Dauntless stress timing question

[dotswarlock 2,424]

I'm going to experiment with the Dauntless title soon and I have a tricky point that I would like to confirm before I pull it off in game.  I managed to use the forum's search function to confirm that a Dauntless + daredevil combo can work (but earns you 2 stress).  However, there is another finer point that I have not managed to find through forum searches.

 

A Dauntless (no matter which pilot), reveals a green maneuver which sets him for a collision.  Does the "check stress level" part of the movement phase happen after the Dauntless title has fully kicked in?  In short, is the sequence like this?

 

- Dauntless does a green maneuver

- A collision occurs and the player choses to use a free action (let's say target lock)

- He then earns a stress from the Dauntless title.

- The "check pilot stress" phase of the green maneuver kicks in, removing the stress. (this is the part that I need confirmed)

 

Thank you!

 

 

 

[LemonheadPrime 88]

It seems to me that the Dauntless title kicks in before the "check pilot stress" step of an activation, so I think what you're suggesting would be possible.

 

My argument for this is the FAQ entry for Night Beast:

 

If “Night Beast” is stressed before he

executes a green maneuver, he cannot

perform a free focus action since the free

action is granted before the stress is

removed during the “Check Pilot Stress” step.

 

Following the same logic, the Dauntless title would kick in before "Check Pilot Stress" step, so the stress is eligible to be removed by the green maneuver.

 

I think.

[WWHSD 9,273]

It seems to me that the Dauntless title kicks in before the "check pilot stress" step of an activation, so I think what you're suggesting would be possible.

 

My argument for this is the FAQ entry for Night Beast:

 

If “Night Beast” is stressed before he

executes a green maneuver, he cannot

perform a free focus action since the free

action is granted before the stress is

removed during the “Check Pilot Stress” step.

 

Following the same logic, the Dauntless title would kick in before "Check Pilot Stress" step, so the stress is eligible to be removed by the green maneuver.

 

I think.

I was totally going to call BS on your interpretation but then I checked the wording of both Dauntless and Nightbeast. They are worded the same way. If NB can't take the Focus Action because stress hasn't cleared yet then Dauntless should apply it's stress before stress gets cleared as well.

[Buhallin 4,563]

Lemonhead has it right.  Dauntless is triggered by the overlap, which is part of the maneuver, which completes before the Check Pilot Stress step - just like Night Beast.

[DraconPyrothayan 6,107]

Wait. What???

[WWHSD 9,273]

Wait. What???

Oicunn has the Dauntless title and Ysanne. He does a green 2 straight into the side of an enemy ship. He activates Dauntless to get a TL and recieves a stress. He then clears his stress because he had performed a green manuever that turn. Combat phase begins and he activates Ysanne for an evade action because he's out of shields and has at least one damage card.

This makes Dauntless (and therefore Oicunn) way better than I thought it was.

Edited January 3, 2015 by WWHSD

[WWHSD 9,273]

 

 

Here's the wording from the FAQ on Night Beast:

 

 

“Night Beast”

If “Night Beast” is stressed before he

executes a green maneuver, he cannot

perform a free focus action since the free

action is granted before the stress is

removed during the “Check Pilot Stress” step.

If “Night Beast” executes a maneuver that

causes him to overlap another ship, he can

still perform a free focus action.

[dotswarlock 2,424]

Well, I'm glad that I spotted that one then

 

Now to see if I can catch anyone with this very, very painful surprise

[WWHSD 9,273]

Well, I'm glad that I spotted that one then

 

Now to see if I can catch anyone with this very, very painful surprise

Print out the FAQ and have it ready. There will likely be an argument.

[DraconPyrothayan 6,107]

That wasn't an "I disbelieve you" comment, it was a HOLY DE^R&*)*&^ E comment.

[WWHSD 9,273]

That wasn't an "I disbelieve you" comment, it was a HOLY DE^R&*)*&^ E comment.

That whole Dauntless+Daredevil+Dauntless+Random Action nested action bit you came up with was pretty smooth. As soon as I saw it i had the same "ooooohhhhhh" moment I had when I realized that Turr could PTL off of his free Boost or Barrell-Roll.

[DraconPyrothayan 6,107]

 That wasn't an "I disbelieve you" comment, it was a HOLY DE^R&*)*&^ E comment.

That whole Dauntless+Daredevil+Dauntless+Random Action nested action bit you came up with was pretty smooth. As soon as I saw it i had the same "ooooohhhhhh" moment I had when I realized that Turr could PTL off of his free Boost or Barrell-Roll.

Dangerous when rules-lawyers and combomen gather in groups, aye?

[Rinehart 684]

If this is the way the Dauntless title works, then what cost does it have?  I mean what is the negative in game effect of using it if the stress is just immediately removed?  It's possible that this is what the game designers intended, but it's unlikely.  In what way does the stress from Dauntless ever even become a factor?  What does it ever limit?  I guess if you do a white move, it doesn't come off.  I'd be surprised if this isn't FAQ'd to not work this way.

 

It is an interesting rule quirk though.

[WWHSD 9,273]

If this is the way the Dauntless title works, then what cost does it have?  I mean what is the negative in game effect of using it if the stress is just immediately removed?  It's possible that this is what the game designers intended, but it's unlikely.  In what way does the stress from Dauntless ever even become a factor?  What does it ever limit?  I guess if you do a white move, it doesn't come off.  I'd be surprised if this isn't FAQ'd to not work this way.

 

It is an interesting rule quirk though.

If you've got stress from the previous round you can't activate Dauntless. If you use Dauntless to activate something that causes a stress, like PTL, you end up with more stress than you can ditch from a single move. This keeps you from being able to use Dauntless in the following round.

I thought it was odd that the Decimator came with both Dauntless and Ysanne even through using one would keep you from being able to use the other. With stress clearing after Dauntless assigns stress it permits a ship that uses Dauntless to also benefit from Ysanne as long as it is doing green moves.

[Buhallin 4,563]

If this is the way the Dauntless title works, then what cost does it have?  I mean what is the negative in game effect of using it if the stress is just immediately removed?  It's possible that this is what the game designers intended, but it's unlikely.  In what way does the stress from Dauntless ever even become a factor?  What does it ever limit?  I guess if you do a white move, it doesn't come off.  I'd be surprised if this isn't FAQ'd to not work this way.

The trigger wording is pretty specific, and FFG has been very consistent with the timing on this.  They could easily have worded it otherwise - "If you overlap another ship while executing a maneuver, you may take your Perform Action step as normal.  Then, gain 1 stress."  That would work the way you think it should.

 

It's also not at all new.  Advanced Sensors+PtL+Green maneuver has been a thing for three waves now, and survives intact, despite having the same "What does it cost??" issue.

 

I don't see any reason - rules-wise, wording-wise, or balance-wise - to think this will be changed any time soon.

[Keffisch 2,642]

And I had so many problems in the previous game because I disallowed myself (as it was unclear at the time) to clear the stress before Ysanne kicked in.

[clontroper5 4,233]

 

watch this^

 

(Not sure if it will work Im having tech difficulties, and had to enter by hand,)

Edited January 6, 2015 by clontroper5

[phild0 1,735]

It DOES seem kind of fishy, though. I'd bust out the core rules and the Night Beast FAQ when playing against someone before I took a stress, then cleared a stress due to my dial being green.

Also, the other drawback, besides not being able to use Dauntless when previously stressed, is you DO get a stress when you bump while performing a non-green move. With 4 green moves, though, the Dauntless title is looking better and better, if this is really the case. FFG should update FAQ on Wave 5 before we get too deep into Store Champ season.

[ted1138 21]

So let me get this straight... I take Captain Oicunn, Ysanne Isard, Dauntless and Experimental Interface, when I perform a green manoeuvre that overlaps an enemy ship(I give that ship a damage card) then I perform a free action(target lock) and receive a stress token, then because of my green manoeuvre I lose the stress token and take a normal action(focus), then at the start of the combat phase Ysanne kicks in and I get a free evade action which kicks in the Experimental Interface which allows me to perform the action on my Expose card? That is crazy! 

 

(...and just for good measure, I take Mara Jade, and leave everyone stressed)

Edited January 9, 2015 by ted1138

[Keffisch 2,642]

Welcome to the Imperial Navy.

[dvorm 1,058]

So let me get this straight... I take Captain Oicunn, Ysanne Isard, Dauntless and Experimental Interface, when I perform a green manoeuvre that overlaps an enemy ship(I give that ship a damage card) then I perform a free action(target lock) and receive a stress token, then because of my green manoeuvre I lose the stress token and take a normal action(focus), then at the start of the combat phase Ysanne kicks in and I get a free evade action which kicks in the Experimental Interface which allows me to perform the action on my Expose card? That is crazy! 

You got that right.

[SmartCookie 1,253]

PLease, FFG. Update the FAQ with this before store championships hit.

[Tsiegtiez 1,608]

So let me get this straight... I take Captain Oicunn, Ysanne Isard, Dauntless and Experimental Interface, when I perform a green manoeuvre that overlaps an enemy ship(I give that ship a damage card) then I perform a free action(target lock) and receive a stress token, then because of my green manoeuvre I lose the stress token and take a normal action(focus), then at the start of the combat phase Ysanne kicks in and I get a free evade action which kicks in the Experimental Interface which allows me to perform the action on my Expose card? That is crazy!

Mostly. If you overlap during your maneuver, you skip your Perform Action step; in your example, you wouldn't be able to focus. Also, you don't deal damage upon overlapping, you have to reverse your ship along the template first, and then anything you are touching receives one damage. But then yeah, Isard and Experimental Interface plus Expose work just like you said!

[SmartCookie 1,253]

Have anyone actually sent this question to FFG?

[dvorm 1,058]

Have anyone actually sent this question to FFG?

Did you?