My Keys to Winning at Sullest

[Darth Lupine 1,556]

I'm actually slowly putting togheter a small rebel fleet just for practice, you understand!

[cynanbloodbane 3,469]

I point at you as hard as I can.

You've mistaken me for a Pokémon good sir!

I wanna be the very best, like no one ever was....

To double arc is my real test, to table is my caaaaaaause!

Oh, I just cant wait to be Kiiing

(Or did i get the wrong song?)

[ScottieATF 2,867]

If you go into a tournament expecting people to play something other then lists designed to win the event, then I think your expectations are quite foolish.

[Tvayumat 3,637]

If you go into a tournament expecting people to play something other then lists designed to win the event, then I think your expectations are quite foolish.

Did I say that?

Interesting.

It's really unfortunate that the present tournament scoring system is so narrowly defined by MoV. It'll be interesting to see what the collected AARs from Sullust tell us about the upcoming "meta".

Edited September 24, 2015 by Tvayumat

[Cuthawolf 129]

Sucks to your Meta. (If you can't pinpoint that misused quote your English department was different than mine.)

 

That said, i intend to bring an AF2A, The Salvation, Two Corvettes (likely an A and B) with assorted upgrades and no fighters. Perhaps it's a mistake, but I find the current Rebel (my faction) squadron game to be very frustrating and unfulfilling. I'm hoping to be more aggressive than usual, willing to trade the smaller ships for larger Imperial Prey...and I intend to give up the smallest margin of points possible. I lost three of my four matches last tournament and still came second because I normally lost by only a few squadrons.

 

With no squadrons this time, hopefully I'll shave out that "lost by" part.

 

And I'm super looking forward to the part where I get to remake my list with new stuff. NOT looking forward to the guy who comes with a Netlist for the final game that's already planned for all the ships and cards he knows about.

[Mundo 264]

Like the OP's list of critical success factors. The keys for me will be:

1) Pick objectives that force a hard choice on your opponent. Happy to go second for free points and/or attack bonus on Demolisher. Equally happy to go first and get the first activation.

2) Fly my 3 ships (VVG) in the planned formation, to benefit from overlapping arcs of fire, placing the Victorys to take the brunt of enemy fire, and Demolisher to act as the finisher.

3) Navigate, navigate, navigate. The Imperial ships have enough power but need to ensure they get the right arcs to benefit.

4) 'Double threat': Ensure that I line up two simultaneous problems for the enemy to deal with in their turn, and therefore only saving one ship out of the two from a Victory's front arc or Demolisher broadside.

[ScottieATF 2,867]

If you go into a tournament expecting people to play something other then lists designed to win the event, then I think your expectations are quite foolish.

Did I say that?

Interesting.

It's really unfortunate that the present tournament scoring system is so narrowly defined by MoV. It'll be interesting to see what the collected AARs from Sullust tell us about the upcoming "meta".

I certainly don't disagree that the tournament structure overly narrows the scope of effective lists. It is not enough to win consistently, but you have to do so by large margins.

[GronardII 385]

 

 

 

 

Bid is irrelevant.

Going with a four ship build. No squadrons. Aiming for fastest win possible in the mos efficient way.

Not to cast aspersions, but this is my least favorite player type to encounter either casually or in tournament.

Will you win? Statistically, yes.

Is your list fun or interesting to play against? Generally, no.

We're all playing for different reasons I suppose.

Be careful how you tread.  The Victory Point System and Tourney Rules breed this type of composition.  Stylish play isn't rewarded...yet.  You can't shun the monster (killing harder in this case) when the system keeps feeding it.

 

Case in point:  I lost a tourney last week based on Margin of Victory, to a player I had already beat.   I was 3-0, he was 2-1.  But he 'Pwned Harderest'...and I placed second based on MoV.  Did I have a stylish list?  yeppers!  But zero points given for that sadly. 

 

I hope this doesn't blow up into a fingerpointing match.  /salute

I can and do shun the monster.

I accept that this puts me at a measurable disadvantage. I'm fine with it. Just means I have to be more clever than my opponent to win, using objectives, obstacles, subterfuge and unexpected combinations in place of the ol "Front Toward Enemy" strategy.

As I said, I don't want to cast aspersions on people who play this way. They can do whatever they want, and if they're having fun I encourage them to continue. Just stating that personally I don't have fun playing the same list over and over and over, nor do I have fun playing a list that intentionally exploits weaknesses in the tournament scoring system. (Which clearly favors maximum activations and playing to table rather than to win objectives.)

YMMV

No offense taken.

I play very different when playing casual. When at a tourney, there's money involved (entry fee), plus a ton of swag ( Sullust ), so of course I'm going to bring the absolute most efficient brutal fleet I can manage, and I completely expect the opposition to do the same.

No tourney, playing for fun? A different story, and I'm bringing whatever I think would be thematic/fun.

Tourneys are by definition a highly competitive environment. If you participate in a tourney, then you should come with that mind set, because while I will absolutely follow the rules and be a sport, I'm also going to be totally ruthless.

Example: last tourney my first opponent was a 15 or so year old kid, there with his dad, who was also playing. He was flying an imp list. Did I win? Yes, but through the game, I pointed out several mistakes he made, allowed him to make corrections out of sequence and generally cut him a ton of slack. He had a lot of fun, he said and learned a lot, for which he thanked me. My last opponent was a seasoned player, who came in second tourney before this one, so I cut him zero slack, and took advantage of every single error he made.

I think you would be ok playing me casual, but not tourney. It all depends on the setting.

Oh and someone asked....I always fly Empire. Even got the uniform...lol.

 

"Bid is irrelevant."  WHAT!!!!! NOOOO!!!!!!!! .......

 

Bid and objectives man, it's all about trapping the fish in the barrel, then blowing that sucker up.

[mobow213 133]

Bid is irrelevant.

Going with a four ship build. No squadrons. Aiming for fastest win possible in the mos efficient way.

Not to cast aspersions, but this is my least favorite player type to encounter either casually or in tournament.

Will you win? Statistically, yes.

Is your list fun or interesting to play against? Generally, no.

We're all playing for different reasons I suppose.

Be careful how you tread.  The Victory Point System and Tourney Rules breed this type of composition.  Stylish play isn't rewarded...yet.  You can't shun the monster (killing harder in this case) when the system keeps feeding it.

 

Case in point:  I lost a tourney last week based on Margin of Victory, to a player I had already beat.   I was 3-0, he was 2-1.  But he 'Pwned Harderest'...and I placed second based on MoV.  Did I have a stylish list?  yeppers!  But zero points given for that sadly. 

 

I hope this doesn't blow up into a fingerpointing match.  /salute

Maybe it should go win lose. Then mov.

Ie 3-0 295 pt

3-0 255

Then

2-1. 300 pts

[Drasnighta 27,022]

Keep Playing Rebel Scum, and keep all of those players who have been practicing Imperials vs Imperials on the back foot.

That, and paint up 3 more B-Wing Squadrons.

Yummy.

[Lyraeus 4,759]

Keep Playing Rebel Scum, and keep all of those players who have been practicing Imperials vs Imperials on the back foot.

That, and paint up 3 more B-Wing Squadrons.

Yummy.

I have 4 B-Wing Squadrons to paint up. . . and 2 A-Wings. . . 

 

My list test decently well last night but it was against another dual whale list running the same point of squadrons in a different match-up. While a great game is was only a base test. . . I don't know if I will make top on the Friday Tournament. . . I TO Saturday and Sunday but I don't know how many people are showing up to those. 

[Drasnighta 27,022]

 

Keep Playing Rebel Scum, and keep all of those players who have been practicing Imperials vs Imperials on the back foot.

That, and paint up 3 more B-Wing Squadrons.

Yummy.

I have 4 B-Wing Squadrons to paint up. . . and 2 A-Wings. . . 

 

My list test decently well last night but it was against another dual whale list running the same point of squadrons in a different match-up. While a great game is was only a base test. . . I don't know if I will make top on the Friday Tournament. . . I TO Saturday and Sunday but I don't know how many people are showing up to those. 

 

 

All my Snubs are painted now...  I just have to decide on AF-Neb-CRa or AF-Neb-Neb...   ::sigh::

I get, maybe 1 or 2 games to practice with this weekend, and then I have to commit to Sullust.

[Lyraeus 4,759]

 

 

Keep Playing Rebel Scum, and keep all of those players who have been practicing Imperials vs Imperials on the back foot.

That, and paint up 3 more B-Wing Squadrons.

Yummy.

I have 4 B-Wing Squadrons to paint up. . . and 2 A-Wings. . . 

 

My list test decently well last night but it was against another dual whale list running the same point of squadrons in a different match-up. While a great game is was only a base test. . . I don't know if I will make top on the Friday Tournament. . . I TO Saturday and Sunday but I don't know how many people are showing up to those. 

 

 

All my Snubs are painted now...  I just have to decide on AF-Neb-CRa or AF-Neb-Neb...   ::sigh::

I get, maybe 1 or 2 games to practice with this weekend, and then I have to commit to Sullust.

 

I have a game night friday but that is me more showing people how to play. . . I cant use my sullust list there. . . the B Whale Roll is a bit strong I think.

[Darth Lupine 1,556]

Bid is irrelevant.

Going with a four ship build. No squadrons. Aiming for fastest win possible in the mos efficient way.

Not to cast aspersions, but this is my least favorite player type to encounter either casually or in tournament.

Will you win? Statistically, yes.

Is your list fun or interesting to play against? Generally, no.

We're all playing for different reasons I suppose.

Be careful how you tread.  The Victory Point System and Tourney Rules breed this type of composition.  Stylish play isn't rewarded...yet.  You can't shun the monster (killing harder in this case) when the system keeps feeding it.

 

Case in point:  I lost a tourney last week based on Margin of Victory, to a player I had already beat.   I was 3-0, he was 2-1.  But he 'Pwned Harderest'...and I placed second based on MoV.  Did I have a stylish list?  yeppers!  But zero points given for that sadly. 

 

I hope this doesn't blow up into a fingerpointing match.  /salute

I can and do shun the monster.

I accept that this puts me at a measurable disadvantage. I'm fine with it. Just means I have to be more clever than my opponent to win, using objectives, obstacles, subterfuge and unexpected combinations in place of the ol "Front Toward Enemy" strategy.

As I said, I don't want to cast aspersions on people who play this way. They can do whatever they want, and if they're having fun I encourage them to continue. Just stating that personally I don't have fun playing the same list over and over and over, nor do I have fun playing a list that intentionally exploits weaknesses in the tournament scoring system. (Which clearly favors maximum activations and playing to table rather than to win objectives.)

YMMV

No offense taken.

I play very different when playing casual. When at a tourney, there's money involved (entry fee), plus a ton of swag ( Sullust ), so of course I'm going to bring the absolute most efficient brutal fleet I can manage, and I completely expect the opposition to do the same.

No tourney, playing for fun? A different story, and I'm bringing whatever I think would be thematic/fun.

Tourneys are by definition a highly competitive environment. If you participate in a tourney, then you should come with that mind set, because while I will absolutely follow the rules and be a sport, I'm also going to be totally ruthless.

Example: last tourney my first opponent was a 15 or so year old kid, there with his dad, who was also playing. He was flying an imp list. Did I win? Yes, but through the game, I pointed out several mistakes he made, allowed him to make corrections out of sequence and generally cut him a ton of slack. He had a lot of fun, he said and learned a lot, for which he thanked me. My last opponent was a seasoned player, who came in second tourney before this one, so I cut him zero slack, and took advantage of every single error he made.

I think you would be ok playing me casual, but not tourney. It all depends on the setting.

Oh and someone asked....I always fly Empire. Even got the uniform...lol.

"Bid is irrelevant."  WHAT!!!!! NOOOO!!!!!!!! .......

 

Bid and objectives man, it's all about trapping the fish in the barrel, then blowing that sucker up.

No. It's all about blowing up every enemy capital ship as fast and efficiently as possible, while losing at the most only one Gladiator.

With the curren tourney score system, nothing else is really important, I've found out. I honestly wish that would change. The system Flames of War uses would be way more fun, I think.

[Lyraeus 4,759]

While that does work Lupine, it can fall flat rather quickly.

[Darth Lupine 1,556]

While that does work Lupine, it can fall flat rather quickly.

It's all in the execution, my friend. I do agree I have actually worked out a counter to this list, but my lips are sealed. Not about to give away military secrets!

[Lyraeus 4,759]

I make my own counter. At that point I let you play your game into my trap.

It's all about using speed. Knowing to slow down, speed up, etc

[Stasy 2,502]

I'm thinking in the next week I'll get maybe one more game and against a live opponent who knows what they are doing. That really doesn't bode well for me and going to Sullust and not getting annihilated. Still need to hammer out a final list.

At least I get 3 cracks at getting it to work.

I'm pretty sure it's a double AFmkII and a single Neb Support list with two squads. It's what I've liked to fly and feel like it performs well, but is ultimately nothing flashy.

Edited September 24, 2015 by Stasy

[Lyraeus 4,759]

I'm thinking in the next week I'll get maybe one more game and against a live opponent who knows what they are doing. That really doesn't bode well for me and going to Sullust and not getting annihilated. Still need to hammer out a final list.

At least I get 3 cracks at getting it to work.

I'm pretty sure it's a double AFmkII and a single Neb Support list with two squads. It's what I've liked to fly and feel like it performs well, but is ultimately nothing flashy.

I might 3 cracks at this. . . I am TO for 2 out of 3 of these

[Darth Lupine 1,556]

I make my own counter. At that point I let you play your game into my trap.

It's all about using speed. Knowing to slow down, speed up, etc

Indeed it is. Hopefully one day we get to test this in person!

[GronardII 385]

 

 

 

 

 

 

Bid is irrelevant.

Going with a four ship build. No squadrons. Aiming for fastest win possible in the mos efficient way.

Not to cast aspersions, but this is my least favorite player type to encounter either casually or in tournament.

Will you win? Statistically, yes.

Is your list fun or interesting to play against? Generally, no.

We're all playing for different reasons I suppose.

Be careful how you tread.  The Victory Point System and Tourney Rules breed this type of composition.  Stylish play isn't rewarded...yet.  You can't shun the monster (killing harder in this case) when the system keeps feeding it.

 

Case in point:  I lost a tourney last week based on Margin of Victory, to a player I had already beat.   I was 3-0, he was 2-1.  But he 'Pwned Harderest'...and I placed second based on MoV.  Did I have a stylish list?  yeppers!  But zero points given for that sadly. 

 

I hope this doesn't blow up into a fingerpointing match.  /salute

I can and do shun the monster.

I accept that this puts me at a measurable disadvantage. I'm fine with it. Just means I have to be more clever than my opponent to win, using objectives, obstacles, subterfuge and unexpected combinations in place of the ol "Front Toward Enemy" strategy.

As I said, I don't want to cast aspersions on people who play this way. They can do whatever they want, and if they're having fun I encourage them to continue. Just stating that personally I don't have fun playing the same list over and over and over, nor do I have fun playing a list that intentionally exploits weaknesses in the tournament scoring system. (Which clearly favors maximum activations and playing to table rather than to win objectives.)

YMMV

No offense taken.

I play very different when playing casual. When at a tourney, there's money involved (entry fee), plus a ton of swag ( Sullust ), so of course I'm going to bring the absolute most efficient brutal fleet I can manage, and I completely expect the opposition to do the same.

No tourney, playing for fun? A different story, and I'm bringing whatever I think would be thematic/fun.

Tourneys are by definition a highly competitive environment. If you participate in a tourney, then you should come with that mind set, because while I will absolutely follow the rules and be a sport, I'm also going to be totally ruthless.

Example: last tourney my first opponent was a 15 or so year old kid, there with his dad, who was also playing. He was flying an imp list. Did I win? Yes, but through the game, I pointed out several mistakes he made, allowed him to make corrections out of sequence and generally cut him a ton of slack. He had a lot of fun, he said and learned a lot, for which he thanked me. My last opponent was a seasoned player, who came in second tourney before this one, so I cut him zero slack, and took advantage of every single error he made.

I think you would be ok playing me casual, but not tourney. It all depends on the setting.

Oh and someone asked....I always fly Empire. Even got the uniform...lol.

"Bid is irrelevant."  WHAT!!!!! NOOOO!!!!!!!! .......

 

Bid and objectives man, it's all about trapping the fish in the barrel, then blowing that sucker up.

No. It's all about blowing up every enemy capital ship as fast and efficiently as possible, while losing at the most only one Gladiator.

With the curren tourney score system, nothing else is really important, I've found out. I honestly wish that would change. The system Flames of War uses would be way more fun, I think.

 

Tisk, tisk, how are you going to average 300+ points a game.

 

K, 300+ a game isn't something that can be maintained, I've spent to much time trying to teach my local scum not to fall for all the obvious traps. That's why I can't let them get control of the bid, I don't want to get beat by a CR90 willing to grab 75 points and call it a day.

[Cubanboy 6,540]

My rules

Don't roll blanks.

Don't Fly off the board.
Bring your ships.

find a store that has only one other person that shows up and just roll a D6 to see who wins, after that play one game that is 800 points per side.

 

Edited September 25, 2015 by Cubanboy