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X-Wing 4th Faction

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I was talking to Bjorn Rockfist over the weekend at the Store Championship we were playing in, so I hope I don't steal his thunder here, but he's got me talked into that not only is there going to be a 4th faction, but it's going to be called Smugglers and Pirates. 

 

He noticed that once the card game added Scum and Villainy, X-Wing was right behind them and apparently the card game has a Smugglers and Pirates faction. 

 

I'm beliving it. You've already got a couple of Bobas, a couple of Hans would fit right in too. Along with Talon Karrde, et al. 

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I was talking to Bjorn Rockfist over the weekend at the Store Championship we were playing in, so I hope I don't steal his thunder here, but he's got me talked into that not only is there going to be a 4th faction, but it's going to be called Smugglers and Pirates. 

 

He noticed that once the card game added Scum and Villainy, X-Wing was right behind them and apparently the card game has a Smugglers and Pirates faction. 

 

I'm beliving it. You've already got a couple of Bobas, a couple of Hans would fit right in too. Along with Talon Karrde, et al.

With all due respect to Mister Rockfist, he's wrong. More or less, you have the following three factions in X-wing:

(1) Empire: ships flown by the Imperial Navy, plus one ship typically flown by slavers, bounty-hunters, and law enforcement.

(2) Rebellion: ships flown by the Rebel Alliance, plus two ships flown by smugglers very closely identified with the Alliance.

(3) Scum and Villainy: everybody else.

There's no room for a "smugglers and rogues-with-hearts-of-gold" faction, because it's very hard to come up with a consistent set of people that should be in the faction and aren't already in either the Rebellion or S&V. You could reprint Dash and Leebo and Han and Chewie and Lando and Drea Renthal and N'Dru Suhlak and Emon Azzameen and Palob Godalhi, but that's a pretty long list, and probably indicates that S&V is intended to be a catch-all for ships and pilots FFG would like to include that don't fit neatly into the Rebel or Imperial factions.

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Even civilian / private security seems like a dumb idea to me. How would that be fun to play? Why would anyone want that? You're purposefully filling this game with obscure ships that have no real place here. What do you need that can't already fit into another faction?

This game is diluted enough. Add more junk ships and you'll turn away players. Scum is pushing it enough as-is. A fourth faction marks the end of this game.

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3 factions is cool,

 

if they do anything, which I don't think they will, I would rather them come out with a new set.

 

TITLE: "GUNSHIP"

 

whole new base set with 1 republic gunship and 2-3 vulture droids.

that would make wave 1:

republic=gunship, ARC fighter

separatists= vulture droids, tri-fighter

 

it would be a stand alone game, but compatible with X-wing if you so wished, of course only cards for each system would be tournament legal for the system they are from.

but it could make for some cool friendly games once it really started rolling out.

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[...]

1. Ep VII, VIII and IX ships in the game. [...] (though Falcon clearly needs a K-Turn based on the preview ;) )

Don't think so, you have been fooled, this is not the K-Turn you are looking for:

http://m.imgur.com/gallery/MVhkmQa

(Click on your own risk, the illusion will be smashed to pieces...)

 

Fairly sure it's still a K.

https://i.imgur.com/H8s9aMF.mp4

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I was talking to Bjorn Rockfist over the weekend at the Store Championship we were playing in, so I hope I don't steal his thunder here, but he's got me talked into that not only is there going to be a 4th faction, but it's going to be called Smugglers and Pirates. 

 

He noticed that once the card game added Scum and Villainy, X-Wing was right behind them and apparently the card game has a Smugglers and Pirates faction. 

 

I'm beliving it. You've already got a couple of Bobas, a couple of Hans would fit right in too. Along with Talon Karrde, et al. 

Pretty sure i said that as a joke a month or so back and was just pulling it out of thin air.

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The smugglers and spies (pirates) will be the next faction.  Probably won't happen for a year or so (Gencon 2016) but it will allow FFG to re-purpose and add variety to some current ships (YT-1300 / YT-2400 / Lamada) along with whatever new stuff they put out. 

 

This is going to happen.  But don't say anything.  People on the forums get their panties in a bunch and start foaming at the mouth over the idea that FFG would want to re-release with new pilot abilities and cards no name ships like the Falcon.

 

Or that Chewey could be the pilot of a Lamada Shuttle.  Crazy, wild stuff that would never happen.

 

Also the idea that Smuggler Han going up againist Rebel Han in a fight in X-wing is totally something, something idoitic or something.

 

I mean can you imagine how stupid you would have to be to think that like how scum is an underworld reflection of empire with an illict slot that Smugglers and spies could be an under world reflection of the Rebels with an illict slot.

 

I personally was pleased they released Boba with a new badass ability and breathed new life, options, and variety into an awesome, iconic character from Star Wars.  But the very idea that this might be done also for Han, Chewey, and Lando is so far outside the realm of possiblity for some people on this forum that it makes skipping across a sidewalk puddle into jumping the Grand Canyon.

 

Bring on the rage nerds

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I mean can you imagine how stupid you would have to be to think that like how scum is an underworld reflection of empire with an illict slot that Smugglers and spies could be an under world reflection of the Rebels with an illict slot.

In this game, Scum and Villainy isn't the "underworld reflection of empire".

Edited by Vorpal Sword

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There doesn't need to be a fourth faction, especially smugglers and spies. They were only included in the card game because there has to be a light side affiliation for every dark side affiliation in that game. They aren't necessary in x-wing because mirror matches can be played. Scum and Villainy was made to include "everyone else," and already has Emon Azzameen.

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Ok, so if FFG did a 4th faction, what could, or would, it be?  I can think of 3 possiblities:

 

1.  Stuff from the Prequel Trilogies.  

2.  Stuff from The Old Republic era

3.  For something completely unique, the Yuuzhan Vong.

 

@1: No but those ships from that era could show up in this game and would hopfully be the Civil War era / Dark Times versions.  Funny thing about CIS droids is that the REBs and the Empire on Byss and some other planets use them.  Besides the IMPs and REBs sharing REP and CIS craft, both factions use X-Wings, Y-Wings, TIE Fighters, TIE Interceptors (very limited) TIE Defenders (Ultra limited) and a TIE Phantom (Once in a life time)

 

@2: Same as 1.

 

@3 Sure nothing has taken the Vong out of canon yet, technically from what IVE seen they shouldnt ever be decanonised, at worst most the fine detailes of their invasion is changed.  Would be cool and ironic if a rogue World Destroyer eats up most their fleet.

 

Vong could have fleet building rules sim to Nids and Dark Elds from BFG.  I also want to se ZC as a sep faction or have rules that givem sub faction rules.  They mostly use high qulity fighters and ships not alot of the junk coming out for S&V.  With what we got mini wise they only ships you could use to have a true ZC force is Star Vipers, Bossok, IG-88 ABCD.  I dont recal them using Head Hunters...

 

Corperate Sector is a good faction to introduce clone wars era REP fighters that are not upgraded / stay true to EP 1-3

 

I think the Hutts have their own fleet that are made up of ships that look like sailbarges and flying saucers.  I might be mixing a pirate fleet with the Hutts.

Edited by Black Knight Leader

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There's really not room or practical need for another faction... but perhaps for another game. And that would be the Prequel era.

If folks could quit being snobbish about the films and just enjoy the plethora of fun ships, it could be a great time: Vulture swarms. Buzz droids. The ARC-170.  Lil' interceptors with Force powers. Good Times.

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I was talking to Bjorn Rockfist over the weekend at the Store Championship we were playing in, so I hope I don't steal his thunder here, but he's got me talked into that not only is there going to be a 4th faction, but it's going to be called Smugglers and Pirates. 

 

He noticed that once the card game added Scum and Villainy, X-Wing was right behind them and apparently the card game has a Smugglers and Pirates faction. 

 

I'm beliving it. You've already got a couple of Bobas, a couple of Hans would fit right in too. Along with Talon Karrde, et al. 

Pretty sure i said that as a joke a month or so back and was just pulling it out of thin air.

 

 

Some people truly believe it. :(

Smugglers and Spies exists because the card game has two sides, it's split into Light and Dark and it needed a light side equivalent of Scum and Villainy to side with the Jedi and the Rebels, Scum and Villainy likewise was bound to the Sith and the Empire. X-wing's Scum takes no side but its own: it's a third side. The Smugglers and Spies are Rebel aligned and thus part of the Rebel faction. A fourth faction would make X-wing a four sided conflict: S&S would be fighting the rebels. What sense does that make?

Card Game Scum and Villainy isn't in X-wing. It's represented by the Imperial Firespray. Likewise, the Outrider and Falcon represent X-wing's S&S.

 

@3 Sure nothing has taken the Vong out of canon yet, technically from what IVE seen they shouldnt ever be decanonised, at worst most the fine detailes of their invasion is changed.  Would be cool and ironic if a rogue World Destroyer eats up most their fleet.

Episode VII directly overwrites them.

Edited by TIE Pilot

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Ok, so if FFG did a 4th faction, what could, or would, it be?  I can think of 3 possiblities:

 

1.  Stuff from the Prequel Trilogies.  

2.  Stuff from The Old Republic era

3.  For something completely unique, the Yuuzhan Vong.

 

Smugglers and Spies.  We'd see the crossover of the YTs and the Lambda to them as well as some faction only ships.  I'd also say we'll see it sooner than later now that Disney is in the picture.

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@3 Sure nothing has taken the Vong out of canon yet, technically from what IVE seen they shouldnt ever be decanonised, at worst most the fine detailes of their invasion is changed.  Would be cool and ironic if a rogue World Destroyer eats up most their fleet.

Episode VII directly overwrites them.

 

 

It doesnt overwrite anything.  Besides the writters have already said that if anythings changed it will only be the fine details.

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@3 Sure nothing has taken the Vong out of canon yet, technically from what IVE seen they shouldnt ever be decanonised...

Overwriting the Yuuzhan Vong invasion would be a blow against poor taste and boring storytelling.

Smugglers and Spies.  We'd see the crossover of the YTs and the Lambda to them as well as some faction only ships.  I'd also say we'll see it sooner than later now that Disney is in the picture.

As noted above, don't hold your breath.

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Ok, so if FFG did a 4th faction, what could, or would, it be?  I can think of 3 possiblities:

 

1.  Stuff from the Prequel Trilogies.  

2.  Stuff from The Old Republic era

3.  For something completely unique, the Yuuzhan Vong.

 

Smugglers and Spies.  We'd see the crossover of the YTs and the Lambda to them as well as some faction only ships.  I'd also say we'll see it sooner than later now that Disney is in the picture.

 

 

I could see that as a way to bring in more YVs and YT craft mostly used by Smugglers.  Maybe make the ship models as modular as the actual craft they are based on.

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I think a faction would need to have recognizable filler ships from the films to be viable as a faction. FFG wants iconic ship models on the table so that when non-players walk by they can instantly recognize the Star Wars IP and become interested, that's why FFG doesn't allow you to alter the shape of ship models in tournaments, they know you will be playing in a public venue with spectators that might become interested in the game when they recognize the Star Wars IP on the table. 

 

Even though Scum was not a big part of the original movies, the faction's filler ships are mostly iconic ships from the films, Slave I, Y-Wings and the Z-95 (which are recognizable to most laypeople as a Star Wars ship because it resembles an X-Wing with its wings closed). I actually think the Scyk got a slight nerfing because FFG was worried it would be too popular as a filler ship without actually looking like a Star Wars ship to the average joe fan. Also note that the generic pilots for TIE Defender, E-Wing and TIE Phantom are considered underpowered, making it more likely that players would field the unique pilots and less likely to field multiples of these less recognizable ships in the same list.  

 

Admittedly the IG-2000 kind of debunks this theory, but it's the only ship so far that does not closely resemble a ship from the films that is also explicitly designed to be run in multiples. 

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Smugglers and Spies lose a lot of what makes them unique once a dogfight starts. If anything like that is added to this game, I'd expect it to be more of an alternate ruleset introduced in an Ace-like pack that allows Han to pilot a Lambda Shuttle and adds Rookie One and Ru Murleen as Phantom pilots.

 

For the most part, even considering the EU stuff, the X-Wing miniatures game really seems to want to capture the feel of the movies. Something that the Star Wars fandom has taken for granted over the years, was that there really wasn't even a Scum and Villainy faction in the movies. Bounty Hunters like Boba Fett? Their plot relevance came from being hired by the Empire. Smugglers like Han? Are already assisting the heroes before they ultimately join the Rebellion. The beginning of Return of the Jedi is the closest you get to a distinct Scum and Villainy faction in the movies (even in Mos Eisley, for which the faction is named, the biggest threat was the Empire and its spies).

 

Which isn't to say that Scum and Villainy doesn't belong in this game, just that it's really the only logical stretch. A better way to look at the factions in this game is that they represent good, evil, and neutral (obviously not from a literal standpoint, but from a literary one). If they really meant to represent every in-universe faction, it would already be a lot more split up. I think it's pretty safe to say these three factions are the only ones the X-Wing Miniatures Game will ever have, just because of the way it's set up. I personally would have no problem with them adding more if they felt justified, but I don't think they mean for the game to be set up that way.

 

The one loophole is that I totally wouldn't be surprised to see a Republic vs. Separatists or other timeline match-up as a spin-off game at some point, that would be compatible in casual play but generally separated competitively. Not saying it's likely, but it's the only way I'd expect them to justify new factions going forward (and even then, there could easily be a "this faction counts as Rebels, this faction counts as Empire" clause in compatibility rules).

Edited by Jokubas

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Ok, so if FFG did a 4th faction, what could, or would, it be?  I can think of 3 possiblities:

 

1.  Stuff from the Prequel Trilogies.  

2.  Stuff from The Old Republic era

3.  For something completely unique, the Yuuzhan Vong.

 

Smugglers and Spies.  We'd see the crossover of the YTs and the Lambda to them as well as some faction only ships.  I'd also say we'll see it sooner than later now that Disney is in the picture.

 

 

What faction only ships? And why are they killing the Rebels? Why is the Lambda, aka the Imperial Shuttle, in a fourth faction of militant smugglers killing Rebels, Imperials and Scum alike as a combat vessel?

The card game Scum and Villainy is not in X-wing. Scum are not Imperial aligned, they're their own team as FFG constantly points out in their articles. S&S is rolled into the Rebels. There's no justification at all for putting anything other than a Starbird on them.

 

I could see that as a way to bring in more YVs and YT craft mostly used by Smugglers.  Maybe make the ship models as modular as the actual craft they are based on.

 

Turretship faction. That'd go down just great.

 

The three we have at the moment cover pretty much everything thematically and in terms of ships. What Smugglers and Spies covers starship-wise is already factored into the Rebels. S&S would literally be Rebels without their arcships.

Edited by TIE Pilot

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I could see that as a way to bring in more YVs and YT craft mostly used by Smugglers.  Maybe make the ship models as modular as the actual craft they are based on.

Turretship faction. That'd go down just great.

 

The three we have at the moment cover pretty much everything thematically and in terms of ships. What Smugglers and Spies covers starship-wise is already factored into the Rebels. S&S would literally be Rebels without their arcships.

Shying away from the ugly saucer YTs, most of the better-looking ones have more wierd arcs than turrets, or turret slots instead of full-on Range 3 stuff.

 

They should, of course, be Scum larges though.

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Smugglers and Spies lose a lot of what makes them unique once a dogfight starts. If anything like that is added to this game, I'd expect it to be more of an alternate ruleset introduced in an Ace-like pack that allows Han to pilot a Lambda Shuttle and adds Rookie One and Ru Murleen as Phantom pilots.

 

For the most part, even considering the EU stuff, the X-Wing miniatures game really seems to want to capture the feel of the movies. Something that the Star Wars fandom has taken for granted over the years, was that there really wasn't even a Scum and Villainy faction in the movies. Bounty Hunters like Boba Fett? Their plot relevance came from being hired by the Empire. Smugglers like Han? Are already assisting the heroes before they ultimately join the Rebellion. The beginning of Return of the Jedi is the closest you get to a distinct Scum and Villainy faction in the movies (even in Mos Eisley, for which the faction is named, the biggest threat was the Empire and its spies).

 

Which isn't to say that Scum and Villainy doesn't belong in this game, just that it's really the only logical stretch. A better way to look at the factions in this game is that they represent good, evil, and neutral (not literally of course, but from a more narrative standpoint). If they really meant to represent every in-universe faction, it would already be a lot more split up. I think it's pretty safe to say these three factions are the only ones the X-Wing Miniatures Game will ever have, just because of the way it's set up. I personally would have no problem with them adding more if they felt justified, but I don't think they mean for the game to be set up that way.

 

The one loophole is that I totally wouldn't be surprised to see a Republic vs. Separatists or other timeline match-up as a spin-off game at some point, that would be compatible in casual play but generally separated competitively. Not saying it's likely, but it's the only way I'd expect them to justify new factions going forward (and even then, there could easily be a "this faction counts as Rebels, this faction counts as Empire" clause in compatibility rules).

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