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Leeboy24

The Future of the X-Wing Starfighter

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Just starting out in the world of X-Wing miniatures game. I'm an avid wargammer and love Star Wars. So I don't know why I took so long to get this but that's a different story. I've spent the last two weeks listening to Podcasts and devouring the Internet learning as much as I can about this game.It seems the general consensus is the X-wing is not a go to kick butt ship.I also understand the game has a very competitive community. So I guess my question is will the X-wing ever become a viable ship on the competitive circuit? Can or will FFG fix this issue and show the X-Wing some love? Curious to hear your feedback

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The best fix is likely to just be a Title card for the T-65.

 

Title: T-65B 0 pts

T-65 X-wing Only

If you equip an Astromech upgrade card, its squad point cost is reduced by 2 to a minimum of 0.

If this ship has an Astromech equipped, at the end of the Planning Phase you may spend a shield token to flip a damage card facedown OR flip a damage card faceup to gain a shield token (up to your shield value.)

 

I don't believe we'll see a Title or other upgrade card specific to X-wings that grant the Boost ability as some have suggested. For one, if it came with a negative cost it would allow a 5-ship X-wing list that would be hardier and more maneuverable than the equivalent 5-Kihraxz list. On the other hand, if it had a 0 or positive point cost, no one would choose a non-unique pilot over the T-70 counterpart.  

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Here's the thing:

 

I know I am one of the few people who think this way, but I can't imagine that the T-70 is supposed to be the fix to all of our T-65 problems.

 

T-70s weren't around for the initial Death Star Assault at the Battle of Yavin, the Escape from Hoth, the Battle of Endor, or anything in between.  The meta is all about "what can I put together that will beat all comers", as it should be.  However, with 30ish years separating Episode VI from Episode VII, it's hard to imagine that a T-70 would ever be involved with Y-Wings or B-Wings.  I like that the two eras can play together, but it would be more interesting to me to see scenarios that are "historically balanced", as ludicrous as that sounds.

 

And I would still like to see the T-65 be a dangerous ship that was versatile enough to show up in most Rebel lists, since the game is named after it.

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Well in the EU or Legends the E Wing is what the the T-70 is in Force Awakens it is the 30 years later ship. I do see what you are saying but you have to look at it from a game design perspective. The T-65 as is, is just about useless. Some of the named pilots have their uses sure.

So you have to give the X some form of buff. Calling it the T-70 and making its stats better and costing a few more points is a pretty solid fix. The ship now works. The Khirax works because its only 20 points and had they not released it I would say the best fix for the X wing was to drop it a point and call it good. Dropping an upgrade that turns a 65 into a 70 for 3 points solves all problems. You have options at that point. You can still take Biggs for 25 points or you can take Biggs in a T-70 for 28 points. Wedge goes from being a glass cannon to crazy terrifying like he used to be. They are not against doing drastic things to make ships better, look at the TiE Adv as an example. The problem that ship had was not the same problem the X wing has. Simply giving the X wing some free upgrades the way they did to the Adv might have worked, however once they released the T-70 that wont work anymore. 

Yes its not thematically 100% accurate but it would fix the X-Wing.

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Well in the EU or Legends the E Wing is what the the T-70 is in Force Awakens it is the 30 years later ship. I do see what you are saying but you have to look at it from a game design perspective. The T-65 as is, is just about useless. Some of the named pilots have their uses sure.

So you have to give the X some form of buff. Calling it the T-70 and making its stats better and costing a few more points is a pretty solid fix. The ship now works. The Khirax works because its only 20 points and had they not released it I would say the best fix for the X wing was to drop it a point and call it good. Dropping an upgrade that turns a 65 into a 70 for 3 points solves all problems. You have options at that point. You can still take Biggs for 25 points or you can take Biggs in a T-70 for 28 points. Wedge goes from being a glass cannon to crazy terrifying like he used to be. They are not against doing drastic things to make ships better, look at the TiE Adv as an example. The problem that ship had was not the same problem the X wing has. Simply giving the X wing some free upgrades the way they did to the Adv might have worked, however once they released the T-70 that wont work anymore. 

Yes its not thematically 100% accurate but it would fix the X-Wing.

The T-70 doesn't really help those who want to play exclusively Galactic Civil War stuff though, in terms of my casual play I'm far more interested in playing scenarios from the OT than anything new. I can't mix the two I find it hard enough doing stuff like using Greedo against Luke, the guy was dead before Luke ever sat in an X-wing and my brain can't handle it!

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If you're playing scenarios then you're not bound by tournament rules. Use the T-70 dial, increase cost by 3 points and add a free Shield upgrade and Engine Upgrade at no slot cost. Boom: fixed X-wing!

 

Or if that's too much, just put a T-65 model on the T-70's peg and use the generically named Blue Squadron Novice, Red Squadron Veteran and Blue Ace.

Edited by Blue Five

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Welcome to the game! If you get your hands on a few X-wings and learn to play them, you'll probably be wondering what all the fuss is about: They have reasonable maneuvers, decent damage, don't break the bank, and have some of the very best pilots in the game (looking at you, Biggs, Tarn, Wedge and Luke!) As you get further into the game (or start playing vs someone who has experience) the ship's limitations will become obvious, and you'll be drawn to more specialised ships, depending on your own tastes - 'leaf on the wind', 'go big or go home', 'there's too many of them!', etc... By that point, FFG will have released a buff for the ship, and you'll be in 7th heaven because your first love will be given a new lease of life. 

 

Don't worry about the anxious hand-wringing you read on these threads too much - they're talking about the game at its highest levels, i.e. regional/national builds, where everything is about squeezing the last few drops out of your lists' point efficiency, and leveraging mechanics to the point of breaking.

 

It's a great great game, on so many levels, and no doubt you'll have a blast, with or without the good old X in your squad.  :)

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I think the people saying that the T-70 is the fix for the X-Wing are completely missing the point.  Obsoleting an old ship and saying, "Hey, just buy a bunch of this new ship!  It's way better," is not a fix.  For example, I have five of the old X-Wings now.  I really don't want any more X-Wings even if they are a slightly different model, and honestly, I'm not really very interested in getting any Episode 7 stuff.  But according to the "T-70 is the fix" crowd, I would have to buy a bunch of new X-Wings to replace the ships I already have.  Sure, since I play casually I could pretend that all my X-Wings are the new fancy X-Wing by printing out a bunch of new cards and somehow finding a way to create five new dials, but that's still missing the point: the old X-Wing is still not very good.

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Just starting out in the world of X-Wing miniatures game. I'm an avid wargammer and love Star Wars. So I don't know why I took so long to get this but that's a different story. I've spent the last two weeks listening to Podcasts and devouring the Internet learning as much as I can about this game.It seems the general consensus is the X-wing is not a go to kick butt ship.I also understand the game has a very competitive community. So I guess my question is will the X-wing ever become a viable ship on the competitive circuit? Can or will FFG fix this issue and show the X-Wing some love? Curious to hear your feedback

 

The named pilots are fine. The generics aren't. However, FFG now has a proven record of releasing fixes for overcosted ships in the form of new upgrade cards. So, I think you can hold out hope for the T-65.

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The old T-65 pilots are really good in very specific lists . Biggs is about the only one still used a lot and that's mainly because of his ability. He is taken as a blaster sponge and is only expected to live a round or 2. Luke's nice if you give him Lone wolf and R2 and run him as a solo flanker, unfortunately the X is still not a great flanker.

 

So I have a question for the T-70 isnt the fix camp. What could they do to the 65 that would make you take one over a B or a T-70? I am not talking about in special cases based on pilot abilities, talk generics that is the easiest comparison. Granted a 3 point upgrade that changes a 65 to a 70 would make Red's and Rookies obsolete but you could still take them with the title if you wanted.  

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So I have a question for the T-70 isnt the fix camp. What could they do to the 65 that would make you take one over a B or a T-70? I am not talking about in special cases based on pilot abilities, talk generics that is the easiest comparison. Granted a 3 point upgrade that changes a 65 to a 70 would make Red's and Rookies obsolete but you could still take them with the title if you wanted.  

 

Honestly, that's what I was originally hoping the core set would be: essentially a bunch of T-65s and TIE/LNs but with some titles or modifications that convert them to the new T-70 and TIE/FO, respectively.  I think the new dial kind of ruined any possibility of that happening, though.

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Could be something as simple as a Torpedo slot modification.

 

0pt: X-Wing Only, Reduce the squad point cost of any equipped Astromech by 2 points to a minimum of 0, gain 1 shield.

 

Removes the stupid torp slot nobody uses, and makes the X-Wing a decent ship without throwing it into the boosting/barrel rolling arc dodger territory it doesn't belong in.

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Here's the thing:

 

I know I am one of the few people who think this way, but I can't imagine that the T-70 is supposed to be the fix to all of our T-65 problems.

If by "one of the few people who think this way" you mean "one of the overwhelming majority of people who think this way" then sure.

Nobody but the alarmiest of alarmists think that the fix for the X-Wing that's been alluded to will end up being "Throw Out All Your Old X-Wings And Use This New One Instead."

It probably won't be this month. It probably won't be till after Wave 8 is released early next year. But in the immortal words of Eddard Kenobi, the X-Wing fix is coming.

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