Vader Question on actions

[piznit 1,705]

If I have Vader equipped with Expert Handling, do I basically get 3 actions in 1 turn?  The free barrel roll, then 2 more actions from the evade/TL/focus choices?

[nigeltastic 3,808]

No, the cost for the card is taking an action. You use an action to use the card, which then gives you that free barrel roll action, leaving you with 1/2 actions used and 1/2 actions left.

[piznit 1,705]

So why does it call it a "free" barrel roll? Just free to a ship that normally doesn't have it?

[balindamood 940]

I agree that it is confusing. My take on it is that you do a barrel roll to get rid of a target lock. This is an action. They could have worded it better.

[MegaSilver 2,880]

It had been FAQ'd to correct the wording.

[piznit 1,705]

Fair nuff, so I did not in fact find a Super Secret Vader Combo!

[Engine25 2,910]

You activate the Expert Handling action, which in turn triggers a free barrel roll action.

[DraconPyrothayan 6,107]

The reason that Expert Handling states that it provides a free Barrel Roll action is to keep Vader from being able to Barrel Roll then Expert Handling for another, and wind up farther away from his starting position than a Decloak.

[MegaSilver 2,880]

Don't forget that Expert Handling gives you a stress.

[stegocent 1,052]

Don't forget that Expert Handling gives you a stress.

Only if you can't normally barrel roll.

[stegocent 1,052]

One of the best upgrades to put on Vader is the Engine Modification.

If you don't have it the card comes with the Falcon.

It gives you the boost action witch is the really good on Vader as he can use the boost and ventilation the barrel roll making him quite mobile.

Really handy for trying to stay out of your opponents firing arc or saying on your targets tail.

One of the best 4 points you can spend imo

[Forgottenlore 9,838]

So why does it call it a "free" barrel roll? Just free to a ship that normally doesn't have it?

Like was mentioned, to prevent you from BRing twice in a single round. If the BR from EH wasn't called an action then it wouldn't prevent someone from also performing the BR action, just like a card that instructs you to acquire a target lock doesn't prevent (and isn't prevented by) the ship performing the target lock action, but a card that tells you to perform a free target lock action does. Since the BR therefore has to be identified as an action, it has to be identified as a free action because otherwise it would cost you your "perform action step" action, which you just spent to use expert handling in the first place and so the whole thing wouldn't function. That's what a free action is, any action that you perform other than your normal "one action in the perform action step", as stated on page 8 of the rulebook.

Cards with the "action:" header cost an action to use, then they list one ore more things they allow you to do. If one of those things they allow you to do is an action, the card has to tell you to perform a free (whatever) action, otherwise it wouldn't be a (whatever) action, it would just be (whatever).

Edited May 26, 2015 by Forgottenlore

[Silver leader 377]

You also remove an enemy Target Lock on your ship after the barrel roll.

[Forensicus 883]

The "real" reason for this wording isn't specifically (or at all) to prevent DV from doing 2 Barrel Rolls, the rules already prohibit you from doing the same action twice in a round, even free actions.

http://xwing-miniatures.wikia.com/wiki/Expert_Handling

EH has the header "Action" which means that you use an Action to activate EH, which then grants you a free Barrel Roll Action. If the wording after the errata/FAQ hadn't said "free Barrel Roll Action" but only "Barrel Roll Action" then it would mean that you would have to use a total of 2 Actions.

[Khyros 4,236]

The "real" reason for this wording isn't specifically (or at all) to prevent DV from doing 2 Barrel Rolls, the rules already prohibit you from doing the same action twice in a round, even free actions.

http://xwing-miniatures.wikia.com/wiki/Expert_Handling

EH has the header "Action" which means that you use an Action to activate EH, which then grants you a free Barrel Roll Action. If the wording after the errata/FAQ hadn't said "free Barrel Roll Action" but only "Barrel Roll Action" then it would mean that you would have to use a total of 2 Actions.

 

But originally, the EH card did not state to do a barrel roll action.  As such, you could do the Expert Handling action, which allowed you to do a barrel roll LIKE action, and then Vader could ALSO do the actual Barrel Roll action.  But they then changed it to be a free BR action, which means you can no longer do two barrel roll like actions.

[WWHSD 9,273]

The "real" reason for this wording isn't specifically (or at all) to prevent DV from doing 2 Barrel Rolls, the rules already prohibit you from doing the same action twice in a round, even free actions.

http://xwing-miniatures.wikia.com/wiki/Expert_Handling

EH has the header "Action" which means that you use an Action to activate EH, which then grants you a free Barrel Roll Action. If the wording after the errata/FAQ hadn't said "free Barrel Roll Action" but only "Barrel Roll Action" then it would mean that you would have to use a total of 2 Actions.

I highly doubt the accuracy of what you wrote there. The original text never instructed you to "Perform a barrel roll action". It merely said to "Perform a barrel roll". This would be no different than cards that instruct you to acquire a Target Lock or a Focus.

The rules do indeed prohibit you from performing the same action twice in a round but the barrel roll that was originally provided by Expert Handling wasn't a barrel roll action, it was part of the Expert Handling action. This is no different than a ship with R7-T1 and Experimental Interface taking a Target Lock action to acquire a Target Lock on the first target and the using EI to take the R7-T1 action and Target Lock a second target (which would replace the first Target Lock).

[Engine25 2,910]

Don't forget that Expert Handling gives you a stress.

Only if you can't normally barrel roll.

And with the new interrupt rulings on the FAQ, it could be argued that you can interrupt EH from resolving to resolve Vader and then receive a stress after everything, similarly to the interaction with Push the Limit and Experimental Interface.

[nigeltastic 3,808]

Don't forget that Expert Handling gives you a stress.

Only if you can't normally barrel roll.

And with the new interrupt rulings on the FAQ, it could be argued that you can interrupt EH from resolving to resolve Vader and then receive a stress after everything, similarly to the interaction with Push the Limit and Experimental Interface.

Not sure this is true, EI or PtL are triggers that happen off of actions, allowing interruption. Vader just allows 2 actions, there's nothing like 'when you perform an action in the perform action step you may immediately perform a second action'.

No trigger, no interrupt.

[CaptainJaguarShark 2,052]

 

 

 

Don't forget that Expert Handling gives you a stress.

Only if you can't normally barrel roll.

And with the new interrupt rulings on the FAQ, it could be argued that you can interrupt EH from resolving to resolve Vader and then receive a stress after everything, similarly to the interaction with Push the Limit and Experimental Interface.

Not sure this is true, EI or PtL are triggers that happen off of actions, allowing interruption. Vader just allows 2 actions, there's nothing like 'when you perform an action in the perform action step you may immediately perform a second action'.

No trigger, no interrupt.

 

 

I agree with your interpretation.