Is it possible to use Rebel's maneuver dial for Scum ships?

[lightage 2]

There are three ship tokens and six card for Y-Wing and Z95 in the Most Wanted expansion pack. But only two maneuver dials.

Can I use rebel's dial for using third Y-Wing (Z95)?

[DR4CO 6,234]

In a tournament, the rules require that you have everything matching your chosen faction.

 

In casual play, check with your opponent, but I doubt many would object.

Edited February 25, 2015 by DR4CO

[Icareane 489]

I'm not seeing anything about that in the FAQs, do you have a quote?

Only thing I could find was that you need components from official x-wing produts.

[Itsacon 4]

Actually, the Official Tournament Rules make no mention of this. They only thing mentioned is that your cards need to match your faction.

I really hope they'll be lenient in this, cause I'm kind of annoyed at how few dials you get with the Most Wanted pack. No Rebel dials for the ships at all, and just 1 dial for the Firespray and HWK. So running the included ships with your rebels would be impossible, and if you want to run a dual-Firespray S&V list, you'll have to buy 4 big sets...

Unless they come out with a way to buy dials seperately, the Scum faction would be very expensive to run competitively.

Edited February 25, 2015 by Itsacon

[Krynn007 2,445]

I doubt they be lenient.

Why would they include a second ywing dial in most wanted?

[Itsacon 4]

Because it's nice to have matching dials. But if they wanted to enforce it, they should have included 3 Rebel dials in the box as well.

Like I said, the tournament rules don't mention dials, just cards, so right now, RAW says it doesn't matter.

[ScottieATF 2,867]

FFG has already stated they are going to require that ship base and dial match the intended faction.

[lightage 2]

Where has FFG stated it?

Edited February 25, 2015 by lightage

[Sergovan 1,440]

I'm not upset about the lack of dial to make my Y's and Z's rebel. I am upset that I can't make my rebel Y's and Z's scum. The hwk and firespray get the bonus but no Y or Z.

 

I'll be getting 2 most wanted sets for the firespray dials. Everything else will be gravy.

[Klutz 1,590]

Just to set the record straight here...

 

The Most Wanted pack comes with dials for :

• The 2 included Z-95's
• The 1 included Y-Wing
• An extra Y-Wing
• An extra HWK-290
• An extra Firespray

So, for the 40$ MSRP you're getting 3 new ships and dials + cards to use 3 of the ships you already own with the new faction.

I'd say that's as much value for your money as the core set (40$ MSRP for 3 ships, dice, templates, damage deck, etc).

[Darth Emphatic 148]

Agreed, Kultz. not like there is Ny precedence here. You usually get one dial for each ship in the box.

[Klutz 1,590]

Agreed, Kultz. not like there is Ny precedence here. You usually get one dial for each ship in the box.

 

Yeah, I personally think the Most Wanted pack was a good move on FFG's part, as it let's them kick-start a new faction with 7 ships in a single wave!

[Itsacon 4]

Yes, we know: with MW, you can use the ships you have for your rebel and imperial fleets as scum fighters.

We're not debating whether MW is good value for money.

The problem is: you also get three `Rebel' fighters with MW, but no Rebel dials.

But as I've said: the official rules currently DON'T say that your dials have to match your faction. Just your cards. So until they change that, it's not a problem if you have a couple of spare Gold and Bandit cards lying around (or use the named pilots).

[lightage 2]

Agreed, Kultz. not like there is Ny precedence here. You usually get one dial for each ship in the box.

But if I want to play two Firesprays I have to buy 2 MW packs with 3 useless ships

Edited February 25, 2015 by lightage

[Klutz 1,590]

Yes, we know: with MW, you can use the ships you have for your rebel and imperial fleets as scum fighters.

 

My previous replay was specifically in response to Sergovan's post, as he seems to have been misinformed about the presence of an extra Scum Y-Wing dial.

 

I'm not upset about the lack of dial to make my Y's and Z's rebel. I am upset that I can't make my rebel Y's and Z's scum. The hwk and firespray get the bonus but no Y or Z.

 

 

 

The problem is: you also get three `Rebel' fighters with MW, but no Rebel dials.

But as I've said: the official rules currently DON'T say that your dials have to match your faction. Just your cards. So until they change that, it's not a problem if you have a couple of spare Gold and Bandit cards lying around (or use the named pilots).

 

If they had included the rebel dials, people would've complained that they didn't include the rebel ship cards and tokens.

And had they included those, the price of the pack would have gone up and been too expensive for just 3 miniatures!

 

I am 85% sure that I saw something from FFG (an e-mail or something) saying you had to have the appropriate dial for your faction.

Unfortunately, I do not remember where I saw this, so I suppose it could be a figment of my imagination.

In any case, I would be very, very surprised if FFG let you use your rebel dials to play scum, or vice versa.

 

 

 

Agreed, Kultz. not like there is Ny precedence here. You usually get one dial for each ship in the box.

But if I want to play two Firesprays I have to buy 2 MW packs with 3 useless ships

 

Well, yes, if all you want is the stuff to run 2 Scum Firesprays, you'll need to buy 2.

And if all you want is the Stealth Device card, you need to buy 2 Firesprays.

Want 2 Predators but only fly Rebel? You need to buy 2 Defenders.

Want to fly Paul Heaver's Fat Han from Worlds? You'll need to buy a Corvette.

 

The only solution to all these problems is to have FFG sell each individual component separately.

And we know that's not going to happen, they've said so before.

 

If you look at Most Wanted as being a pack of only 3 ships (2 Z-95's and 1 Y-Wing), it's a good deal at 13$ a ship instead of the normal 15$ a ship.

Add in the fact that they're including a bunch of stuff for ships you already own and you're getting an amazing deal.

[VanorDM 11,599]

The problem is: you also get three `Rebel' fighters with MW, but no Rebel dials.

No you don't, you get 3 S&V Fighters. There would be a whole lot less confusion and questions if people would just stop thinking of the Z-95 of Y-Wing as both Rebel and S&V ships.

But as I've said: the official rules currently DON'T say that your dials have to match your faction.

The official rules don't allow you to use S&V ships at all right now. When the tournament rules are updated they will include that. Unless of course FFG happens to change their stance, which I doubt but anything is possible.

[Itsacon 4]

The official rules don't allow you to use S&V ships at all right now. When the tournament rules are updated they will include that. Unless of course FFG happens to change their stance, which I doubt but anything is possible.

Yes they do mention Scum: Page 2 of the official Tournament rules

Each player may choose to field a Rebel, an Imperial, or a Scum & Villainy

squad, as tournament seeding ignores the player’s faction.

But nowhere does it say Maneuver dials have to match the faction.

The only place they are mentioned is:

Players may mark

their tokens and their maneuver dials to indicate ownership as long as the

function of the component is not compromised. However, players should be

careful not to mark the backs of their maneuver dials in an asymmetrical way,

or in any way that may indicate to their opponents what maneuvers they have

selected!

So you could just say you've `altered' your maneuver dials to look more like the Scum ones...

[ScottieATF 2,867]

Where has FFG stated it?

In an email that gets reposted every 3 weeks when this same thread pops up over and over again. I give it a few hours before someone goes and finds it.

[VanorDM 11,599]

Yes they do mention Scum:

S&V still isn't legal for Tournament play until they're officially released. So no you can't use them yet. It's possible that they may not have the tournament doc ready for this weekend so they updated it like that to make sure people knew S&V was legal this weekend.

Or maybe they're not going to require people to use the correct dial, anything is possible but that would be a reverse of what they've said already via emails to us.

So you could just say you've `altered' your maneuver dials to look more like the Scum ones...

You could get a sticker or I suppose a cover of some sort that looks like a S&V dial face, and one for the back... But unless you can remove them, then you couldn't use them as rebel dials.

[Buhallin 4,563]

So you could just say you've `altered' your maneuver dials to look more like the Scum ones...

 

Any time you have to say "So you could just say you've..." you're trying to skirt the rules, and you know it.

 

This has been asked and answered via an email from FFG, which I'm sure you can find a link for around here if you actually care about the right answer.  They don't address it in the Tournament rules because it's part of the base rules.  From the rulebook, Page 6:

 

He then assigns the maneuver to one of his ships by placing the dial facedown near its corresponding ship inside the play area.

 

A Rebel Z-95 is not a Scum Z-95, even if they have the same dial.  They don't share the same base plate, or cards.  It's impossible for a Rebel dial to have a corresponding ship which is a Scum ship.

 

We can argue all day over whether they should allow it, how much a wrong-faction dial should be accepted as a general rule and how much a jerk that guy down at the shop is for wanting you to have the right dials...  But the actual rules, for both casual and tournament games, are pretty clear.

[ScottieATF 2,867]

https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/index.php?/topic/114166-scum-and-villainy-most-wanted-expantion-question/page-2

Email clarification is in that thread.

Look this thread has been done about 12 times now. This is the rules forum. A question was asked there is the answer, directly from FFG. Do we need to go through this again?

[Itsacon 4]

A Y-Wing dial next to a Y-Wing is next to its corresponding ship.

You're confusing ships and pilots.

Otherwise, how could you use the Imperial Firespray in a Scum fleet?

There's dials, models, baseplates and cards. For a Scum fleet, you can only use scum baseplates, and scum cards, since those two are tied together. But nowhere in the rules (base or tournament) does it say dials need to be faction matched, just that they need to match the ship.

What people have gotten in emails 6 months ago is irrelevant: It doesn't say anything about it in the official rules that were updated less than a week ago.

Edited February 25, 2015 by Itsacon

[ScottieATF 2,867]

Then do us all a favor and send your own email to FFG, because we are all tired of having this same thread every couple of weeks.

Maybe they changed thier mind, maybe you'll have to accept that they haven't . The world wonders.

Edited February 25, 2015 by ScottieATF

[Buhallin 4,563]

A Y-Wing dial next to a Y-Wing is next to its corresponding ship.

You're confusing ships and pilots.

Otherwise, how could you use the Imperial Firespray in a Scum fleet?

 

No, actually I'm not confusing anything.  The component list includes Ship Tokens (the base plates).  They include Ship Cards (the cards).  The rules sometimes use "pilots" interchangeably with "ships", and typically refer to ships, cards, and dials having a 1:1:1 relationship.  There's actually an argument to be made (depending on how finely you want to parse 'corresponding') that Dutch would have his dial, and the Gold Squadron Pilot has his, and even though they're both Y-wings they're not interchangeable.

 

You can use an "Imperial" Firespray in a Scum fleet because it's not an "Imperial" Firespray.  Everything that makes the ship the ship - the card, the baseplate, and the maneuver dial - are Scum.  Why include a Boba Fett or Kath Scarlett tile?  Except for the color, they're identical.  Why include a Scum Firespray dial, since you literally CANNOT fly it unless you own a matching Imperial dial?  Same goes for the extra Y-wing dial.  What's the point of including it?  If you have an extra Y-wing model, you've got a Rebel dial for it.  The only thing not included in Most Wanted is the models, which they've said you can mix freely.

 

The back of the box even tells you what the components are for - "This pack also contains enough components to repurpose 1 Rebel Y-wing, 1 HWK-290, and 1 Firespray-31 as Scum and Villainy ships."  So what do you need in order to repurpose the ships for a different faction?  What's in the box.  What's in the box?  Tiles.  Cards.  Dials.

 

<shrug>  A question was asked, and you've got the answer.  The response is unanimous.  We've got a very clear email from FFG telling you what the answer is from an official source.  At this point there's nothing to do but, as Scottie says, send another query to FFG to ask if they've changed their minds.  But the rules, the logic of what they put in the box, and an email direct from Frank all says that faction-specific components must match.  You're not alone in disliking it, but you're way past the point of actually trying to find a correct answer, and well into making things up to force it to work the way you want.

[VanorDM 11,599]

What people have gotten in emails 6 months ago is irrelevant:

That's not even remotely true. What the head designer says about any given rules question is always relevant, until FFG changes their mind on it. How long ago the email came out however is not relevant.