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STAR WARS: REBELS Discussion Thread!

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34 minutes ago, SEApocalypse said:

Don't get me wrong, but it imo they did not grow their relationship, they were banging right from season 1 episode 1 and were in the middle of a relationship already.

The cast and crew explicitly contradict that opinion from very early on. When asked direct questions about Hera and Kanan being involved or not is was said that there was obviously tension but not a relationship... yet. There's a lot of dialogue and direction in the show that supports that as well - all of the "when are we going to finally talk about us" moments, and even the fact that the kiss was something the show built up to.

There are heaps of examples of times in the show where Kanan or Hera (or both) stop themselves from acting like lovers even though they clearly want to. Slightly-too-tentative gestures, embraces that are pulled back too soon (or aborted at arm's length), any number of discussions that are heavy with a desire to address their future and their love, but are left hanging in the face of some immediate threat or the importance of the Rebellion. Nearly every episode of S4 so far has had some moment or other where the two are addressing their romantic limbo, and only now they were able to open up about it and finally come together.

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6 hours ago, SEApocalypse said:

Don't get me wrong, but it imo they did not grow their relationship, they were banging right from season 1 episode 1 and were in the middle of a relationship already. They just had recently no time for that, so it becomes a plot point, especially after Kanan got blinded. They never gave to me the vibes of getting together, but as an old couple and iirc the comics had their relationship building slowly already, so basically before rebels started and Ezra joined the team. 

This.

I dunno why this relationship is such a revelation for some. It's been really obvious from day one.

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2 hours ago, Captain Lackwit said:

This.

I dunno why this relationship is such a revelation for some. It's been really obvious from day one.

Not a revelation, but a moment of IMMENSE satisfaction that it was acknowledged in such an overt manner. Honestly, their relationship overall has been handled really well from episode one (not be be confused with Episode I). 

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1 hour ago, Batinthebelfry72 said:

Not a revelation, but a moment of IMMENSE satisfaction that it was acknowledged in such an overt manner. Honestly, their relationship overall has been handled really well from episode one (not be be confused with Episode I). 

Precisely. We all knew where it was headed, but it took them a little while to actually get there. This is even reflected by the crew practically cheering when Hera finally kisses Kanan - they all wanted the two to stop dancing around it and finally move forward.

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1 hour ago, AwesomeJedi said:

Speaking of the TIE Scout, I saw one in one of your custom mission pictures once. Do you have cards for that? If you do, please start a new thread so that we can see them.

I haven’t made any cards for it yet.  It’s for a project I’m currently working on.  I’m still early in the painting/acquiring phase.  The project likely won’t be finished until next summer.  My Battle of Scarif scenario took 5 months from start to finish and I was working vigorously on that.  I don’t seem to have the time to work on this one as much.

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13 hours ago, MandoBard said:

Also in regards to them running around with light sabers there were some old stories where non-Jedi smugglers and bounty hunters or even random travelers would use one they found for trophy or intimidation. With how many Jedi fell during the clone wars there are a lot of sabers out there. Just like how force sensitivity does not equal Jedi. I mean it’s one thing if a major general was running around, a drop out cadet isn’t a Jedi. Also as a matter of scale most of the damage done is sabetour level rather than the Jedi level of the clone wars. Making it easier to cover up

Yeah, but Kanan was to the point where Tarkin was taking him to Mustafar which was the place 'where Jedi go to die'. And the Inquisitors certainly had knowledge of Ezra's abilities despite the death of the Grand Inquisitor meaning that he has to be in an Imperial database of some kind. Never mind the fact that Vader dueled them both and they at least were able to make a fighting retreat whereas non-Force using Sabine was nearly dispatched after her first attack. Also again Thrawn calls them 'the Jedi' multiple times in the series.

There's just no way to easily scoot around it. They painted themselves into a plot corner which is either going to have to have Tarkin AND Vader coming down with dementia in their old age or Kanan and Ezra being killed/disappeared.

I can see Ezra going on some magical wolf journey as I'm sure Filoni would do that as a kind of self-insertion to whatever wolfy stuff he likes, but Kanan just got the kiss of death and there's no coming back from that.

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1 hour ago, flyboymb said:

Yeah, but Kanan was to the point where Tarkin was taking him to Mustafar which was the place 'where Jedi go to die'. And the Inquisitors certainly had knowledge of Ezra's abilities despite the death of the Grand Inquisitor meaning that he has to be in an Imperial database of some kind. Never mind the fact that Vader dueled them both and they at least were able to make a fighting retreat whereas non-Force using Sabine was nearly dispatched after her first attack. Also again Thrawn calls them 'the Jedi' multiple times in the series.

There's just no way to easily scoot around it. They painted themselves into a plot corner which is either going to have to have Tarkin AND Vader coming down with dementia in their old age or Kanan and Ezra being killed/disappeared.

I can see Ezra going on some magical wolf journey as I'm sure Filoni would do that as a kind of self-insertion to whatever wolfy stuff he likes, but Kanan just got the kiss of death and there's no coming back from that.

Or Vader captures them both and sends them to the emperor who has learned how to drain midicholrians from living beings and strips kanan of his force powers and gives them to Ezra who is then sent away to Jakku.... because Ezra is snoke! 

You thought it was a bad prequel plot point but nope another snoke theory, bambozzled again.;)

On a more serious note, I could see them “dying” taking out the factory, the imps take their light sabers from the wreckage as proof, and kanan and Ezra spend the remainder of the war fighting to free lothal without the shiny sticks. 

Edited by FlyingAnchors

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5 hours ago, flyboymb said:

I can see Ezra going on some magical wolf journey as I'm sure Filoni would do that as a kind of self-insertion to whatever wolfy stuff he likes, but Kanan just got the kiss of death and there's no coming back from that.

The 'easiest' solution would be related to the whatever-else-is-happening-on-Lothal-that-isn't-TIE-Defenders.

Maybe the Empire is hollowing the world out to turn it into a beta version of Starkiller Base or something.  Hera still off on Yavin 4 when this is discovered, so the heroes left on Lothal (Zeb/Sabine/Kanan/Ezra) decide to stop it on their own.  ?Sabine? (probably) comes up with a way to overload the grav wells on the ?Interdictors? around the planet (or something about the station hyperdrive itself, or whatever), and so the entire planet gets thrown into a Hyperspace 'dead zone' where it's impossible to jump into or out of the area.

Taddah!  Now, nobody is actually dead, but at the same time they are effectively written out of the story.  They could even go super-lame cop-out and have Sabine comment 'Well, that's that - we're cut off from the rest of the galaxy until the effect of the overload passes, decades from now'

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The whole Tarkin argument just does not make any sense to me.

Lets assume just for a moment everyone in Rebels lives. That puts the number of non-inquisitor force wielders alive in the galaxy at what, 10? 50? There were an estimated 10,000 jedi before order 66, which did not include force sensitives. So even if 100 were alive by the time of Rogue One (but the Empire has been actively hunting force sensitives), you're looking at 1% or less of the previous numbers. Of those, how many can actually be classified as Jedi? 

If the entire Jedi order (as an organization) is destroyed and 99.9% of their members killed, I think you can safely call the Jedi extinct..... at least in terms of threat analysis which is all Tarkin was doing.

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There could be many jedi who are simply not jedi anymore. The trauma of everyone you ever knew dying in an extremely short span time, then you are an enemy of the state, hunted... If anything can throw you spiraling towards the Dark Side, that will.

Ashoka, who isn't/wasn't a jedi anymore, but trained as one, wrecked the asses of Inquisitors. I imagine most capable, stable jedi were hunted down by Vader, newbies and broken ones by the Inquisitors, the rest... vanished. Consumed by the dark, killed by bountyhunters, or somewhere down in a cantina drinking and forgetting. The number of Actual Jedi, is two. Yoda and Kenobi. People with Jedi background exist, but are dying out. A few hopefuls who are trying to rekindle the flame will perish or stray from the Path. That is the fate of Kaanan and Ezra.

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39 minutes ago, treybert said:

The whole Tarkin argument just does not make any sense to me.

Lets assume just for a moment everyone in Rebels lives. That puts the number of non-inquisitor force wielders alive in the galaxy at what, 10? 50? There were an estimated 10,000 jedi before order 66, which did not include force sensitives. So even if 100 were alive by the time of Rogue One (but the Empire has been actively hunting force sensitives), you're looking at 1% or less of the previous numbers. Of those, how many can actually be classified as Jedi? 

If the entire Jedi order (as an organization) is destroyed and 99.9% of their members killed, I think you can safely call the Jedi extinct..... at least in terms of threat analysis which is all Tarkin was doing.

I'm not going to retype the whole thing again. Tarkin considered Kanan a Jedi, sat across a shuttle from him, then later told Vader that Vader was the last of his kind. Either he and Kanan had a heart to heart talk where Tarkin realized that Kanan didn't have his heart in the whole Jedi thing, or Tarkin believes that the guy who wrecked his ship is dead. He's not talking about the Jedi Order, he's talking about each and every known Jedi in the galaxy. Even Yoda considered Luke to be the last of the Jedi when he was dying. 

31 minutes ago, RufusDaMan said:

There could be many jedi who are simply not jedi anymore. The trauma of everyone you ever knew dying in an extremely short span time, then you are an enemy of the state, hunted... If anything can throw you spiraling towards the Dark Side, that will.

Ashoka, who isn't/wasn't a jedi anymore, but trained as one, wrecked the asses of Inquisitors. I imagine most capable, stable jedi were hunted down by Vader, newbies and broken ones by the Inquisitors, the rest... vanished. Consumed by the dark, killed by bountyhunters, or somewhere down in a cantina drinking and forgetting. The number of Actual Jedi, is two. Yoda and Kenobi. People with Jedi background exist, but are dying out. A few hopefuls who are trying to rekindle the flame will perish or stray from the Path. That is the fate of Kaanan and Ezra.

The Empire isn't going to draw a distinction among lapsed Jedi and active Jedi. The Inquisitors pursued Ahsoka just as much as if she were a Master on the Council. The only real way to get the Empire off your back was to give in to the Dark Side and join the Inquisition or to be so far down a rabbit hole that none of the Emperor's agents had a chance of finding you. Even Obi-Wan was tracked down by Maul thanks to some Dark Side shenanigans. Who knows what artifacts the Emperor has from thousands of years of Sith activity with which to hunt down solitary Jedi?

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It all depends on if Tarken considers Kanan to be anywhere NEAR "your (vader's) kind."

If Tarken considers Kanan a failed padawon and unworthy of consideration, "all but extinct" allows for  one or two that havnt been mopped up yet.

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54 minutes ago, Celestial Lizards said:

"The Jedi have been extinct for a millenia!"
"I don't think the Jedi could return without us knowing."

"I've discovered a terrible truth. I think Palpatine is a Jedi Lord."
"A Jedi lord?"

Wait

Millennia. Thousand years. No. I don't think so.

The Jedi were the space police just two decades ago. People are still alive who remember, it's not even a convincing lie.

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41 minutes ago, Rakaydos said:

It all depends on if Tarken considers Kanan to be anywhere NEAR "your (vader's) kind."

If Tarken considers Kanan a failed padawon and unworthy of consideration, "all but extinct" allows for  one or two that havnt been mopped up yet.

He considered Kanan worthy enough to take to Mustafar instead of just a laser through the head in an alley or a kick from the transport at high altitude.

And his conversation with Aresko and Grint specifically refers to his view that Kanan is a Jedi and a threat.

Ezra had the full attention of the Grand Inquisitor, numerous Inquisitors, and Lord Vader regardless of Kanan's presence or absence. He was also a Jedi, albeit untrained, in the Empire's eyes.

And again, how is Tarkin going to fret over who is a Jedi and who is not when he is more than willing to consider all of Alderaan sympathetic enough to the Rebellion to execute the entire planet? Tarkin does not waste energy on semantics.

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1 hour ago, flyboymb said:

And again, how is Tarkin going to fret over who is a Jedi and who is not when he is more than willing to consider all of Alderaan sympathetic enough to the Rebellion to execute the entire planet? Tarkin does not waste energy on semantics.

Maybe Tarkin is just extraggerating to make a point, just like with Alderaan. 

"The Jedi are extinct, except that guy who blew up my Star Destroyer a while back, and his padawan, their fire has gone out of the universe. You, my friend, and those two guys, are all that's left of their religion" sounds a bit energy-wasteyish.

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Consider the possibility that Tarkin was talking about the Jedi as an Order rather than a handful of individuals. The Jedi Order is extinct, even if a handful of people who claim the title of Jedi are still alive. They're irrelevant to galactic affairs, and have no real impact. Their fire has gone out of the universe. From that perspective, Vader is the only relevant former member of the Jedi left. He still has power and still affects the greater galaxy.

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