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Do you have questions about attacking, defense tokens and critical hits? READ THIS FIRST

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In response to your question:

 

Rules Question:

in Star Wars Armada, when a defending shop spends defence tokens, does it spend them one at a time? Could a ship spend its Evade token to force a re-roll on an attack dice and then decide to spend its redirect token if the re-roll doesn't help? Or does the defending ship have to declare all the defense tokens it wants to use before resolving any of their effects? For example in the above scenario you would have to decide to use the brace before seeing the result of the evade. Many thanks, DWRR

The defender can spend his defense tokens one at a time, seeing the result of the previous defense token before choosing whether to spend the next token. In your example, the ship can indeed spend the evade token, see the re-roll, and then decide to spend the redirect token.

Thanks for playing!

James Kniffen

Game Designer

Fantasy Flight Games

 

So given this response, if the defender caused the attacker to re roll a die, and now the attacker gets an accuracy icon, he can then spend that accuracy icon to block a defense token correct?

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It may now be useful to clarify up near "gathering attack pool" that there is a difference between upgrades that "increase" your armament such as enhanced armaments versus upgrades that "add" dice such as Ackbar.  

 

As far as I can figure out and what others have told me: With a CR90 B (blue dice), you can attack at long range if you have enhanced armaments.  You cannot attack at long range if you only have Ackbar.

I think that kind of quick reference would still be helpful. Recently had an instance of an obstructed CR90A taking a side arc shot. I thought the Ackbar dice were then not "added" to the attack pool to satisfy removing a die for obstruction because the attack could never take place - I feel bad about not pursuing my disagreement especially because if it is wrong, it reinforces their unintentional bend in the rule. I am pretty sure my assessment was correct but the tournament started late and was running much longer than it should. :(

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There's a few different places this has picked up.

 

Normally, you pick up dice from your battery armament, roll them, and then add dice to the pool.

 

An obstruction makes you remove a dice before you roll them, and if you have 0 dice, the attack ends.

 

3 Cards:  "Enhanced Armaments", "Rapid Reload", and "Expanded Launchers" increase the battery armament, which lets you grab those dice at the start.

Ackbar, Concentrate Fire, and 99% of other effects, add to the pool.

 

 

A cr90B does not have a Pool at Long Range.

 

A CR90A with an Obstructed Side Arc does not have a Pool at Long range.

 

A CR90A with Enhanced Armanents with an Obstructed Side Arc does have a Pool (of 1 Die) at Long Range.

 

Ackbar adds on only if you have a Dice Pool.

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In response to your question:

 

Rules Question:

in Star Wars Armada, when a defending shop spends defence tokens, does it spend them one at a time? Could a ship spend its Evade token to force a re-roll on an attack dice and then decide to spend its redirect token if the re-roll doesn't help? Or does the defending ship have to declare all the defense tokens it wants to use before resolving any of their effects? For example in the above scenario you would have to decide to use the brace before seeing the result of the evade. Many thanks, DWRR

The defender can spend his defense tokens one at a time, seeing the result of the previous defense token before choosing whether to spend the next token. In your example, the ship can indeed spend the evade token, see the re-roll, and then decide to spend the redirect token.

Thanks for playing!

James Kniffen

Game Designer

Fantasy Flight Games

 

So given this response, if the defender caused the attacker to re roll a die, and now the attacker gets an accuracy icon, he can then spend that accuracy icon to block a defense token correct?

 

 Sadly no, as by the time the defender is using defense tokens the window of opportunity for the attacker using accuracy results has passed. 

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It may now be useful to clarify up near "gathering attack pool" that there is a difference between upgrades that "increase" your armament such as enhanced armaments versus upgrades that "add" dice such as Ackbar.  

 

As far as I can figure out and what others have told me: With a CR90 B (blue dice), you can attack at long range if you have enhanced armaments.  You cannot attack at long range if you only have Ackbar.

I think that kind of quick reference would still be helpful. Recently had an instance of an obstructed CR90A taking a side arc shot. I thought the Ackbar dice were then not "added" to the attack pool to satisfy removing a die for obstruction because the attack could never take place - I feel bad about not pursuing my disagreement especially because if it is wrong, it reinforces their unintentional bend in the rule. I am pretty sure my assessment was correct but the tournament started late and was running much longer than it should. :(

 

 

I just went back and checked the first page, it is very clear about what dice are rolled and when, even mentioning upgrade cards that change battery armament...

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Hey btw, this got buried, but for future reference, can you al check if this is correct?  I think I summed up everything as well and obviously notated as possible.  

 

1) Measure Arc, Attack range and LoS

 

2) Gather Attack Pool

    a. increases in battery

    b. if obstructed (los to los), remove 1 die

3) Roll Attack Pool

4) Modify Attack Pool - attacker rerolls, add, modify, change, spend

5) Spend Accuracies 

    a. (you may not spend accuracies after this step)

    b. (yes you do remove the accuracy die when it is spent)

 

6) Defender spends Defense tokens

   a. defender rerolls, evades spent and resolved here, then defender chooses to spend others

7) Attacker chooses critical effect

   a. contain spent here, resolve special critical effects here

8) Total damage - brace resolves here

9) Deal damage - Redirect/scatter resolves here

  a. Standard crit effect resolves here:  First damage card is face up.

 

--

 

Measuring Step 1: 

 - Hull zones are only the cardboard within the two lines

 - Squadrons are measured for range and LOS from the closest point on the squadron cardboard.

1.  Arc:  Is the target hull zone within the attacker arc (and at a distance where you can gather dice)

2.  LOS: Does the line from yellow dot to yellow dot not cross a defender's hull line?  (crossing an attacker hull line is ok).

   a.  Obstruction: true or false - does that line go through an obstacle or another ship?  (don't remove 2 dice for 2rocks/ships)

   b.  Shield teeth and, i think, shield dials count for obstructing (need double check)

3.  Range:  measure from closest point of hull zones to each other.  (if this line crosses another defending hull zone, you do not have LOS)

 

Let me know if I got anything wrong.

 

 

 

Looks good to me.

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In response to your question:

 

Rules Question:

in Star Wars Armada, when a defending shop spends defence tokens, does it spend them one at a time? Could a ship spend its Evade token to force a re-roll on an attack dice and then decide to spend its redirect token if the re-roll doesn't help? Or does the defending ship have to declare all the defense tokens it wants to use before resolving any of their effects? For example in the above scenario you would have to decide to use the brace before seeing the result of the evade. Many thanks, DWRR

The defender can spend his defense tokens one at a time, seeing the result of the previous defense token before choosing whether to spend the next token. In your example, the ship can indeed spend the evade token, see the re-roll, and then decide to spend the redirect token.

Thanks for playing!

James Kniffen

Game Designer

Fantasy Flight Games

So given this response, if the defender caused the attacker to re roll a die, and now the attacker gets an accuracy icon, he can then spend that accuracy icon to block a defense token correct?

 Sadly no, as by the time the defender is using defense tokens the window of opportunity for the attacker using accuracy results has passed.

But doesn't by virtue of the rule the attacker re-rolls with the evade token, technically sending the attacker, and thus the attack process, back to step 3 in Blail Blerg's synopsis? Thus allowing any accuracies that result from the re-roll to be spent in step 5. The defender then gets to see the results of the re-roll and spend additional defence tokens in step 6 as outlined by James.

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In response to your question:

 

Rules Question:

in Star Wars Armada, when a defending shop spends defence tokens, does it spend them one at a time? Could a ship spend its Evade token to force a re-roll on an attack dice and then decide to spend its redirect token if the re-roll doesn't help? Or does the defending ship have to declare all the defense tokens it wants to use before resolving any of their effects? For example in the above scenario you would have to decide to use the brace before seeing the result of the evade. Many thanks, DWRR

The defender can spend his defense tokens one at a time, seeing the result of the previous defense token before choosing whether to spend the next token. In your example, the ship can indeed spend the evade token, see the re-roll, and then decide to spend the redirect token.

Thanks for playing!

James Kniffen

Game Designer

Fantasy Flight Games

So given this response, if the defender caused the attacker to re roll a die, and now the attacker gets an accuracy icon, he can then spend that accuracy icon to block a defense token correct?
 Sadly no, as by the time the defender is using defense tokens the window of opportunity for the attacker using accuracy results has passed.
But doesn't by virtue of the rule the attacker re-rolls with the evade token, technically sending the attacker, and thus the attack process, back to step 3 in Blail Blerg's synopsis? Thus allowing any accuracies that result from the re-roll to be spent in step 5. The defender then gets to see the results of the re-roll and spend additional defence tokens in step 6 as outlined by James.

I don't see why this would be the case...

Nothing says to walk backwards in the steps of an attack when using an Evade token. The attacker has passed the step where they choose to spend their accuracy and remove them from the pool. Now it's the defender's turn to spend their non-accuracied defense tokens. Then the attack steps continue as normal. The rules don't allow or suggest for a return to a previous step with any thing that I know of.

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I think the distinction is that the evade token is resolved immediately after it's spent during Step 4: Spend Defense Tokens.  There is no requirement that all of the defense tokens being spent in a turn be spent simultaneously, thus allowing the defender to spend an evade, resolve it, and then spend more tokens as he chooses.  At no point do you revert back to Step 3: Resolve Attack Effects, which is the only point at which the attacker is allowed to spend accuracy dice.

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I think the distinction is that the evade token is resolved immediately after it's spent during Step 4: Spend Defense Tokens.  There is no requirement that all of the defense tokens being spent in a turn be spent simultaneously, thus allowing the defender to spend an evade, resolve it, and then spend more tokens as he chooses.  At no point do you revert back to Step 3: Resolve Attack Effects, which is the only point at which the attacker is allowed to spend accuracy dice.

 

 

Indeed.

 

You are required to spend the Defense Tokens in Step 4.  You may spend them in Any Order.

 

The FAQ Clarifies that, as well as stating that they Resolve at the Appropriate time.  For Evade, that time is immediately.  

Brace does not resolve until you are in Step 5, and have totalled the Damage Remaining.

Redirect does not resolve until even further on, when you are suffering that damage one point at a time.

 

 

 

Just because the Die is being Rerolled, this is not an Attacker Modifies Dice effect, which would be Step 3.  Because it is the Defender who is modifying that dice, just getting the attacker to do it, because as a courtesy, it is his dice.

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I am very confused by this discussion of the order of events in the attack sequence, specifically application of critical effects.  
 
The original post says critical effects take place in step 1.

                             Resolve Damage (in this order):

  1. You may resolve a critical effect if at least 1 critical hit symbol is showing in your dice pool.
    • Resolve the effect in full before continuing.

However, the Rules Reference page 2 states "If the defender is dealt at least damage card by this attack, deal the first damage card face up."

What if all the attacks are nullified by defense tokens and therefore no damage cards are ever dealt? What if the attacks are absorbed by sheilds and no damage cards are actually dealt? No damage is taken but the ship magically takes a critical effect? This can't be right.

 

The rules reference does not even mention critical effects until step 5 Resolve Damage.

On top of that if you just think about what is being represented here. A shot gets through a ship's evasive maneuvers and sheilds hits the hull and it luckily causes more damage then usual. How can a shot cause more critical damage if it never actually makes it to the hull?

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There are Multiple Critical Effects that you can Trigger.

 

However, that one is the Default.

 

As a Default, notice that the first word of that line is IF.

 

 

 

If Defense Tokens have nullified all of the Dice, then there is no Dice showing a "CRIT" Symbol, and you do not trigger anything.

 

If Defense Tokens have been spent, and there is at least some damage left over, including at least one Crit Symbol, you Trigger the Critical Effect.

 

The Default Critical Effect is an IF.

 

If all of the Damage is absorbed by shields, then no Damage cards are Dealt, and the Critical has no effect.

 

If at least one damage card is dealt, because there was damage in excess of the shields, then the first card will be dealt face up.

 

 

 

So you are correct.  It is not right.

 

HOWEVER

 

There is a Critical Effect - on the Advanced Proton Torpedos card, that is "Black: Crit"  - Deal a Face Up Damage Card.

 

That means when you get to step 5, if you have a Black Crit showing, you can immediately deal a face up card, before you even count how much damage is done, because Yes.  It is representing that an Advanced Proton Torpedo has blasted straight through the shields and done some damage - evne if the rest o the attack is absorbed by shields...

 

 

Note as well, that EVEN IF ALL OF YOUR DICE ARE CRITS.  You only resolve ONE SINGLE CRITICAL EFFECT>  The other Dice are redundancy versus the dice being cancelled or evaded away or some such.

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Ok thanks for that.

 

Just two clarifications.

So the APT smashes through the shield causing a face up damag card.  Does this face up damage card count as a point of damage?  If that black crit dice is still present at the end does it do another point of damage? I keep reading people saying APT causing 2 damage points.

When a defender is evading at long range and cancels an attack dice of his choice, he can choose a crit and if it is the only crit then there is never a face up card dealt right?

 

If a defender evades and cancels the only black crit what happens to the APT?

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I can understand the torpedo going through sheilds causing a crit effect and a point of damage. But then counting the dice again at the end seems strange to me.

 

Remember, we're not dealing with Individual Torpedos, or Individual Blaster Shots...  Each attack made in Armada is a Battery of attacks..  A Battery being a nebulous number, but otherwise meaning a bunch...  

 

So its just some amount got through to deal critical damage...  The rest is still on target.

 

  So...

 

Its not counting the dice again.

 

Its only counting the dice once.

 

You follow the same steps.

 

In Step 5, You first resolve your Critical Effect.

That can be "If I'm done a damage card, the first is face up."

Or, APTs being "Deal a Face up card immediately"

Or Assault Concussion Missiles, "Deal 1 damage to each adjacent hull zone."

Or Overload Pulse, "Exhaust all Defense Tokens."

Or XX9 "If damage cards are dealt, the first two are face up".

 

 

You do not spend the critical dice to do a critical effect.  Its simply available due to it being there.

 

So once you've resolved the critical effect (which, as we have stated, may be no effect even!)

 

Then you count up the Damage points.  Not the Damage dice, but the amount of Symbols there...

Then you take that number (not that number of dice), and halve it if the Brace Token was spent.

 

Then you Deal that Damage, one point of a time...  With an amount going to an adjacent shield, if a Redirect Token was spent...

 

 

...

 

There are many Critical Effects...  Think of the APT one as "a couple got through the shields...  The rest still hit the shields and/or hull..."  Same as ACMs...  "A Couple just splattered on adjacent shields, but the majority of the damage still hits where it was aimed..."

 

and so on.

Edited by Drasnighta

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NICE WORK, i'm book marking this. may add the following as well.

 

for step 3.1, add a statement about adding CF command dial extra die just so it's visibly there in text for new people.

 

for step 5.1, add a statement that you either choose to resolve a crit effect DIE or upgrade card (i.e. assault proton torpedoes) 

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OK I have been reading this over and over and watching the vids and I think I got it.  I just have one last clarifying situation.

If a ship with APT's hits with only 1 black crit dice. All other dice are blank. The defending ship has no defense tokens and no shields.   The attacker works out the APT's crit effect which is to deal a face up damage card (which also counts as a point of damage). Then during the "total up damage" phase the black crit dice is counted as 1 point of damage which is dealt out as a face down damage. The defending ship has taken 2 hull damage plus whatever effect the face up card says.

That is correct right?
If the exact thing happened but the defending ship had one shield in the defending hull zone. Then the 1 point of damage would be absorbed by the shield. But the ship still has the face up damage card, therefore one point of damage.
Correct?





 

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In-Correct.

You have one die showing a Hit/Crit after everything is set and done.

At the start of Step 5, you resolve your critical Effect - One Face up Card immediately.

Then you count how much damage you have done.

Your One HIT/CRIT die has One Hit Symbol (one point) and one Crit Symbol (one point, as it is a ship shooting a ship).  (You count by Symbol, not by Die...  And the Crit Symbol ALLOWS you to Resolve a crit effect, it does not need to be Spent to do the Crit effect)

So then 2 Damage is Dealt.

If there are no shields, taht is two face down cards.

If any shields are there, then they are absorbed on shields, UNTIL such time as there are no shields...  Damage is done one point at a time.


So the Net effect in the end is:

If the Ship has No Shields on that Zone at the Start of the Attack: One Face up from the APT Crit effect, Two Face Down from 2 Damage Points.
If the Ship has One Shield on that Zone at the start of the Attack: Once Face Up from the APT Crit effect, One Face Down Card, and the Shield Removed.
If the Ship has 2+ shields on that Zone at the start of the attack:  One Face Up card from the Crit effect, and the Shields Depleted by 2 Points.

 

 

If the Ship has Many many shields on that Zone at the Start of the attack: And the Face Up Crit Card is "Projected Misaligned"...  The highest hull zone (assuming it is that zone) loses all shields immediately.  The Face Up crit card is turned face down (as per the card), and then the Two Points of Damage are now Dealt TO the Hull, resulting in 2 more face down damage cards, for a Total of No Shields Remaining and 3 Face Down Cards...

Edited by Drasnighta

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OK, Technically I was wrong and right at the same time. In my example I used a black dice that just shows a crit with no hit. (1damage). I had forgotten that there is no such facing on a black die. So I should have used a black hit/crit as you have. Thank you for clarifying. I understand now.

Your last paragraph was another nice clarification.

So the APT could result in an interesting scenario. If a ship is down to one hull point but has replaced it's sheilds. An APT effect would destroy the ship without any need to result anymore damage, even with a ship with full sheilds.

 

For the record. I hate the way this works. In my mind a ship's sheilds should block hits. Once hits get through to the hull then damage and critical effects should start to kick in. I still feel like we are double counting the crit dye when we deal 2 damage cards for one die face. I understand how it works and will play by it, but it makes no sense to me. I can certainly use the rule for its advantages when I play. Its just a game afterall.

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