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I'm out

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Seriously...

2nd edition Tilea will be published but I'll be buggered if I can even afford this game let alone have the patience to bother with it

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I like how the game mechanics about combat, so you can spend the rest of the evening "roleplaying" how  you manage to hit the orcs in their faces and spleens...

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Darthvegeta800 said:

What a 'splendid' community.
Barely anything is known so far and venom has been spat at FFG already.

The same is the case with essentially every RPG community faced with a new edition of their game of choice - 'edition wars' will break out, overflowing with vitriol and declarations of loathing. It's annoying, but largely harmless so long as you're not too easily offended.

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N0-1_H3r3 said:

Darthvegeta800 said:

 

What a 'splendid' community.
Barely anything is known so far and venom has been spat at FFG already.

 

 

The same is the case with essentially every RPG community faced with a new edition of their game of choice - 'edition wars' will break out, overflowing with vitriol and declarations of loathing. It's annoying, but largely harmless so long as you're not too easily offended.

 

True i suppose. The same goes for example for WH40K edition changes.
Still going so hostile with only a small preview as a foundation? I can understand a modicum of negativity or caution but this?

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Darthvegeta800 said:

What a 'splendid' community.
Barely anything is known so far and venom has been spat at FFG already.

 

I said it before and I'll say it again. Disagreeing with the direction that FFG is taking with a game that we love is well within our rights. Expressing our annoyance can hardly be seen as besmirching the community. 

I suppose we are all expected to just accept and be happy about the changes, even if we don't feel that way? 

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Darthvegeta800 said:

True i suppose. The same goes for example for WH40K edition changes.

Still going so hostile with only a small preview as a foundation? I can understand a modicum of negativity or caution but this?

Compared to the D&D 3.5/4 edition war this is quite sedate, actually. And that one still causes border skirmishes to flare up now and again, two years after D&D4 was first announced and over a year since it was released. The last big one before that was the WFRP edition war of 04/05.

People are passionate about their hobbies, as can only be expected. When confronted with something that challenges their passions, they react, well, passionately.

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Shadowspawn said:

Darthvegeta800 said:

 

What a 'splendid' community.
Barely anything is known so far and venom has been spat at FFG already.

 

 

 

I said it before and I'll say it again. Disagreeing with the direction that FFG is taking with a game that we love is well within our rights. Expressing our annoyance can hardly be seen as besmirching the community. 

I suppose we are all expected to just accept and be happy about the changes, even if we don't feel that way? 

Clamoring like its the coming of apocalypse when they've only put out a description blurb that goes on the back of a box?  I could point at other recent events where people make a lot of noise without knowing the full story, but i'd rather not start a flame war.

right now, none of us really know what the changes are and have nothing to really be upset or happy about.

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I have to agree with Darthvegeta.

We don't know anything yet and people are starting outraged flame threads about how WFRP 3rd Ed sucks already. Gg.  

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True, we have a very limited amount of information to go on right now (so it would be nice if FFG had actually given us some real detail to go on). However, the information we have been given is very disturbing.

The dice pool idea is hardly that revolutionary, sounds like a cross between games like Descent and a bunch of older RPGs I've got upstairs gathering dust (bought them, don't play them because the rules don't work). Might be wrong on this, but I'm extrapolating from what FFG have said and what I've seen elsewhere.

Cards as an integral part of gameplay; I just hate this idea, it's impractical for one thing. My group doesn't have anywhere to put a bunch of cards while we're gaming. We don't all sit around a table, because there isn't room. Instead we sit scattered around my living room, all we need with the current rules is a hard surface to rest on while we're writing and to roll the dice on (hardback rulebook does just fine for this).

Now we need somewhere to put cards, counters and other paraphenalia, you can't just use them from hand because which cards you select and put in play have a direct impact on gameplay (actions, stances?). Plus you've also got card and token management at a group level.

Careers: dozens to choose from? So fewer than you get in the core book for WFRP2 even if you only count the basic careers in other words. And the 40 or so careers in WFRP3 includes "advanced" careers like waywatchers, swordmasters, wizards, ironbreakers and witch hunters. Very different approach to the background right there.

So no, we don't have a huge amount of information. But I don't like what we do have.

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Its the way that FFG have gone about introducing this game which raises my hackles.  All the crap of ART and the silence before and during, its just plain annoying tbh.

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Saying that people have no reason to be concerned is disingenuous in my view. It's certainly true that fans tend to get excited about this sort of thing but to say that nothing is known is absurd. It's already clear that the new edition is going to have radically new mechanics and utilise a number of gimmicks that appear to be geared to discourage piracy. It's quite clearly a sea change in WFRP and surely people's understandable concerns don't deserve to be dismissed or patronised. Why should I want a game that mechanically bears virtually no relation to the game I like?

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ChaosChild said:

 

So no, we don't have a huge amount of information. But I don't like what we do have.

 

 

Exactly, and I really do not have the money for £50 odd pounds to blow on this new edition, from what I've seen I'm sticking with what I know. Even if this means I'm seen as some sort of strange luddite (rpgite?)

This thread is here just as a response to the "I'm in" thread, I've stopped out of there and I've really not been vitrolic about the game at all, hell I was perhaps the calmest one on the forums when FFG first picked WFRP up... but now, bugger it. I've defended them to hell and it turns out the naysayers were right

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I've also been a bit disturbed by what I've seen but I think it would be better to reserve judgement once the final product is out. The pics from gencon show a character sheet that is extremely similar to the 2nd edition. So it is possible that they might be offering two ways to play the game, such as how there are two ways to rule armor in the 2nd edition rules.

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Valadar said:

I've also been a bit disturbed by what I've seen but I think it would be better to reserve judgement once the final product is out. The pics from gencon show a character sheet that is extremely similar to the 2nd edition. So it is possible that they might be offering two ways to play the game, such as how there are two ways to rule armor in the 2nd edition rules.

This actually brings a glimmer of hope into my eyes again....gran_risa.gif

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Valadar said:

I've also been a bit disturbed by what I've seen but I think it would be better to reserve judgement once the final product is out. The pics from gencon show a character sheet that is extremely similar to the 2nd edition. So it is possible that they might be offering two ways to play the game, such as how there are two ways to rule armor in the 2nd edition rules.

 

Player sheets in question...

3.bp.blogspot.com/_eqPrIE5E1OM/SoRCK5KBDmI/AAAAAAAAAGc/kCuHItjFC_A/s1600-h/0813091230-775642.jpg

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If the game has the slightest recemblance to a boardgame then I'm out for sure! I HATE it - I don't think it has anything to do with roleplaying! 

WFRP is dead - long live WFRP1 & WFRP2

 

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Aldred Fellblade said:

Saying that people have no reason to be concerned is disingenuous in my view. It's certainly true that fans tend to get excited about this sort of thing but to say that nothing is known is absurd. It's already clear that the new edition is going to have radically new mechanics and utilise a number of gimmicks that appear to be geared to discourage piracy. It's quite clearly a sea change in WFRP and surely people's understandable concerns don't deserve to be dismissed or patronised. Why should I want a game that mechanically bears virtually no relation to the game I like?

 

To discourage piracy? 

partido_risa.gif

Yeah, let's see... FFG has a huge problem with piracy, with all the succesful board games they sell, with DH (pure paper RPG, easily scanned) selling like hot bread and continually out of stock with most retailers - hilarious idea. 

Even if they did and they only wanted to milk money out of players - do you think it would be a good idea to release a risky and inventive new product in a 100 bucks box? That alone is going to discourage a lot of buyers, probably more than would download the pirated PDF if FFG just printed a new, lightly modified edition of the pure paper WFRP. 

Your piracy notions make no sense whatsoever. 

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Schwermuht said:

If the game has the slightest recemblance to a boardgame then I'm out for sure! I HATE it - I don't think it has anything to do with roleplaying! 

WFRP is dead - long live WFRP1 & WFRP2

 

 

Yes, because as any good roleplayer knows, roleplaying is dependant on system!

Oh, wait... it isn't.

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Diriel said:

Valadar said:

 

I've also been a bit disturbed by what I've seen but I think it would be better to reserve judgement once the final product is out. The pics from gencon show a character sheet that is extremely similar to the 2nd edition. So it is possible that they might be offering two ways to play the game, such as how there are two ways to rule armor in the 2nd edition rules.

 

 

 

Player sheets in question...

3.bp.blogspot.com/_eqPrIE5E1OM/SoRCK5KBDmI/AAAAAAAAAGc/kCuHItjFC_A/s1600-h/0813091230-775642.jpg

It looks like there's six primary characteristics.  I don't see Weapon Skill or Ballistic Skill on there, so I'm assuming they're actually skills now.  Furthermore, I can't read the last characteristic, so I can't tell if it's still Fellowship or if they've changed it to something else.  Odd that they didn't add Perception, or if they did, it's frustrating that Fellowship may have been replaced.

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Aldred Fellblade said:

 

It's already clear that the new edition is going to have radically new mechanics and utilise a number of gimmicks that appear to be geared to discourage piracy.

 

 

Discourage piracy?

Forgive me for asking, but have you actually met a person that has taken the decision of refusing to buy any more RPG books, because he/she can just download them online?

I find the concept a bit laughable, this is still a hobby where you pretty much NEED the books to be in bookform, and printing a pirated copy of a book seem like more of a trouble than just buying the book in the first place.

So why would these "gimmicks" as you call them be geared to discourage piracy?

I seriously hope that FFG won't buy into the whole crap idea about lost revenues because of piracy (a myth concocted by hollywood and disgusting record companies). Books have been available FOR FREE in libraries for years and years, yet still people have not decided to quit buying books. And just because you can get an inferior copy of a book for free online it doesn't mean that it will discourage people from buying the book later on if they think the pdf copy is worth the money.

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Sythorn said:

It looks like there's six primary characteristics.  I don't see Weapon Skill or Ballistic Skill on there, so I'm assuming they're actually skills now.  Furthermore, I can't read the last characteristic, so I can't tell if it's still Fellowship or if they've changed it to something else.  Odd that they didn't add Perception, or if they did, it's frustrating that Fellowship may have been replaced.

If you look really carefully at the Envoy career, I think Fellowship is listed as one of its primary characteristics.

Perception may still be a skill, but all basic skills may default to their parent attributes' full rating now, instead of using half the rating like in V2.

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Schwermuht said:

If the game has the slightest recemblance to a boardgame then I'm out for sure! I HATE it - I don't think it has anything to do with roleplaying!

It looks like a board game because it's packaged like one, and because it has lots of nifty color handouts that probably last for the whole campaign. But from everything I've seen, it's just a snazzy roleplaying game.

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