Shatterpoint?

[SirUrza 1]

My group is thinking about moving from Saga to the new game and going to maintain our characters. My character was heavily built around lightsaber combat augmented by the Shatterpoint power. 

 

It seems like the bottom control upgrade is what I'm looking for, is there anything else I should be looking at?

Edited April 12, 2015 by SirUrza

[Donovan Morningfire 10,200]

The Mastery Upgrade (free Triumph against one target if successfully activated) and bottom row Control Upgrade (commit 3 Force Dice to gain Pierce equal to Cunning+Perception) for the Seek is pretty much Shatterpoint in a nutshell.  Or at least the combat-related aspects of it.

 

It's also expensive, since you need Force Rating of at least 2 to have a chance at activating the Mastery Upgrade, to say nothing of the XP to purchase all those upgrades in between.

 

If anything, it goes back to what Shatterpoint initially was in the EU... a very rare and difficult to master ability that not every Jedi and their nephew had access to.

 

Though truthfully, if you've not played this system at all before now, I'd strongly suggest just making a fresh start with brand new characters.

[MuttonchopMac 381]

I'll second what Donovan said, especially about starting with new characters. The system plays very similarly at both low and high amounts of xp, but too much xp off the bat and you can be drowning in talents and rolling a lot of dice. Starting small is the way to get a feel for it.

[Donovan Morningfire 10,200]

I'll second what Donovan said, especially about starting with new characters. The system plays very similarly at both low and high amounts of xp, but too much xp off the bat and you can be drowning in talents and rolling a lot of dice. Starting small is the way to get a feel for it.

This is quite true.

 

The power curve between this game and Saga Edition is very different, due in no small part about how combat remains dangerous no matter how much XP you've accrued, as abilities that let you avoid getting hit are pretty well spread out amongst the talent trees, and a group of stormtroopers can remain dangerous to your party no matter how much XP they've accrued.  I've seen groups that were used to stormtroopers (particularly in d20) being complete chumps be shocked that a couple of stormtrooper minion groups could be such a major threat to their characters.

[The Grand Falloon 1,718]

While i agree that starting at a lower level is a good idea, perhaps they could have some rapidly accelerated XP gain until the reach an equivalent level.  You could always have some goofy power drain, like in almost every video game sequel where the main character loses all his upgrades from the first one.  As long as you explain to the players why you're doing it, ham-handedness can be overlooked.

[capnhayes 28]

I think that if shatterpoint is included as a talent it would give someone the ability to add breach 1 to a brawl check.

[MuttonchopMac 381]

The Mastery Upgrade (free Triumph against one target if successfully activated) and bottom row Control Upgrade (commit 3 Force Dice to gain Pierce equal to Cunning+Perception) for the Seek is pretty much Shatterpoint in a nutshell.  Or at least the combat-related aspects of it.

 

It's also expensive, since you need Force Rating of at least 2 to have a chance at activating the Mastery Upgrade, to say nothing of the XP to purchase all those upgrades in between.

 

If anything, it goes back to what Shatterpoint initially was in the EU... a very rare and difficult to master ability that not every Jedi and their nephew had access to.

 

Though truthfully, if you've not played this system at all before now, I'd strongly suggest just making a fresh start with brand new characters.

 

 

I think that if shatterpoint is included as a talent it would give someone the ability to add breach 1 to a brawl check.

 

You should read Donovan's post above in detail. You get 5+ pierce (assuming you have 2 or 3 for Perception / Cunning, which gets through most things, and a Triumph on every combat check. So insta-crits. You'll crit someone to the point of death really quickly.

[Donovan Morningfire 10,200]

And against most opponents, Pierce 6 or 7 (Cunning 3 + Perception 3 or 4) is going to be quite sufficient to get through their soak value.

 

We really don't see shatterpoint being used against vehicles, so providing any degree of breach isn't necessary.  Lightsabers get Breach 1 because we have seen them get used on vehicles (generally lightly armored ones) in both trilogies and other places, and them being known for slicing through most things without too much hassle.

[Oden Gebhac 445]

And against most opponents, Pierce 6 or 7 (Cunning 3 + Perception 3 or 4) is going to be quite sufficient to get through their soak value.

 

We really don't see shatterpoint being used against vehicles, so providing any degree of breach isn't necessary.  Lightsabers get Breach 1 because we have seen them get used on vehicles (generally lightly armored ones) in both trilogies and other places, and them being known for slicing through most things without too much hassle.

There's an episode of the Clone Wars where Windu uses shatterpoint to break the canopy of a downed gunship.  That's about the only instance Shatterpoint used on a vehicle I know of.  Has anyone thought of how to use Shatterpoint, mechanically speaking, against an obstacle like a viewport a simple door?

[Donovan Morningfire 10,200]

 

And against most opponents, Pierce 6 or 7 (Cunning 3 + Perception 3 or 4) is going to be quite sufficient to get through their soak value.

 

We really don't see shatterpoint being used against vehicles, so providing any degree of breach isn't necessary.  Lightsabers get Breach 1 because we have seen them get used on vehicles (generally lightly armored ones) in both trilogies and other places, and them being known for slicing through most things without too much hassle.

There's an episode of the Clone Wars where Windu uses shatterpoint to break the canopy of a downed gunship.  That's about the only instance Shatterpoint used on a vehicle I know of.  Has anyone thought of how to use Shatterpoint, mechanically speaking, against an obstacle like a viewport a simple door?

 

If you're referring to the 2D series, remember that Force usage was incredibly over the top in that series, with Mace Windu taking the cake in that.  Heck, we see Yoda flipping massive Separatist troop carriers around like they were toys, something that's quite difficult in this system.

[Oden Gebhac 445]

 

 

And against most opponents, Pierce 6 or 7 (Cunning 3 + Perception 3 or 4) is going to be quite sufficient to get through their soak value.

 

We really don't see shatterpoint being used against vehicles, so providing any degree of breach isn't necessary.  Lightsabers get Breach 1 because we have seen them get used on vehicles (generally lightly armored ones) in both trilogies and other places, and them being known for slicing through most things without too much hassle.

There's an episode of the Clone Wars where Windu uses shatterpoint to break the canopy of a downed gunship.  That's about the only instance Shatterpoint used on a vehicle I know of.  Has anyone thought of how to use Shatterpoint, mechanically speaking, against an obstacle like a viewport a simple door?

 

If you're referring to the 2D series, remember that Force usage was incredibly over the top in that series, with Mace Windu taking the cake in that.  Heck, we see Yoda flipping massive Separatist troop carriers around like they were toys, something that's quite difficult in this system.

 

I think so since I haven't seen a lot of the CGI series.  But that scene was perfectly done.  The gunship had crashed, the canopy was already stressed to kingdom come so using Shatterpoint would have been relatively simple versus to use Shatterpoint.  

 

Also I think some people forget another usage of Shatterpoint.  Windu often used Shatterpoint while meditating on events and people, attempting to divine critical points that could tip things one way or another.  I think it would be neat to see Shatterpoint used in a non-combat scenario during gameplay.

[Donovan Morningfire 10,200]

A lot of Mace Windu's usage of shatterpoint outside of combat can very easily be chalked up to him having decent ranks (3 or so) Charm, Negotiation, and Leadership, which combined with a high Presence and the Influence Control Upgrade that lets him roll his Force Dice (I'd say he's Force Rating 5 going by the old EotE Beta chart) on those kinds of checks means he's going to succeed on even when rolling against really high difficultly dice pools.

 

Just that one Influence control upgrade by itself would be enough to allow a Force user to excel in non-combat situations.

 

Also, Mace Windu had been noted to be exceptionally gifted at sensing and employing shatterpoints, with most individuals trained to do so really only able to do the combat side or the social interaction side.  Mace was unusual in that he could do both fairly easily from a young age as opposed to having to be a seasoned Jedi Master.

 

So in that light, don't fall into the trap of thinking that shatterpoints are a simple and easy thing to do.  In Legends, it's generally not unless the Force user is exceptionally gifted (Mace Windu) or written as being excessively overpowered (Jacen Solo by the Legacy of the Force series).