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tenchi2a

My Farewell to FFG Star Wars

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You can try SW D6 from WEG, it is a great game. I really love it.

Of course the D6 force rules are REALLY broken. And D6 rules don't scale well for long.

 

 

Totally agree on the first, in total disagreement with the second.

 

When you get beyond a certain number of dice in skills nothing can challenge your characters. It is a great game until your dice pools get too big. FFG has a similar problem but they saw it an nipped it in the bud by not allowing more than 6 dice in a skill. 

 

I don't want to turn this into a rpg versions war but... I have to reply!  :)

 

My players have as few as 100 xp, and to most of them I cannot challenge them anymore on their expertise area. To give and example, there is a Slicer / Medic with Int 5, rank 3 in medicine and rank 3 in Computers (plus boost dice from equipment and aid from another PC). He heals all the critical injuries and slices all computers. I have to invent impossible situations to challenge him in those areas, it is fine from time to time to say this door is super secured, or this computer has an ultra safe firewall, but not on every situation. So we skip most of the rolls and I just say you succeed and we keep the game moving.

 

Anyway, the FFG game is fun but I find player characters extremely capable within no time, I have the memory it took longer time to reach this level in D6, but I have not played it for years so it may be just bad memory  :P

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Sigh... I have to agree I don't even remember anyone improving an attribute unless it was one of the Jedi Force Abilities!

 

I played an engineer and spent most of mine just surviving every adventure as they came along... seriously I was left wondering why I was the only one but then I got to pull a "Villa" moment when learning Vader was coming to see us personally after we were captured and jailed so I used a Force Point and dismantled the cell.... good times! :)

 

Only run one game of Edge and feeling a mite left out! :(

 

Well at least I get to read these! ;)

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Ladies and gentlemen, the OP has clearly left the building.

Let us turn our attention to more pressing threads at hand and let this one die in peace.

Actually, i think it's more fun to continue to completely derail this thread.

 

Should the OP come back (I've seen more than a few "good bye" posts on forums only for the poster to return not too long after), odds are they'll check this thread, see the large post count, and be surprised when they review it to see that nobody gave a crap about them leaving and simply used the thread for discussions other than OP's hurt farewell post.

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My players have as few as 100 xp, and to most of them I cannot challenge them anymore on their expertise area. To give and example, there is a Slicer / Medic with Int 5, rank 3 in medicine and rank 3 in Computers (plus boost dice from equipment and aid from another PC). He heals all the critical injuries and slices all computers. I have to invent impossible situations to challenge him in those areas, it is fine from time to time to say this door is super secured, or this computer has an ultra safe firewall, but not on every situation. So we skip most of the rolls and I just say you succeed and we keep the game moving.

 

Success is fun, I like those days where everything seems to fall my way and I can overcome all the challenges. So I see no harm in having players rise to the challenge.

 

This game has more than one axis of each test, so success alone isn't exactly pain free, I can pass my test but still generate an interesting effect that isn't exactly positive to me. Best advice I have here is don't make reading the results of the dice a mechanical process, yes you open the door, but those two threat trigger and alarm. Don't worry if the rules say you need three, as soon as the players find they have more fun than not they'll just accept what you have.

 

Layer problems, don't just have a door that needs opening. Have a door that needs opening, while a group of players is engaged by a hidden creature in the waste disposal room, while the walls close in. Give the players some pressure and make decisions fast, then you may have the combat guy hacking the door, the politico fighting the snake and the droid medic fighting to keep the walls from closing.

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My players have as few as 100 xp, and to most of them I cannot challenge them anymore on their expertise area.

 

You need to get your players to buy more trees! I'm at 150+ and all my pertinent skills are still 1 and 2 yellows at most, and I've got 3 trees with an eye on my 4th. I tell you, them 40 and 50 point outlays really, really slow down character progression!

Edited by Desslok

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Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

 

If you like the system, but don't like a handful of rules...change those rules. If you don't like having to spend 30 XP to dip for Force Sensitive Emergent, just give the F&D specializations the same FR 1.

 

If you don't like the morality stuff, don't use it.

 

If you don't like super lightsabers (which, by the way, are mostly worse than the one in the Edge of the Empire core rulebook), remove some/all of the upgrades. A 6 damage, crit 2, breach 1, sunder weapon is pretty strong all on its own without being too strong.

 

If you don't like the special rule for Mechanics when modifying a lightsaber...(c'mon, say it with me now) DON'T USE IT.

 

There! You throw out a handful of rules you didn't like, and now you get to continue using the other 900 pages of books that you do enjoy.

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Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

 

If you like the system, but don't like a handful of rules...change those rules. If you don't like having to spend 30 XP to dip for Force Sensitive Emergent, just give the F&D specializations the same FR 1.

 

If you don't like the morality stuff, don't use it.

 

If you don't like super lightsabers (which, by the way, are mostly worse than the one in the Edge of the Empire core rulebook), remove some/all of the upgrades. A 6 damage, crit 2, breach 1, sunder weapon is pretty strong all on its own without being too strong.

 

If you don't like the special rule for Mechanics when modifying a lightsaber...(c'mon, say it with me now) DON'T USE IT.

 

There! You throw out a handful of rules you didn't like, and now you get to continue using the other 900 pages of books that you do enjoy.

The force and destiny specializations have it already.

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Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

 

If you like the system, but don't like a handful of rules...change those rules. If you don't like having to spend 30 XP to dip for Force Sensitive Emergent, just give the F&D specializations the same FR 1.

 

If you don't like the morality stuff, don't use it.

 

If you don't like super lightsabers (which, by the way, are mostly worse than the one in the Edge of the Empire core rulebook), remove some/all of the upgrades. A 6 damage, crit 2, breach 1, sunder weapon is pretty strong all on its own without being too strong.

 

If you don't like the special rule for Mechanics when modifying a lightsaber...(c'mon, say it with me now) DON'T USE IT.

 

There! You throw out a handful of rules you didn't like, and now you get to continue using the other 900 pages of books that you do enjoy.

The force and destiny specializations have it already.

 

The Force and Destiny CAREARS have it... a subtle distinction.

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yes. 2 different paths to force sensitivity. Done on purpose to create different flavors of force sensitives. 

I think you missed the point the OP, and then I, were making...

 

At this point, we've pretty much ignored what the OP was whining about and opted to completely derail the thread and make it actually serve some useful purpose.

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My players have as few as 100 xp, and to most of them I cannot challenge them anymore on their expertise area.

 

You need to get your players to buy more trees! I'm at 150+ and all my pertinent skills are still 1 and 2 yellows at most, and I've got 3 trees with an eye on my 4th. I tell you, them 40 and 50 point outlays really, really slow down character progression!

 

:)

I don't think I can do that...yet. They like to be good at what they do. Only now after 100 xp, that for example the Slicer / Medic has "mastered" his specialisations with his Int 5 and rank 3 with the skills, is he considering starting a tree with a combat specialisation. 

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You can try SW D6 from WEG, it is a great game. I really love it.

Of course the D6 force rules are REALLY broken. And D6 rules don't scale well for long.

 

 

Totally agree on the first, in total disagreement with the second.

 

When you get beyond a certain number of dice in skills nothing can challenge your characters. It is a great game until your dice pools get too big. FFG has a similar problem but they saw it an nipped it in the bud by not allowing more than 6 dice in a skill. 

 

I don't want to turn this into a rpg versions war but... I have to reply!  :)

 

My players have as few as 100 xp, and to most of them I cannot challenge them anymore on their expertise area. To give and example, there is a Slicer / Medic with Int 5, rank 3 in medicine and rank 3 in Computers (plus boost dice from equipment and aid from another PC). He heals all the critical injuries and slices all computers. I have to invent impossible situations to challenge him in those areas, it is fine from time to time to say this door is super secured, or this computer has an ultra safe firewall, but not on every situation. So we skip most of the rolls and I just say you succeed and we keep the game moving.

 

Anyway, the FFG game is fun but I find player characters extremely capable within no time, I have the memory it took longer time to reach this level in D6, but I have not played it for years so it may be just bad memory  :P

 

 

One option is simply to allow them to run roughshod on those areas they specialize in, and whiff on others.  That's totally their choice, and it's a valid one.  What I would do is let them have those easy wins (they've invested a decent slug of experience to make sure they do, so it's important to let them feel that they bought something worth having), but also give them challenges outside their wheelhouse. 

 

If the doctor wants to be House, fine.  What made House interesting was the fact that he managed to make ridiculously difficult Medicine checks (routinely with multiple Challenge dice added in from lying patients, red herring symptoms, etc.), but blew the really simple Charm checks, Discipline checks (to wean himself from pain pills), etc.

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Yeah, WEG's system started getting a little wonky once the dice pools started going past 6 dice.

I actually think the system actually worked a bit further than that, except for force users. Generally you didn't need more than 5 dice for most tests, so what happened was you simply did more, which fits the fast moving nature of Star Wars. At 8 dice you could reliably shoot 4 guys in one turn (or 12 if you spent a force point). Solution: Throw 16 guys at them. They're stormtroopers, there are more when they came from.

 

Force users were just busted though... especially as they could essentially make themselves unkillable with the lightsaber combat power once they had about 5 dice in sense. Guess it was meant to kind of compensate with starting as **** at the beginning (having to gimp yourself to start with powers). That's one of the reasons I don't think they were not intending long campaigns, as it took so long for force users to actually able to do anything (and then become nuts hard at about 5/6 dice in the force skills). Even basic powers didn't become reliable until you had 2 dice (if you were doing nothing else at the same time), and the interesting ones usually required 3 or more before you even bothered to use them. The simple number of multiple action penalties that force users built up meant they could easily use 7 or 8 dice in their skills without becoming busted (lightsaber combat aside).

 

Melee was also wonky, as it was hideously damaging (my strength 4 character spends a force point when using a vibroaxe: 11 dice of damage here I come), but there wasn't any actual "stickiness" in combat, so enemies could just move away freely.

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yes. 2 different paths to force sensitivity. Done on purpose to create different flavors of force sensitives. 

I think you missed the point the OP, and then I, were making...

 

What that you don't like the fact that FFG was only dealing with force users who learned of the force later in their lives? Or that you like I though they were going to deal with the force only using universal trees? I though that was how they were going to do it. I was wrong. This way actually is better. 

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