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booored

Any word on necrons / nids?

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Magic the Gathering would like to have a word with you.

Well, at risk of going a little more off topic, I'll just add that MTG has a extremely rich lore. We are talking massively thick easily the equal of 40K. Entire wiki's full of interconnecting plots and each expansion adds to this in a very direct way. Just google the latest set and you will find the story that is attached to this, a story usually thicker than many games. There are entire forums that do nothing but talk about the story and theme of the new sets. Though, like ANY game, it is a backdrop to the game itself and MTG like 40K the table top game can attract players who know nothing of the theme, just that it is MTG or 40K. The big difference is that they are established games.

So... Anyone allready made some guesses on which Warlords could be the potential Necron and Tyranid Warlords?...

Trazyn the Infinite maybe? He is all about artefacts and ancient technology. This could translate into the game as attachments and support cards. So you "assimilate" the other faction or faction for army units and then augment them with these old artefacts.

Though I am still not sold on this "assimilate" aspect of necron lore. To be frank it smacks of a newer codex than I have read. They were all about the cleansing of life when I knew them.

Edited by booored

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Magic the Gathering would like to have a word with you.

Well, at risk of going a little more off topic, I'll just add that MTG has a extremely rich lore. We are talking massively thick easily the equal of 40K. Entire wiki's full of interconnecting plots and each expansion adds to this in a very direct way. Just google the latest set and you will find the story that is attached to this, a story usually thicker than many games. There are entire forums that do nothing but talk about the story and theme of the new sets. Though, like ANY game, it is a backdrop to the game itself and MTG like 40K the table top game can attract players who know nothing of the theme, just that it is MTG or 40K. The big difference is that they are established games.

 

 

How much of the game have you played so far?

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For me it's a mixture of theme and mechanics. Star Wars, Game of Thrones and this all appeal to me on a thematic level, which drew me to them in the first place... but then Star Wars mechanically seems a bit bonkers to me, while AGOT was a tad run of the mill (also it's getting a second edition anyway so might as well hold off). At the time, since I could only choose one, I chose Conquest because I loved the way it plays the best.

 

(Although 4 player AGOT is pretty cool)

 

But everyone tells me Netrunner is an amazing game and I'm honestly not that bothered because I have no connection with the universe, I don't really care about the cyberpunk setting. I might get around to trying it at some point but I'm no rush.

 

My two credits: Theme draws people in, but it's the mechanics that keep people playing. Having a great IP to hook is important, but if it plays **** then no-ones going to get past the core set unless they have more money than sense. And friends. Friends help.

 

Also - people are forgetting that AGOT introduced two new houses after release, although that was in the CCG Days. Post LCG switch each new house was given a Deluxe Expansion of it's own though

 

Possible we might see a similar occurrence here?

Edited by DigitalEccentric

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Trazyn the Infinite maybe? He is all about artefacts and ancient technology. This could translate into the game as attachments and support cards. So you "assimilate" the other faction or faction for army units and then augment them with these old artefacts.

Though I am still not sold on this "assimilate" aspect of necron lore. To be frank it smacks of a newer codex than I have read. They were all about the cleansing of life when I knew them.

 

 

Yes there have been some huge changes to the Necron lore, hence I can't really put my finger on which Warlords are potential candidates for the LCG. I do think we will see a C'tan and perhaps a general recursion theme, altough I hope they will give them the depth they need.

 

Another possability is that they'll add some non Necron-Nid cards among the Necrons to boost up certain factions, maby Chaos will get another boost, together with AM? I hope so at least (altough they might get that in Warpacks aswell).

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My two credits: Theme draws people in, but it's the mechanics that keep people playing. Having a great IP to hook is important, but if it plays **** then no-ones going to get past the core set unless they have more money than sense. And friends. Friends help.

quote for truth

 

Also - people are forgetting that AGOT introduced two new houses after release, although that was in the CCG Days. Post LCG switch each new house was given a Deluxe Expansion of it's own though

Possible we might see a similar occurrence here?

I would say that it is a marketing aspect of the LCG. CoC, Warhammer Invasion and Lord of the Rings all introduced new factions as well after a few cycles. The only one that hasn't is Netrunner.

 

I do think we will see a C'tan

Isn't C'tan like a God or something? That would be like actually having a Tzeentch or Khorne themselves in a chaos deck, wouldn't it?

perhaps a general recursion theme

This or maybe more likely a regeneration theme?

 

Another possability is that they'll add some non Necron-Nid cards among the Necrons to boost up certain factions, maby Chaos will get another boost, together with AM? I hope so at least (altough they might get that in Warpacks aswell).

I would be willing to bet that there will NOT be any specific cross nid/nec factions cards. Nids will be totally separate from Necs. The wheel seams to show that nids can not ally with necrons in anyway, or with anything for that matter.

I would also bet that in the deluxe that they introduce the new factions they will also add maybe 2 or 3 new cards for each of the older factions as well.

Edited by booored

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C'tan used to gods, they are now "dowgraded" to the likes of Greater Daemons/Daemon Princes.

Regeneration is also a decent option. Altough Gift of Isha or Recursion fits the "standard" for the undead/ever living.

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C'tan used to gods, they are now "dowgraded" to the likes of Greater Daemons/Daemon Princes.

hmmm.. lame. Still in that case it would be more of a massive "demon" type card like the Chaos ones. Though a "Demon Prince" could totally be a warlord, so I dunno. Guess we will find out eventually.

Regeneration is also a decent option. Altough Gift of Isha or Recursion fits the "standard" for the undead/ever living.

Yeah but recursion is such a powerful effect in card games. I would be a little nervous if I was a designer and giving a single faction such a bonkers powerful effect as a tribe trait. I mean, sure it fits the "undead never dies" thing pretty well, but I would like to see recursion in some way on all factions eventually as I have always felt that like card advantage though increasing your draw it is really a "basic" effect. Also, we have seen recursion on Tau though the 1st Tau warlord's attachment recursion power.

Regen could be a safer mechanize to give a faction without drastically altering how you play when you pick up necrons. They would just be harder to kill due to a heal effect, maybe necrons might be rare as well, as they could reply on the faction pairing for army units. Obviously I am just imagining here.

A few mates and I made a 40K game about 10 years ago or so. We got around the regen thing by having necrons when killed tap, or deactivated was the keyword we used. They would remain tapped and regen 1 health a turn until 1/2 health rounded down. Then they would uptap and march on. Like in the table top game there was cards that could accelerate the "revival". We did this so necrons could "die" and "regen" but never in fact interact with the actual discard pile. There was a lot of other cool stuff, like the physic field link of the necrons was powered by support cards (to use conquest terms), each monoloth allowed 1 point of dmg to heal on any activated necron. So there was also some ways for them to regen when damaged before they died.

Anyway w/e... my old game has nothing to do with anything, but my point is that with a little imagination there is many ways they could go with this "undead" thing.

What about Nids? I do not really know much about them apart from them being a bio-swarm and all that general stuff. Maybe the Hive Warlord could be a actual hive ship? I also saw a post here ages ago that suggested that a Tyrinid warlord could be a entire planet. I thought that was cool.

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This thread makes me laugh so much :D

 

On topic:

aGoT released additional factions in separate deluxe expansions and considering the huge difference thematically and mechanically between Necrons and Tyranids, I would expect the same for Conquest.

 

On MtG Theme:

Even though it has a theme, that's not why people play/don't play.

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This thread makes me laugh so much :D

 

On topic:

aGoT released additional factions in separate deluxe expansions and considering the huge difference thematically and mechanically between Necrons and Tyranids, I would expect the same for Conquest.

 

On MtG Theme:

Even though it has a theme, that's not why people play/don't play.

It's hard not to laugh when we have our own resident harlequin.

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On MtG Theme:

Even though it has a theme, that's not why people play/don't play.

Well, I think for the majority that is true, as MTG is so large now as a established game that the theme is not the draw it once was. That isn't to say it doesn't have theme. It has extremely strong theme.

Still remember when it was first released this wasn't the case. MTG was designed with the simply idea "what if baseball cards was an actual game". With the original MTG release, they were worried that with out the draw of personalities, what we would now call theme, no one would invest in the collectors aspect. So if you look at the old MTG posters, they had entire stories and the boxes in the stores had cards printed on them with slogans and little mini stories. So "Llanowar Elves" wasn't just a random card, it also had its own personal story. This was done specifically to add theme and to try and put personality behind the cards so it mimicked the baseball personality idea.

Now they do not bother, with Planeswalkers and entire book series, comics etc etc. The theme is so established that even people that do not play the game know the theme. Much like say with 40K.

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I don't understand all these claims that people aren't playing the game because Tyranids and Necrons aren't in, like those two are the only factions people play, and the 7 (SEVEN!) factions released and blossoming to date barely cater to half of the possible players.

 

Such holdouts will always have pie-in-the-sky claim as to why the game isn't "real" 40K yet.  I am sure if Tyranids and Necrons were released tomorrow, these same conscientious objectors would unleash their outrage decrying that until a Squat warlord makes an appearance, this is just a flavourless sham.

 

Game is fast, fun, and furious, and I hope the designers keep doing what they are doing, and release new factions when they believe the current ones have the level of variety they wish for them.  

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See my post in Rumors and News of all my thoughts but:

 

My Guess:

Deluxe Expansion - Necrons and Tyranids - July
 
Amy LCG product except the core sets have always had 3 of each card and I do not see that changing any time. These rules have worked for FFG and there is no business based reason to change now.

 

See Edge of Darkness for the Star Wars community. It was like Core-set part 2. It completed some not fleshed out factions but only provided half of the play set required each player to buy 2 to complete it. This allowed them to add a greater variety of cards while keeping the price point to that of a normal deluxe. I wouldn't put it out of reach for something like that to happen here.

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See my post in Rumors and News of all my thoughts but:

 

My Guess:

Deluxe Expansion - Necrons and Tyranids - July
 
Amy LCG product except the core sets have always had 3 of each card and I do not see that changing any time. These rules have worked for FFG and there is no business based reason to change now.

 

See Edge of Darkness for the Star Wars community. It was like Core-set part 2. It completed some not fleshed out factions but only provided half of the play set required each player to buy 2 to complete it. This allowed them to add a greater variety of cards while keeping the price point to that of a normal deluxe. I wouldn't put it out of reach for something like that to happen here.

 

 

The difference betweem Tyranids/Necron and Star Wars is the simple fact that in Star Wars they gave you 2 half-assed factions and it was frustrating if you wanna play those factions. In Conquest, they are not there yet, so it's easier to wait for them IMO since they didn't include half a candy in the Core Set. 

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I'd be surprised if they did that. People dislike being forced to buy 2 copies of the same thing. Not that it makes any real difference, it is mainly a psychological thing. Players just like a single box that has everything in it. Simple as that.

You can argue that the faction box in star wars is bad for the game as eventually years from now a new player needs to track down 2 copies of it instead of one, when it may be out of print and hard to find. This is the best argument for why FFG should not ever do this again. They are not always in print like Core Sets.

Still there is a worrying precedence in the Core set. I was very surprised to see us forced to buy 3 copies of the core set. ANR was designed so only the very keen needed 3 and Star Wars only needed 2. Conquest "requires" 3 as most cards are singles. So based on that... maybe we might need to buy 3 sets of the expansion!! hehe

I would also be very surprised if they split Nids and Necs into two expansions. People are pisses and people are waiting. They would be mad to not introduce the new factions as fast as possible. Having these factions come in late has completely turned off many players already. If the box comes out and some waiting player doesn't get their faction and now has to wait even longer, that will be it for them and this game. As I said at the start of the thread most people I know personally didn't buy the set when they found out Nids especially and necs where not in it. Nowadays most players I know, can not even remember this game exists as it has fallen so far off the radar. Those that do remember are waiting for the faction box. If they have to wait even longer.. then I doubt any will pick it up/

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@booored,

I for one wouldn't mind having 'Nids and Necrons split into 2 boxes.

 

I would rather have 2 well done, balanced races, with plenty of variety in cards, split into 2 boxes and thus requiring me to purchase 2 boxes total, rather than one complete box (with both races housed therein) that might not contain a required amount of balanced cards and/or necessary cards to game with off the bat. (out of the box)

 

Just an opinion.  :)

Edited by Papa Midnight

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Yeah it will be one or the other, but I do not think it will be the star wars model where you get both factions but need to buy to copies. It will either be a single box with 3 of every card and both factions, or 1 box for each.

Personally I'd like to see one box for both.

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Yeah it will be one or the other, but I do not think it will be the star wars model where you get both factions but need to buy to copies. It will either be a single box with 3 of every card and both factions, or 1 box for each.

Personally I'd like to see one box for both.

I am pretty sure they will do 1 box 2 factions. Based on recent deluxe expansions most are 165 cards (3 x 55)

My prediction will be 2 or 3 warlords each

So 55-12 =43 cards left

43/2 21.5

So

21 necrons

22 nids

I'm pretty sure nids will get more cards since they don't get ally

So

2 warlords each

18 necron

25 nids

Or

3 warlords 15/22

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I believe it will be a single warlord each in the deluxe expansion. Cards in the core and deluxe expansions stay active in rotation so 1 warlord for each faction just like the core set

 

So

1 warlords each
17 Necron - 60 cards
32 Tyranids  - 105 cards
 
Bothe can be played, without allies, out of the box and have room for variation in play style. The first two warpacks in the next cycle will have a second warlord for each.
 
All warlords in the warpacks will cycle out of tournament play after 8 cycles

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Don't discount that there will probably be at least 1-3 neutral cards in the expansion, perhaps more so that it can to be of use to factions outside of those present in the box.

I would expect 2-3 warlords per faction in a deluxe to provide variety. Not sure there will be another warlord for every faction in the second cycle, that is a lot of card slots that could be better used for more general expansion.

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yeah, people always forget neutral!

I kinda assumed 3 warlords but I think Tek may be right. If it came with 4 warlords 2 for each then they would have the same count as the other factions. Not sure why I didn't think of that before. This would open up a ton of slots for cards.

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10 Factions counting Neutral. 165 cards in a Deluxe Expansion. Two Warlords with signature squad means 147 cards divided by 3. That leaves 49 cards for two factions. 60 cards in a Warpack. 6 Warpacks in a cycle. Only core sets and Deluxe Expansions stay in rotation, all other card, including Warlords, will cycle out

 
Deluxe Expansion 1 will look something like:
1 Tyranid Warlord with signature squad plus 32 other Tyranid cards
1 Necron Warlord with signature squad plus 17 other Necron cards
165 total cards
 
Cycle 2 will look something like:
1 Tyranid Warlord plus 17 new cards, 2 cards for each of the 7 original factions plus 3 Neutral cards (60 cards)
1 Necron Warlord plus 17 new cards, 2 cards for each of the 7 original factions plus 3 Neutral cards (60 cards)
2 cards for 7 factions plus 3 cards for two factions (60 cards)
2 cards for 7 factions plus 3 cards for two factions (60 cards)
2 cards for 7 factions plus 3 cards for two factions (60 cards)
2 cards for 7 factions plus 3 cards for two factions (60 cards)
This cycle would give us 1 new Warlord and 9 new cards for Tyranid and Necron, 12-13 new cards for everyone else and 14 new Neutral cards
 
Deluxe Expansion 2 might be 2 Warlords with signature squads for each of the 9 factions plus 3 Planet cards. This would be 165 as well and give us three Warlords for each faction that stay in rotation and one each that will fall out in high cycles along with 3 new Planets.
 
or
1 Warlord with signature squad for each of the 9 factions plus 3 new cards for each faction - 120 cards
9 new planets
12 new Neutral cards
 
Cycle 3 will look something like:
2 new cards for each faction (60 cards)
2 new cards for each faction (60 cards)
2 new cards for each faction (60 cards)
2 new cards for each faction (60 cards)
2 new cards for each faction (60 cards)
2 new cards for each faction (60 cards)
 
 
If Deluxe Expansion 2 is just cards then
5 new cards for 5 factions
6 new cards for 5 factions
 
and Cycle 3 will look something like:
1 Warlord, 9 new Planets plus 14 new cards (60 cards)
2 Warlords plus 14 new cards (60 cards)
2 Warlords plus 14 new cards (60 cards)
2 Warlords plus 14 new cards (60 cards)
1 Warlord plus 17 new cards (60 cards)
1 Warlord plus 17 new cards (60 cards)
This would allow for 9 new cards for each faction and 9 Neutral cards during the cycle.
 
This is the first LCG that is designed from the start with rotation in mind. I expect to see Planets in Deluxe Expansions and most Warlords in Cycles. But we must think about what stays playable and what will rotate out as we consider these products. 
Edited by Tekwych

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Hehe nice crystal ball you got there.... Anyway we will see, but I still expect 4 warlords 2 of each faction and then all same faction cards with maybe 3 neutrals and 2 of each other faction.

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