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sevick

So do the imperials ever win?

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I've played the Empire in six games and lost them all. The first two were very close and decided on the last turn and last die roll. The next four got progressively worse for the Empire.

Finally got around to reading the rules, mea culpa, and found things I'd been doing wrong with the Allied heroes.

You can only use one hero and you increase threat by the deployment cost of that hero and resolve an optional deployment when a hero is used. Needless to say, when the Rebels are running Luke and Chewbacca, that's a 25 point advantage!

I will crush them next time. :-)

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@Blipvert

 

Page 5 of the Rules Reference Guide states: (Under Allies -> Rebel Allies)

 

Immediately after deploying hero figures to the map during setup, Rebel players can choose to deploy up to one ally.
I believe that point is reiterated a couple times in the guide.

 

Now on topic in regards to campaign play:

 

When we first got the game and the rebels were learning how it was played I as the Imperial player was able to beat them. However after playing a couple times and doing a real campaign with them the Rebels crush me everytime now. And it is almost never very close as they are able to tear down my new deployments with ease. Especially when using Jyn, Gaarkhan and Gideon. In 2 / 3 player setups Jyn's double activation makes her special abilities are crazy good. Couple that with Trick shot and good luck getting anything close to her. With Gideon's command things get even more interesting as extra attacks for Jyn are a major boon. And beating Gaarkhan to a wounded state only improves his offense. 

 

Now I liken the game to DnD and original Descent however as the Imperial player if the Rebels really plan out their moves there isn't a lot you can do. And that's good as you don't want the game to be too hard that you have to play perfect to win. However in campaign the Rebels seem to get really powerful really quickly when they start adding on new items. Such as weapons. For example Jyn with a Stun gun is a huge pain. As stun can put you at a big diadvantage as the imperial player. Especially for a unit such as an AT-ST. Jyn can effectivily lock you down to one action. And the best part about stun as a Rebel is that it effects Imperial Officers and their ability to command you. As it requires that you use an action on that character to remove Stun. Jyn can essentially shutdown an AT-ST. And that sucks. 

 

Now I have a ton of experience playing games like this and so does the group I play with so I expect stuff like this to arise. And sometimes as DM you have to realize that you are basically running the game for the enjoyment of others. Which I'm cool with as the guys love the game and that it is set in a Star Wars setting. I just wish I could hit them a little harder. :) 

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I think it's a very balanced game, granted it favours the rebels a bit more once they start working like a team and employing good tactics.

But I don't think the imperials are quite helpless.

Every new agenda set or new troop type that is released for the game will affect that balance and it wouldn't take much to swing things to the dark side.

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Also in the rebels is that it is the fact that it is 4 players developing a strategy vs 1. The IP might have a better overview of the mission and hwat will happen, but the rebels have four minds to spot opportunities

In an ideal situation, absolutely! But I'm afraid my first group had a tendency toward one person dominating the rest, so it was really his mind vs. mine.

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So far, after four missions I would say it's fairly balanced.  We just restarted a campaign last night, me as the Empire and three heroic rebels (Jyn, Gaarkan and Fenn).

 

The rebels won both missions, but both came down to the wire.

 

Aftermath was won in the 6th round, with two of the rebels wounded.  It was only a last minute dash to the final terminal and a couple of big, lucky hits that won it.

 

Second mission was the 'Spice job'.  Again it was won in the final round, this time with all 3 rebels wounded but Chewwie still alive and kicking.  I could have won it but for a positioning mistake on my final activation which could have blocked Chewwie from getting to the final barrel.  If I'd blocked him they only had Jyn left to activate with her two red die to try and succeed a strength test.

 

So, despite losing both games I feel in no way unfairly treated by the game as both were in my grasp to win.

 

The next mission should be interesting.  All of the rebels are saving their XP, so they have some extra gear but no skill upgrades yet while I've got my Show of Force and Battle Armor going into 'A New Threat'.  I'm hoping Weiss will do me proud and get me my first win.

Edited by jpthebrit

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Also in the rebels is that it is the fact that it is 4 players developing a strategy vs 1. The IP might have a better overview of the mission and hwat will happen, but the rebels have four minds to spot opportunities

In an ideal situation, absolutely! But I'm afraid my first group had a tendency toward one person dominating the rest, so it was really his mind vs. mine.

 

 

Could always make it a rule that if a character withdraws their player gets muted. :P

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Just finished a campaign recently against my (adult) son, with me as the IP. The Imperials won Aftermath when he rolled very poorly in the last round. We noted that Mak is lethal from long range but not so much when up close, at least very much so in that particular mission. Then he proceeded to run off wins in seven of the next eight missions. The only one I won was Under Siege, and that didn't even seem like a "full win", somehow, though technically it counted as one..

 

Then, I won Chain of Command and Desperate Hour (finale), in the end, to win the campaign. That wasn't expected as his heroes were pretty well geared up by then. But I got lucky and drew the agenda card that allowed me to deploy Darth Vader for the finale, and had saved the agenda card allowing you to deploy a group for five fewer threat. 

 

I agree that the rebels are tough once they acquire some skills and reasonable gear and learn how to synergize it all. But there are some nuances that the IP can learn that are helpful as well, such as when to play agenda cards and when to save them, what open groups to choose, and exactly when to deploy groups and reinforcements and from what deployment point.

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If you are not getting xp then yea you are going to lose

All players get XP.  The Imperial player is a player, therefor gets XP.

 

You might not get extra XP for winning, but everyone gets XP for playing.

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I'm playing a campaign as the Imperial Player, and I've won every single quest so far. The early ones were by the skin of my teeth, but now that things have started snowballing, quests are getting easier and easier for me. I'm running subversive tactics, and we're about to play the third story mission, to give you an idea of how far we are. I've been focusing primarily in using imperial officers with E-Web Engineers and Royal Guardsman in combination as my best tactic for killing heroes or holding area.

 

Hero party I'm up against is Mak Eshka-Ray, Fenn Signis, Gaarkhan, and the scoundrel (forget her name). 

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As the Imperial Player I win most of the missions though they are all quite close.

As a rebel player with other rebels the imperials have won most missions.

 

As a Rebel player playing 4 heroes I have won all but 1 of the 6 mission played. I got over whelmed by Vader, Royal Guards and Elite Storm Troopers on a Luxury Cruise, talk about the wrong cruise ship to hijack.

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I honestly don't know how you guys win as the Imp player.  I have played 3 games so far including the tutorial (nope haven't played all the way through) and the win loss ratio is 1-2.  The only way I won the Homecoming mission is the Rebel player ran out of time.  These are the issues as I see them:

 

Rebel Player:

Wounds, huh, who cares, I can rest to regain most/all of them.

I average 6+ damage an activation.  Plus more the Wookie on the Charge. Plus more for Jyn's OP pre attack shot.

Did I mention I have 12+ HP for all characters?

 

Imp Player:

Acting second is horrid.  Especially vs. a Jyn player.  The three attack combo on the opening action is literally unstoppable.

Averaging only a meager 2 damage per activation is just silly.

Most of the influence and XP cards aren't good until 3 influence or 3xp.  As an IMP player are you expected to take it on the chin until the third mission?

Seriously though, I would love a bit of help.

 

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1st campaign game was close. Actually got to round 6 but Rebs managed to get the last console. Closing the door at the end of the turn it was opened was the way to go in this game. It trapped 2 Rebs outside that took 1 1/2 turns to get through it. Unfortunately the wookie and Jedi were the 2 that were inside. Imp player tried to block paths but did well to almost win by running out the clock, kinda like getting the Deathstar dial to 12 in the SW LCG.

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I honestly don't know how you guys win as the Imp player.  I have played 3 games so far including the tutorial (nope haven't played all the way through) and the win loss ratio is 1-2.  The only way I won the Homecoming mission is the Rebel player ran out of time.  These are the issues as I see them:

 

Rebel Player:

Wounds, huh, who cares, I can rest to regain most/all of them.

I average 6+ damage an activation.  Plus more the Wookie on the Charge. Plus more for Jyn's OP pre attack shot.

Did I mention I have 12+ HP for all characters?

 

Imp Player:

Acting second is horrid.  Especially vs. a Jyn player.  The three attack combo on the opening action is literally unstoppable.

Averaging only a meager 2 damage per activation is just silly.

Most of the influence and XP cards aren't good until 3 influence or 3xp.  As an IMP player are you expected to take it on the chin until the third mission?

Seriously though, I would love a bit of help.

The first few missions have aggressive time limits to make up for the low amount of threat the imperial player gets. As you get more threat the time limits get longer and then disappear.

Every time a player rests it costs them an action, this really hurts when they are against a time limit. Those abilities that trouble you cost strain, they won't be used against you each turn unless the hero's are resting a lot.

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Jyn's interrupt shot ability only works if she has line of sight to your guy t the start of the activation. While it is very map-dependent, you might try hiding around corners and setting up ambushes to pounce on her.

 

Another idea would be to rush in close with fodder troops to limit her line of sight. While other rebels could potentially clear them out for her, that in itself pins them in place and prevents them from achieving mission objectives. Probe droids are interesting to use in that capacity, since the self-destruct ability forces the heroes to either waste actions to shift out of an advantageous position or waste actions to take out the droid. While they could also move out via strain, that limits their use of hero abilities that are giving you headaches. Plus, if they opt to move out instead of destroying the droid, a sneaky tactic is to follow them via Imperial Officers :P

 

As mentioned above, you could also try straining out the rebels. Trandoshans work for that, there's also some class and agenda cards for doing that.

Edited by Don_Silvarro

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Using figures effectively, firing stormtroopers together and moving them back into cover works a treat.  

 

I had two games last night, 'A new Threat' and 'luxury Cruise' I won both as the Imperial player, just by using the abilities of the characters well and some good solid rolls and military might abilities.

 

Also try to pick up the High value target agenda whenever you can.

Edited by Spidey NZ

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I play imperial and I've only won once during the campaign. We have one side mission, one story mission and the finale left in the campaign. It's now in the point where it's just ridiculously easy for the rebels to win. The game felt more balanced in the early missions than it does now.

 

We have Mak, Gaarkhan, Fenn and Diala as the rebels and I'm playing Technological Superiority (I liked the flavor although the deck itself feels rather weak). The rebels got really lucky right after the first mission where they drew the Vibroblade and modification for it and bought that for Gaarkhan giving him a weapon with Reach and Cleave 2. That made positioning units so that they can't be cleaved a nightmare. Gaarkhan's Charge also allows him great mobility. The time limit was what helped me during the first few missions though I lost them, barely. We also made some mistakes early activating the same surge ability more than once per attack for example or letting Nexu pounce and attack. But these weren't that serious. Maybe the most severe error was in Spice Job side mission where I revealed the key after they killed the guard and so that saved them 3 actions.

 

I've only won the Imperial Hospitality mission but since then it's really been favoring the rebels. The last mission we played was Drawn In and I saw no way to win that as an Imperial. All the heroes have tier 3 weapons and can do around 6 damage per attack. In the first turn, Gaarkhan killed 1 Stormtrooper from both of the groups surrounding them. So I couldn't get 3 attacks on the first activation. The E-Web Engineer was just too far away to use for attack too. Next, Fenn moved using strain and Tactical Movement and killed the E-Web Engineer. I used the second storm trooper group to deal some damage. Then Mak activated, opened the nearest door and killed off two Stormtroopers (Mak has the upgrade that allows him to interact as a free action for 1 strain). Diala activated and killed off the remaining 2 stormtroopers leaving me with just the Elite Imperial Officer for the second turn. Getting 5 threat / turn doesn't really help there at all.

 

The Rebels finished the mission in 3 rounds. They didn't even bother with the Royal Guard Champion.

 

Perhaps the game would be more balanced had I win more of the campaigns. I also made the huge mistake of wasting 3 Influence on the Vader side mission. I should have read the mission details before deciding to buy the card. One would think that a side mission bought with hard earned Influence points would favor the Imperials but it doesn't. And if by some miracle the Imperials do win that, all they get is Vader. He costs 18 threat so even in later campaign, it takes 3 turns to get enough threat to deploy him. And against Rebels who deal 10+ damage per activation, he's not going to last long.

 

Currently my best cards are the Arc Blasters and Adaptive Weapons. Arc Blasters is great at stripping off the Focus tokens. Still, those are hardly enough. It's funny that even the Rebel players are thinking of ways to balance the future missions.

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I'm running the imperials in a game on roll20 and we just started under siege. I've won the first mission and prevented Diala from getting her lightsaber.

I'm running subversive tactics and the rebels are Fenn, Gideon, Mak, and Diala.

Don't cluster your troopers. Move them adjacent to get squad training then break them up.

On missions with larger areas use officers to get units in the action faster. Pay attention to movement. Forgo firing if forcing a rebel to move through you is more beneficial. You aren't on a time limit but the rebels usually are. They have to get places quickly, and a rebel left behind is an easy target.

The Nexu in temptation are great for blocking the final door. They take up four squares and are tough. If Diala can't interact with the door the mission does not progress. The point is, use the large figures to your advantage to slow the rebels.

Attachments on troopers are the most bang for your buck. With subversive tactics' savage weaponry, a lowly Stormtrooper squad, if ignored, can wreak havoc.

Make the heroes use their abilities. All the time. If they are at max strain they can't do as much damage or move as far.

Do you best to give then no win choices. Attack Vader twice and not be able to do precise strike or rest and get only one attack?

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Ok I have played through 4 missions as the Imps and I have lost all of them. I am beginning to to not want to play seeing how the imps do not get any exp for any of those 4 missions whether they win them or not all they get is to spend influence points that give you  a 1 time use card? IDK maybe I am just a bad player, but it seems that the players will always win. Letting the players attack twice is one of the main things that seems op and the imps don't get that unless the card says otherwise.

   Maybe I am the only one if so does anyone have any tips for the imperial player because right now I am getting frustrated with this game.

 

If you're getting frustrated that you're losing when you're basically playing the DM maybe the campaign isn't for you.

 

My campaign is at 50/50. (I'm Technological Superiority versus Mak, Gideon, Gaarkhan and Fenn). Rebels won Aftermath, Target of Opportunity and Dark Obsession, they lost A New Threat, Breaking Point and Fly Solo.

Aftermath and Breaking Point came down to the last activation at the Round limit and felt very balanced. A New Threat and Dark Obsession the aggressor (Rebels on ANT and Empire of DO) got annihilated because of bad decisions. Target of Opportunity the Empire didn't stand a chance, Fly Solo was the most one sided mission in the Empire's favour I've ever played: Adaptive Weapons broke it a bit.

Word of advice for anyone who does Dark Obsession as the Empire: Vader can take just about anything they throw at him (he averages about four blocks according to the FFG page on him). His ability to use Stormtroopers as meat shields is a trap, as the heroes'll blast and cleave him to death. It's the one mission where you need to be objective focused: comes as a bit of a shock when you're used to holding the heroes back and letting the round counter do your work for you.

 

Don't cluster your troopers.

 

Guilty as charged. I might rename Squad Training to "Havoc Shot Bait".

 

Seriously though, I would love a bit of help.

Adaptive Weapons in Technological Superiority is awesome. Suddenly all your Stormtroopers are attacking with Green Red.

That being said, I'm going to try and learn this cover thing in the previous post, but even Green Green is better than Green Blue.

Edited by TIE Pilot

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