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Captain Lackwit

STAR WARS: REBELS Discussion Thread!

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Hey guys, I'm just wondering... does the Empire ever win battles?

Short Answer: YES. Read anything in which an Imperial character is the protagonistt.

Long Answer: Other than Hoth, do we ever see the Empire win on film? This question is missing the point. The original Star Wars trilogy isn't about the Empire's greatness; it's about the Rebellion overcoming the Empire's greatness. Naturally, greatness doesn't appear great at the moment of defeat. The average viewer doesn't mind; they accept the narrative telling them the Empire is nigh unstoppable. If accepting that narrative isn't your thing, then there are anti-hero stories in the Star Wars universe. Give the mouse more money and enjoy.

 

 

“It's like in the great stories, Mr. Frodo. The ones that really mattered. Full of darkness and danger they were. And sometimes you didn't want to know the end… because how could the end be happy? How could the world go back to the way it was when so much bad had happened? But in the end, it’s only a passing thing… this shadow. Even darkness must pass.”

― J.R.R. TolkienThe Two Towers

 

 

A story is only as good as its dragon. In LotR the evil empire trashed middle earth so bad in story that they only had a handful of guys left at the final battle. In the original trilogy the bad guys in story trashed a planet in the first movie as well as a bunch fighters, a whole base, most of the fleet, and two main characters in the second, and a good bit of the fleet, a pile of Ewoks, and countless rebels in the third.

 

The Empire might not have been the smartest bad guys, but the rebels were fighting for their lives until the very end; making retreats, losing fights, making tactical decisions and mistakes. There is no tension unless there is real danger. If the stormtroopers and ships aren't a real threat to the protagonists then the only time we'll ever be excited in the movies is when an arch-villain shows up.

 

Now I don't know who this average viewer is, but there are already plenty of low-risk films out there. I have to give RO points, they at least had the gall to put the protagonists in real danger.

 

 

 

The other neat trick a government can pull to maintain control is using terrorists violence at a local level while not using national force. In this manner, a captive population can hold out hope that a higher level of government will rescue them, and so they will not (necessarily) begin active resistance to their own murders.

This was exactly how, for instance, Jim Crow was maintained, and how it has been reimposed.

In any event, the Death Star is the exact wrong response to the rebellion. It poses the sort of existential threat that leaves a subjegated population feeling that their lives are forfeit if they _don't_ fight, so they might as well take a few of the bad guys with them.

 

 

I don't know about the "has been reimposed" bit, and I'm not touching it.* Everything else seems spot on.

 

*(Aside of course, from singling it out as the bit I don't agree with.  :P)

Edited by OneKelvin

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Bets on when we'll see the Hammerhead corvette come out for epic?

I'll bet that Armada gets the Hammerhead corvettes before X-Wing does.

 

No bet - and I can't wait to see how they work in the ramming mechanic.

 

My best guess would be a unique title card that says something along the lines of "when this ship would suffer damage from overlapping another ship, it takes no damage".

Keep it simple. It would just need to be worded correctly so that it works when the corvette runs into another ship, and not when another ship runs into the corvette.

 

And no, I would not give it the ability to move the ship it runs into in any way. That was one instance in the movie, and the Star Destroyer was completely disabled. A very unique situation. 

Currently, there's no such way to completely disable a ship like that in Armada, and the movement template doesn't look like it would support forced movements very well.

Edited by Derpzilla88

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Maybe the reason it was decided the Empire surrendered a year and a half after Endor is so that writers of future Star Wars content placed between Episode VI and VII have a "blank slate" of a galaxy to work with sooner rather than later. So to speak.

 

Within the Star Wars universe, it does make some sense that the Empire would fall so quickly after Endor. With both Palpatine and Vader gone, control of the Empire would most likely fall to the Moffs. And they've always been depicted as power-hungry and work to their own agendas that would often try to destroy their rivals. Without the Emperor to keep them controlled and in-line, the power struggle probably destroyed the Empire internally faster than the Rebellion would have from the outside.

 

Although, I did kind of like the old canon where the Empire survived in various states for years and years after Endor.

 

That's all well and fine but then that year and a half needs to be horrific intense infighting amongst the moffs and fleet commanders to the point that when the combined Imperial fleet loses at Jakku morale has diminished beyond repair. They need to sell that the Empire basically fell into another civil war after Endor. Right now i'm not feeling their collapse at all.

 

The reason a year and a half makes no sense is that even if Jakku had been set five years after the writers have twenty five years to play around with writing. None of the current sequel trilogy characters would be effected and we'd have a more realistic timeframe for the Imperial collapse.

 

Right now the canon feels like well the Empire doesn't exist in The Force Awakens so we need to get them out of the way quickly so we can get the story back to the sequels. All i'm saying is things feel rushed for something on the scale of a galaxy.  

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Right now the canon feels like well the Empire doesn't exist in The Force Awakens so we need to get them out of the way quickly so we can get the story back to the sequels. All i'm saying is things feel rushed for something on the scale of a galaxy.  

 

 

Ehhh...the Empire isn't gone by the time of 'The Force Awakens'.  After Jakku, they signed a treaty that ended the war, yes, but it didn't dissolve the Empire.  The Empire kept on going, just no longer at war with the New Republic.  Mostly, systems that remained loyal to the concept were following one Moff or another, who, indeed, kept fighting each other for years.

 

The 'First Order', in TFA, was just one of the larger splinters off the original Empire - building up strength in the Outer Rim - but only one of many.  Probably the largest, and certainly with the most industrial capacity, but it isn't like "the Empire" dissolved after Jakku.  It just started crumbling, then, and hadn't finished falling apart even 30 years later....

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Right now the canon feels like well the Empire doesn't exist in The Force Awakens so we need to get them out of the way quickly so we can get the story back to the sequels. All i'm saying is things feel rushed for something on the scale of a galaxy.  

 

 

Ehhh...the Empire isn't gone by the time of 'The Force Awakens'.  After Jakku, they signed a treaty that ended the war, yes, but it didn't dissolve the Empire.  The Empire kept on going, just no longer at war with the New Republic.  Mostly, systems that remained loyal to the concept were following one Moff or another, who, indeed, kept fighting each other for years.

 

The 'First Order', in TFA, was just one of the larger splinters off the original Empire - building up strength in the Outer Rim - but only one of many.  Probably the largest, and certainly with the most industrial capacity, but it isn't like "the Empire" dissolved after Jakku.  It just started crumbling, then, and hadn't finished falling apart even 30 years later....

 

Whaaaat? Naw! Clearly you're wrong! This CAN'T be true because I have to hate DA MOUSE because clearly, clearly, everything they make is bad and #LEGENDSFOREVER!

There couldn't possibly be unstated or at least common sense implications of these things! No way!

That's just inconceivable.

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I just watched Rouge One again, and I noticed something. That shot you guys posted with the Ghost on Yavin, later, there is an almost identical shot, when they are leaving in the imperial shuttle. The Ghost is gone. That would make sense since "General Syndulla" was called to the briefing room earlier. So did The ghost go on a mission during Rouge One, before it went to scariff?

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I just watched Rouge One again, and I noticed something. That shot you guys posted with the Ghost on Yavin, later, there is an almost identical shot, when they are leaving in the imperial shuttle. The Ghost is gone. That would make sense since "General Syndulla" was called to the briefing room earlier. So did The ghost go on a mission during Rouge One, before it went to scariff?

 

I guess we will have to wait until Rebels covers the events of Rogue One. Something worth noting is that at the battle of Scariff the Phantom is not docked with the Ghost. 

Edited by Animewarsdude

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Are we certain that Rebels will end at Yavin? Or do you think it might go on to Hoth and even Endor?

 

We see the Ghost in Rogue One* and Chopper too, do you think Jarrus and Bridger might have survived to that point and are just keeping the Jedi thing on the down-low? Do you think the cast gets broken before Yavin and only a few are left with the Ghost? Where do you see their story ending?

 

*Cheeky Vigil. 

Edited by OneKelvin

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Rouge One? Are there trailers for this? 

Anyway, the Phantom being missing might explain why Rex wasn't in on the Scarif ground mission. In Rogue One

Why would he be? He's going to be on Endor.  :P (still a fan theory I know)

 

I wonder if they'll try a rogue two in a couple of years.... "Many bothans".

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I think they will butit would need to be in more than a couple of years I think. But eventually.

It could be more heist/spy than war movie so we aren't just rehashing. Could be a cool opportunity to show Palpatines manipulation of events. For all the talk of Rogue One being a heist movie it wasn't at all in my eyes.

I don't know what form the 'loss' will take but I do think the Rebels crew needs to have had some serious stuff happen. My earlier suggestion was that Mail and Ezra could 'grey'neach other and have gone off somewhere leaving Kanan distraught and ashamed at his failure so.he goes into self imposed exile (or gets himself deaded) leaving the non force users to get on with the Rebellion. I also think Sabine could be off doing Mandalorian things depending how the rest of season 3 goes. Hera, Chopper, Zeb and Rex though I think will be there at the events of Rogue One.

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Are we certain that Rebels will end at Yavin? Or do you think it might go on to Hoth and even Endor?

All we know for sure is that Rebels was reported to have a 5-year storyline which would tie in with it finishing around the time of ANH. Plans could change and we don't know what will happen to the characters. Many people assume that Kanan and Ezra at least will need to "become one with the Force" by the end in order for Yoda's statement to Luke that he was the last of the Jedi to be true.

Although that could just be from a certain point of view. ;)

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Maybe but I think this time they need to treat it as the truth, rewatch the scene with Yoda in ESB, he doesnt sound like there's any hint of alterior meaning.

Anyways my problem lies more in the fact that Ezra is really not that great of a character. He's a very generic tweenage protagonist who is an orphan that is highly capable. For me he's not special enoough or endearing enough to dillute Luke's uniqueness in the Star Wars canon.

Despite my occasional qualms with the show I love the rest of the Rebels cast quite a bit and i'm glad that we have confirmation some of them make it. I honestly care more about the Rogue One ensemble now because they died. I expected to hate Jyn Erso but I actually want to hear more of her story because she had a fantastic ending to her story.

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Are we certain that Rebels will end at Yavin? Or do you think it might go on to Hoth and even Endor?

All we know for sure is that Rebels was reported to have a 5-year storyline which would tie in with it finishing around the time of ANH. Plans could change and we don't know what will happen to the characters. Many people assume that Kanan and Ezra at least will need to "become one with the Force" by the end in order for Yoda's statement to Luke that he was the last of the Jedi to be true.

Although that could just be from a certain point of view. ;)

 

Here's your "Certian point of view."

 

"That boy is our last hope."

"No, there is another."

"Oh, right, Leia still exists. I'll have to tell Luke about her."

"Say that, over my dead body, you will.

 

 

But that's an assumption on Obiwon's part. Yoda is ACTUALLY talking about Ezra.

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