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No Dash threads? Really?

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Hi people, just joined up but have been an avid reader for the past month or so.

Just noticed a lot of talk about advanceds and decimators but nothing really for dash.

An imperial man at heart I am also over the moon about the imps getting a turret ship of their own and even more excited for the tie advanced fix ( I have 3 ).

However hoping to see more discussion on mr dash himself, how people view him in the casual/tournament games, personal experience, preferred builds etc.

Being a dash render fan form the old N64 game. Here is my "Purist Dash" build.

Dash rendar

Outrider

Heavy laser cannon

Lone wolf

"Leebo"

For support I run mr corran horn though am considering etahn ahbat for future games.

Corran horn

Ptl

Advanced sensors

R2-D2

Hull upgrade

Funnily enough, in the game i had with him, corran ended up being supported by dash.

I find the pair entertaining to run and have had two wins so far.

Cannot wait to get more games in with it.

Dash ignoring obstacles and needing to keep at range 3 is fun and challenging to outpace opponents. Corran cannot be ignored due to his ability and can tank a lot of shots. Though waiting for the game where he dies in 1 round. Opponents are reluctant to leave corran once damage has been applied or he can run away then regen shields.

So any other dash builds that people trying out? Tales of glory and woe?

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Actually...

 

If you're not either VERY excited or VERY dissapointed with the new title for the advanced, you're not allowed to read the forums. You could also talk about christmas, or ask for improvements to your favourite ships.

 

Jokes aside:

 

Dash has two very succesful versions right now. One is Theorist's "Super Dash" (58 points, PTL, Kyle Katarn, HLC, Outrider, Engine Upgrade) and the other is "Sideslip Dash" 53 (Lone Wolf, Rec Spec, HLC, Outrider). Those were the builds used during the TCO (Team Covenant Open) that lead them to the semifinals and finals, respectively.

 

Both very efficient, triple action dash has better mobility, but not that much, because is stuck on greens + boost and barrel Roll. Sideslip's can use all it's dial, but if he is not focusing, it actually is less impactful during that turn, when shooting.

 

I have tried Sideslip's, just because I think Corran is stupidly strong despite it's cost. 47 points don't allow you to go for the perfect 48 build, but you swap engine for HU, and everything keeps going. Dash is hell. I played against less experienced players, so I gave them 150 points while I was using 100, and even with accurate guesses about my movement, they always ended up eating a HLC+focus salvo, and nobody likes that. I ended up crushing them ruthlessly, because that's what friends are for. Corran's double taps are also a serious issue for high mitigation builds, since people can only use evasion + focus generally once per game round, and if you get shot by those 2 guys three times in a round, you're going down steady.

 

Playing against engineless Dash with Kath Scarlett, gave the initiative and managed to stay in the hole, but the opponent didn't exploit Dash's ability to deliberately park in asteroids and then barrel roll, which could have made me things uncomfortable at least. If you're chasing dash, is better to negate a shot and eat an asteroid than ending up being shot point blank 4 dice to the face, unless you have a good amount of health.

 

My humble opinion is, Dash do not have that many succesful configurations available, so people use the most efficient, and then is done until we get new cannons, or upgrades. Maybe someone has experienced with ion turret Dash, or even without Outrider, but I think it's worth to pay 5 points for the title (And 7 for HLC).

 

****, always the same. Wanted to give a pair of opinions... my fingers keep betraying my intentions and tend to keep writing.

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I like the model itself - quite good-looking with nice detail.  As a ship to play, it's... okay.  I dunno.  I find it is a lot of points to build one, for not all that much payout.  I'd rather fly two or three well-equipped fighters.

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IMO, Dash + Corran is one of the 3 top builds right now.  The other two being Fat Han with 3 Z's, and a Decimator with Echo/Whisper.

 

Pretty boring as they are all turret lists, but blame the designers I guess for making them all so good.

 

The 4 biggest pain in the you know what right now for me are Fat Han, Super Dash, R2-D2 Corran, and Echo/Whisper with VI & ACD.  Not surprisngly they all appear in the lists I mentioned above.

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How important is it to include Veteran's Instincts on Dash?  I fear that without it, Dash would easily fall prey to Whisper.  With it and losing initiative, Dash could move after Whisper and could use Leebo or EU to get Whisper out of Dash's donut hole.

 

Thoughts?

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I get have PTL on Dash makes him really manouvreable, but it also puts stress on him. Making Rebel Captive targets undesirable, and there's loads of those around.

 

I really like the look of that Sideslip Dash. Not as manouvreable but a bit tankier and not susceptible to stress causing lists.

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I think the fact that the Dash Rendar Pilot card and the Outrider title were both fully revealed on June 13 ( a whole 6 Months and 1 week ago) the buzz has most certainly died down a few months ago now, Heck the number of threads complaining about 58 Point Dash "dominance" prior to its actual release were quite astounding.

 

Also as others have pointed out, in that 6 months Dash as a pilot has been "Solved" one might say and there are really only 1-2 versions of Dash that are considered optimal and see any play, pretty much outrider and HLC are mandatory and its a question of PTL + Kyle Katarn Crew or VI + other crew depending on whether your in a high PS meta or not.

 

Of course you don't have to play that build as that is the beauty of this game however with Dash's pilot ability getting to Range 3 is best and Outrider + HLC is the perfect fit, and realistically with the limited canon options and the fact that he has a native attack value of 2 means the YT2400 really needs HLC to justify the point investment.

 

No doubt in 3 months time (fingers crossed) when the Imperial raider comes out, there will be little fuss regarding the Tie Advanced as that's all going on right now.

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Hello Guys! Greetings from Italy!

 

We are trying a bit 'of configurations for Dash, Sideslip Dash and Super Dash are both good.

I prefer predator to maximize the roll of heavy laser cannon instead lone wolf that requires that Dash maneuver mostly alone .

 

My question is:  Is Better Dash with Corran, or Dash with a support team like 3x Z95 and missiles or 2x Z95 & Y-Wing with ion turret? 

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I think in the current meta its coran or another yt2400 all the way. With HLC a and double tap coran and expose decimators, phantoms running around, the 3 z95 supports are going to go down fast. It really isn't to hard to drop a z95 in one round with those ships. Pluss z95 don't have that good of a dial to keep up and 2 shots at range 3 or through and asteroid on a 2 agility ship don't have the best odds of doing that much damage let alone a ship with more agility.

Sadly that's what the most competitive but this game is so good that games outside of tournaments can be played with less competitive builds since most of us have substantial amount of ships of both factions

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IMO, Dash + Corran is one of the 3 top builds right now. The other two being Fat Han with 3 Z's, and a Decimator with Echo/Whisper.

There's another really good build that can go toe to toe with any of those three. I haven't lost with it yet, and I haven't seen anyone lose with it, but it's not invincible by far. It's just beastly and underrated.

It involves a tie defender, lol.

Edited by Koshinn

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IMO, Dash + Corran is one of the 3 top builds right now. The other two being Fat Han with 3 Z's, and a Decimator with Echo/Whisper.

There's another really good build that can go toe to toe with any of those three. I haven't lost with it yet, and I haven't seen anyone lose with it, but it's not invincible by far. It's just beastly and underrated.

It involves a tie defender, lol.

 

Heresy! Burn him I say!

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I think in the current meta its coran or another yt2400 all the way. With HLC a and double tap coran and expose decimators, phantoms running around, the 3 z95 supports are going to go down fast. It really isn't to hard to drop a z95 in one round with those ships. Pluss z95 don't have that good of a dial to keep up and 2 shots at range 3 or through and asteroid on a 2 agility ship don't have the best odds of doing that much damage let alone a ship with more agility.

Sadly that's what the most competitive but this game is so good that games outside of tournaments can be played with less competitive builds since most of us have substantial amount of ships of both factions

I think a fair few stress/ion builds will come out to try & deal with the usual suspect builds hence why I think PTL might not be so awesome anymore. Will still take it with advanced sensors though. Be interesting to see the local meta this Sunday at my first tourney!

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IMO, Dash + Corran is one of the 3 top builds right now. The other two being Fat Han with 3 Z's, and a Decimator with Echo/Whisper.

There's another really good build that can go toe to toe with any of those three. I haven't lost with it yet, and I haven't seen anyone lose with it, but it's not invincible by far. It's just beastly and underrated.

It involves a tie defender, lol.

Would you like to share? ;-)

I'm guessing Vessery and Decimator?

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IMO, Dash + Corran is one of the 3 top builds right now.  The other two being Fat Han with 3 Z's, and a Decimator with Echo/Whisper.

 

Pretty boring as they are all turret lists, but blame the designers I guess for making them all so good.

 

The 4 biggest pain in the you know what right now for me are Fat Han, Super Dash, R2-D2 Corran, and Echo/Whisper with VI & ACD.  Not surprisngly they all appear in the lists I mentioned above.

This however id still say fat Han and dash are better then the decimator. (At least until we see what crew come with the epic)

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Pff, it's lack of Raider excitement that I don't get! I know it was somewhat overshadowed by the X11, but come on, it looks awesome!

The raider is awesome but epic play lost a lot of steam while waiting for ships. Furthermore I don't expect a lot of epic ships to be in the pipeline considering the entire article was about then making a new ship just so they can fit one in for epic play.

The advanced fix people love but I feel they are overvaluing it a bit considering it still is just a 3 atk ship that requires a target lock to work. I think what really is going to have a strong impact are the crew that come With the epic. as the rebel epics show those can completely change the meta (r2d2 and c3po)

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Pff, it's lack of Raider excitement that I don't get! I know it was somewhat overshadowed by the X11, but come on, it looks awesome!

The raider is awesome but epic play lost a lot of steam while waiting for ships. Furthermore I don't expect a lot of epic ships to be in the pipeline considering the entire article was about then making a new ship just so they can fit one in for epic play.

The advanced fix people love but I feel they are overvaluing it a bit considering it still is just a 3 atk ship that requires a target lock to work. I think what really is going to have a strong impact are the crew that come With the epic. as the rebel epics show those can completely change the meta (r2d2 and c3po)

 

 

 

ok... here's why its so crazy... lets look at xwingdice.com

 

2attack dice with focus one reroll (predator) rolls ~1.8 damage. add 1 for ATC and you're looking at ~2.8 damage...

a 4 attack ship rolls 2.9 damage with focus. 

They essentially made Vader with ATC and Predator hit like a phantom. Only he's much tougher.

Compare these two ships:

 

Darth Vader (29)

Predator (3)

Advanced Targeting Computer (1)

Engine Upgrade (4)

TIE/x1 (0)

"Whisper" (32)

Veteran Instincts (1)

Advanced Cloaking Device (4)

 

 

Which is the better ship? It's not hard to argue Vader here.

Edited by Kelvan

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Pff, it's lack of Raider excitement that I don't get! I know it was somewhat overshadowed by the X11, but come on, it looks awesome!

The raider is awesome but epic play lost a lot of steam while waiting for ships. Furthermore I don't expect a lot of epic ships to be in the pipeline considering the entire article was about then making a new ship just so they can fit one in for epic play.

The advanced fix people love but I feel they are overvaluing it a bit considering it still is just a 3 atk ship that requires a target lock to work. I think what really is going to have a strong impact are the crew that come With the epic. as the rebel epics show those can completely change the meta (r2d2 and c3po)

Yeah, but the ship is so cool! I dunno about the meta, or competitive gaming, but at my house it's definitely going to see some play!

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I've been flying Super Dash a ton since Gen-Con, for I too am a old Shadows of the Empire fan. And I too have flown your Purist build! BRO FIST! YEAH! :lol:

 

I suspect in the meta the Lone Ranger (Lone Wolf+Recon Spec.) is better just because of mirror matches. I feel like Dash will always from here on have a place in the meta, it will just move around based on need. Which is an awesome very ssuccessfuldesign, go FFG! Woot! I don't know though, game is strangely getting harder to decipher for me right now and not easier which is awkward. I am currently running into problems with what I suspect is just general power creep(yes I said it, please listen to my points, I'm not trolling I swear.) forcing some things straight out of viability. I'm absolutely ill about the phantoms continued existence in the game. I feel like it is the new benchmark of quality and FFG is now working to bring the power level up toward it, since basically they don't have a choice with their no hard errata and no ban/restrict policy. And I admire, respect, and appreciate those policies believe me. But being a player who has become a fairly capable Phantom hunter, I'm still forced to make lists geared towards it, and then in game I lose enjoyment because for whatever mental energy I invest into figuring out it's moves, when I come up with thee plan to stop it, he just goes elsewhere. So back to ye olde Falcon. So for me in the case of the Phantom it has created a very icky feeling that maybe you understand, maybe not. -_-

 

Getting back to Bro-Dash-alot it is odd we don't here more about him. Not even the solution of how to build and fly him part, but I practically had money down on flame threads railing off against how broken he potentially is. Because the weird part for me is in my meta the Imps get more love from the top players, I'm the odd one that likes Rebels. There are two friends in said meta who will fly other funny lists when it strikes their fancy, but anytime they actually want to 'play', it's the Phantom they roll out. And they HATE when I play Dash. They will b**** a storm about how broken his maneuverability is, and the turret, and the action economy. And I don't hear the end of it. So when I kill the Phantom on a lucky position and really lucky dice shot, the grumbles intensify. Or they kill Dash because, y'know, doughnut and all, and go right back to ranting against him anyway! Notably, the only time Dash and his squad manages to kill Phantoms, because these are the best players of the ship I've seen, is when the Phantom screws up because they got cocky and try to get me when I put myself at just the very tip of their reach and invite them to screw up, or they get cocky and hit a rock, which only one of the two manages to do.(A la Art of War: "A good commander first puts himself beyond the possibility of defeat, then waits for his opponent to make a mistake.") Now that they know not to 'get cocky' and just fly away from the traps I set, I'm back to no joy on the target. So here I am, in my meta, at a stale mate with the guys about who's ship is more broken. It's quite the predicament. And I'm sure when Dash get's the latest in laser technology, the Mangler Cannon, it's going to get worse. I'm guessing I'm the only one with this problem then? Anybody else? :huh:

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ForceSensitive, i feel your pain on the complaining about broken builds part. Personally I feel. That people will complain to no end even if it doesn't make any sense. I definitely understand the Phantom hate, but a buddy of mine can play against my Echo (and Whisper is even easier for him to beat) quite well. You are correct that you need to be prepared for it, but the same can be said about Fat Han (which I personally hate but have learned to just deal with it instead of complain :-P) or Super Dash.

I do find do it funny that you phantom friends complain about Dash, as phantoms, like you said, are perfect counters to super dash. Only bad luck or bad moves by the phantom player would have him lose against dash. My friend and I pretty much never play dash vs Echo/Whisper since it's just a rout.

With the Mangler Cannon Dash will be tough to fight, though 3 attacks just makes him more like a super maneuverable Fat Han, but without gunner and predator and slightly less durable thanks to no c3p0. I'll take those odds any day. ;-)

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IMO, Dash + Corran is one of the 3 top builds right now. The other two being Fat Han with 3 Z's, and a Decimator with Echo/Whisper.

There's another really good build that can go toe to toe with any of those three. I haven't lost with it yet, and I haven't seen anyone lose with it, but it's not invincible by far. It's just beastly and underrated.

It involves a tie defender, lol.

Would you like to share? ;-)

I'm guessing Vessery and Decimator?

Vessimator! Or Double D!

Action economy! Turrets and white Ks! Accurate (TL+Focus) 4-5 dice attacks! Straight line speed! No hard counters (unlike Dash and Phantoms)! Soft counters other Decimators! Soft counters Dash (higher ps, speed, etc)! Soft counters Phantoms (accurate turret)! Two of the highest ranked Imperial pilots in the game other than Vader! A Tie Defender! 22hp! Equal pilot skill for ease of maneuvering! What's not to like (besides swarms)?

Colonel Vessery — TIE Defender 35

Veteran Instincts 1

Heavy Laser Cannon 7

Rear Admiral Chiraneau — VT-49 Decimator 46

Expose 4

Ysanne Isard 4

Experimental Interface 3

Edited by Koshinn

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Nice! I have a similar list built. But with predator and engine on Chiraneau instead. I LOVE the expose build, but there is a hard counter to it, which ate control builds. The stress list pretty much destroys 11 points on the decimator. Which is why I'm considering going to slightly less damage and more maneuverability

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