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stevensonson

'Fixing' the overcosted Astromechs.

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So, I love flying X-wings, and I love sticking Astro's in my X-wings. I'm a sucker for 'Thematic' lists, which means I want to put the 'right' droids with the Pilots that they went with in the films (D2 for Luke, D8 for Porkins, K6 for Dreis). Clearly R2 D2 for Luke is fine, but the other two droids are never (or at least rarely) used, due to the fact that they rely on a defense die roll.

 

180px-R5-K6.png

 

This guy sees occasional use on Dutch, but he's Garvin's droid, he should go on Garvin, goddamn it!

 

180px-R5-D8.jpg

 

And this guy costs you an action to boot!

 

So this Forum is full of wannabe game designers, how might you 'fix' these droids to make them see at least some use (remember we can't take points off them, so it's probably going to be some sort of title)?

Edited by jimmius

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It's not the price that kills them, it's green dice dependency. They're the brittlest most crumble-prone ledge you could ever hold onto.

 

I'd redesign both from the ground up, honestly, because RNG craps all over their viability (versus the strictly superior Fire Control system or R5-P9 respectively). Removing the green dice roll and just letting them do their thing (basically a unique Astromech FCS and an Action: discard one damage card) would probably be the easiest thing to do.

 

As is, R5-D8 could cost 0 points and I'd still probably never use him because focus and tls are simply more reliable :P

Edited by ficklegreendice

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Overcosted astromechs?

You can completely negate any damage done to your ships. If someone manages to remove a shield token, for example, you can get that shield token back, and it doesn't cost you an action to do so.

I'd say given the cost of Imperial astromechs, the Rebel astromechs are nowhere near overcosted.

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Overcosted astromechs?

You can completely negate any damage done to your ships. If someone manages to remove a shield token, for example, you can get that shield token back, and it doesn't cost you an action to do so.

I'd say given the cost of Imperial astromechs, the Rebel astromechs are nowhere near overcosted.

 

This is a thread about two specific Astromech cards and not Astromechs in general

 

There's a post right under the title I think you should take a gander at :P

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Overcosted astromechs?

You can completely negate any damage done to your ships. If someone manages to remove a shield token, for example, you can get that shield token back, and it doesn't cost you an action to do so.

I'd say given the cost of Imperial astromechs, the Rebel astromechs are nowhere near overcosted.

This is a thread about two specific Astromech cards and not Astromechs in general

There's a post right under the title I think you should take a gander at :P

Apparently I fail at reading comprehension. My apologies.

Though I do still think R5-D8 is worth his weight in gold and would take him in a flash, given the chance as an Imp.

Edited by The Amazing Flight Lizard

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It's not the price that kills them, it's green dice dependency. They're the brittlest most crumble-prone ledge you could ever hold onto.

 

I'd redesign both from the ground up, honestly, because RNG craps all over their viability (versus the strictly superior Fire Control system or R5-P9 respectively). Removing the green dice roll and just letting them do their thing (basically a unique Astromech FCS and an Action: discard one damage card) would probably be the easiest thing to do.

 

As is, R5-D8 could cost 0 points and I'd still probably never use him because focus and tls are simply more reliable :P

 

That is the easiest solution. I don't ever see it happening though.

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It's not the price that kills them, it's green dice dependency. They're the brittlest most crumble-prone ledge you could ever hold onto.

 

I'd redesign both from the ground up, honestly, because RNG craps all over their viability (versus the strictly superior Fire Control system or R5-P9 respectively). Removing the green dice roll and just letting them do their thing (basically a unique Astromech FCS and an Action: discard one damage card) would probably be the easiest thing to do.

 

As is, R5-D8 could cost 0 points and I'd still probably never use him because focus and tls are simply more reliable :P

Heh, I take it by your name and the post that you don't like green dice? ;) I can foresee a way to make it work though, as the X-wing has no title slot. So:Improved Astromech socket. X-wing Only. Title. When an upgrade card with the (astromech) Icon asks you to roll a green die, you may treat the result of that die as an (evade) result. 1pt

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Heh, I take it by your name and the post that you don't like green dice? ;) I can foresee a way to make it work though, as the X-wing has no title slot. So:Improved Astromech socket. X-wing Only. Title. When an upgrade card with the (astromech) Icon asks you to roll a green die, you may treat the result of that die as an (evade) result. 1pt

 

 

Titles could work (really should be 0, though). I'd much prefer an errata to obviously underpowered upgrades. Given additions such as A-wing Test pilot (free, straight benefit, small condition) I don't think that'd be a huge leap to make (free, straight benefit, conditional use with limited number of upgrades). Having it be a Title is cost enough, imo, since it won't let R5-K9 stack with the Y-wing title that gives them two attacks a turn.

 

As for green dice...well let me just say that my green dice have killed far more tie fighters than my red ;)

Edited by ficklegreendice

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there might be a way to reduce the cost on non-unique astromechs where their cost counts as negative squad points like the refit card the A-Wings got.

 

This could be specific to X-Wings or Y-Wings? or let them both benefit.

Perhaps a generic pilot that gets a free non-unique astomech?

Edited by The_Brown_Bomber

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Thinking it over, yeah any fix to removing these droids' awful probability dependency would have to come in title form

 

As awesome as it would be to have title Dutch toss out 3 target-locks to his squad (action, droid trigger on primary, droid trigger on turret), and I couldn't say if it'd be healthy for game balance :P

 

Problem is finding a fluff justifiable name for said title, because it's much easier to slap "Improved Astromech Interface" on a 0-cost modification and call it a day than to find an X/Y-wing variant that had droids that actually worked

Edited by ficklegreendice

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Problem is finding a fluff justifiable name for said title, because it's much easier to slap "Improved Astromech Interface" on a 0-cost modification and call it a day than to find an X/Y-wing variant that had droids that actually worked

But the problem with Mods is that they are more competitive than a Title. The titles are pretty abstract anyway, so you could just say 'T65 A' (B, C, D, point is a 'newer' model than the untitled one) and call it a day.

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As awesome as it would be to have title Dutch toss out 3 target-locks to his squad (action, droid trigger on primary, droid trigger on turret), and I couldn't say if it'd be healthy for game balance :P

 

Dutch couldn't have both titles, so he couldn't do that, thankfully.

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As awesome as it would be to have title Dutch toss out 3 target-locks to his squad (action, droid trigger on primary, droid trigger on turret), and I couldn't say if it'd be healthy for game balance :P

 

Dutch couldn't have both titles, so he couldn't do that, thankfully.

 

 

Exactly, that's why I said the fix'd have to be in title form. So, I'm on board with your idea (at 0 points, mind :D)

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"When you roll a die outside of combat, you may change all [blank] results  to the result of your choice. 

If you do, receive a stress token".

Also does work with Saboteur, so I'd call it an Elite Pilot Talent.

I like it, but EPT is a very valuable and competetive slot, especially for what is essentially a fix for 2 broken droids.

 

EDIT: That could work as a mod tho.

Edited by jimmius

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"When you roll a die outside of combat, you may change all [blank] results  to the result of your choice. 

If you do, receive a stress token".

Also does work with Saboteur, so I'd call it an Elite Pilot Talent.

I like it, but EPT is a very valuable and competetive slot, especially for what is essentially a fix for 2 broken droids.

 

EDIT: That could work as a mod tho.

 

2 Droids, 3 Crew (Saboteur, Lando, and R2D2, which would be insane), 1 EPT (Daredevil), 1 Modification (Anti-Pursuit Lasers), and granting an invulnerability to Asteroids, Proximity Mines, and a third of the Damage Deck (Structural Damage, Console Fire, Weapon Malfunction, Damaged Sensor Array, Minor Explosion, Minor Hull Breach).

 

Edited by DraconPyrothayan

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"When you roll a die outside of combat, you may change all [blank] results  to the result of your choice. 

If you do, receive a stress token".

Also does work with Saboteur, so I'd call it an Elite Pilot Talent.

I like it, but EPT is a very valuable and competetive slot, especially for what is essentially a fix for 2 broken droids.

 

EDIT: That could work as a mod tho.

 

2 Droids, 3 Crew (Saboteur, Lando, and R2D2, which would be insane), 1 EPT (Daredevil), 1 Modification (Anti-Pursuit Lasers), and granting an invulnerability to Asteroids, Proximity Mines, and a third of the Damage Deck (Structural Damage, Console Fire, Weapon Malfunction, Damaged Sensor Array, Minor Explosion, Minor Hull Breach).

 

 

Heh, that's gonna be difficult to balance. Maybe make it 'small ship only' to mitigate the worst cheese (Lando, R2), and make it a 'single die', so Prox mines still hurt.

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"When you roll a die outside of combat, you may change all [blank] results  to the result of your choice. 

If you do, receive a stress token".

Also does work with Saboteur, so I'd call it an Elite Pilot Talent.

I like it, but EPT is a very valuable and competetive slot, especially for what is essentially a fix for 2 broken droids.

 

EDIT: That could work as a mod tho.

 

2 Droids, 3 Crew (Saboteur, Lando, and R2D2, which would be insane), 1 EPT (Daredevil), 1 Modification (Anti-Pursuit Lasers), and granting an invulnerability to Asteroids, Proximity Mines, and a third of the Damage Deck (Structural Damage, Console Fire, Weapon Malfunction, Damaged Sensor Array, Minor Explosion, Minor Hull Breach).

 

 

Heh, that's gonna be difficult to balance. Maybe make it 'small ship only' to mitigate the worst cheese (Lando, R2), and make it a 'single die', so Prox mines still hurt.

 

 

No amount of drawback or restriction would ever make guaranteed evade Lando balanced :P

 

2 evade (well, evade + C3PO) fat falcon are bad enough let's not add to it.

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