Control Questions

[BrooklynMike 0]

1) If you take control of a character, do you get their attachments too?

2) If you take a character during your operations phase can you then turn around and use the character in that phase? 

[Dark Young 0]

1. I'm unable to find a specific saying on wether or not the attachments go with the character, failing that looking at rules for attachments. The only thing I can find saying that they would come off (be destroyed) is if they would be destroyed OR if the characters type is changed in any way.

2. I'm not sure I exactly understand your question but I think your answer follows: When you take control of a character it retains whatver state it was in. If it's exhausted or insane when you take control of it, it enters your play area exhausted or insane. Same goes for Support cards if they're exhausted.

[BrooklynMike 0]

Keeping the attachments or not is a key point, and I hope we can get a ruling. The whole strategy of which character you would take control of is driven by whether or not you get to take their attachments as well.

For now, I'll go with a strict view that accounts for the defined circumstances when a card loses its attachments: when it is discarded, goes insane, or for some reason changes type. This will argue that since gaining control is none of these then you keep the cards. 

[EchPiEl 20]

No, the cards should always de proofread, should do what the card says and nothing more. If a card states that you "gain control of a character" you gain control of the character and nothing more, and it's perfectly possible having an attachment controlled by one player on a character controled by another player (otherwise Curses would be pointless) so it doesn't cause a rules problem of any kind.

[TheProfessor 4]

This is a good question.

Let's consider the Hastur card Infernal Obsession, which says:  Attach to a non-Ancient One character. While attached, you gain control of attached character. If control changes again, discard Infernal Obsession from play.

Why would they bother to clarify "if control changes again..." unless under ordinary circumstances the attachment would transfer?

So my conclusion becomes you get attachments along with characters when you gain control of a character.

[BrooklynMike 0]

 In fact, Internal Obsession was the card that spurred the question, and that wording supported the "keep the cards when you take control" conclusion. 

[EchPiEl 20]

No, that statement in Infernal Obssesion is telling you what to do when the charactar that has Infernal Obsession attached changes control again, not what to do when the card changing control is the Infernal Obsession itself. And has much more sense that way, because otherwise you'll have two attachments (in the case another Infernal Obsession is played on the same character) controlled by two different players, each telling one of them that he has control over the character.

[Dark Young 0]

EchPiEl said:

 

No, the cards should always de proofread, should do what the card says and nothing more. If a card states that you "gain control of a character" you gain control of the character and nothing more, and it's perfectly possible having an attachment controlled by one player on a character controled by another player (otherwise Curses would be pointless) so it doesn't cause a rules problem of any kind.

 

 

 

I agree with you that if a character is "controlled" by a card in play it does not give that NEW controller "control" of its attachment. But I think the question is more so does the attachment stay attached to the character that transferred control.

Example:

Player A controls Repo Man and has attached Dynamite to him.

On their turn Player B plays Infernal Obsession targeting Repo Man. Player B gains control of Repo Man and moves him to their side of the playing field

(Here comes the part of dissension)

IMHO Dynamite would move, still attached, to Repo Man to Player B's play area. But is Dynamite under Player A's control still, or Player B's?

I would think that Player A still controls Dynamite and could choose to activate it whenever it's action can be activated.

I agree that CONTROL of attachments does not change, but that the attachments stay with the character their attached to until one of the occurrences I've noted in the previous post would occur.

And for those don't know it:

Dynamite Cost 2 Agency

Item. Weapon.

Attach to an Ageny character.  Action: Discard Dynamite from play to wound all characters commited to the same story as attached character.

 

Additionally, if the Attachment gives some sort of benefit directly to the character it still affects that character even if its controller changes. Most attachments do not have any text stating that the HAVE to be attached to a character YOU control. They just state "Attach to a character". Heck, if you WANT to give your opponents character some extra Terror icons, more power to ya'. I won't say it was a GOOD decision though.

 

 

[Dadajef 0]

look at here for answers.

[TheProfessor 4]

I'm pretty new to these forums... who is the official FFG rules guru?  (When I looked at the linked discussion, I'm not sure who is the official voice of FFG)

[radynski2 0]

TheProfessor said:

I'm pretty new to these forums... who is the official FFG rules guru?  (When I looked at the linked discussion, I'm not sure who is the official voice of FFG)

The "official" voice of FFG rarely appears in these forums.   We usually take care of the rulings ourselves, but there is often a "guru" who has a little more sway.  Originally it was Mr. Fish (anybody remember him?) and then I took over for several years, with help later on from Marius.  But since I stopped showing up regularly, its been Marius.  At least I think it still is.

[marius8 1]

cannon said:

TheProfessor said:

 

I'm pretty new to these forums... who is the official FFG rules guru?  (When I looked at the linked discussion, I'm not sure who is the official voice of FFG)

 

 

The "official" voice of FFG rarely appears in these forums.   We usually take care of the rulings ourselves, but there is often a "guru" who has a little more sway.  Originally it was Mr. Fish (anybody remember him?) and then I took over for several years, with help later on from Marius.  But since I stopped showing up regularly, its been Marius.  At least I think it still is.

Well, you still are. Even though our opinions usually are diametrically opposed...

[phlip45 0]

I have a question based on control and attachments as well.

Situation: My opponent controls Paul Lemond with a shotgun attached to him, as well as Slavering Gug. In my hand I have a Blind Submission. He commits both Paul and Gug to a story. What I was wondering is A) If I Blind Submission Paul and gain control of him will he still be commited to that story? B) If he is could I pay 1 to shotgun Gug in the face and kill him.

I couldn't find anything in the faq or the rules that states what happens exactly when control changes on a character that is already commited to a story. I'm new to the game and find FFG's forum search to be quite lacking so I'm sorry if the answer has already been posted somewhere. If it was already posted in a faq or in the rules forgive me as I often am blind to the obvious.

[PRODIGEE 0]

Hi Phlip45,

Don't mind asking, we're here to help you. You may find the FAQ in the front page of the Cthulhu minisite, in the SUPPORT section.

If you go to the page 2 of the FAQ , you'll read this :

 

(v1.9) Gaining Control
If a card effect allows you to take control of a
card, move that card into your playing area. If that
card is an attachment, immediately attach it to an
eligible card you control. (If you cannot, then you
may not take control of the attachment.)
When you have taken control of a card, you are
considered to be that card’s controller, but not its
owner. When that card leaves play for any reason,
or at the end of the game, you must return it to its
owner. If it leaves play as the result of a game or
card effect, it defaults to the specified out of play
state of its owner. For example, Marius has taken
control of Travis’ Basil Elton (KD F13) card.
When Marius uses the card’s ability, Basil Elton is
shuffled, by default, back into its owner’s deck.
Note that if you already control a Heroic character,
you cannot take control of a Villainous character,
and vice versa.
When you gain control of a card, that card’s status
does not change. Thus, if you gain control of an
insane or exhausted character, they remain insane
or exhausted.
Any time a player gains control of a committed
character during a story, that character is removed
from the story.

So, you'll get control of LeMond, which will still be exhausted, and removed from the story he was committed at first..

So answer A is No, is not committed anymore

Answer B is Yes, as you've steal Lemond and it's attachment, which you control now (don't forget you're just controler, not the owner ^^).

[phlip45 0]

Thank you very much. I remember reading that. I guess I just missed that last part >.< Thanks again.

[Dark Young 0]

PRODIGEE said:

So, you'll get control of LeMond, which will still be exhausted, and removed from the story he was committed at first..

So answer A is No, is not committed anymore

Answer B is Yes, as you've steal Lemond and it's attachment, which you control now (don't forget you're just controler, not the owner ^^).

Just wanted to clarify. The player who plays Blind Submission does not gain control of the attachment. The original owner/controller still controls the attachment. However, the ability that Shotgun confers is given to Paul Lemond who it's attached to.

Name: Shotgun

Cost:1 Agency

Sub-type: Attachment. Weapon

Text: attach to a character. While attached character is commited to a story, it gains:" Action: Pay 1 to choose and wound a character committed to this story."

If the card didn't have the text "it gains" in it, referring to the character text box it's attached to, the player of Blind Submission wouldn't be able to do anything with the attachment.

Either way the attachment is technically controlled by it's original player, despite the fact they can't do anything with it unless they control the character it's attached to.