Hyperspace vs Warp Speed

[Commander Kahlain 237]

Both go at the same speed: The speed of plot...

 

This: the science behind either is speculative at best.  I will stand by this statement until the Forum members pelt me with rotten fruit

[Hedgehobbit 419]

Both go at the same speed: The speed of plot. 

 

The plots are often dependent on the tech. Star Trek has lots of "we are the only ship in range" type stories whereas Star Wars has lots of "we need to deliver this so let's fly haflway across the galaxy and be back before lunch" type of stories. 

[clontroper5 4,232]

 

Both go at the same speed: The speed of plot. 

 

The plots are often dependent on the tech. Star Trek has lots of "we are the only ship in range" type stories whereas Star Wars has lots of "we need to deliver this so let's fly haflway across the galaxy and be back before lunch" type of stories. 

 

even the death star was able to travel from aldeeran (which it had just blown up) to yavin in 1 day!! and that must have like a class 10 hyper drive at least because it is so massive

 

heres a map with Alderaan (lower red circle) and Yavin (upper circle, duh) highlighted.

 

p.s. dont quote me on the hyper drive thing it is a wild guess without research

Edited May 19, 2015 by clontroper5

[Mikael Hasselstein 6,898]

Both go at the same speed: The speed of plot. 

 

The plots are often dependent on the tech. Star Trek has lots of "we are the only ship in range" type stories whereas Star Wars has lots of "we need to deliver this so let's fly haflway across the galaxy and be back before lunch" type of stories. 

even the death star was able to travel from aldeeran (which it had just blown up) to yavin in 1 day!! and that must have like a class 10 hyper drive at least because it is so massive

 

Is there any mention how long it took to go from what used to be Alderaan to Yavin IV? I know that Vader says that "This will be a day long remembered...", but maybe he's speaking with poetic inaccuracy?

 

What Norsehound says about the speed of plot also has the dimension of the unspecified time between scenes.

 

According to the D6Holocron, the Death Star has a hyperdrive multiplier of x4. According to the Nav Computer, it would take the Death Star almost 40 days to arrive there at that speed.

 

Now, depending on your sense of time-scale, you can agree or disagree with that. Neither of those sources are infallible, and people have very different senses of time time scale where it regards the SW Galaxy. I'll stick with the sources above, and think that it took the Rebellion's analysts some time to figure out the Death Star's defenses and get the squadrons ready to attack the Death Star.

 

But obviously I'd have some investment in the Nav Computer. YMMV

[Hedgehobbit 419]

According to the D6Holocron, the Death Star has a hyperdrive multiplier of x4. According to the Nav Computer, it would take the Death Star almost 40 days to arrive there at that speed.

 

 

If that were truly the case then the Rebels would have had plenty of time to evacuate before the Death Star showed up. There's a similar situation in ESB. Han shoots the probe droid returns to base and they immediately start to evacuate the base. That wouldn't make sense if they used WEG greatly exaggerated travel times. There's also the "half way across the galaxy" line in ESB and the fact that Luke would have to spend a week traveling to Degobah without food, water, or a toilet.

 

There are just too many examples to brush it all away as poetic inaccuracies. 

 

The NavComputer is cool. Just treat results of "days" as "hours" and you're done. 

Edited May 23, 2015 by Hedgehobbit

[Mikael Hasselstein 6,898]

The NavComputer is cool. Just treat results of "days" as "hours" and you're done. 

 

Thanks!

 

Yes, that's what I generally advice people who have an issue with my time scale.

[Hobojebus 11,341]

Time when using hyperspace is determined by the route taken more than any other factor, going across the galaxy you have to avoid the galactic core because that's gonna be filled by stars and supermassive black holes.

It can be faster to travel to a further destination simply because it's a relatively straight line with no major obstacles to go around.

Of course jar jars star trek films utterly screwed the pouch in terms of travel times they go from alpha to beta quadrants in seconds.

[Hedgehobbit 419]

It can be faster to travel to a further destination simply because it's a relatively straight line with no major obstacles to go around.

 

This is my main complaint with how Star Wars handles hyperspace routes. Since a galaxy is a relatively thin disk, it would be safest to fly upward, where object are sparse, fly across the galaxy, and then fly back down into the disk. Instead they weave and wind their way through the densest area possible. It makes cool looking maps but it treats space as a 2-D surface. 

[Forgottenlore 9,838]

This is my main complaint with how Star Wars handles hyperspace routes. Since a galaxy is a relatively thin disk, it would be safest to fly upward, where object are sparse, fly across the galaxy, and then fly back down into the disk. Instead they weave and wind their way through the densest area possible. It makes cool looking maps but it treats space as a 2-D surface. 

 

I don't know if Star Wars has ever addressed this, but for my own Sci-Fi universe for RPGs I say that FTL travel requires a certain level of gravitational field to work. Go too far outside of the galactic disc and you get stranded, literally, in the middle of nowhere. Try and fly too close to a large gravity well and you pop put in a bad situation as well.

 

Not a perfect explanation, but it does serve explain why travel is always inside a galaxy.

[Vigil 687]

 

Both go at the same speed: The speed of plot. 

 

The plots are often dependent on the tech. Star Trek has lots of "we are the only ship in range" type stories whereas Star Wars has lots of "we need to deliver this so let's fly haflway across the galaxy and be back before lunch" type of stories. 

even the death star was able to travel from aldeeran (which it had just blown up) to yavin in 1 day!! and that must have like a class 10 hyper drive at least because it is so massive

 

Is there any mention how long it took to go from what used to be Alderaan to Yavin IV? I know that Vader says that "This will be a day long remembered...", but maybe he's speaking with poetic inaccuracy?

 

What Norsehound says about the speed of plot also has the dimension of the unspecified time between scenes.

 

According to the D6Holocron, the Death Star has a hyperdrive multiplier of x4. According to the Nav Computer, it would take the Death Star almost 40 days to arrive there at that speed.

 

Now, depending on your sense of time-scale, you can agree or disagree with that. Neither of those sources are infallible, and people have very different senses of time time scale where it regards the SW Galaxy. I'll stick with the sources above, and think that it took the Rebellion's analysts some time to figure out the Death Star's defenses and get the squadrons ready to attack the Death Star.

 

But obviously I'd have some investment in the Nav Computer. YMMV

 

I think 40 days is a bit much. In 40 days, the rebels would probably have found the tracker on the Falcon and have plenty of time left over to pack their stuff and leave (maybe call in more rebel fighters for the attack on the Death Star - no sense letting a good trap go to waste). 

I think a week to ten days is probably more doable. It gives them time to work out a weakness of the Death Star, to get Luke trained up well enough in a crash course on flying an X-Wing to send him on a combat mission (seriously, if I were in command of that OP, Luke would have been lucky to get to be a tail gunner on a Y-Wing... of course, then I'd also be dead, unless the pilot was incapacitated or Luke was a WSO, not just a tail gunner), and enough time to have discovered the tracking device on the Falcon and have removed it, but late enough that they didn't have time to evacuate the base on Yavin IV (other than maybe some families or other non-essential personnel). 

[Mikael Hasselstein 6,898]

This is my main complaint with how Star Wars handles hyperspace routes. Since a galaxy is a relatively thin disk, it would be safest to fly upward, where object are sparse, fly across the galaxy, and then fly back down into the disk. Instead they weave and wind their way through the densest area possible. It makes cool looking maps but it treats space as a 2-D surface. 

 

I don't know if Star Wars has ever addressed this, but for my own Sci-Fi universe for RPGs I say that FTL travel requires a certain level of gravitational field to work. Go too far outside of the galactic disc and you get stranded, literally, in the middle of nowhere. Try and fly too close to a large gravity well and you pop put in a bad situation as well.

 

Not a perfect explanation, but it does serve explain why travel is always inside a galaxy.

 

That's a decent one. Another is to treat the major hyperroutes as buslines rather than airplane trips. Maybe most interstellar travel happens at the local level - or Core-to-semi-periphery, rather than one side of the Outer Rim to the other side of the Outer Rim.

 

My understanding is because hyperroutes are constituted by astrogational data (the data about there mass shadows are and are not, so that they can be avoided), and that this data is constantly updated by starships uploading their sensor logs to the Space Ministry. That means that locations that see more traffic also have more accurate and therefore quicker space routes. Because there are only a few people that are going to go directly from Bonadan at one end of the galaxy to Terminus on the other, there won't be data on a potential route connecting those to. Therefore, it's much safer and quicker to take the well-traveled Hydian Way that connects the two along a very long string of dyadic hyperroutes connecting systems along the way.

 

 

According to the D6Holocron, the Death Star has a hyperdrive multiplier of x4. According to the Nav Computer, it would take the Death Star almost 40 days to arrive there at that speed.

 

Now, depending on your sense of time-scale, you can agree or disagree with that. Neither of those sources are infallible, and people have very different senses of time time scale where it regards the SW Galaxy. I'll stick with the sources above, and think that it took the Rebellion's analysts some time to figure out the Death Star's defenses and get the squadrons ready to attack the Death Star.

I think 40 days is a bit much. In 40 days, the rebels would probably have found the tracker on the Falcon and have plenty of time left over to pack their stuff and leave (maybe call in more rebel fighters for the attack on the Death Star - no sense letting a good trap go to waste). 

I think a week to ten days is probably more doable. It gives them time to work out a weakness of the Death Star, to get Luke trained up well enough in a crash course on flying an X-Wing to send him on a combat mission (seriously, if I were in command of that OP, Luke would have been lucky to get to be a tail gunner on a Y-Wing... of course, then I'd also be dead, unless the pilot was incapacitated or Luke was a WSO, not just a tail gunner), and enough time to have discovered the tracking device on the Falcon and have removed it, but late enough that they didn't have time to evacuate the base on Yavin IV (other than maybe some families or other non-essential personnel). 

 

Whatever suits your headcanon.

 

I can see the Rebellion having an incentive to stick around and to destroy the Death Star, given that they had discovered its weakness. Do we get the sense that they're surprised by the Death Star's arrival? Leia induced that they were coming. (Smart girl, that one. Too bad she proved to be a member of the Rebel Alliance and a traitor.)

 

For me (besides my labor investment), it's also a preference for a "bigger" galaxy, so to speak.

 

But, again, I'm not George Lucas. Interpret things as you will. There's not too much iron-clad coherence out there aside from some loose description and tables from the West End Games RPG. Because WEG's RPG is my "home", that's what I defer to.

[Gosric 696]

Evidently it took not a long time to go from Bespin to far enough outside the galaxy to see the whole thing through a viewport. sounds pretty fast to me

[Mikael Hasselstein 6,898]

How long did that take?

[Corellian Corvette 1,733]

A few minutes of screen time and a jump cut or two.

[Commander Kahlain 237]

Well, I used to love Star Trek....  Then this (dumb) plot device call "Trans-Warp Beaming" came along... 

 

<Pounds head against brick wall>

[CenterPoint 268]

struggling to remember which star wars novel I read it in , but i seem to recall them saying how no one in SW could leave the galaxy because the mass shadow of the galaxy screws up hyperspace lanes out that far. i seem to remember thats why the Yuuzan Vong were so much of a suprise

 

also In the final episode of TNG (All Good Things) Captain Beverly Picard, and Admiral Riker both travel at Warp 13, but in Voyager the warp limit is warp 10. so not sure where that comes into play with warp 10 being impossible and all. 

[Robin Graves 6,054]

struggling to remember which star wars novel I read it in , but i seem to recall them saying how no one in SW could leave the galaxy because the mass shadow of the galaxy screws up hyperspace lanes out that far. i seem to remember thats why the Yuuzan Vong were so much of a suprise

 

also In the final episode of TNG (All Good Things) Captain Beverly Picard, and Admiral Riker both travel at Warp 13, but in Voyager the warp limit is warp 10. so not sure where that comes into play with warp 10 being impossible and all. 

 

a Q did it.

[Green Knight 9,732]

Warp speed is all over the place

 

Currently, at Warp 10, your speed is INFINITE. 

[VanorDM 11,599]

Currently, at Warp 10, your speed is INFINITE.

For what it's worth... In Star Trek Online, they treated transwarp to be kind of a cross between warp speed and hyperspace, or even Stargate's wormhole travel. Transwarp would open a tunnel outside of normal space that you could travel though. So effectively you weren't traveling faster, but rather crossing less space.

[GronardII 385]

Warp drive, Hyperspace, Transwarp, Bhaaa. Only one series ever got FTL right.

[AverageBoss 233]

I actually remember reading the individual hyperdrive speed ratings were based on the amount of time it took to reach two specific points in the galaxy. I thinks it was days a Coruscant to galactic center.

 

Also, this seemed appropriate:
 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gd5yB9Vmd6I

Edited October 27, 2015 by AverageBoss

[Forgottenlore 9,838]

I actually remember reading the individual hyperdrive speed ratings were based on the amount of time it took to reach two specific points in the galaxy. I thinks it was days a Coruscant to galactic center.

That was one of the explanations for why lower was better, yes.

There have been others.

[capnhayes 28]

Oh yes Star trek is very very consistent with its science! LOL, are you kidding me! The "science" on Star Trek is laughable at best and the Treknobable word vomit is annoying to say the least! Sorry to be so harsh but seriously Star Trek science is a complete joke. Nadion particles, kiloquads, and isotons. Umm yeah... Sounds like real science, lol... Also would anyone like to ask those genius science advisers how the Enterprise in Star Trek 2 that is supposed to travel at warp 5 (125c) can travel from earth to the regula 1 space station and mutara nebula that is according to the Star Trek maps over 300 light-years away in only a matter of hours? Yeah, real science at work there. Good job Star trek science advisers... 

[SomeKittens 439]

struggling to remember which star wars novel I read it in , but i seem to recall them saying how no one in SW could leave the galaxy because the mass shadow of the galaxy screws up hyperspace lanes out that far. i seem to remember thats why the Yuuzan Vong were so much of a suprise

 

also In the final episode of TNG (All Good Things) Captain Beverly Picard, and Admiral Riker both travel at Warp 13, but in Voyager the warp limit is warp 10. so not sure where that comes into play with warp 10 being impossible and all. 

 

Uhhh....

 

[GronardII 385]

Well, both franchises screwed up on science. Star Trek, being Science fiction, had a lot of techno babel in its 13 movies and about 30 years worth of TV. Kinda suprised they didn't have more gaffs.

Star Wars on the other hand is "science" fantasy. And considering the colossal cock up Midi-chlorians were, better they leave the Techno Babel to the experts and stick to their space knights with space swords and hand waving away plot points.

Edited December 15, 2015 by GronardII