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ShiKage

What are your impressions so far? [Possible Spoilers]

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To those who have bought and played the Beginner Game, what are your impressions so far?

 

Is the story and content approximately on par with the previous beginner game material? Were there any particular points of difficulty or trouble either as GM or as a player? Like parts of the story that didn't flow well or challenges that didn't make sense or proved unbalanced?

 

What about your impressions of the pregen characters? Do they work out well and do they generally seem appropriately balanced and capable of handling the provided challenges of the adventure or do they tend to walk all over enemies or get taken out too easily? Would characters made with the beta rules be reasonably powered and properly balanced to face the challenges presented in the adventure?

 

Finally, what are your impressions of the bonus adventure that is available online?

 

Myself, I own all three beginner box games but haven't played this one yet. I ran the EotE one and read the initial chapters of the follow up adventure, and I played in the Age of Rebellion one but not it's follow up adventure. However, in EotE, I really liked how the beginner box provided a fun story to how the PC groul (even if played with custom PCs and not the pregens) could have come together and how they acquired their ship. I also really liked, at least conceptually, the idea of them now having to face several obstacles in familiarizing themselves with the ship and making it their base of operations. In my opinion the Beginner Game and it's follow up adventure for EotE provide a lot of flavor and context to a group while allowing them to experiment with how they function as a team and how they are likely to approach various problems and challenges, making it a great warm up for almost any group of players and even for the GM.. who can also then learn the playstyle of the group and use that in building future encounters. I'm hopeful that the Fate and Destiny material will prove equally as fun, engaging and useful.

Edited by ShiKage

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The adventures are pretty straight-forward and to the point. So, in a way, it's way easier for GMs and players, since you aren't given a handful of options to follow, and it's just about doing a task, moving forward, doing a task, moving forward, and so on. I suppose it could make things a little more difficult for GMs if players decide to go off the rails, but that's more of just a general issue with any heavily pre-planned adventure. Though, it kind of opens up in Act 2 of the Continuation Adventure in giving players more of a chance to think outside the box and problem solve.

 

Both adventures also feature a lot of low-penality failing forward. So instead of needing to come at a number of encounters again and maybe try a different way if you fail, the adventures just sort of hands you what you need and lets you go on your way with not really any big penalties. This is opposed to say the AoR Beginner Game continuation adventure (and a few other FFG pre-published ones), where not completing a task, or not doing it as well as you could have, can really make things more difficult.

 

In terms of story issues, from my first couple read-throughs of the adventures, I didn't spot anything like with AoR's Beginner Game, where the Imperial personnel just sort of vanish without mention, or EotE's where it doesn't mention that players need to take care of things at the spaceport control.

 

There's some small imbalances with the pre-gens. Mystic/Dao is supposed to do Melee, but just has a +2 Damage Walking stick, and his main thing (Force hurl + Force Rating) takes more XP than just the Beginner Game will give to get it, and he doesn't particularly stand out at anything else compared to his fellow characters. Only thing Dao really has to help him out before then in combat is 6 stimpacks. Warrior/Pon is kind of on the beefy side, 4 Brawn, a Lightsaber, 5xp to grab the Enhance/Brawl upgrade, and Parry access; but Pon is mostly just a "beat people up" character, so I guess it sort of balances out. Everyone else has a role they fill out nicely and keeps up well.

 

Overall, it's a nice set of adventures, but personally, I found AoR and EotE's a little better just in terms of how much was set up through the adventures to give you a wide range of things to continue on with in terms of story and various enemy/weapon stats to continue forward with what you've done in the adventures and make your own. FaD presents some great opportunities, particularly in giving you access to a temple with multiple holocrons and connections to a mentor that can lead to a huge number of things todo, but for me, it just doesn't hit the same levels as AoR and EotE.

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Just finished a read-through. I also own and have ran the other two beginner boxes (and own the other 2 books + the F&D Beta).

 

This is definitely the weakest one of the three... the adventure is very, very linear, with what seems to me little possibility for exploration or interaction.

 

Haven't read the online part yet, though, maybe it'll improve on the beginner box's content.

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Only gone through the characters so far having been lucky to get my copy on Saturday.

They're better than I expected after the mess with the F&D Beta characters I was worried these wouldn't make sense but barring a little tinkering they look fine.

Tarast the Shien Expert needs to swap Presence and Willpower, change the saber to a trainer still need the 1000 extra credits but seems fine as a starting character.

Sarenda the Soresu Defender drops to 25cr but keeps the saber for the 10pt from Morality.

Kaveri is actually fine has the +1000 credits so has an extra 100cr than listed.

I'll leave the rest for now work beckons!

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Kaveri is a Seeker/Hunter

Dao drops 1 wound not sure how to treat the Ancient Scrolls but removes the remaining credit whilst his 10xp goes towards his Grit talent and covers his spare skill rank darn did I cover his stimpacks as a Seer?

Belandi as a Healer (naturally!) Takes the 5xp and 1000cr so has 550cr and not 400cr.

Pon as a Shii-Cho Knight with a training saber with 950cr remaining not 250cr having taken 5xp along with 1000cr.

Now to read the rest!

Oh I read there was problems with the villain being mullered by so many lightsabers so do the training sabers improve things?

Edited by copperbell

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Box is opened walk-through under way. Course this is not as stunningly eye-opening as the EoE beginner, since I have been weaned from the d20 saga already

 

That is a lot of it.  I think the F&D beginner box does the job it's supposed to, introduce the rules and concepts in a measured way.  EotE did as well, but since it was a new way of RPGs I was completely blown away.

 

I'm also already sick of the "find ancient lore, get a holocron" limited plot lines.  Honestly, I think EotE is a better setting for Force users in the Dark Times, forcing the characters to come to grips with being on the run and having to live more "mundane" lives.   Just MHO, but I think they'd have done better to jump to a different time period, even TCW, or just after Order 66.

 

Map is gorgeous though, and ripe with other possibilities.  It would be a waste not to spend some extra time there.

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So far, the feedback seems to fall in with what my impressions have been from a brief look at the characters mostly. I've not read the module itself as I am hoping to play it rather than run it.

 

The characters actually seem pretty accurately built aside from free lightsabers for some of them. Swapping these for training sabers could certainly increase the difficulty at least a bit since they would no longer effectively ignore soak. But I don't think most enemies will have a lot of soak either. You'll also be stunning instead, but I think that's overall a moot point.. so you stun then tie them up or similar. But basically, I'm not certain the inclusion of the sabers terribly unbalances things.

 

I like the premise of basically securing a lost temple which potentially provides guidance and knowledge to the character and can also act as a sort of home base even, especially for those who might be hoping to work on reviving the order.. or at least discovering more about it. It could be an interesting starting point for a F&D centered game with a party that is really into the Jedi side of things.

 

For most others, EotE offers a lot... and given the timeframe of the game, I think most Force Sensitives need to be fairly balanced with some kind of 'mundane cover' as it were. A way to fit into general society and not stand out too much. That's the only way they'd likely have survived long. As for time period.. I personally like the idea of playing in something closer to Star Wars rebels period. I think it offers up more opportunities for surviving padawans, undiscovered force sensitives for characters, and even the occasional yet to be found Jedi to act as a mentor.

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Yet to fully read through the books like Age of Rebellion I have problems with where they start this game.

 

So their mentor is being forced to lead a fallen force user to a long forgotten temple and hiding place of one of the last remaining Holocrons.

Somehow their mentor has sent them a message asking for aid, which makes me wonder how and why did it lead them to Splintir.

 

How about their mentor mentions finding a new ally and arranges a meeting to introduce this new friend only when they turn up they discover the new friend has captured their mentor and forcibly encouraging her to lead him to the hidden Jedi Temple instead of waiting.

 

For some reason this new foe is unaware how many people his captive is contacting and arranged a meeting that results in them turning up a couple of hours after the Mentor leaves the arranged meeting place.

 

This starts the game with them arriving at the site and encountering a couple of guards their adversary left behind assuming there would only be one or two arriving thereby explaining how they'll likely survive this ambush.

 

That reveals what's happened to their mentor and their first meeting with what they assume to be a force ghost (but actually a hologram after all unless they can spot the cameras how would they tell the difference?) who reveals their mentor's fate and leads to the first encounter especially relevant since the "ghost" has a reason for revealing these details as they want the fallen force user out of the valley just as much as they would want to rescue their mentor...

 

How does that sound?

Edited by copperbell

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I'm also already sick of the "find ancient lore, get a holocron" limited plot lines.  Honestly, I think EotE is a better setting for Force users in the Dark Times, forcing the characters to come to grips with being on the run and having to live more "mundane" lives.   Just MHO, but I think they'd have done better to jump to a different time period, even TCW, or just after Order 66.

 

It's solid Act II campaign fodder, but it does feel like it's playing very much into the Jedi trope because that's exactly what it is and what the Dev team believes is the paying customer's expectation for the product (and they're probably right).

 

Yet, as I've just hinted, this is not where I'd start a campaign in the dark times.  You're on a remote world unearthing lost Jedi artifacts, and you're carrying a lightsaber?  Don't start in the middle of the film -- I paid full price for this ticket!

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I'd consider converting the setting wholesale to a different time period - with some work, this could be used for Jedi padawans on the run from the Sith in the KOTOR or SWTOR eras, for instance. That might make more sense, as well as giving you more flexibility to have the PCs do great things within the scope of the established narrative.

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I'm also already sick of the "find ancient lore, get a holocron" limited plot lines.  Honestly, I think EotE is a better setting for Force users in the Dark Times, forcing the characters to come to grips with being on the run and having to live more "mundane" lives.   Just MHO, but I think they'd have done better to jump to a different time period, even TCW, or just after Order 66.

 

It's solid Act II campaign fodder, but it does feel like it's playing very much into the Jedi trope because that's exactly what it is and what the Dev team believes is the paying customer's expectation for the product (and they're probably right).

 

Yet, as I've just hinted, this is not where I'd start a campaign in the dark times.  You're on a remote world unearthing lost Jedi artifacts, and you're carrying a lightsaber?  Don't start in the middle of the film -- I paid full price for this ticket!

 

 

I agree here.. unfortunately, as it is a relatively short adventure meant to introduce people to the game and they want to hook them in, they are playing to that rather substantial group who feel that Star Wars isn't Star Wars without Jedi and that Jedi aren't Jedi without their lightsaber. So they throw lightsabers on a few characters to make them happy.

 

Personally, I think the Beta adventure handles this better with the adventure reward basically being a source for crystals allowing the creation of lightsabers by the characters if they so choose. Make it fit the type of characters they can make with the core book a little more closely and give them that last piece of their Jedi puzzle as a reward to get them jumping into the extra book and considering making their own complete character.

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I agree here.. unfortunately, as it is a relatively short adventure meant to introduce people to the game and they want to hook them in, they are playing to that rather substantial group who feel that Star Wars isn't Star Wars without Jedi and that Jedi aren't Jedi without their lightsaber. So they throw lightsabers on a few characters to make them happy.

 

Sure, but I consider what's in the box to be woefully incomplete without the supplemental material online.  With that, you have an actual adventure, and a pre-made way to take characters from Act I Space Farmer to Act II Space Hero with all the appropriate trappings.

 

 

Personally, I think the Beta adventure handles this better with the adventure reward basically being a source for crystals allowing the creation of lightsabers by the characters if they so choose. Make it fit the type of characters they can make with the core book a little more closely and give them that last piece of their Jedi puzzle as a reward to get them jumping into the extra book and considering making their own complete character.

 

 
As do I, but there's no reason you couldn't incorporate that into the Spintir material...

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Personally, I think the Beta adventure handles this better with the adventure reward basically being a source for crystals allowing the creation of lightsabers by the characters if they so choose. Make it fit the type of characters they can make with the core book a little more closely and give them that last piece of their Jedi puzzle as a reward to get them jumping into the extra book and considering making their own complete character.

 

 
As do I, but there's no reason you couldn't incorporate that into the Spintir material...

 

 

Actually, from the little I did browse of the bonus online adventure this would be very easy. They mention there being a crystal cave and the gatekeeprs being able to instruct one in the ways of constructing a lightsaber, thus letting any characters who want one to then get a lightsaber at that point.

 

Admittedly, I actually really like the bits of backstory involved in how some of the characters start with their lightsabers. Finding one in a cave on a dead jedi body and having no clue what it is at all so tinkering with it.. or being taught how to craft one from a close friend and mentor... or being given one by a close friend and mentor after helping to defend them during the exploration of some historically significant jedi site.. these are pretty neat story elements in my opinion.

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Personally, I think the Beta adventure handles this better with the adventure reward basically being a source for crystals allowing the creation of lightsabers by the characters if they so choose. Make it fit the type of characters they can make with the core book a little more closely and give them that last piece of their Jedi puzzle as a reward to get them jumping into the extra book and considering making their own complete character.

 

 
As do I, but there's no reason you couldn't incorporate that into the Spintir material...

 

 

Actually, from the little I did browse of the bonus online adventure this would be very easy. They mention there being a crystal cave and the gatekeeprs being able to instruct one in the ways of constructing a lightsaber, thus letting any characters who want one to then get a lightsaber at that point.

 

Admittedly, I actually really like the bits of backstory involved in how some of the characters start with their lightsabers. Finding one in a cave on a dead jedi body and having no clue what it is at all so tinkering with it.. or being taught how to craft one from a close friend and mentor... or being given one by a close friend and mentor after helping to defend them during the exploration of some historically significant jedi site.. these are pretty neat story elements in my opinion.

 

 

Came here to mention just this. The background stories actually have some great life to them in terms of describing when and how it all works. I haven't hosted it yet, but thus my players have rolled up their own characters and I've taken some of the fun plot-points of the pre-gen character backgrounds and incorporated it into their short backgrounds. It gives them a great reason to trust each other and know they are working towards a common goal. 

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With the system as it stands, oddly, I find the way these NPCs got their lightsabers to make the lightsaber hold more value and meaning to the characters than most ways that would be presented for gaining them after character creation.. which is just plain odd in my opinion. And a particularly good GM could certainly change this.

 

After character generation it just seems most likely it will be a case of: You found a source for some crystals.. now you can have a lightsaber. With these characters it just feels more personal.. like having found it and gotten it working on her own, or the imaginary time spent with the mentor learning to craft it, or fighting off enemies in a temple and being given it as a reward by someone you respect. Because it's in the background the offscreen nature seems less debilitating to the value it might hold to the character. While offscreening time spent learning to make it with your mentor between adventures still ends up amounting to one adventure you don't have it, the next you do. But perhaps that is just me.

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Yeah, I'm curious to see how the adventures in the core rulebook and GM Kit shake out.

 

I think Lorne's pretty much right in that a lot of the expectation with Force and Destiny is "we finally get to play Jedi!"  That expectation was there from the early days of EotE, with a number of folks deciding to hold off on the system until the Force and Destiny book was published so that Jedi PCs were actually a thing instead of a hedged version (Force Exile and a house-ruled Lightsaber skill with a tiny selection of Force powers).

 

I'm pretty sure FFG's marketing department is savvy as to what folks are expecting out of a Star Wars game that centers on the Force, and in the forefront of that perception are people with laser swords that make cool noises when you swing them.  So in that respect, getting one's hands on a lightsaber crystal by the second or third session will probably be the norm. as it fits the general theme of "the PCs are trying to uncover lost Jedi lore and learn the mysteries of the Force," much as EotE modules have the PCs dealing with shady individuals and get involved in less-than-legal activities, and AoR modules are centered upon the PCs fighting the Empire in some form or another.

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I completely agree Donovan, I too pointed out that the beginner game threw characters in with lightsabers because they knew people would be looking for those. From what I have seen so far, I actually have little problem with this at all. A basic lightsaber doesn't seem too overwhelmingly unbalancing to things over all. In fact, I'd almost like a system where you can select to start with a basic lightsaber as one of the morality bonus options, instead of bonus XP and/or money. In this way, people wanting them can get them early on and write it into their BG with an interesting story rather than it being acquired almost like one might acquire discarded armor and with about as much story and development to it.

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In my game Malefax had a glass jaw. He went down before he had a chance to act

 

Yeah, a few people have mentioned this. It may also depend somewhat on the group.. if you have a group of 4-6 people he may be underpowered but for 2 people that happen to be the non-combat oriented specs he might be a little challenging.

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I finally played this last night. I think over all it feels very similar in how it plays to the other Beginner Game boxes. It was quite fun for the most part and many of the challenges we faced were more due to the group composition.

 

So for this game I played my own custom character but built basically the same as Kaveri and my wife played Pon. This had us with two combat centered characters for the most part, one ranged and one close quarters. Then we met the social challenge, and well, we were a little screwed there. :) But that is how life works sometimes and that is ok. Then we got to the final encounter and this actually did take us a bit of work, Malefax was able to score a few really good hits and nearly take out Pon before we finally took him down.

 

Two things came up during our play however. First is the social challenges seem to expect certain questions but often times these questions aren't readily apparent or natural at the time. This comes up in several of the beginner games really and is likely easily addressed by a practiced GM. However, my wife and I are never all that great in these situations and really she was GMing and playing a warrior to help out while I did most the RP part. I imagine the NPC could lead the PCs a bit into the right questions but the book mostly seems to suggest the NPC asks why you are there and then leaves the rest in your hands.. also a better setup of what the message received was and what the PCs actually know going in would help a lot here. I think, as a beginner game though, it should put a little more there to help a new GM and new players to learn how to tackle the challenge a little better.

 

Similarly, in the final battle I was unfortunate enough to receive a Despair result. There is a suggestion in the book of having some rubble fall and hit the character as a result. This is a great example of adding something situational and narratively interesting into the fight. Unfortunately, it doesn't provide any guidance on what the effect of this should be... should the rubble cause some flat amount of damage? should it cause some base damage plus a certain number of green dice? should there be any difficulty dice included presenting a possibility of avoiding the falling rubble? should it impose a setback die on the next roll and/or a boost die on the next attack targeting the player? Some combination of all of these? It would have been nice to see just a little more guidance on how this interesting suggestion could be leveraged within the scene. Again, practiced GMs likely can come up with this on the fly easily enough, but a new GM could really benefit from just a few extra lines of text to set them on the right path a little better.

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Malefax blanked on his initiative roll killed in round on by 2 lightsabers and a blaster rifle.

 

Ouch!

 

Conversely, I've just finished the first part and currently have 3 unconscious PC's at the feet of the one remaining Advozse merc, after some truly epic bad rolling by the players.  Going to interesting picking it up from there next time! :)

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Malefax blanked on his initiative roll killed in round on by 2 lightsabers and a blaster rifle.

 

Ouch!

 

Conversely, I've just finished the first part and currently have 3 unconscious PC's at the feet of the one remaining Advozse merc, after some truly epic bad rolling by the players.  Going to interesting picking it up from there next time! :)

Sheesh they (we) must be a right trio of deadbeats ;-)

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Malefax blanked on his initiative roll killed in round on by 2 lightsabers and a blaster rifle.

 

Ouch!

 

Conversely, I've just finished the first part and currently have 3 unconscious PC's at the feet of the one remaining Advozse merc, after some truly epic bad rolling by the players.  Going to interesting picking it up from there next time! :)

 

 

Sheesh what a trio of deadbeats. The mystic with the walking stick should have stuck to making toasted sandwiches... (first time I've ever killed a character).

 

What I've seen of the story (not much cos I was the first to drop on the bridge) looks good. Don't get an attachment to the characters yet like I did with Pash and Oskara yet even with the cool space wizard stuff.

Edited by TheSmilingPsycho

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