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Captain Lackwit

STAR WARS: REBELS Discussion Thread!

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1 hour ago, flyboymb said:

Well, they did it. It was certainly better than a lightsaber through the stomach or a fall into superheated plasma. We finally see the characters respond to REAL loss and I have to wonder if their near invincibility will now be the source of a major falling out with the group? You have to think. Other Rebel cells probably have to deal with the loss of close comrades all the time. Those faceless A-Wing pilots likely ate, slept, and trained next to a number of folks that had to grieve for their absence and have the sense of unease about getting close to their replacements. The Rebels crew has always pulled through. No challenge or enemy was ever too strong to keep any member of the team from coming home at the end of the day; not the Grand Inquisitor, not Tarkin, not even Vader.

And now a couple of blasts from an AT-AT, a vehicle that they've taken down so many times, has taken the soul of their team. What will hit the team more? The loss of their teammate or the realization that, all this time, the same thing could have happened to them at any moment? I get the feeling that nobody is going to be wagging their fingers at stormtroopers shooting at them anymore.

That being said, I'm pretty sure we're not going to see the end of Ezra during this series. Disney isn't going to kill a kid on a kid's show and it would cheapen both deaths to put them so close together. At this point, Ezra is either going to have to disappear off the grid or be put into an instance where his death is heavily assumed by others in order for Tarkin's words to still ring true. Like it or not, the Empire still considers him a Jedi and the guy following the progress in that AO has said that all the Jedi are at least gone if not dead.

Season 4 part 2 trailer shows Ezra facing of with Palpatine.

As much as I'd like to think that Ezra lives and goes into a Obi-wan style hiding, Palpatine isn't known for being merciful.

Besides all that, Disney did this and marketed it towards kids...

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11 minutes ago, Indy_com said:

Season 4 part 2 trailer shows Ezra facing of with Palpatine.

As much as I'd like to think that Ezra lives and goes into a Obi-wan style hiding, Palpatine isn't known for being merciful.

Besides all that, Disney did this and marketed it towards kids...

That's also my logic for Ezra, but besides R1, I really don't think Disney is going to show any love to the OT fluff...

Black Cauldron was back in '85, I think they learned from that mistake (as I remember, the film didn't get any large appreciation back then).

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1 hour ago, Indy_com said:

Season 4 part 2 trailer shows Ezra facing of with Palpatine.

As much as I'd like to think that Ezra lives and goes into a Obi-wan style hiding, Palpatine isn't known for being merciful.

Besides all that, Disney did this and marketed it towards kids...

2

No, if Ezra squares off against ole Sparky, he needs to die.  Baring some ridiculous deus ex machina that saves him, it would be idiotic that he survives.  Vader was just playing with them in Season 2, and he still tossed both Ezra and Kannan around like rag dolls.  Ezra, by himself, stands no chance against Palps.  Yoda barely escaped his fight with Palps, remember? 

I don't hate these characters as much as some of the people on here, but to do anything else kills the suspension of disbelief, and is disrespectful to the entire franchise. 

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7 hours ago, FlyingAnchors said:

Banking on bloodlines to TFA, would love from between TLJ and 9 because it forces them to do a time skip, and it provides an almost immediate connection with the new movie (Like agents of shield, eh, sort of). 

Knowing Filoni, with wolf pack Battalion in the clone wars and now loth-wolves, there will be a wolf of some kind in this new story, but I doubt it will be as heavy handed as it has been in rebels.

Also could we just give Filoni his own movie series.? I mean if he can make people feel so much emotion within 20 minutes, imagine what he could do with 2 1/2- 3 hours...

Or perhaps a better comparison would be the 2D animated Clone Wars series that was aired between ATOC and ROTS. I really hope they do a time skip for 9, you can't just have all of this stuff happen in the span of weeks or months, it really limits what they can do with the characters in books, comics, and the like. It would be great if they did it like the 3D Clone Wars focusing on different groups of the Resistance, let Filoni have some fun with the characters and give them the depth that others would like to see them get in the same way Anakin got that treatment in Clone Wars. I know I personally didn't care much for Anakin in those films, granted due to writing and acting, but the Clone Wars made me appreciate the character more.

I do hope it won't be so heavy handed, maybe a fighter squadron or squad. It would be good to see Rebels characters in that era too, the same way that we see Hondo and the like in Rebels. 

I've said before it would be great to have him do an animated adaption of the Thrawn trilogy for the new canon, ideally with Zahn there writing the script or heavily involved in the film's production. You might have to get other people to voice Han and Leia but they could definitely get Anthony Daniels for 3PO and possibly Mark Hamill for Luke. 

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Just now, Alpha17 said:

No, if Ezra squares off against ole Sparky, he needs to die.  Baring some ridiculous deus ex machina that saves him, it would be idiotic that he survives.  Vader was just playing with them in Season 2, and he still tossed both Ezra and Kannan around like rag dolls.  Ezra, by himself, stands no chance against Palps.  Yoda barely escaped his fight with Palps, remember? 

I don't hate these characters as much as some of the people on here, but to do anything else kills the suspension of disbelief, and is disrespectful to the entire franchise. 

I think ol' palpy will be either throwing an obliterated Ezra to the ground in ashes after the fight, or will have "Shown him the power of the dark side."

He either turns or dies.

No exceptions.

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Good riddance to Kanan Jarrus.

It’s because of him and his crew that disenfranchised conclaves across the galaxy coalesced into a single powerful coup that ushered in a weak incompetent government—a governing body that reverted back to the bureaucratic ways of the Old Republic, revealed itself to be ill-prepared to handle an entity as large as the galaxy, and failed to do its job by snuffing out the former malevolent regime.

If Kanan never took arms against the Empire,

  • Trillions of lives would have been saved.
  • Alderaan and the 5 planets of the Hosnian system would still exist.
  • Princess Leia Organa would’ve spent her days drinking tea in her veranda.
  • Wedge Antilles would’ve finished his degree at the Imperial Academy to become a highly decorated officer.
  • Obi-Wan would’ve spent his days on Tattoine betting on Pod Racers.
  • Han Solo would either get captured by Jabba’s bounty hunters or find a way to pay back the gangster and reunite with his one true love, Sana Starros, to spend their days grifting the criminal underground
  • Chewbacca would get released from his life-debt and return to Kashyyyk to his family and take care of Lumpy and Malta.
  • Hobbie Kilvean would still be alive and well with his cats.
  • Luke and Biggs would still be shooting womp rats and drinking Bantha Milk at Toschi Station, instead of wasting their time destroying senseless weapons of mass destruction.
  • Yoda would have gotten time to go to an online ESL program.
  • Galen Erso would’ve become redundant when Tarkin cancels the Stardust program and would then spend his time searching for and reuniting with his daughter.
  • Chirrut Îmwe and Baze Malbus would still be alive and kung fu fighting as they continue guarding the Whills.
  • Gial Ackbar would be at home coming up with catchphrases.
  • The First Order and FN-2187 would never have ever existed.
  • Poe Dameron would never have existed since his parents would not have met.
  • Rey would never have been abandoned on Jakku, Nima Outpost would never exist because the Battle of Jakku would not have been fought.
  • Iden Versio would have risen up in the ranks to become a Moff.
  • Ahsoka Tano would be doing whatever it is that Gray Force Users do.
  • Anakin Skywalker, either by Sheev’s natural death or Sith company promotion, would gain control of the galaxy and without the Emperor guiding his every move, his true nature, the “There is still good in him” nature would come forth and bring about a more peaceful, more sympathetic, orderly government.

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5 hours ago, patox said:
  • Anakin Skywalker, either by Sheev’s natural death or Sith company promotion, would gain control of the galaxy and without the Emperor guiding his every move, his true nature, the “There is still good in him” nature would come forth and bring about a more peaceful, more sympathetic, orderly government.
 

I know the overall statement was in jest, but this would have been interesting.  Mostly because even Vader never came off quite as evil as Palps, but a little bit because I would have loved to see the two of them throw down, for realsies.  I think Vader could have taken Sparky. 

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1 hour ago, Alpha17 said:

I know the overall statement was in jest, but this would have been interesting.  Mostly because even Vader never came off quite as evil as Palps, but a little bit because I would have loved to see the two of them throw down, for realsies.  I think Vader could have taken Sparky. 

 

 

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9 hours ago, Giledhil said:

That's also my logic for Ezra, but besides R1, I really don't think Disney is going to show any love to the OT fluff...

Black Cauldron was back in '85, I think they learned from that mistake (as I remember, the film didn't get any large appreciation back then).

Why?
No, really, why?

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1 hour ago, Captain Lackwit said:

Why?
No, really, why?

Let's see : 

- We got 2 "Episodes". The two of them being horrible for different reasons - the first one is a failed and unfunctional remake, the second is a huge steaming pile of ****.

But what they have in common is, mostly, that they aim to invalidate the sucess of the Rebel Alliance and OT heroes; having failed to create new characters that will naturally overtake the ancient, they have to destroy them and/or their achievements (or at least they feel they have to).

The military victories of the Rebel Alliance -> useless, there's something even more powerful and evil a few years later.
The restauration of the Galatic Republic? -> Gone in a blink.
Leia's efforts to build this new republic -> nope, she's a space guerilla leader again.
The Emperor is dead, at the cost of Anakin's sacrifice ? Useless, he's replaced by a new super vilain of the Dark Side that came out of nowhere.
Luke's achievements and his destiny to "transmit what he had learn" -> #notmyluke
(and of course, some big fails on the Lore, like hyperspace, that seems now to be a magic wand for fixing broken scenarios...)

-Then we have this new "wholistic" canon. I can see the interest and the goal of having only one canon, including all the works in the SW universe and binding them in a comprehensible and logical package.
But, of course, that approach means you should be really careful with some products, like kids shows (because they have their own restrictions, in character and story telling, etc.) or comic books, for example.
Because with that wholistic approach, everything done in those productions become an element of the general SW lore.

Of course, they weren't careful at all. So we got Princesses that magically turn into starhip pilots (Leia blowing up TIE fighters in an antique fighter that predates the Clone War, seriously?... ), space whales, helisabers (yay, I loooove these!), Sabine the Empress of Mary Sues, a pack of morons without space gear in a TIE fighter cockpit, etc.


That's showing respect to the OT, either its characters, its lore, or the story it tells.

Edited by Giledhil

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1 hour ago, DailyRich said:

Hera just showed up in the Doctor Aphra comic, still a general, running some secret Rebel flight school.

Yeah, she survives until after Endor. She's a fighter, a Rebel proper. I would not at all be surprised to see a crusty Hera in The Resistance, tbh.

4 hours ago, Giledhil said:

Let's see : 

- We got 2 "Episodes". The two of them being horrible for different reasons - the first one is a failed and unfunctional remake, the second is a huge steaming pile of ****.

But what they have in common is, mostly, that they aim to invalidate the sucess of the Rebel Alliance and OT heroes; having failed to create new characters that will naturally overtake the ancient, they have to destroy them and/or their achievements (or at least they feel they have to).

The military victories of the Rebel Alliance -> useless, there's something even more powerful and evil a few years later.
The restauration of the Galatic Republic? -> Gone in a blink.
Leia's efforts to build this new republic -> nope, she's a space guerilla leader again.
The Emperor is dead, at the cost of Anakin's sacrifice ? Useless, he's replaced by a new super vilain of the Dark Side that came out of nowhere.
Luke's achievements and his destiny to "transmit what he had learn" -> #notmyluke
(and of course, some big fails on the Lore, like hyperspace, that seems now to be a magic wand for fixing broken scenarios...)

-Then we have this new "wholistic" canon. I can see the interest and the goal of having only one canon, including all the works in the SW universe and binding them in a comprehensible and logical package.
But, of course, that approach means you should be really careful with some products, like kids shows (because they have their own restrictions, in character and story telling, etc.) or comic books, for example.
Because with that wholistic approach, everything done in those productions become an element of the general SW lore.

Of course, they weren't careful at all. So we got Princesses that magically turn into starhip pilots (Leia blowing up TIE fighters in an antique fighter that predates the Clone War, seriously?... ), space whales, helisabers (yay, I loooove these!), Sabine the Empress of Mary Sues, a pack of morons without space gear in a TIE fighter cockpit, etc.


That's showing respect to the OT, either its characters, its lore, or the story it tells.

This is so emotionally charged and with all due respect, lacking in objectivity that I'm fairly unsure on how to tackle it.

Honestly I just wish people were half as critical about The Expanded Universe, to realize by comparison just how amazingly good we have it now. There was a story, you know. A "Canon" one, where Leia fought a Jedi Hutt. They both had lightsabers, by the way. A hutt with a lightsaber, Gil. I mean, should I bring up the whole- and I can't find it these days because I didn't dedicate it to memory, thing where Han, Leia and Luke swam inside of a sentient being and killed it from the inside out- which by the way, had breathable blood?

Or for god's sake.

latest?cb=20090521184317

Lord Nyax. Do we need to talk about Lord Nyax? And how he was, "Canon"? You think Kylo Ren's lightsaber is bad...

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3 hours ago, Captain Lackwit said:

Yeah, she survives until after Endor. She's a fighter, a Rebel proper. I would not at all be surprised to see a crusty Hera in The Resistance, tbh.

This is so emotionally charged and with all due respect, lacking in objectivity that I'm fairly unsure on how to tackle it.

Honestly I just wish people were half as critical about The Expanded Universe, to realize by comparison just how amazingly good we have it now. There was a story, you know. A "Canon" one, where Leia fought a Jedi Hutt. They both had lightsabers, by the way. A hutt with a lightsaber, Gil. I mean, should I bring up the whole- and I can't find it these days because I didn't dedicate it to memory, thing where Han, Leia and Luke swam inside of a sentient being and killed it from the inside out- which by the way, had breathable blood?

Or for god's sake.

latest?cb=20090521184317

Lord Nyax. Do we need to talk about Lord Nyax? And how he was, "Canon"? You think Kylo Ren's lightsaber is bad...

Yeah, the old "Canon" was just ridiculously inconsistent and way too over-the-top absurd in so many ways. Don't forget Tilotny. Whatever the heck Tilotny actually was. Or Abeloth. The Vong. The absolutely countless number of world, or even star system, destroying superweapons. The EU was just a mess in so many ways. And while I love certain stories from the EU (Bane Trilogy, Thrawn Trilogy, Hand of Thrawn Duology, and the Coruscant Nights Trilogy, to name a few), I firmly believe the current canon is vastly superior in consistency, both in terms of in-universe events and out-of-universe quality of storytelling. 

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1 hour ago, Underachiever599 said:

Yeah, the old "Canon" was just ridiculously inconsistent and way too over-the-top absurd in so many ways. Don't forget Tilotny. Whatever the heck Tilotny actually was. Or Abeloth. The Vong. The absolutely countless number of world, or even star system, destroying superweapons. The EU was just a mess in so many ways. And while I love certain stories from the EU (Bane Trilogy, Thrawn Trilogy, Hand of Thrawn Duology, and the Coruscant Nights Trilogy, to name a few), I firmly believe the current canon is vastly superior in consistency, both in terms of in-universe events and out-of-universe quality of storytelling. 

And it just flat out is! I mean it sure as **** has its issues and isn't perfect at all but you know what, I'll take this universe over the just... Awful, dodgy crap we had before.

We only choose to remember what we grew up with and the good, cool stuff. How many hundreds of s**ty star wars books have none of us read? Because we KNEW they were crap!?

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5 hours ago, Captain Lackwit said:

This is so emotionally charged and with all due respect, lacking in objectivity that I'm fairly unsure on how to tackle it.

Honestly I just wish people were half as critical about The Expanded Universe, to realize by comparison just how amazingly good we have it now. There was a story, you know. A "Canon" one, where Leia fought a Jedi Hutt. They both had lightsabers, by the way. A hutt with a lightsaber, Gil. I mean, should I bring up the whole- and I can't find it these days because I didn't dedicate it to memory, thing where Han, Leia and Luke swam inside of a sentient being and killed it from the inside out- which by the way, had breathable blood?

Or for god's sake.

Lord Nyax. Do we need to talk about Lord Nyax? And how he was, "Canon"? You think Kylo Ren's lightsaber is bad...

Funny how saying something like "I don't like what Disney has made with SW and how it relates to the OT" could be so easily (and wrongly) translated into "I like all the EU works and would prefer to have them all back".
That's not what I said, because well, read it again, my point wasn't about EU vs NuCanon at all.
In a vacuum, not speaking about the EU, I find the new material mostly **** (reasons developped above).
 

Edited by Giledhil

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I'll be the guy that says that I very, very much prefer the EU over Disney's universe.  A very large portion of what I've seen of Disney's universe comes off as a bad rehash of better done EU plot points.  The Aftermath books are a prime example, but the movies seem to suffer from it too.  Sure, did the EU have dumb ideas?  Absolutely.  Waru is as idiotic as Bendu or the Force Family of the Clone Wars, and the Legacy of the Force books caused me to stop reading post-NJO SW books.  Just wasn't interested.  But the crap to gold ratio seemed to be far better in the EU than Disney.

As a side note, people complain, but I've never understood the hatred for the Vong.  I loved the NJO, and thought it was a wonderful change of pace.  It presented a valid external threat that shook up the galaxy and caused the NR and Empire to finally have to work together.  The series was a little long and had dumb moments, but overall, I thought it was excellent.

Edited by Alpha17

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17 minutes ago, Alpha17 said:

I'll be the guy that says that I very, very much prefer the EU over Disney's.  A very large portion of what I've seen of Disney's universe comes off as a bad rehash of better done EU plot points.  The Aftermath books are a prime example, but the movies seem to suffer from it too.  Sure, did the EU have dumb ideas?  Absolutely.  Waru is as idiotic as Bendu or the Force Family of the Clone Wars, and the Legacy of the Force books caused me to stop reading post-NJO SW books.  Just wasn't interested.  But the crap to gold ratio seemed to be far better in the EU than Disney.

Yes! Give me Operation Shadow Hand over Operation Cinder any day.

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11 hours ago, Azrapse said:

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/the-fallacy-fallacy

7 hours ago, Jo Jo said:

Hey, at least you guys got him to admit its only decent... not actually good.

Don't blare the bagpipes just yet hombre, I said the non film and show stuff is decent. I still love the films and shows but I haven't been terribly impressed by the uh, "cohesion" thus far, with extended media. So, yeah. STuff the bagpipes until I say I hate XI or something. That kinda statement only makes my resolve stronger.

8 hours ago, impspy said:

Yes! Give me Operation Shadow Hand over Operation Cinder any day.

Operation Cinder is a very Palpatine thing to do, "If I can't have it nobody can" but... It's actually REALLY stupid that the whole freakin' Empire was THAT loyal.

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On ‎2‎/‎22‎/‎2018 at 3:40 AM, Indy_com said:

Besides all that, Disney did this and marketed it towards kids...

To be fair, the 70s/80s were a different time.  I mean, Disney also marketed this as a 'kid-friendly movie' (major spoilers if you haven't seen The Black Hole)

...oh, and another spoiler...the ship DOES get into the Black Hole at the end!  How do you think that goes?

Remember - kid's movie, folks!  At least, what passes for one in 1979...

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