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Boy, howdy! A new DH2 supplement!

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Can some one explain the faith powers?  I wonder how they work.  I was thinking of making new ones to do hidden cults that provide power for a measure of faith.

Not sure what you mean. DH1e had "Blood of Martyrs" which indeed did have "faith powers" (e.g. spend a fate point to allow an ally to regrow a lost limb. "Its a miracle!"). Generally speaking, it wasn't well received, or at least viewed as massive power creep.

 

In Enemies Within, SoBs now just have access to a couple speciality talents, much like the Inquisitor elite advance. Thematicly they draw upon the zeal of the Battle Sister, generally through manipulation of the Fate Point economy (they have a few things that allow them and allies to regain Fate Points, as well as a few extra uses of Fate Points for relatively short term but sizable boosts to statistics).

 

 

Dang...  Oh well.  At least I know what they do now.  Oh well I can make up talents for hidden cults.

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And home for lunch break to find mine on the doorstep.  Sweet.

My cursory (VERY cursory - and don'thave it here at work, so won't really be able to answer questions) skim likes what I've seen so far.  Especially the new CG choices.  I also like that there's a section on "Tools of the Radical" or something to that effect, basically about using, well, Radical stuff like Dark Oracles, Death Cults, etc, in the purging of Heresy with Heresy.

I especially liked Frontier World for concepts.  Ag world was very much about being the burly farmer sort.  Feudal seemed almost broken, never penalized for wearing armor.

Penitent seemed good, albeit a bit of work, needing to keep track if you took damage to get a roll bonus.  while Radical seemed a bit weak at first glance, spend a fate point to get hatred for a particular foe for the encounter, and if you run from it, lose a point of sanity.

 

All the same, they were definitely written up with the 'role' being your approach to doing things in the Warband, not what you are.  This makes something like a Penitent Guardsman very feasible, and that's a good thing!

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These generally do two things: use your insanity bonus to add to damage, penetration etc, or allow you to use your WP Bonus for the same thing.

Nope. Nothing used in the Canoness profile is available to the SoB elite package.

 

That actually sounds rather cool - and surprising. After reading BoM, which featured a drastically different interpretation of the Sisters and their Acts of Faith as opposed to what I am used to, and later material such as the aforementioned rulebook and its Canoness reaffirming this stance, I really did not expect they'd re-think their stance on this subject.

 

I really like the idea of using Insanity Bonus, too. Clever, and fitting.

 

Still not a fan of making the system rely on a resource all characters can use for other important stuff by default, but it depends on just how the mechanic allows them to regain spent FP - i.e. the "sweet spot" of being able to trigger just the right amount of standard FP uses whilst still having something to do your special moves with.

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I haven't read the book so I can't really make a hard stand on them having so many of their moves based around FPs. In general it's an idea I'm okay with to make certain class ideas stand out but it's easy to mess up. Tau PCs from RT for example have a bunch of cool FP based abilities, but of course they start play with one FP. Dark Eldar have pain tokens that can really influence how they base their play style which I think was well done. I'm really interested in reading it. And I do like the idea of them gaining insanity points instead of corruption points. Though I wonder if maybe they could use their own special derangements like they have in Death Watch. Becoming more insular, paranoid, and psychotic with specific gameplay effects would be pretty chill. Like -20 to all fellowship tests made with those not part of the Ecclesiarchy, hatred against anyone not part of the Ecclesiarchy. Stuff like that.

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I just got the book. 

They work a lot with FP, but on the other hand, you can get some back when you get righteous fury in battle (if you've got the right talent), which ain't bad.

 

It is not ultimate, but it can be a very strong character when duty calls.

Which talent is that? I'm not seeing it in the generic talent pool, is it SoB only?

 

EDIT: Nevermind, found it. That's pretty snazzy.

Edited by cyclocius

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Dark Eldar have pain tokens that can really influence how they base their play style which I think was well done.

 

Oh, so basically this is an example where class-based abilities were, for some reason, not used with FP but their own unique mechanic? Interesting, probably some sort of experiment by the designers, considering they (sadly) did not seem to apply it anywhere else.

 

Though I wonder if maybe they could use their own special derangements like they have in Death Watch. Becoming more insular, paranoid, and psychotic with specific gameplay effects would be pretty chill. Like -20 to all fellowship tests made with those not part of the Ecclesiarchy, hatred against anyone not part of the Ecclesiarchy. Stuff like that.

 

It would be cool, but probably too "micro" for a game like DH that does not focus on them. The Deathwatch RPG contains a ton of mechanics whose only purpose is to lend an even greater focus on playing Space Marines, some of whom such as special derangements would make perfect sense in "crossover" games like Black Crusade as well, but simply are not used to keep complexity somewhat in check - and some of whom are really only there to generate/support an epic experience as if you'd watch a movie or read a novel, but don't make much sense from a more realistic PoV (I'm looking at you, squad modes).

 

Either way, potential is certainly there!

 

They work a lot with FP, but on the other hand, you can get some back when you get righteous fury in battle (if you've got the right talent), 

 

Another clever idea.

 

My chief criticism with using FP for these abilities was always that this approach would essentially "rob" these characters of options that should be available to everyone, by forcing you to decide between spending FP for normal things or on what is supposed to be special about you. On the other hand, if FP represent what Shadowrun would refer to as "Edge", it makes sense that any such abilities should draw from this same resource for the sake of consistency and, depending on your version of Acts of Faith, even balancing.

 

The only thing I could see going wrong here is that the character either becomes too powerful by generating too many FP (especially if they also use them for "normal" Fate stuff, surpassing other characters in the amount of standard Fate bonuses triggered), or perhaps more likely that they still don't regain a sufficient number of FP due to Righteous Fury not being triggered often.

 

An unintended bonus, however, might be that this nudges a Battle Sister character slightly towards using their traditional bolt weaponry due to its Tearing trait (greater chance to generate RF).

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Or chainsword in close combat, which gives the same bonus. 

I also like the idea of having different mechanics dependant on the class, instead of the Fate Points. Until we get that, the sister regenerate hers FP with the first righteous fury of each battle, which is nice. 

 

Also, the reinforcement characters are also nice, even if I don't think that playing an arco-flagellant should be fun...

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Yeah with RT dark eldar, they didn't have a lot of FPs, but certain actions depending on their char builds would generate pain tokens, and like X amount of tokens equaled a temporary fatepoint. The actions could be stuff like killing an enemy in melee, inflicting critical wounds, or whatever. I don't remember if they got any special abilities with their fatepoints, but the pain tokens made them feel and play a bit different. Killing an enemy was important, but now the hows had mechanical value.

 

I haven't read rules for Sisters yet, but the renewal of Fate Points via righteous fury seems to be a pretty similar idea. It would cause them to favor weapons with tearing, which bolters and chainswords some of their traditional weapons have. It would also cause them to generally favor weapons that do multiple d10s and some aoe sort of weapons right? Dropping frag grenades and spraying flamers into clumps of enemies seems to be situational but quite badass. Melta weapons are even better. Hitting someone with an eviscerator, that's 4 chances to roll a 10 per attack. Those are kind of extreme examples for various reasons , but I can imagine most SOBs rocking a bolter with an exterminator cartridge, a 1handed chainsword, and some frags. Which seems highly appropriate. Even meltas and eviscerators totally fit into their wheel house honestly.

 

This sounds like a cool rule. I can't wait to get my hands on it.

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Yeah Soul Reaver is pretty interesting. The adventure is okayish, I like it but plenty don't, and even if you don't like it itself. It is a pretty cool setting for the Expanse. And the armory is nice as usual.

 

Hmm that is an interesting point. I always read tearing as an extra d10 per d10, but that's not actually how it's worded. Guess I never though about it too hard me not using too many weapons that would qualify. All the same with that reading it's still 3 chances. Which is still pretty sweet. Thanks for pointing that out.

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The only thing I could see going wrong here is that the character either becomes too powerful by generating too many FP (especially if they also use them for "normal" Fate stuff, surpassing other characters in the amount of standard Fate bonuses triggered), or perhaps more likely that they still don't regain a sufficient number of FP due to Righteous Fury not being triggered often.

 

An unintended bonus, however, might be that this nudges a Battle Sister character slightly towards using their traditional bolt weaponry due to its Tearing trait (greater chance to generate RF).

 

 

True, but this ability (or at least the ability to buy it) resides in the Sister Of Battle Elite advance package, not the 'homeworld analogue'. The other elite advances existing to date are 'Inquisitor' and (on a more relevant scale to starting characters) 'Pariah' - both of which have equally no shortage of defy-the-normal-rules abilities.

 

Also, to be honest, I'm fine with the idea of 'you get more fate points' - fate points are generally implied to be the emperor's blessing, generally going the adepta sororitas' way, fits their character in a more subtle way than 'sparkly space magic'.

 

Not to mention, you can pump fate points on other people's behalf, too, once or twice in a campaign - Whenever you burn fate and survive, instead of standing up magically intact, you instead grant everyone who sees your noble sacrifice/miraculous survival (delete as appropriate) fate points back themselves.

 

And yeah, I like that the rules mechanically favour chain and bolt weapons. That may or may not be deliberate but it's very characterful.

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I don't understand why FFG doesn't want my money. I am not buying your falling apart at the seems hardcover, no matter how much you'd like me to.

 

All withholding the PDF is doing is making me unhappy. Why are you making me unhappy instead of taking my money?

 

Its bad business.

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It's available on DriveThruRPG now. 

 

I think something 'off' might have happened with that release.  Numerous people say that they never got an alert email; and if you look at the bottom of the right sidebar, it claims that it was released just over a month ago.  It's like it was in the system but wasn't showing up on searches or something.  

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Someone in the other thread mentioned it was categorized under DH1 and nobody noticed for a month. Which is both sad and hilarious if true.

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So I got the book a few days ago and read through it once, working on my second through. It is good. Was interesting, entertaining and had quite a few new things and GM hooks to use. My biggest complaint was I wanted more content. I want more practical and varied items; think lazcannon or thunderhammer, signature 40k weapons. The new addition to armor upgrades was excellent but fell flat. They had so much potential to do anything and they kinda just went "meh, whatever, here are a couple things you can do". The book had a severe feel of "writer not caring" effect about it. Again, I say it was a good read, but I felt none of the material to expand upon the corebook was particularly interesting. 

 

New class system. I called it. I knew they were going to keep the old class system and just drop the advanced skills. The advanced talent system officially just replaced the character progression of the old game. They hinted at it in core with Inquisitor, blank and psyker, but with SOB, it is entirely back. I find the advanced system to be redundant and they should have skipped the whole aptitudes system but whatever. I am neither for nor against this new method. I am against, however, having all the classes of the first being split into new expansion books, which is obvious now they are going to do.

 

Though more than anything, I am so glad they brought back minor psychic powers; I expect them all or most to be brought back in future editions, which did raise the question, why not new psyker branch? Seems like a wasted opportunity to bring back some of the oldies but goodies.

 

Agree? Disagree? What do you guys think?

Edited by Olifant

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I thought the book was great.  I like how they have Sister of Battle as an elite advance with Sororitas as a background.  I don't mind the new "advanced" progression via using Elite Advances.  I was really looking forward to the Sister talents, as I was a big fan of Blood of Martyrs and all the faith talents in there and the Reinforcement Sister and her talents. in the core book. The Profane Relics was a nice addition and I have already taken stuff from there for my campaign.

 

If they keep the same format for Malleus and Xenos, I will be very pleased.

 

~ alemander

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I thought the book was great.  I like how they have Sister of Battle as an elite advance with Sororitas as a background.  I don't mind the new "advanced" progression via using Elite Advances.  I was really looking forward to the Sister talents, as I was a big fan of Blood of Martyrs and all the faith talents in there and the Reinforcement Sister and her talents. in the core book. The Profane Relics was a nice addition and I have already taken stuff from there for my campaign.

 

If they keep the same format for Malleus and Xenos, I will be very pleased.

 

~ alemander

Did you pick cursive comic sans for your font on purpose?

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