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I'm New - Maybe I don't get it - But Imperial Assault is starting to be a disappointment

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In one campaign that I'm running, players expressed a disappointment about the way the game is balanced. They understand that if they want to win, they have to rush to the objective and forget about gunning everyone Rambo style, but they think it makes for a boring game, not the experience they were expecting.

 

So, since I don't care about losing or winning, I'm thinking about removing the time limit, except in missions where it's really thematic. To try and balance that, I'm thinking about limiting each heroes to one rest per turn. Or should it be a team Rest Pool, say 3 rests per turn.

That is a good houserule.  If you remove or delay the time limit, the Rest action becomes too powerful, since the heroes can make it so that they basically never die or get wounded...and that's no fun.  Also, pay attention to the fact that not all of the missions have a time limit.  

 

What you might consider doing for to adjust the timed missions is to limit the amount of Rest actions to X per mission.  After they've used all of their Rests, they can rest no more.  Maybe represent this with some tokens or something.  I think you'd have to play around with the number of available Rests, but I think it's better to give them a specific number of Rests per mission, rather than per round.

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In one campaign that I'm running, players expressed a disappointment about the way the game is balanced. They understand that if they want to win, they have to rush to the objective and forget about gunning everyone Rambo style, but they think it makes for a boring game, not the experience they were expecting.

 

So, since I don't care about losing or winning, I'm thinking about removing the time limit, except in missions where it's really thematic. To try and balance that, I'm thinking about limiting each heroes to one rest per turn. Or should it be a team Rest Pool, say 3 rests per turn.

That is a good houserule.  If you remove or delay the time limit, the Rest action becomes too powerful, since the heroes can make it so that they basically never die or get wounded...and that's no fun.  Also, pay attention to the fact that not all of the missions have a time limit.  

 

What you might consider doing for to adjust the timed missions is to limit the amount of Rest actions to X per mission.  After they've used all of their Rests, they can rest no more.  Maybe represent this with some tokens or something.  I think you'd have to play around with the number of available Rests, but I think it's better to give them a specific number of Rests per mission, rather than per round.

 

For the missions without time limit, we'll just play them as intended. 

 

Good observation about the rest action being limited by mission instead of per turn. Maybe I could use the intended round limit as a base line. Half the number of round +1 maybe, would it be too harsh, too easy? A mission that is supposed to end by turn 6 would allow each player to rest 4 time per game.

 

Keep in mind that this group is looking more for a thematic experience than a competitive one. And I don't care about winning or losing, as long as the game still feel tight. So, not too easy not too hard, just casual fun with some friends.

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I came up with some house rules for removing round limits that I really like. First, don't remove the rest ability, but rather a hero can only rest when they have strain. So they can't rest twice in a turn and at best, they can only recover 3 or 4 health (depending on the character). The other thing I added that my group enjoyed was to allow the Imperial to add 1 new open group and double the threat gained on every round after the mission should have ended. This still makes it possible, but much more difficult for the Rebels to win.

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How to play imperial assault...

 

You know, that's one the of edited scenes I have the least problem with, but it's still badly done.

 

1) The new background Storm Troopers don't look natural

2) What is that room meant to be?  Are a load of Storm Troopers being loaded onto TIE Fighers?  We all know TIE Fighters have their own bays, and it's not the same bays were troopers get loaded on to transports.  I suppose it could just be some sort of parade ground where they show of all their cool stuff, like when they drive nuclear missiles through the streets of authoritarian cities, but this is on the Death Star - who's going to be impressed by that?!

3) It's just not as funny!  The joke was why is this squad of storm troopers running away from one man?  They realise this and turn the tables.  The joke is gone in the changed version.

 

3 is obviously the biggest.

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How to play imperial assault... https://youtu.be/raF9wfPxir8

I agree.

I still can't convince my fellow rebels that more running and less gunning is the way to go (and choking off halls, taking cover, etc).

But if this were AoR, EotE, or F&D this would go something like this...

1). Group rolls initiative. Han's player (Harrison) rolls highest. Getting multiple advantages, he yells for Luke and Leia to run while he uses an action to intimidate the storm troopers. Luke (Mark) and Leia (Carrie) decide to take his advice. Rolling a success and a triumph, the storm troopers actually flee!

2). Next round, rolling to lay down fire, Han not only whiffs (no successes) but rolls multiple despair results. The GM (George) shakes his head as the storm troopers change directions and return fire.

Edited by LordPasty

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I came up with some house rules for removing round limits that I really like. First, don't remove the rest ability, but rather a hero can only rest when they have strain. So they can't rest twice in a turn and at best, they can only recover 3 or 4 health (depending on the character). The other thing I added that my group enjoyed was to allow the Imperial to add 1 new open group and double the threat gained on every round after the mission should have ended. This still makes it possible, but much more difficult for the Rebels to win.

I thought about it a little bit more, and with your way, hero could still heal twice in a round: Rest action-Use one strain to move-Rest Action.

 

I think I will just not bother to limit Rest and double the threat once the rebels hit the round limit. Thematic, and it doesn't screw with the missions already without a time limit.

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I came up with some house rules for removing round limits that I really like. First, don't remove the rest ability, but rather a hero can only rest when they have strain. So they can't rest twice in a turn and at best, they can only recover 3 or 4 health (depending on the character). The other thing I added that my group enjoyed was to allow the Imperial to add 1 new open group and double the threat gained on every round after the mission should have ended. This still makes it possible, but much more difficult for the Rebels to win.

I thought about it a little bit more, and with your way, hero could still heal twice in a round: Rest action-Use one strain to move-Rest Action.

 

I think I will just not bother to limit Rest and double the threat once the rebels hit the round limit. Thematic, and it doesn't screw with the missions already without a time limit.

 

I thought using strain to move extra only works if you already are using the move action?

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I came up with some house rules for removing round limits that I really like. First, don't remove the rest ability, but rather a hero can only rest when they have strain. So they can't rest twice in a turn and at best, they can only recover 3 or 4 health (depending on the character). The other thing I added that my group enjoyed was to allow the Imperial to add 1 new open group and double the threat gained on every round after the mission should have ended. This still makes it possible, but much more difficult for the Rebels to win.

I thought about it a little bit more, and with your way, hero could still heal twice in a round: Rest action-Use one strain to move-Rest Action.

 

I think I will just not bother to limit Rest and double the threat once the rebels hit the round limit. Thematic, and it doesn't screw with the missions already without a time limit.

 

I thought using strain to move extra only works if you already are using the move action?

 

 

No you can use it just to gain a movement point. Which can be huge to get into the right spot to attack twice as an example.

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I came up with some house rules for removing round limits that I really like. First, don't remove the rest ability, but rather a hero can only rest when they have strain. So they can't rest twice in a turn and at best, they can only recover 3 or 4 health (depending on the character). The other thing I added that my group enjoyed was to allow the Imperial to add 1 new open group and double the threat gained on every round after the mission should have ended. This still makes it possible, but much more difficult for the Rebels to win.

I thought about it a little bit more, and with your way, hero could still heal twice in a round: Rest action-Use one strain to move-Rest Action.

 

I think I will just not bother to limit Rest and double the threat once the rebels hit the round limit. Thematic, and it doesn't screw with the missions already without a time limit.

 

I thought using strain to move extra only works if you already are using the move action?

 

Nope, you can still do it even if you didn't pick a move action. Your only limitation is that you can do it up to two times per activation.

 

It's a good way to move 1 to get out of cover, shoot twice (and regen your strain by using a surge) and move back 1 to take cover. Or just slowly move toward your objective by moving two then attacking twice and regen your strain with surges.

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I came up with some house rules for removing round limits that I really like. First, don't remove the rest ability, but rather a hero can only rest when they have strain. So they can't rest twice in a turn and at best, they can only recover 3 or 4 health (depending on the character). The other thing I added that my group enjoyed was to allow the Imperial to add 1 new open group and double the threat gained on every round after the mission should have ended. This still makes it possible, but much more difficult for the Rebels to win.

I thought about it a little bit more, and with your way, hero could still heal twice in a round: Rest action-Use one strain to move-Rest Action.

 

I think I will just not bother to limit Rest and double the threat once the rebels hit the round limit. Thematic, and it doesn't screw with the missions already without a time limit.

That's a good point. Although the people I play with know that the intent of the rule is not to allow things like that. I guess that's why it's a house rule.

 

Another variation on the unlimited rounds I came up with is to implement a risk/reward feature that allows the rebels to "escape" when the allotted mission time is over and they haven't completed their objectives, or they can keep playing with increased Imperial reinforcements pouring in (double threat and extra open groups). If they continue, and still lose, then the Imperial would get an extra influence and/or XP. If the Rebels win, then they would get the bonus they would normally achieve. I haven't been able to play test this yet.

Edited by thestag

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The idea of rushing through the mission, leaving viable enemies to attack you on multiple fronts and just *taking damage because you can handle it*  is a completely unsound tactical process.  It plays like someone who coded a video game, with no understanding of squad tactics at all, wrote it.  I was very, very disappointed.

 

I hear this complaint from my Rebel players all the time, but when I look back at the Star Wars movies rarely were all the enemies dispatched as our heroes traversed on adventures. They were always on the run, whether Escaping the assault on Echo Base or rescuing a Princess from the Death Star the baddies that weren't a big enough threat were inconvenienced and ran by.  This complaint comes up all the time in Descent as well but it's very thematic to the Star Wars franchise.

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The idea of rushing through the mission, leaving viable enemies to attack you on multiple fronts and just *taking damage because you can handle it*  is a completely unsound tactical process.  It plays like someone who coded a video game, with no understanding of squad tactics at all, wrote it.  I was very, very disappointed.

 

I hear this complaint from my Rebel players all the time, but when I look back at the Star Wars movies rarely were all the enemies dispatched as our heroes traversed on adventures. They were always on the run, whether Escaping the assault on Echo Base or rescuing a Princess from the Death Star the baddies that weren't a big enough threat were inconvenienced and ran by.  This complaint comes up all the time in Descent as well but it's very thematic to the Star Wars franchise.

 

 

Run away? Sure, all the time. Running past? Ok, maybe.

 

I don't remember the heroes running through a block of enemies, especially ones that were alert and actively firing at them.

 

- H8

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The idea of rushing through the mission, leaving viable enemies to attack you on multiple fronts and just *taking damage because you can handle it*  is a completely unsound tactical process.  It plays like someone who coded a video game, with no understanding of squad tactics at all, wrote it.  I was very, very disappointed.

 

I hear this complaint from my Rebel players all the time, but when I look back at the Star Wars movies rarely were all the enemies dispatched as our heroes traversed on adventures. They were always on the run, whether Escaping the assault on Echo Base or rescuing a Princess from the Death Star the baddies that weren't a big enough threat were inconvenienced and ran by.  This complaint comes up all the time in Descent as well but it's very thematic to the Star Wars franchise.

 

I always am the Imperial player since I'm the one that owns the game. The critic that got me thinking came from the second group of player, the one more casual that just want to relax and have some fun playing games. They understand the objective, what they need to do. But if they are to spend their time just running with their characters, they prefer to spend their time playing other games. I can understand the disappointment; do you want to play a Star Wars game to shoot down Stormtroopers or just to run pass them? Thematic as it may be, it can get boring pretty fast if that's not what you expect.

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The idea of rushing through the mission, leaving viable enemies to attack you on multiple fronts and just *taking damage because you can handle it*  is a completely unsound tactical process.  It plays like someone who coded a video game, with no understanding of squad tactics at all, wrote it.  I was very, very disappointed.

 

I hear this complaint from my Rebel players all the time, but when I look back at the Star Wars movies rarely were all the enemies dispatched as our heroes traversed on adventures. They were always on the run, whether Escaping the assault on Echo Base or rescuing a Princess from the Death Star the baddies that weren't a big enough threat were inconvenienced and ran by.  This complaint comes up all the time in Descent as well but it's very thematic to the Star Wars franchise.

 

 

Run away? Sure, all the time. Running past? Ok, maybe.

 

I don't remember the heroes running through a block of enemies, especially ones that were alert and actively firing at them.

 

- H8

 

 

Go rewatch a New Hope where Han Luke and Chewy run from troopers for a good 20 minutes on the Death star.

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The idea of rushing through the mission, leaving viable enemies to attack you on multiple fronts and just *taking damage because you can handle it*  is a completely unsound tactical process.  It plays like someone who coded a video game, with no understanding of squad tactics at all, wrote it.  I was very, very disappointed.

 

I hear this complaint from my Rebel players all the time, but when I look back at the Star Wars movies rarely were all the enemies dispatched as our heroes traversed on adventures. They were always on the run, whether Escaping the assault on Echo Base or rescuing a Princess from the Death Star the baddies that weren't a big enough threat were inconvenienced and ran by.  This complaint comes up all the time in Descent as well but it's very thematic to the Star Wars franchise.

 

I always am the Imperial player since I'm the one that owns the game. The critic that got me thinking came from the second group of player, the one more casual that just want to relax and have some fun playing games. They understand the objective, what they need to do. But if they are to spend their time just running with their characters, they prefer to spend their time playing other games. I can understand the disappointment; do you want to play a Star Wars game to shoot down Stormtroopers or just to run pass them? Thematic as it may be, it can get boring pretty fast if that's not what you expect.

 

 

My players have never gotten to that point, they always have tough decisions to make "Do I finish this guy off or perform a double move or try to snipe him in one hit and do a single move."

 

I've yet to see a mission where you can't attack and all you can do is run.

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The idea of rushing through the mission, leaving viable enemies to attack you on multiple fronts and just *taking damage because you can handle it*  is a completely unsound tactical process.  It plays like someone who coded a video game, with no understanding of squad tactics at all, wrote it.  I was very, very disappointed.

 

I hear this complaint from my Rebel players all the time, but when I look back at the Star Wars movies rarely were all the enemies dispatched as our heroes traversed on adventures. They were always on the run, whether Escaping the assault on Echo Base or rescuing a Princess from the Death Star the baddies that weren't a big enough threat were inconvenienced and ran by.  This complaint comes up all the time in Descent as well but it's very thematic to the Star Wars franchise.

 

 

Run away? Sure, all the time. Running past? Ok, maybe.

 

I don't remember the heroes running through a block of enemies, especially ones that were alert and actively firing at them.

 

- H8

 

 

Go rewatch a New Hope where Han Luke and Chewy run from troopers for a good 20 minutes on the Death star.

 

 

No, that was exactly my point. They ran AWAY FROM the troopers.

 

Like, the heroes turn into a hallway, and find a bunch of Stormtroopers at the other end. What do the heroes do?

1) Heroes go back THE OTHER WAY down the hallway, AWAY from the obvious danger.

2) Heroes run (with miraculous luck and preternatural dodging ability) ACROSS the hallway (i.e. intersection) to take a different route.

3) Heroes run charging down the hallway, directly into the hail of blaster shots, take several hits that they nevertheless shrug off, continue on DIRECTLY THROUGH the waiting squad of troopers, as if shouldering through a football play, singing "HAHAHA can't catch me, I'm the gingerbread man!" and continue on their merry way, absolutely unimpeded by the comically inept blockade.

 

#1 and #2 happen all the time, with full admittance to plot armor, etc.

 

#3 NEVER EVER HAPPENS. Except in Imperial Assault.

 

- H8

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The idea of rushing through the mission, leaving viable enemies to attack you on multiple fronts and just *taking damage because you can handle it*  is a completely unsound tactical process.  It plays like someone who coded a video game, with no understanding of squad tactics at all, wrote it.  I was very, very disappointed.

 

I hear this complaint from my Rebel players all the time, but when I look back at the Star Wars movies rarely were all the enemies dispatched as our heroes traversed on adventures. They were always on the run, whether Escaping the assault on Echo Base or rescuing a Princess from the Death Star the baddies that weren't a big enough threat were inconvenienced and ran by.  This complaint comes up all the time in Descent as well but it's very thematic to the Star Wars franchise.

 

 

Run away? Sure, all the time. Running past? Ok, maybe.

 

I don't remember the heroes running through a block of enemies, especially ones that were alert and actively firing at them.

 

- H8

 

 

Go rewatch a New Hope where Han Luke and Chewy run from troopers for a good 20 minutes on the Death star.

 

 

No, that was exactly my point. They ran AWAY FROM the troopers.

 

Like, the heroes turn into a hallway, and find a bunch of Stormtroopers at the other end. What do the heroes do?

1) Heroes go back THE OTHER WAY down the hallway, AWAY from the obvious danger.

2) Heroes run (with miraculous luck and preternatural dodging ability) ACROSS the hallway (i.e. intersection) to take a different route.

3) Heroes run charging down the hallway, directly into the hail of blaster shots, take several hits that they nevertheless shrug off, continue on DIRECTLY THROUGH the waiting squad of troopers, as if shouldering through a football play, singing "HAHAHA can't catch me, I'm the gingerbread man!" and continue on their merry way, absolutely unimpeded by the comically inept blockade.

 

#1 and #2 happen all the time, with full admittance to plot armor, etc.

 

#3 NEVER EVER HAPPENS. Except in Imperial Assault.

 

- H8

 

You have to remember that some of it is an abstraction to fit within the mechanisms of a game. A game where one hit means a hero is eliminated (which would be more realistic as you want) wouldn't make an interesting fun game where you would be too dependant on luck.

Likewise for the abstraction you can assume players to be taking cover in surrounding scenery as they move, with damage representing hits to armour, pinning characters down etc.

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How about the imperial player receives one threat for each rest action a hero takes? 

 

 

But I like the idea of ignoring the time limit regarding the end of the mission and make it just harder for the heros after that time limit. But I feel this could be quite hard to balance as well. But depending on the imperial player he could adjust how much opponents pour in based on how much damage the heros already have. Too many foes could be frustrating for the players as well. 

 

Admittedly I havent played many missions yet. And the first mission is probably not the best benchmark for that. But considering the fact that the first mission should be fun and not frustratinig I think that relaxing the time limit would be a good idea. 

 

Overall very good ideas in this thread. I also like the idea of limiting the amount of rests per mission. Especially considering that at some point you cant just patch you up more. 

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No you can use it just to gain a movement point. Which can be huge to get into the right spot to attack twice as an example.

 

I just looked this up, and it's slightly confusing:

 

ADDITIONAL MOVEMENT

At any point during his activation, a hero may suffer [sTRAIN] to gain movement points. For each [sTRAIN] he suffers, the hero gains one movement point, which is added to the total of movement points he possesses. Only heroes can suffer [sTRAIN] to gain  movement points.  A hero can do this up to two times per activation.

 

So, if I'm reading that right, you can do it up to twice per activation, but it's not limited to one strain each time, meaning you could take strain up to your limit to move, then rest to get rid of them (which is your first action), the take strain again to move up to your strain limit, then take your second action.  So you could move around 10 squares without doing a single action.  Is that right?

 

Edit:  and your final action could be a move!  Is this right?!

 

PS

We need in-game symbols on the forums - strain, hits, etc.

Edited by mazz0

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No you can use it just to gain a movement point. Which can be huge to get into the right spot to attack twice as an example.

 

I just looked this up, and it's slightly confusing:

 

ADDITIONAL MOVEMENT

At any point during his activation, a hero may suffer [sTRAIN] to gain movement points. For each [sTRAIN] he suffers, the hero gains one movement point, which is added to the total of movement points he possesses. Only heroes can suffer [sTRAIN] to gain  movement points.  A hero can do this up to two times per activation.

 

So, if I'm reading that right, you can do it up to twice per activation, but it's not limited to one strain each time, meaning you could take strain up to your limit to move, then rest to get rid of them (which is your first action), the take strain again to move up to your strain limit, then take your second action.  So you could move around 10 squares without doing a single action.  Is that right?

 

Edit:  and your final action could be a move!  Is this right?!

 

PS

We need in-game symbols on the forums - strain, hits, etc.

 

Use the rules reference manual to check rules, not the quick start guide. Under Strain -> Strain in a campaign it specifically states may suffer 1 strain to gain 1 movement point, which you may do up to twice per activation.

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No you can use it just to gain a movement point. Which can be huge to get into the right spot to attack twice as an example.

 

I just looked this up, and it's slightly confusing:

 

ADDITIONAL MOVEMENT

At any point during his activation, a hero may suffer [sTRAIN] to gain movement points. For each [sTRAIN] he suffers, the hero gains one movement point, which is added to the total of movement points he possesses. Only heroes can suffer [sTRAIN] to gain  movement points.  A hero can do this up to two times per activation.

 

So, if I'm reading that right, you can do it up to twice per activation, but it's not limited to one strain each time, meaning you could take strain up to your limit to move, then rest to get rid of them (which is your first action), the take strain again to move up to your strain limit, then take your second action.  So you could move around 10 squares without doing a single action.  Is that right?

 

Edit:  and your final action could be a move!  Is this right?!

 

PS

We need in-game symbols on the forums - strain, hits, etc.

 

Use the rules reference manual to check rules, not the quick start guide. Under Strain -> Strain in a campaign it specifically states may suffer 1 strain to gain 1 movement point, which you may do up to twice per activation.

 

Aah, right.  That makes more sense!  I don't see why they couldn't have made that clear in the Learn to Play guide though.  It's one of the annoying things about IA, all the different rule books.

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