Pandemic simplicity? or Arkham Horror difficulty?

[chucklepie 0]

From a visual point of view, it's clearly taking ideas from Pandemic, which isn't a bad thing because that's a great game. Then add the XCOM factor

 

What I really enjoy about Pandemic is it can be learnt in 10 minutes and taught to children in minutes too, yet is none the worse for it. What I worry is XCOM will turn into yet another game requiring a 60 page tomb, the memory and intellectual capacity of a scientist comprising difficult rules, loads of look up tables and complex gameplay requiring constant reference to the manual.

 

Which way will this be going? I do hope it's one I can play casually with friends and family and not have to either go to a board game club or play by myself (with Arkham, I have to play 3 characters myself  )

 

[RogalDorn01 128]

There is no rulebook with the game.  The app teaches you how to play with a tutorial

[chucklepie 0]

Never spotted that. Still doesn't say what level of difficulty is.

 

I worry when you can't play a board game without a tablet. Next you'll be saying they've invented a game that only requires a tablet

[Xraysteve 28]

The game has multiple difficulty levels.  And I believe on the easier settings, things like the 'pause timer' are unlimited (where as it's another resource to manage on harder difficulties), thus, you can play an easy game after the tutorial to see if there are any questions or such.  But, like rogaldorn said, the app does have a tutorial as well.

[chucklepie 0]

If you need tablet, count me out.

1. 10 years time, can you see the app being updated? Board games are for long term.

2. App means dlc,which means the gameplay will be limited unless you keep buying new misions

3. This is a worrying trend I hope stops.

[Xraysteve 28]

1.  I had a board game for about 7 years that proved to not be protected against flood-waters...can't play it anymore.  Should I demand my money back?

2.  Perhaps, but really no different than than FFG's other game expansions.  The core game is still there whether you get the expansion or not.

3.  What trend? 

[Robin Graves 6,054]

[Galadhir 0]

3. What trend?

People are afraid of app integration... I hear the same thing from people commenting on Golem Arcana.

I think its inevitable, and it must say I welcome it. It is a fresh aproach, fixes problems with bad design and errata, adds few of its own like app bugs, compatibility issues, power consumption I agree...

I was sceptical at first and was on the fence with Golem Arcana which also introduced a camera and micro dots to interact with printed material, glad I've made the jump, it streamlines the game significantly, speeds up setup/teardown, makes sure you follow the rules, can't wait for X-Com.

Try it before judging it, you might actually like it.

Edited November 2, 2014 by Galadhir

[Xraysteve 28]

But that's two games.  I would hardly call two games that have mandatory apps a 'trend'.  Are there other games I'm missing that have mandatory apps?

[FatPob 26]

Trends are not a bad thing.  Either way I would not call this a trend, not even say this was even a revolution, more an experiment.  

 

There are some very good reasons for including what is effectively a Digital Games Master.  The ability to consider hundreds of variables and present them clearly in under 2 seconds to players.

 

Could it be done by a player - I am sure it could, but how much time will this add to a game that as a concept has a timed phase.  Waiting 6 minutes for a normal GM to make decisions and then telling the players they have 40 seconds to make a choice is a little silly.  I am looking forward to being part of the experiment.

 

One comment though does keep coming up which I find quite odd - "Pointless having an app, I won't be able to play the game in X years".  

There are not many games that stand such a test of time in the first place (yeah I know chess, go, dominoes, dice, etc... lols, but I am specifically referring to themed games such as this and their ilk), and best of games would get a facelift and 2nd/3rd/4th/5th etc edition within X years at any rate.

[guest455987 15]

Just played a full game demo at BGG.con and I loved it.  Really fun and unique, and anyone complaining about the app should just stuff a sock in it.  The app is a great integration into the overall game.  In terms of complexity, there are several moving parts and it's probably right in between Pandemic and AH, though a bit closer to Pandemic.  Nothing like either, though, in terms of gameplay.

[Bleached Lizard 31]

Just played a full game demo at BGG.con and I loved it.  Really fun and unique, and anyone complaining about the app should just stuff a sock in it.  The app is a great integration into the overall game.  In terms of complexity, there are several moving parts and it's probably right in between Pandemic and AH, though a bit closer to Pandemic.  Nothing like either, though, in terms of gameplay.

 

But don't you know that whenever a cooperative game is released that features a map of the world it's de rigueur to state that it's obviously exactly like Pandemic?

[Robin Graves 6,054]

 

Just played a full game demo at BGG.con and I loved it.  Really fun and unique, and anyone complaining about the app should just stuff a sock in it.  The app is a great integration into the overall game.  In terms of complexity, there are several moving parts and it's probably right in between Pandemic and AH, though a bit closer to Pandemic.  Nothing like either, though, in terms of gameplay.

 

But don't you know that whenever a cooperative game is released that features a map of the world it's de rigueur to state that it's obviously exactly like Pandemic?

 

 

That's right! RISK obviously stole that concept from pandemic! Boooo!

[Fnoffen 96]

Except I wouldn't really call RISK a co-op game...

Edited November 23, 2014 by Fnoffen

[Robin Graves 6,054]

It is if you gang up on the leader

[Fnoffen 96]

True dat...

[chiller087 37]

Really fun and unique, and anyone complaining about the app should just stuff a sock in it.

 

I laughed when I read this, best thing I've heard all day.

 

Haven't played the game myself yet, but I really was hoping the app wouldn't turn into one of those "The vast majority of players play the game without the app, and look at you strangely and sigh if you say, 'Aren't we going to use the app?'" kind of things.  Glad to know it's been implemented correctly.

[cleardave 741]

If you need tablet, count me out.

1. 10 years time, can you see the app being updated? Board games are for long term.

2. App means dlc,which means the gameplay will be limited unless you keep buying new misions

3. This is a worrying trend I hope stops.

You actually don't need the tablet to run it.  Beyond tablet support, you can download it to an Apple/Android smartphone, run it off the FFG site, or just plain download the app on to your desktop/laptop.

 

In 10 years, I would hope that the game wouldn't need to be updated, as it seems quite functional right now, and any typos could easily be patched in what I imagine would be a free update.

 

For DLC, I assume you're referring to an inevitable expansion for the game, which I would imagine would reflect the "Enemy Within" expansion for the video game.  Since the app was free anyways, I would infer that an update to include an expansion to the base game would also be free.  I would also imagine they would put a toggle on the app to include or exclude expansion materials.

 

Ultimately, the benefit of the app, which seems to remove a bunch of "AI Decks" that would otherwise have to dictate the movements of the enemy UFO's and things like that.  Additionally, it takes the procedure of the timed phase and tells you what to do, rather than require that we go through a 16-step routine ourselves, which would be prone to human error.

 

As well, a "timed phase" is easier to facilitate when you have it roll off like the app does, leaving little time on higher difficulties to make tough decisions.

[Khobai 371]

The app will need to be updated for an expansion. And honestly X-COM TBG is a game that wont feel complete without an expansion

 

The app is FANTASTIC and the board game does a great job handling the strategic side of X-COM. However the board game fails miserably with the tactical side of X-COM. X-COM is very much a game with in-depth tactical battles... but the board game takes those wonderful in-depth battles and trivializes them into pathetic dice rolls.

 

X-COM TBG is simply not going to feel like a complete game until an expansion is added which brings back, at least in part, some of the tactical decision making of the video game series. Right now the missions just feel grindy and unrewarding. Your actions are largely mechanical and predetermined and theres no real sense of accomplishment at all.

Edited January 27, 2015 by Khobai

[Xraysteve 28]

I could see them having tactical combat in an expansion, but in terms of the game in it's current state, it would be out of place.  It would likely put too much emphasis on the squad leader role, leaving the other players with little to do for a good portion of the game.

[Khobai 371]

I could see them having tactical combat in an expansion, but in terms of the game in it's current state, it would be out of place.  It would likely put too much emphasis on the squad leader role, leaving the other players with little to do for a good portion of the game.

 

 

 

The problem isnt just confined to the Squad Leader role though. Interceptor/Satillite combat is equally lacking. The die mechanic just isnt engaging or rewarding for players and furthermore its a slap in the face to the video game series. Players should have the ability to make more tactical decisions during combat which affect the outcome. Even if its just something overly simple like an aggressive/balanced/defensive stance mechanic, thats still better than nothing.

 

The lack of tactical decision making is really my ONLY gripe with the game though. The game is otherwise an excellent adaptation of the video game series.

Edited January 27, 2015 by Khobai

[Bleached Lizard 31]

 

I could see them having tactical combat in an expansion, but in terms of the game in it's current state, it would be out of place.  It would likely put too much emphasis on the squad leader role, leaving the other players with little to do for a good portion of the game.

 

 

 

The problem isnt just confined to the Squad Leader role though. Interceptor/Satillite combat is equally lacking. The die mechanic just isnt engaging or rewarding for players and furthermore its a slap in the face to the video game series. Players should have the ability to make more tactical decisions during combat which affect the outcome. Even if its just something overly simple like an aggressive/balanced/defensive stance mechanic, thats still better than nothing.

 

The lack of tactical decision making is really my ONLY gripe with the game though. The game is otherwise an excellent adaptation of the video game series.

 

 

Do you know for certain this doesn't exist?  These things could be implemented in the form of special abilities on the alien and tech cards.

[chiller087 37]

However the board game fails miserably with the tactical side of X-COM. X-COM is very much a game with in-depth tactical battles... but the board game takes those wonderful in-depth battles and trivializes them into pathetic dice rolls.

Well, to achieve the level of tactical decision making you're talking about, they would need to make (something along the lines of) an Imperial Assault clone for Xcom, which would be an entirely different game then the Xcom board game we have now. It would focus too much on combat, and the other roles would likely suffer neglect.

If you wanted to incorporate all the micromanaging required of a squad on the ground, *and* include the full scope of the research and global UFO defense mechanics as well, you'd have a game that would take bloody well forever to complete, and fewer would want to play. As simplistic as the current game is now, I personally prefer it the way it is.

[Khobai 371]

Well, to achieve the level of tactical decision making you're talking about, they would need to make (something along the lines of) an Imperial Assault clone for Xcom

 

 

Not really. In fact that would be ridiculous and games would take FOREVER. I dont want anything that complex or time consuming added to the game.

 

Id just like to see players have more actual choices during combat. The problem with the tech cards is that using them isnt really a choice because theres usually no reason NOT to use them.  I think itd be cool if you had to choose what items to equip your soldiers with before they go on a mission or defend the base. Additionally I think each class of soldier should have a unique ability, not just different skill icons.

 

Interceptor combat could be made more interesting by having different types of alien ships with different abilities. And also having at least one more type of interceptor, thats based on UFO tech, and has to be researched.

These are ALL things that can be remedied in an expansion, and I have no doubt they will be, but as of now the game feels incomplete to me.

Edited January 27, 2015 by Khobai

[chiller087 37]

All of that sounds pretty good to me, at least on paper. Sounds like it would add to the table clutter though, especially in single player. Here's hoping they will expand on what they've built.