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CliffordHolm

Programmable missiles? Missiles with dials?

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I don't know about home brew, but I would love to see a missile or torp that worked this way officially. It would be very entertaining.

With that new punisher pilot dropping bombs out of his front guides, maybe we will see something like this eventually.

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Probably only good for epic, simulating TIE Fighters heavy rockets (a speed 5 straight and boost would do it, and impact to give 2crit+4-5 dice.) To be clear it's dial would only be 3,4,5 forward, and a boost, with boost allowing it to impact. Or better yet, boost to control turn, and a 3 4 5 to impact.

 

Thinking about it, i'd also give it an assault missile-like blast radius, doing 1 crit like a space bomb.

 

Maybe also does not detonate turn it is launched deal. and like 4 agi.

 

Or as I posted somewhere else - have it be an anti-huge/large doing bonus damage to either.

 

 

Another possibility. Missile with set rules. it'd require a TL to fire and MUST move (boost first then move probably) towards target, at fastest speed possible. Cost less points as guidance not as good, easier to dodge.

Edited by DariusAPB

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It would have to do Auto Damage probably. Other wise you'd spend 4 turns homing in on your target only to maybe do no damage. Boring. 

 

If it's remotely controlled, you could fire it on turn 1 then fly it in circles until a juicy target presents itself. Or worse, a Z swarm all packing the missile instantly turns from a swarm of 6 to a swarm of 12

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They'd have to move faster than the fastest ship otherwise the missiles would be out run. They'd also have to have a limited fuel supply (limited number of turns on the board). How would you handle the homing aspect? If using dials you could guess wrong and completely miss your target. What about ECM? Electronic Counter Measures for large or huge ships? If ECM then what about ECCM?

Star Fleet Battles used missiles decades ago. Talk about a power creep! While the concept is nice the practicality of adding them could result in a lot of additional bookkeeping and slow the game a lot. IMO the present, simplified use of rockets and missiles is a good compromise. With the EM upgrade becoming available this gives a needed boost to these weapons. Actually putting counters on the board may not be a good idea.

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Probably only good for epic, simulating TIE Fighters heavy rockets (a speed 5 straight and boost would do it, and impact to give 2crit+4-5 dice.) To be clear it's dial would only be 3,4,5 forward, and a boost, with boost allowing it to impact. Or better yet, boost to control turn, and a 3 4 5 to impact.

 

Thinking about it, i'd also give it an assault missile-like blast radius, doing 1 crit like a space bomb.

 

Maybe also does not detonate turn it is launched deal. and like 4 agi.

 

Or as I posted somewhere else - have it be an anti-huge/large doing bonus damage to either.

 

 

Another possibility. Missile with set rules. it'd require a TL to fire and MUST move (boost first then move probably) towards target, at fastest speed possible. Cost less points as guidance not as good, easier to dodge.

 

I actually had a similar idea for heavy proton rockets a couple months ago:

 

I miss the nail-biting bombing runs from Tie Fighter. To that end:

Heavy Proton Rocket <Bomb>

Cost: 5

When you reveal your maneuver dial, you may discard this card to drop one heavy proton rocket token.

Insert ID token with numeral matching your revealed maneuver's speed into rocket token.

Assign 3 Critical Hit tokens to rocket token.

When a ship executes a maneuver, if its base or maneuver template overlaps this token, this token detonates.

When this token executes a maneuver, if its base or maneuver template overlaps another ship or obstruction, this token detonates.

 

Heavy Proton Rocket Token

Proton rocket icon on a cardboard token exactly the size and shape of a small ship base, including nubs.

Token has cut-out slot for placing ID marker to indicate its speed.

Token has the following stats printed on it:

 

     PS: 12

     ATK: 0

     EVA: 2

     HUL: 1

     SHI: 0

     Icon: Boost

 

Proton Rocket cardboard stock includes ID # tokens #0 - #5 and three Critical Hit tokens.

 

Heavy Rocket Rules Card

Heavy Rockets activate similarly to ships, but are not ships.

  • Activation Phase: each token makes a green straight X maneuver (X = ID Indicator). e.g. a token dropped before a 2 Bank Left maneuver always moves 2 Straight.
  • Action: Once per round a heavy rocket token may spend one Critical Hit token to make a Boost action.
  • Combat Phase: a heavy rocket token cannot attack. A heavy rocket token defends normally.
  • When a rocket token detonates, deal 2 face-up damage cards to any ship overlapping it and 1 face-up damage card to each ship at range 1 from the token.
  • A destroyed rocket token does not detonate. A rocket token that leaves the field does not detonate.
  • A rocket token placed under a ship detonates immediately.
It pleases me to make an ordnance card that can destroy unwary bomber pilots as easily as it can enemy Huge ships.

 

Basically, you drop an HPR like a bomb. Its rocket motor kicks in at PS 12, so after everything else has moved, and it always moves at the speed its carrier was going when the HPR was dropped. Then the rocket steers by using its Crit tokens to buy boosts.

When it hits something (or something hits it), the HPR detonates similarly to a Proton Bomb, but doing more damage on direct hits.

After 3 boosts it runs out of propellant and drifts off the board.

Edited by sleet01

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I'm not sure I've heard a way to make this idea work that doesn't end up being fiddly and boring in practice. It's not that the idea are bad, but we end up on the simulation side of gaming, and that often reduces the fun.

On the other side: a Tie Bomber can be thought of as a long range, multi turn, homing torpedo. Complete with HP and agility.

I'm not sure what benefit there is to adding another ship like object to the playing field.

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I would go it has boost and can perform any Straight, 2 and 3 boosts and 3 turns, and if its template or token/base overlaps the target it does X damage, if it hits an Asteroid/debris field the missile is removed.

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How about this:

- Use the Senator's Shuttle token from the core kit.

- Give it an X-wing dial (just because it's an average dial and everyone has at least one of them).

- Assign 4 tracking token to represent fuel,

- Spends 1 token each turn before performing you maneuver.

- You may spend an additional token to perform a boost action.

 

Triggers as an Action, placed on the board the same as with mines, using the 1 straight, but you place it in front or your ship instead. It cannot detonate until the round after you've placed it.

Cost: 4

Target an enemy ship within 2-3

Deal 2 damage when it overlaps an enemy ship.

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Seems too complicated for this game, especially if you had several of them in your list.

 

Now that being said.  If you were to house rule them I would keep it simple.  You fire the missile out of your front guides with any of the three speed maneuvers (turn, bank or straight).  Then it moves at the same pilot skill as the person who fired it (use target locks to designate).  It does not have its own dial, you just select a 3 speed maneuver for it each turn.  If its base or maneuver template overlaps something it goes boom and inflicts some amount of auto-damage.

 

The problem with any of these rules is that you would most likely see people using them at very close range to just auto-hit stuff which would kind of ruin the fun of the mechanic

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...

The problem with any of these rules is that you would most likely see people using them at very close range to just auto-hit stuff which would kind of ruin the fun of the mechanic

That's why I went with a PS 12 move tied to the attacker's speed at drop time. A rocket that moves after everyone else and relies on post-move boosts to catch stuff is much harder to auto-hit with, but still offers some rewards for making skillful, high-speed attack runs.

SFB has a multitude of different seeking weapons and they really don't slow the game down... unless you count the time spent allocating all that damage >_>

The X-wing PC games had tons of slow-moving munitions that thematically added flexibility and tension to a lot of missions, and I for one would love to see that added to the minis game as well.

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...

The problem with any of these rules is that you would most likely see people using them at very close range to just auto-hit stuff which would kind of ruin the fun of the mechanic

That's why I went with a PS 12 move tied to the attacker's speed at drop time. A rocket that moves after everyone else and relies on post-move boosts to catch stuff is much harder to auto-hit with, but still offers some rewards for making skillful, high-speed attack runs.

SFB has a multitude of different seeking weapons and they really don't slow the game down... unless you count the time spent allocating all that damage >_>

The X-wing PC games had tons of slow-moving munitions that thematically added flexibility and tension to a lot of missions, and I for one would love to see that added to the minis game as well.

I can see them being dropped (fired) at the end of a combat round with a PS12 but they would to have a speed not dependent on the firing ship. The speed would have to be faster than the fastest big base ship or it would never catch them. If you're in a stern chase with a YT with boost and dropped it, the missile would never catch it. Think of the dial on the B-wing. I agree they couldn't detonate until the round after their first movement.

For duration how about 3 turns with 1 boost for the turn of impact?

SFB uses a different method for movement, a pulsed schedule, that seems better suited to missiles. Having the missiles move free while everyone else is locked into their movements is somewhat troubling. You'd also have to deal with turn restrictions. What's the tightest the missile could turn? SFB used a hexagonal grid while we're using movement templates. I can see a problem arising after 3 turns where the paths of the target and missie are diverging. This can be a source of arguments.

While I like the idea of separately flying ordnance I think there's a lot more to consider than how fast, how far and how much damage it causes.

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This has been a great discussion and thank you to everyone.

 

I was day dreaming this to have 2 purposes. First to simulate a chase scene where the hero out runs and out maneuvers a heat seeking missle.  Second to have some sort of kamikaze disposable weapon against Capital ships in Epic games.

 

I want it to cost 10 points and the stats will match that. 10 points because its cheaper than 12, the accepted lowest cost ship, and there are a couple of those now.

I was picturing this as an off the map area artilllery shot, so the launch platform will not be seen.  The guided missile will just appear on the edge of the deployment zone, but not the first turn.

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Here's my First Draft of my rules.  They've not been play tested.  Please give me constructive criticism.

 

   Ballistic Torpedo

Deployment

The model for the Ballistic Torpedo remains off the game mat during setup and stays there until deployed.  Deployment occurs when a friendly ship acquires and spends its target lock declaring the expenditure as being for the Ballistic Torpedo.  The target lock token is then replaced with the “Radar Ping” token. 

The next turn the model for the Ballistic Torpedo is placed on the edge of mat, in the deployment zone for the controlling player.

Movement

The   Ballistic Torpedo has a Pilot Skill of 0.  (except when in Ballistic mode)

The Ballistic Torpedo should travel toward the enemy ship that has the Radar Ping token, but its course is up to the controlling player.

Obstacles affect the Ballistic Torpedo in the same manner as other ships.

Dial

Straight ahead.   1, 2, 3 all green.

Gentle left or right turns.  1, 2, 3 all white.

U-Turn.  Red maneuver.    The U-turn is a unique movement template.  The controlling player must declare if the U-turn will be the left or right before placing the template near the model.  (The U-turn is something cool I saw at Litko's website.  Its a new movement template they invented.)

There are no 90 degree turns or K-turns or S-turns

 

Actions

Barrel Roll

Boost

Evade

Target lock  (moves the Radar Ping token to a new ship)

Become a proximity mine.  (can’t be undone)

Become a Seismic Charge.  (can’t be undone)

Become Heat Seeking.  (can’t be undone)

Become Ballistic.  (can’t be undone.)

 

Explanation of actions:

Becoming a proximity mine or seismic charge means the model is swapped out for those tokens and they behave as stated in the core rules.

 

Becoming Heat Seeking means that the controlling player will no longer be able to program its movement dial nor can it take any actions.  Movement will be Speed 2 with it being measured 360’ around its circular base.  (The model of the Ballistic Torpedo now being changed from a regular X-wing base.)  The Torpedo will not alter its course but head toward the ship with the Radar Ping token.  If it encounters an obstacle then use the core rules to resolve the situation.  The attack will be at -2 Red dice from its beginning stats.

 

Becoming Ballistic means that the controlling player will no longer be able to program its movement dial nor can it take any actions.  Movement will be speed 4 straight ahead until it collides with something (enemy, obstacle or friendly ship)  or is off the map.  The attack will be at +2 Red dice from its beginning stats.  The Radar Ping token is not used anymore and can be removed.  Enemy ships may pass through a Torpedo during their movement and not set off the Torpedo.  During the Torpedo’s move it must impact the first ship it encounters (and not pass by seeking a better target).

When in Ballistic mode the Torpedo moves last, being treated as having a pilot skill of +1 of the highest pilot fielded.

Miscellaneous

Radar Ping token is placed on the designed target for the torpedo.  The Torpedo will fly past, around, other ships that don’t have the Radar Ping token (except when in Ballistic mode).  The Radar Ping token could be any mission token that came from any X-wing expansion. 

“Tip the wings”  Enemy ships that don’t have the Radar Ping token can disrupt the Torpedo.  If an enemy ship lands on, touches, passes through the Torpedo the enemy player may spin the Torpedo in any direction they want to.  [This concept is inspired from the British RAF ‘tipping the wings’ of the German V-1 Rockets]

Stats

Cost 10

Pilot Skill 0

Hull 1

Green 2

Red 5  on impact you may change your Focus results to Hit.

At the start of each Action phase the Ballistic Torpedo gets a free evade token.  (Using the evade action would then grant the Ballistic Torpedo 2 evades that turn.)

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We use these as our house rules in our gaming group: 

 

Not programmable, but makes torps feel much different from primary weapons. More thematic and also fun for epic.

 

Torpedoes and missiles

Another mechanism and a new role for stand-off weapons.

 

  1. Torpedo and missile range:
    1. All Missiles and torpedoes have their max Range expanded with two range bands. ( ie : Proton torpedo now have a range of 2-5.

 

  1. All ships can target lock at a range matching the range of missile weapons carried as long as the weapon is equipped.

 

  1. Torpedo and missile movement
    1. Range 1-3: Torpedoes and missiles can attack a target within range 3 in the round they are fired as per the normal rules

 

  1. Range 4-5: If the target is at range 4-5 a torpedo/missile weapon marker is placed at distance 3 from the ship firing the weapon. The weapon marker is placed in a straight line between the attacker and the defender. Mark the weapon marker and the target with matching target lock markers.
    1. In round 2 the torpedo/missile will attack the target if the target is within the remaining range of the weapon.  The attack uses a PS of 0 in order to determine the order of the attack.
    2. A pilot may not spend any tokens to modify the attack dice on a missile or torpedo attacking in round 2.
    3. Missiles and torpedoes that move a second round will target the nearest section of a Huge ship.

 

Example: A B-wing uses a Proton torpedo (Range 2-5) to attack an incoming TIE Bomber at range 5. In turn 1 a torpedo marker is placed at a distance of range 3 from the B-Wing with a target lock marker on the torpedo and the target. In round 2 the Torpedo attacks the Bomber assuming it is still within range.

 

  1. If a missile weapon completely misses its target during the first round of attack then place the missile marker between the rear guides of the base of the defending ship. The missile is now considered to have used 3 of its total range allowance. The missile will attempt to attack the defender again in the second round of attack if the weapon is still within the remaining range allowance of the missile. This second attack applies to missiles only and not torpedoes.  Exeption to this rule: Assault missiles do not turn around  for another attack.

 

Example: A TIE Advanced fires an Ion Pulse missile (range 2-5) at the millennium Falcon. The Falcon succeeds in turning the side to the incoming missile thus doubling the value of the single evade result rolled and by spending an evade token it has a total defense result of 3 evades. The missile misses completely having now used 3 of its total range of 5. A Missile marker is placed between the rear guides of the base of the falcon. During the second round and the missile relentlessly attacks the Falcon again assuming that the Falcon has not moved out of the remaining missile range of 2.

 

  1. Evading torpedoes and missiles
    1. If a missile weapon is attacking a small or large ship from the rear arch add 1 attack dice to the attack value of the weapon.
    2. If a missile or torpedo weapon is attacking the side arc of a defender (small or large ships)  then double the value of any evade results rolled when defending.

Example: In turn 2 The TIE Bomber turns the side to the incoming Torpedo in order to better evade.  A result of 2 evades is rolled on the 2 defense dice but as the TIE bomber has its side turned this value of each die is doubled to a total result of 4 evades.

 

 

Epic ships and defence against missiles

 

Point defence:

If huge ships are carrying a sensor team and Quad Lasers at the same time they can target missiles and torpedoes within range using the Quad lasers. The incoming weapon is considered to have an agility value of 2 and a hull value of 1.

 

  •  

An incoming missile or torpedo can be jammed using a Jam action if the weapon is within range. Roll 5 attack dice. Each Hit or Crit removes 1 attack die from the incoming weapon. If the attack value is reduced to 0 no attack takes place.

A freguency jammer allows for one more Jam action in the same turn wihin range 1 of the incoming weapon.

 

Ionization Reactor:

Firing off an ionization reactor destroys all missiles or torps within range.

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