Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
DraconPyrothayan

A guide to Ordnance

Recommended Posts

What follows is a Damage to Cost ratio of Missiles and Torpedoes, including description of incomparable effects.

 

As Missiles and Torpedoes contrast directly to primary attacks, I will be measuring them against a theoretical Bomber's primary attack with the same action-modifiers, as Ordnance is most commonly carried by 2-attack ships.

  • The first column assigns the name. Any ordnance whose range is not 2-3 is marked with an *
  • The second column assigns the cost
  • The third column assigns the expected damage of the ordnance subtracting the expected damage of a Primary Attack of a TIE Bomber with the required action.
  • The fourth column assigns any incomparable data. Any ordnance that does not spend its required action token is marked with an *. The damage addition from that action is factored into column 3.

 

Flechette Torpedo       : 2 | 0.0 | If defender has < 4 hull value, assign Stress on attack.

Proton Torpedo          : 4 | 1.5 | Draws spare damage from a single Rolled Eye

Ion Torpedo             : 5 | 0.5 | If Hits, assign Defender + all at R1 one Ion Token.

*Advanced Proton Torpedo: 6 | 1.0 | If ability to change Rolled Eyes to Hits, bonus damage becomes 3.125 when rolling fewer than 4 blanks.

 

Ion Pulse Missiles      : 3 | -.- | *If Hits, Defender receives 2 Ion tokens and 1 damage.

*Proton Rockets         : 3 | 1.5 | *Less effective if carrier has <3 agility 

*Cluster Missiles       : 4 | 1.5 | Performs as 2 attacks

Concussion Missiles     : 4 | 1.5 | Draws spare damage from a single Rolled Blank

Assault Missiles        : 5 | X.5 | If Hits, deal one damage to all at R1

Homing Missiles         : 5 | 1.5 | *Defender cannot use Evade Tokens against this attack.

 

When dealing with the ones that are Pure Damage, sorted by the highest damage-cost ratio to the lowest, we have:

Proton Rocket with 3 agility, [Cluster Missile, Concussion Missile ,Proton Torpedo are Tied], Homing Missile, Proton Rocket with 2 Agility, Advanced Proton Torpedo

The Assault Missiles tie the Homing Missile with just 1 target Splashed, and rises to second-most effective if it splashes damage onto just two ships. To surpass a fully realized Procket, it needs to splash damage onto 4 ships.

 

 

Flechette Torpedo, Ion Torpedo, and Ion Pulse Missile gain bonus effectiveness when you factor in their control aspects.

Flechettes deal the same expected damage as a 2 attack ship with a Target Lock. However, you don't need to hit the opponent to give them a free stress.
Ion Torpedo can Ionize an entire fleet, and have 2 expected damage vs the defender (vs the 1.5 of a Target Locked 2 attack ship)

Ion Pulse Missiles can Ionize a large ship in a single attack, but have their damage capped at 1 if it hits.

 

 

 

TL:DR

 

If you're equipping Torpedoes/Missiles for added damage, first consider whether Assault Missiles will be useful in your expected match.
Then, if your ordnance carrier has 3 agility, Proton Rockets are the best damage boost available for the points. If you have only 2 agility, they actually fall between Homing Missiles and Adv. PT.
Following that, Concussion Missiles, Cluster Missiles, and Proton Torpedoes are equally valid, with pros and cons in different match-ups and different fleet-builds.
Homing Missiles are the least effective Missile, with damage on-par with Concussions for a higher price, unless your opponent is sitting on an Evade Token that will fizzle due to you having no more attacks.
Advanced Proton Torpedoes are the least effective Torpedo by a long-shot, unless you have the ability to get double-action economy for your shot. 


 

For the Control Ordnance, things get a little froggier. Ion Pulse Missiles are the least effective, but Flechette Torpedoes and Ion Torpedoes are too different from each other to directly contrast.  Without help, all deal worse damage/cost than the AdvPT.


 

I may be willing later to re-evaluate with Push the Limit and/or the Jonus Bonus.

Edited by DraconPyrothayan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd be curious to see the data when you have both a focus and a TL.
I have a feeling that'll push Concussion Missiles ahead of Proton Torpedoes.

Also, Homing Missile's advantage of not requiring you to spend the TL might well be very useful on a loaded up K-Wing or TIE Punisher.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Same thing. The problem is that some times it's much easier to get range and TL and f. But not always.

Sometimes the difficulty of pulling off the double action shot is really hard to determine.

Guri. Elites with PTL. Tens to have a better time with double actions.

I think ordnance is valued higher on those.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you for the knowledge. Very interesting read and this actually does help for when I decide to use ordinance.

One question I have for you is if you get a chance could you give me a run down of scum boba and which is best for him once the next set hits? I have been testing him and with glitterstim and his ability it FEELS like cluster is the best way to go but I am not as good with numbers as MJ or you. If you don't have time/ the desire to crunch those numbers it's no biggie! I'm just curious if my experiences line up with the true numbers or if I have been led astray by my smallish pool of test games.

Either way thanks again for the really insightful post! :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One question I have for you is if you get a chance could you give me a run down of scum boba and which is best for him once the next set hits? I have been testing him and with glitterstim and his ability it FEELS like cluster is the best way to go but I am not as good with numbers as MJ or you.

Boba + Glitterstim? That's gonna be the equivalent of two 3 die attacks, target-locked and focused, or 5.625 damage expected from the two attacks.

From this we subtract Boba's natural damage while target locked and focused, and have 2.8125 bonus damage from Cluster Missiles (at Range 2).

This actually means its just under the efficiency of a 3 agility Proton Rocket without double-action, and more of this damage will be mitigated from any other missile, due to being two attacks.

However, it's still a combat step in which you've launched, on average 5.625 damage at your opponent, which is devastating for all but the nimblest of foes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

One question I have for you is if you get a chance could you give me a run down of scum boba and which is best for him once the next set hits? I have been testing him and with glitterstim and his ability it FEELS like cluster is the best way to go but I am not as good with numbers as MJ or you.

Boba + Glitterstim? That's gonna be the equivalent of two 3 die attacks, target-locked and focused, or 5.625 damage expected from the two attacks.

From this we subtract Boba's natural damage while target locked and focused, and have 2.8125 bonus damage from Cluster Missiles (at Range 2).

This actually means its just under the efficiency of a 3 agility Proton Rocket without double-action, and more of this damage will be mitigated from any other missile, due to being two attacks.

However, it's still a combat step in which you've launched, on average 5.625 damage at your opponent, which is devastating for all but the nimblest of foes.

 

Sigh. Now i want a cracks fighter

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for that Draco ^_^

Moon lord yea he is really fun... And for the alpha strike he is all but invincible since getting the rerolls plus focus on every return shot mitigates so much damage. When testing glitterstim I have rarely taken more than 2-3 damage during the first r1 engage even when I was in r1 and 2 of bbbbz. (Although B wing shots are still scary so I don't recommend taking the full brunt in any situation If you can help it. Last night I was betrayed hard by the greens when I would roll double blank and reroll into double blank like 3 times in a row... Fastest I've ever had boba die D: )

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Advanced Proton Torps and cluster missiles do require you to spend the target lock actually; that may affect your calculations.  (unless i read your chart wrong, the * means you don't need to spend to shoot, right?).  Also, homing missiles don't require you to spend your TL.

Edited by Babaganoosh

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Advanced Proton Torps and cluster missiles do require you to spend the target lock actually; that may affect your calculations.  (unless i read your chart wrong, the * means you don't need to spend to shoot, right?).  Also, homing missiles don't require you to spend your TL.

You misread the chart.

An asterisk in column 4 means they don't have to spend the token. An asterisk in column 1 means the range requirement us something other than 2-3.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ion Torpedo looks way too low.

As far as actual DAMAGE is concerned, the expected damage from a launched Ion Torpedo is 2 (4 dice, each with a .5 chance of damage). Subtract from that the expected damage of a 2 die attack with a Target Lock (without which you cannot fire the Ion Torpedo), which is 1.5 (2 dice, each with a .75 chance of damage), and you get a damage increase of .5, and a MASSIVE Ion field.

So, low damage, huge control potential. Incomparable to the ones that simply deal damage, 

 

 

 

Advanced Proton Torps and cluster missiles do require you to spend the target lock actually; that may affect your calculations.  (unless i read your chart wrong, the * means you don't need to spend to shoot, right?).  Also, homing missiles don't require you to spend your TL.

You misread the chart.

An asterisk in column 4 means they don't have to spend the token. An asterisk in column 1 means the range requirement us something other than 2-3.

I wish I knew how MajorJuggler keeps his charts so clean, and in a single line. Probably helps that he doesn't have to include incomparable data...

 

 

I'd be curious to see the data when you have both a focus and a TL.

I have a feeling that'll push Concussion Missiles ahead of Proton Torpedoes.

When you've got a Focus to spend on the attack, Proton Torpedoes essentially lose their special ability, while Concussion Missiles still get the re-roll.

When you've got Lone Wolf, or any other ability that allows you to alter Blank results, Proton Torpedoes are slightly better than Concussions.

 

Mathematically speaking, I count [KABLAM] as = [boom] until I've determined the Crit-vulnerability quotient of the defender. After all, they both only take out one shield...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Homing Missiles, I'd say, are a bit misleading since you'll always have a TL to use with them.  If you can reliably get that TL from a secondary source to combine with a natural Focus, then Concussion Missiles definitely seem to be the way to go.  Then again, they still can't re-roll with a TL...

 

And, honestly, the more I toy around with it the more I think having a way to get that second action is a requirement to get the best usage out of ordnance.  Low->middle PS?  Have a Squad Leader so you can Focus then the SL passes a late-round TL off to shoot at whoever you want.  High PS?  Take PTL and Focus-TL on your own.  Ordnance needs dice modification to approach being effective.  And it's also what makes Homing Missiles so tantalizing, as they'll always have that modification and you just need a Focus to maximize your chances at those four die coming up with hits.

 

Then you have Jonus, who can give solid re-rolls to allies and make better use out of non-HM/IPM ordnance, and Drea Renthal can do it for herself (as can Krassis Trelix to a lesser extent, but he should always have a cannon anyways).  Guri with Deadeye can also pretty reliably get a double focus to use on an APT (which realistically shouldn't need a TL for rerolls), and... erm... yeah.  Plenty of ways to get double actions, but not many ways to get effectively two modifications on your torpedoes and missiles.  "Redline" will join the ranks when the next wave hits, at least.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And, honestly, the more I toy around with it the more I think having a way to get that second action is a requirement to get the best usage out of ordnance.  Low->middle PS?  Have a Squad Leader so you can Focus then the SL passes a late-round TL off to shoot at whoever you want.  High PS?  Take PTL and Focus-TL on your own.  Ordnance needs dice modification to approach being effective.  And it's also what makes Homing Missiles so tantalizing, as they'll always have that modification and you just need a Focus to maximize your chances at those four die coming up with hits.

If you want to have some fun with ordnance, try this out:

  • Cracken + Cluster Missiles
  • Bandit + Concussion Missiles
  • Bandit + Concussion Missile
  • And 45 points of other fun stuff!

YAXWSB

 

The idea is that the Bandits focus, then Cracken moves in, TLs and fires his Cluster Missiles. Thanks to the 2 attacks from Cluster Missiles, he can pass each Bandit an action (which they use to TL). The Bandits now each have a TL + F Concussion Missile!

 

The alpha strike can put a solid dent into most large ships.

I won my first SC with a similar list (had Homings on the Bandits, and a WSF+Outrider+Mangler+RecSpec as escort).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...