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Explosive Ewok

Is Soontir Fel broken?

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I ask because there is one way to play him, and one set of cards to use with him. 

 

Somebody somewhere made the joke that they might as well have just included PTL into the cost of him, made him 30 points and handed out a stress token with a focus and evade glued to the sides. 

 

So, nobody takes Fel without PTL, and these days nobody takes him without Autothrusters. The only card up for any debate is the last card, which is typically Stealth Device. You could use Hull Upgrade or Target Lock, but in a competitive setting, most people stick with Stealth.

 

This game is amazing because there's no "one way" to play any of the pilots... except Mr. Fel here. All other pilots have a wide variety of things you could do with them to make them either hard hitting or defensive or a mixture of both. Maybe even some crazy combo nobody has put together yet and used effectively.

 

I do love playing him and he's challenging to face, my only observation is that when you see Fel from across the table, you basically already know what he has and how he'll be played. Anyone else and you need to see what upgrades they have before you get a good idea of what is to come.

 

What do you think?

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He's annoying, and his 'optimal' build is pretty well set in stone, but I think he's still interesting, and you could likely experiment pretty well with him trying different options. In some senses he's what most pilots/ships want to be; he's got a 'complete' set of upgrades, which is pretty cool for people who really love the ship.

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This game is amazing because there's no "one way" to play any of the pilots... except Mr. Fel here. All other pilots have a wide variety of things you could do with them to make them either hard hitting or defensive or a mixture of both. Maybe even some crazy combo nobody has put together yet and used effectively.

Tarn Mison and his R7 disagree.

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This game is amazing because there's no "one way" to play any of the pilots... except Mr. Fel here. All other pilots have a wide variety of things you could do with them to make them either hard hitting or defensive or a mixture of both. Maybe even some crazy combo nobody has put together yet and used effectively.

Tarn Mison and his R7 disagree.
You might alslo go as far as saying that now Imperial Kath Scarlet Or Ten Numb won't leave home without a Mangler Cannon.

Or Corran Horn forgetting his FCS as well as stealing R2-D2 from "that other Jedi dude."

Or Han Solo or Chewie not bringing our beloved Protocol Droid.

Or Dash without the Outrider Title.

Or Vader (any TIE advanced pilot) without the X/1 Title (and, in Vader's case the Adv. targeting Computer and Engine Upgrade).

Or Kyle Katarn without Moldy Crow.

Or Nera without DeadEye (perhaps this is stretching it).

Or Fell's Wrath without Outmaneuver. Nah, just kidding.

Edited by Veldrin

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I don't think that there being an optimal way to fly a certain pilot is broken at all.  Maybe he was designed that way, maybe he wasn't, but invariably in a game like this there will be a "best" way to build out certain pilots.  (Aside: this is one of the things that makes IG-88 so interesting.  It's pretty clear that there is no single best way to load out an Aggressor.)

 

Fel is a great pilot, and should be according to lore (and for his cost).  He's still quite fragile and folds pretty quickly to being blocked or Vadered, so I don't see him as broken at all.

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Mr Fel is a stud.  He is versatile and has great survivability.  The common build of PTL, RGP, AT, SD is one way to play him.  He heavily benefits from PTL because of his pilot ability, allowing him to turtle up something fierce.  He has serious synergy with those upgrades because of his pilot ability and the interceptor dial.  I would say he isn't broken, but optimized.

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I think he's the best you can make a 'normal' ship before it breaks the game. He's one of the handful of 'normal' X Wing ships that can actually compete with turret HLC's that can move wherever the **** they want and land on obstacles with no consequence, or ships with HLC and better gunner and FCS because hey that's not broken at all.

The typical Soontir build doesn't include a Targeting Computer. Even when he has one he still has to spend his action to do it. Unlike the Phantom, once he gets bumped he actually is in great danger. His reliance on PtL makes it fairly easy to guess that he's just going to do a 2 hard green every turn lol.

Unlike a turret he has to, you know, actually face your ship to hit it and he doesn't have access to the phantom's candy canes.

He's just a beefed up normal ship. Like an A Wing with 15 upgrades on it, but actually worth it.

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That's kind of the case with all Interceptors and not just Fel (with Turr being the exception). Sure, Fel gets more out of PTL than the other Interceptors do but PTL is pretty much an auto-include on any Interceptor with an EPT slot. Not having an EPT slot for PTL keeps Interceptor pilots from getting played (Alpha Squad is the exception here, but even it doesn't see much play). Just like Fel, autothrusters and a defensive modification are pretty much auto-includes if points allow for it.

Turr can get away VI which makes him a budget Interceptor ace but he's still really good with PTL. Tetran Cowell has a cool synergy with Stay on Target but I can't say that I've ever actually seen him get played. Alpha Interceptors might be slightly more popular if more people had multiples of them.

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Fel may be the king of the arc dodgers since the Phantom nerf, but one mistake and he is usually toast. I have found that if he is one the board long enough, you can get him down. It is a function of keeping him at bay while you finish off his mates. I think large base ships with engine upgrades are more broken.

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well that's not what "broken" implies, since he very clearly works and doesn't break the game (Seriously shouldn't have to keep reminding everyone about what Whisper used to be like)

 

all interceptors are soldering-gunned to PTL, because otherwise they're 25 points+ tie fighters

 

auto-thrusters are also mandatory because the sheer idiocy of primary weapon turrets completely eradicating their advantage (arc-dodging) was keeping them from seeing play without the upgrade

Edited by ficklegreendice

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Speaking to the title, no. The answer is almost always no. To call a game piece "broken" is to say that it actually breaks the game. This means that it interferes so significantly with how the game is played that it becomes unplayable as intended.

 

A pilot with an ideal build does not break the game. The goal of optimization is to figure out which choices are better than other choices and, just as importantly, when. For Soontir Fel, the answers are "PTL, Autothrusters, Stealth Device" and "almost all the time."

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It's anecdotal but I'm pretty sure a Daredevil Soontir made the top cut at the Madness store championship here in Dallas. I prefer my Fels pushing the limit but there are other ways to kit him out.

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well that's not what "broken" implies, since he very clearly works and doesn't break the game

 

Obviously. Perhaps I should have chosen my words more carefully, broken was just the first thing that came to mind.

 

I don't mean it in a sense that he upsets the balance of the game or anything like that. You know what I'm saying, though, if you read the post. I mean that he doesn't really have any play left in him. You know what you're facing when you see his card on the table.

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Wait til Vader + ATC + EU + VI for the same points as loaded Soontir.

 

 

You lose the added Focus token but you move at PS 11 and you don't stress yourself. Not to mention you get two shields.

Edited by Jo Jo

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well that's not what "broken" implies, since he very clearly works and doesn't break the game

 

Obviously. Perhaps I should have chosen my words more carefully, broken was just the first thing that came to mind.

 

I don't mean it in a sense that he upsets the balance of the game or anything like that. You know what I'm saying, though, if you read the post. I mean that he doesn't really have any play left in him. You know what you're facing when you see his card on the table.

 

 

yes you should have :P

 

 

the good news is, just because you know what he is when you see his card on the table (just as you know every derivative fat han/cheri <_<) doesn't necessarily mean you'll be able to counter him the same way. Flying is immensely important with fell, who actually has a diverse array of counterplay options that can be globally applied. Most notably, one block and he's gone. How each Soontir player reacts to this fact at a moments notice varies (from flying cautiously even if sacrificing shots, to k-turning into a block for focus) even if the upgrades do not

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Wait til Vader + ATC + EU + VI for the same points as loaded Soontir.

 

 

You lose the added Focus token but you move at PS 11 and you don't stress yourself. Not to mention you get two shields.

Why not run them both mwuhahahha!

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Wait til Vader + ATC + EU + VI for the same points as loaded Soontir.

 

 

You lose the added Focus token but you move at PS 11 and you don't stress yourself. Not to mention you get two shields.

Why not run them both mwuhahahha!

 

 

 he won't be as tanky if he's running around boosting/rolling or tling for ATC and lacking auto-thrusters

 

otherwise

 

bth.gif

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Wait til Vader + ATC + EU + VI for the same points as loaded Soontir.

 

 

You lose the added Focus token but you move at PS 11 and you don't stress yourself. Not to mention you get two shields.

Why not run them both mwuhahahha!

 

 he won't be as tanky if he's running around boosting/rolling or tling for ATC and lacking auto-thrusters

 

otherwise

 

bth.gif

That's why you just run them both with big daddy Palpatine in his shuttle watching their backs.

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