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STAR WARS: REBELS Discussion Thread!

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That scene is clearly not supposed to be read literally at all. The show couldn't have signposted that anymore clearly short of Pablo Hidalgo walking on screen and saying "by the way, folks, this is clearly an allegory here".

Even if read literally, there are so many ways it doesn't necessarily confirm she survived. Everything about that shot is clearly constructed to show that she's either died or "on the way" to death (especially given how heavily the idea of Force Users leans into the Samurai style legend her walking off to die from a fatal wound would be dramatic and fitting). It's not a scene you are supposed to read without subtext.

Sure, it clearly stokes ambiguity that she's actually alive. It's not exactly showing us her cold dead corpse. But arguing that this is proof she's alive is like arguing whether

 

the top does or does not fall at the end of

 Inception*. It's missing the wood for the trees.

 

*Arguably there's a statute of limitations on classing this one as a spoiler but I felt I ought to hedge my bets.

Edited by Ktan

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2 hours ago, Drasnighta said:

Have you read Lost Stars?

Ciena Ree is involved in a lot of stuff...

Like, talk about dipping your nose into Airtime to form an elaborate background.... it’s not limited to the old stuff ?

I have read it, and loved it.   The difference I feel, is how on the nose much of it is.   Ackbar, being an admiral is automatically a tactical genius, was slave to the man who built the death star AND has the skills to design starfighters.   I'm sure I missed some stuff.  

Ciena was, yes involved in many major battles, yes.   Really she became a captain of a Star Destroyer that was being sacrificed at Jakku, through some merit and the fact that there were few capable imperials left by that time.

Most of her endeavors would be a foot note, where as Ackbar has done enough to take up several pages of bibliography.   I don't mind characters interacting - heck the rebellion is small really, but one character doesn't need to do a dozen (or more) galaxy altering endeavors.

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1 hour ago, T70 Driver said:

The thing is Vader could have killed her, turning her into force ghost like Qui Gon and Obi Wan, which is what we could be seeing here.

She is colored (and not "blueish" like force ghosts). Anyway, why the heck she would walk away as a force ghost.

1 hour ago, Giledhil said:

That's actually a zoom from the episode ? I watched it on a 23' computer screen, so I didn't see that this clearly. Thanks for the shot.

Watch again. 

1 hour ago, Giledhil said:

Actually, yes, that's a possibility. Or her "walking away" could be an allegory for her death.
Anyway, I don't see Vader letting her live.

Allegory? Star Wars is not about that. The image is what happens.

And Vader had no choice. The whole place exploded in his face.

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31 minutes ago, Ktan said:

So I guess Luke literally beheaded a clone of himself dressed up as Darth Vader on Dagobah?
 

 

Like the scene of Rey in the cave, this is Luke's point of view. There is no one to see Ashoka walking away, only the spectator.

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4 hours ago, That Blasted Samophlange said:

I have read it, and loved it.   The difference I feel, is how on the nose much of it is.   Ackbar, being an admiral is automatically a tactical genius, was slave to the man who built the death star AND has the skills to design starfighters.   I'm sure I missed some stuff.  

Ciena was, yes involved in many major battles, yes.   Really she became a captain of a Star Destroyer that was being sacrificed at Jakku, through some merit and the fact that there were few capable imperials left by that time.

Most of her endeavors would be a foot note, where as Ackbar has done enough to take up several pages of bibliography.   I don't mind characters interacting - heck the rebellion is small really, but one character doesn't need to do a dozen (or more) galaxy altering endeavors.

....Rescuing Vader after Yavin AND disabling the Hyperdrive on the Falcon at Bespin notwithstanding....  

 

Those bits were pretty much unnecessary to me in the same vein.

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8 hours ago, Odanan said:

She is colored (and not "blueish" like force ghosts). Anyway, why the heck she would walk away as a force ghost.

Watch again. 

We see her in the entrance, then disapearing into darkness before the plan cuts to the grieving Ghost crew. 
In my opinion, she's gone.

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33 minutes ago, Giledhil said:

We see her in the entrance, then disapearing into darkness before the plan cuts to the grieving Ghost crew. 
In my opinion, she's gone.

Because darkness killed her?

Listen, everybody thinks she is dead: the Ghost crew, the Empire (Vader)... but, even if she never appears again, she left that episode alive.

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7 minutes ago, Odanan said:

Because darkness killed her?

Listen, everybody thinks she is dead: the Ghost crew, the Empire (Vader)... but, even if she never appears again, she left that episode alive.

I guess they had to do this allegorically because the targeted audience is too young?
Anyway, we can disagree on a scene from a kids show, that's not a problem. And maybe I'll be proven wrong, that's no problem either; after all, some people in SW can be cut in half with a lightsaber and still come back ^^

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1 minute ago, Giledhil said:

I guess they had to do this allegorically because the targeted audience is too young?
Anyway, we can disagree on a scene from a kids show, that's not a problem. And maybe I'll be proven wrong, that's no problem either; after all, some people in SW can be cut in half with a lightsaber and still come back ^^

Yep.

We can agree that, no matter if she is dead or alive, if the writers want her to come back, they can do it (without all of the trouble they had with bringing back Maul).

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I think (and interviews with Filoni on Celebration might hint at that) the intention there was to kill her, which they couldn't show because ******* DisneyXD, but due to fan response Filoni changed his mind.

 

Which is sad, and robs Ahsoka of the perfect conclusion of her character. I really like Ahsoka, and I wish she was dead, however strange that sounds.

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1 hour ago, eMeM said:

I think (and interviews with Filoni on Celebration might hint at that) the intention there was to kill her, which they couldn't show because ******* DisneyXD, but due to fan response Filoni changed his mind.

 

Which is sad, and robs Ahsoka of the perfect conclusion of her character. I really like Ahsoka, and I wish she was dead, however strange that sounds.

Death with dignity?  You expected too much.

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10 hours ago, Odanan said:

Like the scene of Rey in the cave, this is Luke's point of view. There is no one to see Ashoka walking away, only the spectator.

You are missing the point. Both those scenes are clearly signposted as something we are not supposed to view completely literally. As is the scene where Ahsoka is shown descending into darkness. 

It's deliberately ambiguous. As is Luke's scene (was it a physical manifestation or is he hallucinating?). As is Rey's. 

You're selectively interpreting the scene to reach your conclusion. If the conclusion was as clear cut as you are stating there would have been no fandom wide discussion as to whether Ahsoka was alive or not. There are also pieces of concept art supporting the idea Ahsoka died and using visual metaphor and allegory to discuss it. Even Filoni has said "we might see Ahsoka again but not in the way you'd expect". It's clear this is quite possibly reference to something akin to a transformation. Implication being Ahsoka as we know know her is dead, but something lives on in her spirit. 

And your point about there being no allegory in Star Wars is, to be frank,  flat out wrong. As demonstrated by both the Dagobah scene and the parody I linked.

Robot Chicken Yoda: "To. Make. You. THINK!" 

Edited by Ktan

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5 hours ago, Ktan said:

You are missing the point. Both those scenes are clearly signposted as something we are not supposed to view completely literally. As is the scene where Ahsoka is shown descending into darkness. 

In my view Ahsoka's scene is a completely different thing. But whatever. You guys chose to believe she is dead and it's not me (or the scene itself) that will convince you of the contrary.

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20 hours ago, Odanan said:

In my view Ahsoka's scene is a completely different thing. But whatever. You guys chose to believe she is dead and it's not me (or the scene itself) that will convince you of the contrary.

In a franchise where a guy is literally cut in half and dropped down an insanely deep pit yet survives to one day rule the Mandos and a quad amputee  with 100% BSA burns ends up as #2 powerful guy in the galaxy I would say Ashoka could have a chance of surviving even if she had mortal wounds and decided to walk into a cave where no one could rescue her.

 

but yeah she’s dead.  

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