han Solo in different movies. We know Time Lords have thirteen incarnations (normally). We have identified two of them. I wonder if Han Solo is "The Corsair" that was mentioned in one episode of Doctor Who. I guess there are eleven other incarnations out there to find...

Edited by knasserII

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I like this theory of who Rey is related to. And this Dad's theory would be an interesting twist.

The second one is an excellent idea. This is a real problem with movies that are primarily set ups for sequels - in the intervening time we're going to hear a hundred different theories of what's going on and one of them will probably be right and there will be others that some will have preferred. If the Dad's Theory (naming it now) doesn't turn out to be the right one, I'm going to be disappointed by almost anything else they could come up with. It's clever, it's thematic and it actually works. They just have to make Snook something dangerous enough to actually justify someone giving up everything they believe in to kill him.

Nice link. Very clever way of taking the Kylo Ren story forward.

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I like this theory of who Rey is related to. And this Dad's theory would be an interesting twist.

The second one is an excellent idea. This is a real problem with movies that are primarily set ups for sequels - in the intervening time we're going to hear a hundred different theories of what's going on and one of them will probably be right and there will be others that some will have preferred. If the Dad's Theory (naming it now) doesn't turn out to be the right one, I'm going to be disappointed by almost anything else they could come up with. It's clever, it's thematic and it actually works. They just have to make Snook something dangerous enough to actually justify someone giving up everything they believe in to kill him.

Nice link. Very clever way of taking the Kylo Ren story forward.

 

Snoke might actually be worth it; one rather compelling theory I read yesterday (based on the similarities of the musical themes, no less) is that Snoke is actually Darth Plagueis. That would also explain how come he looks so hideous.

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So, are you going to 8 and 9 or no?

 

Me personally...  no.   I hope they do well and lots of people like them and Disney makes lots of money.  But they weren't aimed at me and that's fine. 

 

I'm glad I saw Force Awakens because I needed to give it a chance and view it with an open mind.

 

But it wasn't for me, which is no huge surprise seeing as I've liked little Star Wars output since the prequels and only came back to it because of the game.

 

If people like or love the movie, I don't begrudge them that at all.  There's lots of popular stuff that's loved by millions that leaves me cold.  I never really got Harry Potter or Ponies either. I dislike Game of Thrones though its hugely popular.  Most of the books I read will never make the bestseller lists, and the music I listen to won't ever make the top forty. That's just fine by me. I've come to accept that my personal tastes are kinda niche.

 

Although it wasn't to my taste, I see why Disney did what it did, and if I was aiming to make as much $$$ as possible, I'd have done precisely the same thing. I can't hold that against them.

 

 

 

 

I feel bad for you and the others that Star Wars is ruined for you.

 

 

Funny thing here... it isn't ruined for me. 

 

I can still watch the originals if I want. Or read those few EU books I enjoyed.  Or play any of the great games or RPGs.

 

I'm a big, big fan of the FFG game. And I'm happy to run a game in which midichlorians, gungans and Death Star 3.0 don't exist.

 

That's a big plus of this role-playing thing some of us do. I'm sure you wouldn't enjoy my game and I wouldn't enjoy yours. Having different tastes is fine, no?

Edited by MTaylor

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I like this theory of who Rey is related to. And this Dad's theory would be an interesting twist.

 

Apparently

Disney blew this by accidentally releasing a clip of Ren going "Face me, cousin!" while fighting Rey and then begging the guy who posted it to take it down - but the cat was out of the bag by then.

Edited by Desslok

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The person who originally posted that video admitted it was wrong. If you watch other videos of that battle scene, he yells out "Curses!"  from time-to-time. It's clear he was yelling "Face Me" then got hit and yelled "Curses!"

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Well, I finally saw it New Years Eve.  I'm sort of torn about it.  It really needs two ratings.

As a movie, it was a lot of fun, with a few stupid things, not as enjoyable as Guardians of the Galaxy, but still:  solid 8 out of 10.

As Star Wars though...way too much fan service, I neither appreciated it, nor needed it, nor wanted it:  4 of 10.

 

The Great:

- effects.  I love how the TIEs don't just explode anymore, they disintegrate with flying debris and smoke and particle effects of all kinds.

- though I didn't think I'd care, having real objects in the scenes as opposed to CGI-everywhere was noticeably a good thing.  Kudos to JJ on the mix.

- the planetary sets.  Huge, grand, and yet familiar.  I love how Rey is making her meal and the shots slowly pan out to show she's living in an old AT-AT walker

 

The Good:

- the acting, especially Rey, but really almost everybody, including those old people who look familiar...  I really loved the expressive tension between Kylo and Rey when he's trying to read her mind and she turns it on him.  Very compelling.

- the humour, there are some great memorable lines ("You changed your hair."  "You're still wearing the same jacket.")  But they didn't go overboard with it or make it inappropriate.  Thankfully 3P0 was kept at bay.  I love the stormtroopers response to Kylo's tantrum ("O boy, he's at it again.  Let's just go patrol over there...").

- the basic story.  Classic McGuffin, but it works well enough.

- Battle of the N00bs!  Nobody knows what they're doing with a lightsaber, not even Kylo, and it shows.  At least, I *hope* that was intentional.

- the lightsaber contains echoes of its past deeds.  When Rey finds it, the screaming made me think of the younglings killed in E3.  Very effective.

 

The Poor:

- the story details, because there aren't any.  Who is the von Sadow character?  Why does he have a map?  Why does R2 have a map with the exact missing piece?

- Why did Kylo turn?  This seems like a big deal.  It's true that E4 and E5 were void of the details of why Anakin became Darth Vader, which was what made the prequels so much better (IMHO...haha, take your shots).  It may not have been for the best of reasons, but they were, at least, relatable.  But nothing about Kylo is relatable.

- the First Order officers.  They were all petty conniving backstabbers who clearly hated each other and Kylo.  Not one of them had the presence of 1/10th of a Tarkin.  How could they be a serious threat?

- Poe's ridiculous multi-TIE and stormtrooper shooting round.  Let's see, that must have been 6 Agility, 5 skill, 5 Triumphs and 2 Advantages...

- Poe escapes from Jakku...how?

 

The Terrible:

- YADS:  yet another death star.  But at least the first ones kind of made sense, this one was just stupid.  We don't need a star-sucking shooter that somehow takes out the whole Republic in one shot...  I hated this part and everything it implied:  that the galaxy was that small; that the Republic was that useless (even though they were financing the Resistance); that even though Star Wars plays somewhat fast and loose with physics, it never played THAT fast and loose; etc, etc, mega-etc.

- the last scene.  That was pure "movie manipulation" with the whole dramatic "turning around reveal".  Luke would have sensed her coming, and met her on the beach.  It could have been just as dramatic, but not so completely pandering.

 

--------------------------

If the last two movies explain a bit more of the politics, give some reasons for Kylo, and avoid more death stars...I'll probably end up content.  However, I still want to know what Lucas had planned.  I have a feeling I would have liked it better...at least the story, if not the execution.

 

EDIT:  forgot to add the Poe escape...

Edited by whafrog

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This was my first Star Wars movie in a theater. YADS didn't bother me for that reason. My dad keeps telling me how amazing and awesome the scenes with planets blowing up were when they were experienced in the theater scale. Unfortunately, I can't see it so it's still theater of the mind for me but I think new fans deserve that experience.

If I had a complaint about the star killer weapon (actual science not considered... it gets a lot more than dark when the sun goes byebye) it's that I didn't get a sense that it was necessary for the first order. If the repulic had no official defense force, then the resitance didn't seem so big, powerful or capable that it could stand up to the first order even without the star killer weapon. If the Republic did have an official defense force that made the star killer weapon necessary, it wasn't explained.

I also think the effect of blowing up those planets wasn't adequately explained. It's a bigger blow to the rebels/resistance than Alderaan was.

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This was my first Star Wars movie in a theater. YADS didn't bother me for that reason. My dad keeps telling me how amazing and awesome the scenes with planets blowing up were when they were experienced in the theater scale. Unfortunately, I can't see it so it's still theater of the mind for me but I think new fans deserve that experience.

If I had a complaint about the star killer weapon (actual science not considered... it gets a lot more than dark when the sun goes byebye) it's that I didn't get a sense that it was necessary for the first order. If the repulic had no official defense force, then the resitance didn't seem so big, powerful or capable that it could stand up to the first order even without the star killer weapon. If the Republic did have an official defense force that made the star killer weapon necessary, it wasn't explained.

I also think the effect of blowing up those planets wasn't adequately explained. It's a bigger blow to the rebels/resistance than Alderaan was.

The republic did have a fleet that was keeping the FO in check. However, it appears most of it was destroyed in the Hosnian system during the film.

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It's also idiotic to go around blowing up inhabitable planets... they're the ultimate finite resource.

In a universe where they can build planet sized space stations that travel through hyperspace?

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I get the feeling that the galaxy is somewhat in a state like the US leading up to the civil war. The Republic and the First Order are against each other. But the republic wants to avoid all out war initially. Which is where the Resistance comes in. It knows how dangerous the First Order is and actively fights it. The Republic turns a blind eye to the Resistance's actions hoping to resolve things more peaceably with the obviously disastrous results. The First Order knew they would need to deal a huge blow in order to have any upper hand and came up with their system killer, a serious upgrade to the earlier Empire's planet killer. Deathstars and Starkiller base are the nukes of the Star Wars galaxy. Using Starkiller is similar to the South having a nuke and using it on Washington. The results of the Civil War may have been vastly different.

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It's also idiotic to go around blowing up inhabitable planets... they're the ultimate finite resource.

 

If they fired the Death Star two times a second for the next ten thousand years, the average galaxy would still billions of planets.

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It's also idiotic to go around blowing up inhabitable planets... they're the ultimate finite resource.

 

If they fired the Death Star two times a second for the next ten thousand years, the average galaxy would still billions of planets.

 

 

We're not worried about all planets -- just the small fraction that are habitable planets.

Edited by MaxKilljoy

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