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Kaelthas

So what do you think would happen?

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Well, by Chaos god of Order, I would like to infer that It would be as tyrranical as the Imperium of Man is. As humans would create the god in their own image (similar to the desires of the Eldar becoming Slannesh.) If he were the Chaos God of Order, he'd be a tyrranical god who enforced order (his order) with an iron fist. Since it would be created by men from their actions/thoughts manifesting int he warp, it wouldn't truly be the Emperor anymore.

Additionally, I don't really think the Emperor is truly alive in the setting. He is described as a corpse god decaying on his golden throne. The pictures of him in books show him as skeletal. I personally think they are using him as a conduit now and that his body and mind are basically shattered. I don't think there is any recovery from that. I think if the Imperium knew the truth on a massive scale that the emperor was indeed dead, it would shatter the chains that currently bind whatever's left of him to his golden throne (spiritually) and a new Chaos God would emerge.

Of course, nothing in this setting is definitive, but that's the way I choose to look at it.

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Strictly speaking, the "Chaos God of Atheism" exists only in a single source in a single poorly-regarded adventure book for WFRP 1st edition. I don't recall that particular entity ever being mentioned in a 40k source at any point.

The Gods of Law and Malal were all created at roughly the same time by the same person, and thus share the same fate - they're not allowed to be part of the Warhammer Fantasy setting anymore, because GW don't possess the rights to use them (it's the origin for GW's more draconian approach to handling their IP). Necoho and Zuvassin (the Chaos Gods of Doubt and Undoing, respectively, introduced in Something Rotten in Kislev (1988, the fourth part of the five-part Enemy Within campaign, and something of a letdown after the high quality of the first three parts) in part because GW weren't allowed to use Malal anymore. There are a couple of knowing, sidelong references to Malal here and there - the Sons of Malice Traitor Marines being the best-known one.

All this existed because Warhammer (and 40k, by extension after the addition of Chaos in the Realms of Chaos books - the original 40k setting as depicted in the Warhammer 40,000: Rogue Trader book didn't include any mention of Chaos) drew the idea of Law and Chaos from Moorcock's work, where Law and Chaos (rather than Good and Evil) are the fundamental forces at war, but both are bad if not kept in balance (D&D borrowed the same concept, but their alignment system adds back in Good and Evil as well, which screws up the "too much of one alignment is bad" notion).

However, that's changed considerably as things have progressed - the idea of "Law vs Chaos" doesn't exist in its original form in 40k. If anything, the "Order vs Chaos" battle of 40k these days is more "the order of the material universe vs the ephemeral nature of the Warp".

My preferred interpretation relies on a different definition of Chaos. While the most straightforward contemporary definitions would suggest Chaos as disorder, randomness, uncertainty, anarchy, etc., I've come to favour an older definition - khaos (incidentally, an alternative spelling used in reference to the language of daemons and magic in some sources), which refers to the formless abyssal void that preceded the creation of the universe.

In this sense, Chaos and the Warp are synonymous - the Warp is the formless unreality within which all realities dwell ("word of god" from GW head office is that the Warhammer World and the 40k Universe are distinct universes connected by the Warp, which neatly fits the old background of the Old Ones travelling between universes through the Immaterium), and the Chaos Gods are the turbulent, tempestuous pseudo-intellects that exist as a reflection of mortal existence in the universe - echoes of mortal thought and deed across the aeons, coalesced into entities of existential malice.

Consequently, my theories and inferences tend to posit that exposure to the Warp is anathema to the material universe - the Warp unmakes reality, unravelling natural law, and while sufficiently strong-willed individuals can exert their will upon it (psykers manifest psychic powers by drawing on the unmatter of the Warp and commanding it to take a particular form), it is the fundamental antithesis of all that is constant, consistent, and material.

I could go into more detail - I've been developing a singular theory of the Warp for over a decade now - but that should suffice here. In this regard, the idea of a Chaos God of Order is entirely feasible - but the order it imposes may be the endless oblivion of the empty Warp, or the absolute dominion of material law. The Ruinous Powers do tend to promote the furthest extremes of a given notion, and even they have some 'lawful' elements (Nurgle promotes stagnation and acceptance of the inevitable as much as creeping decay and despair, Slaanesh and Khorne are sensation and fury, respectively, without end, Tzeentch's schemes rely on the ordered structure of cause and effect to bear out).

This, this, this right here.

This is why you should be writing for Games Workshop instead of people like Cruddace and Ward.

This is quite possibly the best concise explanation of the nature of the Warp and the Materium in a metaphysical sense that I have seen since forever.

All of this is now my headcanon.

 

I'm saving this and putting it right next to Baron von EvilSatan's copy-pasta on "Why Everything is so Grimdark".

Edited by Fgdsfg

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This is why you should be writing for Games Workshop instead of people like Cruddace and Ward.

Too busy.

I applied for a writing job at Forge World a couple of years back, but I'm pretty sure that Andy Hoare got that one (fair play to him, I've worked with Andy on several occasions and I like his work). Instead, I've continued on the RPG side of things - nothing for FFG since 2012, but the last six months have seen me working with Modiphius Entertainment on Mutant Chronicles 3rd Edition, doing a mixture of rules and background. Jay Little (whose name you may recognise from his work on WFRP 3rd edition, or FFG's Star Wars RPGs) designed the system being used for Mutant Chronicles (currently dubbed "2D20"), and I'll be running ongoing development of games using that system from next month.

 

I tend to regard 40k as being in good hands at the moment, though. Two very good friends of mine are currently working at GW's design studio in Nottingham; one of them was lead background writer on the newest Codex Orks and the forthcoming (next week) Codex Dark Eldar, the other used to work on Mantic Games' Dreadball. I know their work, I know their styles, I've had both of them as players in 40kRP campaigns, and I trust them to do their best for the setting we're here to discuss.

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I've really been looking forward to that game.  Since you're working on it, how easy do you think it'd be to do a DH game in Mutant Chronicles?  I love Little's SW system but it doesn't really cover all the themes of 40k to do an easy port.

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I've really been looking forward to that game.  Since you're working on it, how easy do you think it'd be to do a DH game in Mutant Chronicles?  I love Little's SW system but it doesn't really cover all the themes of 40k to do an easy port.

Mutant Chronicles 3rd Edition doesn't use the same system as WFRP3 or the FFG Star Wars games; it's a brand new system (which Modiphius Entertainment will be using on other licences moving forwards).

 

An early version of the game, as an open beta adventure, can be found at DriveThruRPG for free. The system's evolved somewhat since that was written, but the heart of the game is still there. It's built for quick cinematic action, and the adventure demonstrates how well it serves the pulpy action-horror that both Mutant Chronicles and 40k lend themselves to. Once the rulebook's out, you'd need to rebuild the character creation, armoury, and bestiary sections, and the various powers chapters would need reworking (the Arts of the Light and the Gifts of the Dark Symmetry don't entirely line up with 40k psychic powers), but the core rules should work fine.

 

Edit: But enough of that digression - I think I've managed to derail the thread long enough. Anyone else wanting to talk about Mutant Chronicles, feel free to message me privately.

Edited by N0-1_H3r3

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Me and and a player got into a discussion on the nature of Chaos and the Warp, sparked by me declaring this compulsory reading due to now being canon in our game, where he questioned the existence of a God of Atheism (Malal), which is a bit of a moot argument since he isn't of consequence whatsoever (as you say, N0-1_H3r3, it's one scenario, from one guy, in WHF, the same guy that created the "Chaos Gods of Order"-thing, so.. w/e).
 
But anyway, I argued for the possible existence of a God of Atheism nontheless, as faith and concepts take form within the Immaterium as the mass psyche of the universe, represented by souls (Immaterial) tied to bodies (Material) affecting it (the Warp is affected metaphysically, Realspace is affected physically).
 
He argued that the vast majority of the universe adheres to some form of faith, whereas I argued that even the most ardent and zealous iconoclast doubts on some level, and it adds up.

Either way, this discussion eventually lead to an idea, or a realization on my part, which I will simply quote straight out of the conversation, with my player's messages and my full response (although only the last part is of relevance to this idea or realization):
 

Player:
Alright, but how god of atheism and doubt can exist if nearly nobody is an atheist in wh40l


Me:
Because the gods of chaos are embodiments of concepts, not independant entities, and chaos by it's very nature, the warp, the immaterium, is the opposite of creation. So there's two possible reasons why there could be a God of Atheism. There's arguably a God of Vengeance, a Daemon Lord of Regret and a Spirit of Licking your elbow, too.

Nevermind the Council of the Colour Blue.


Player:
Warp gods (From what I understand) are "created" by faith in some idea.

But what is idea behind Malal if nobody doubts?


Me:
A lot of people doubts, but more importantly, the nature of the warp is ultimately nothingness, meaning that there's functionally two distinct and strong reasons Malal could be a potential chaos god - in fact, he might be the only true one.

That being said, he functionally doesn't, so it's a moot point.


Player:
This is where we disagree. Imho nature of the warp is not nothingness, but endless possibilities. Thus it might be possible to create god of doubt, yet he has competion from god of hope (for example). Anything people belive in is accually a competion for Malal. Beliving is not doubting. They are mutually exclusive.


Me:
Not true. Even the most zealous iconoclast tends to have doubt on some level. Either way, as N0-1_H3r3 writes;

"Consequently, my theories and inferences tend to posit that exposure to the Warp is anathema to the material universe - the Warp unmakes reality, unravelling natural law, and while sufficiently strong-willed individuals can exert their will upon it (psykers manifest psychic powers by drawing on the unmatter of the Warp and commanding it to take a particular form), it is the fundamental antithesis of all that is constant, consistent, and material."

Order vs. Chaos, Materium vs. Immaterium, Structure vs. Warp, Creation vs. Unmaking. The fact that he goes through some history of how the setting got to where it is is just icing, and it also explains why there's no "Chaos Gods of Order", or at least why these ideas by the same person that created Malal makes no real sense in the extended, later context.

I do however like the shift that did occur, where the idea of Law vs. Chaos became "lost" as the Materium became "Order" and the Immaterium became Chaos, it suggests that the God-Emperor could very well be a real, literal God of Order, for example, but that he manifests in the Materium, whereas the Gods of Chaos manifests in the Immaterium in it's obviously chaotic manner.

 

What if all the fanfics got it wrong? What if the God-Emperor is not to become a God of Order in the Chaos, nor are Saints the equivalent to Daemons? What if.. Pariahs and Untouchables are the Daemons of the Materium, material beings without connection to the Warp, the functional representation of the Immaterium, that has to be "anchored" to the Warp to even be there (such as in a bubble of realspace, say, with a gellar field.. on a ship?).

 

Just throwing it out there.

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By that logic mankind invention and usage of gellar fields and warp travel would be our (Material) incrusions into Warp. Deamonic possesions and invasions - hell: whole Horus Heresy would be in fact an act of defence from Chaos Gods.

 

edit. grammar

Edited by Wincent

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By that logic mankind invention and usage of gellar fields and warp travel would be our (Material) incrusions into Warp. Deamonic possesions and invasions - hell: whole Horus Heresy would be in fact an act of defence from Chaos Gods.

 

edit. grammar

 

Yes. Every gellar field-protected ship into the warp is a bubble of realspace in the immaterium, a solid brick against the window that is the empyrean.

 

The vast majority of the perceivable universe would straddle the two realms in one way or another, to varying degrees, pinned between their existence within the Immaterium (the Warp) and the Materium (Realspace). This would also explain why discipline and structure has a direct counteracting effect to the influences of the warp. It is not just a matter of weakening your own desires and whims, but about enforcing Order upon Chaos.

 

Eldars have incredibly strong souls and have strong ties to the immaterium, due to their descent as a collective culture and their psychic nature interlinking them all. They counteract this by anchoring themselves to the Materium and practising strong disciplines of Order.

Straddling the two realms, humanity has a low centre of balance, seemingly walking the line easily, although without enough force to truly counteract the influences of either. Eldar walks a line balancing themselves with poles of extremes.

Necrons in this context are obviously all-out Order and Structure.

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Not only gellar fields: It's said somewhere that deamons took shapes based on mortals fears/imagination. So mortal are basicaly enforcing something Material (form) on something Immaterial (deamon). In exchange deamons are enforcing something (arguably) Immaterial (emotions) on something Material (mortals). Of course there are few grades: from mundane sword to eldar farseer.

 

About Necrons - it's quite funny as being established part of setting some time already - C'tan are indeed gods of Materium.

 

edit. This theory also neatly connects loose ends of imprisoning Void Dragon on Mars and giving credit do Cult Mechanicus by Emperor. Void Dragon (Materium god) would be imprisoned by the bubble (the Cog if you wish) of faith-warp (Immaterium) of its very own cultists.

Thatss also why Old Ones created psychic races (Eldar, Ork, maybe even Yu'vath) to fight Necrons, why Necrons flee form Enslavers and also why in "modern" times Eldars are speculated to be a bit protective aboute Tau (Materium mostly) in their fight with Arch-Enemy (Immaterium).

Edited by Wincent

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My beef with a "God of Atheism" would be that it is ... very, oddly specific.

 

The Warp crafts things out of very basic emotions and concepts, and the more overlap you have, the stronger the result will be (as I interpret Chaos Gods and similar entities to work like huge basins in the Immaterium that collect them and are empowered by them). Consequently, whilst a "God of Atheism" would have too few "feeders" (similar to a God of the Colour Blue or the God of Getting Up Early), a much better fit would be the "God of Doubt" (which you originally hinted at as a byname), because this entity would be "fed" by a much larger pool of thought-energy.

 

It might assume the portfolio of a God of Atheism, but at the same time also a God of Belief. Because the God of Doubt and its daemons exist to shatter your perspective, whatever it is.

 

If you are a believer, it will ask "what if there were no gods"? Just to make you doubt.

If you are an atheist, it will ask "what if there is a god"? Just to make you doubt.

 

In a way, religion as a whole would be just one topic this entity meddles with, just like Slaanesh isn't just the God of Cocaine or the God of Loud Music.

 

Then again, perhaps all of this doubt-stuff is already controlled by Tzeentch ... ;)

 

 

Not true. Even the most zealous iconoclast tends to have doubt on some level.

 

I wouldn't put that out as a general truth. It would apply to the majority of the faithful, but everyone?

 

Either way, to actually "feed" a God of Doubt they'd have to actively think about it, not have it hidden somewhere deep down.

 

edit. This theory also neatly connects loose ends of imprisoning Void Dragon on Mars and giving credit do Cult Mechanicus by Emperor. Void Dragon (Materium god) would be imprisoned by the bubble (the Cog if you wish) of faith-warp (Immaterium) of its very own cultists.

 

I feel this would fit neatly into Dark Heresy and FFG's interpretation of the setting - though it's worth pointing out that adherents to the Cult Mechanicus in GW's material (specifically, d100 Inquisitor) get zero faith powers, unlike in this RPG.

 

As another possible problem - I like to think that the Warp and everything you put into it is, by its very nature, "everywhere" simultaneously, as time and space have no meaning in it, making such a locally limited bubble troublesome. And even if you limit it to proximity, the sentient population on Mars is comparatively light (if only because the vast majority is mindless servitors).

 

Lastly, how could mere belief in a Machine God work in such a specific way? Faith and willpower, when focused on the task, seem to be capable of repulsing daemonic entities, as if they were severing their connection to the (subjective) "here and now", but wouldn't this mean everyone would have to be instructed about the Void Dragon, and "scheduled" to actively think about subduing it every now and then? I mean, if it were that easy, imagine what the Imperial Cult should be able to do, given its much, much larger number of adherents.

Edited by Lynata

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I admit this whole Void Dragon idea isn't very well thought of from my part, but let me try my best:

 

Admittedly in warp there's no space and time as we know it, but here we've got the Void Dragon, who - as a god of physical realm - should also have some kind of 4D omnipresence.

Cult of Machine did (well: at least should, there's nothing specific in40k as we agree) create warp presence of Machine God, whos domain overlaps with Void Dragons, and who is belived to be - at best - present only as a rotti... I mean Emperor/Ommissah and, at worst, quite nowhere and everywhere - as a machine spirit bound to every bit of machinery.

 

I assume we all agree that Immaterium do affect Materium, in this case by bounding Void Dragon by the artifical construct of, very well named, Machine God to its Avatar (Emperor) and/or every bit of machinery. Doing such thing is almost exact copy of stuff Necrons did to C'tan: shred them to bits.  (Also fits neatly into all tech-secrets whispered by Machine God into ears of Magos.)

This bubble isn't centered on Mars or any other physical location - this bubble it is a warp construct of Machine God bounding Void Dragon. It is a soul-stuff forced into a Materium god to weaken it. Possesson by engineered faith.

 

On Mars there's only rotting carcass of Void Dragon sitting on the Silver Throne, bound forever in this undying state as the last remaining light of science, to whom thousand of purest servitors are sacrifieced daily. ;)

 

(and I know that simmetry proofs nothing, it's just imho quite elegant).

 

edit: On the second thought it can be argued that Dark Age of Technology and Age of Strife were engineered by Emperor to tame technology/Void Dragon/Materium so than he can focus on conquering Material galaxy to pave the way to tame Immaterium (i.e. by hacking on webway) to support mankind evolution into psychic species.

Maybe there's some simmetry between Man of Iron and Deamons/Age of Strife and Horus Heresy: two oposite forces Manking have to first unlock and defeat to ensure its own survival.

Edited by Wincent

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Me and and a player got into a discussion on the nature of Chaos and the Warp, sparked by me declaring this compulsory reading due to now being canon in our game, where he questioned the existence of a God of Atheism (Malal), which is a bit of a moot argument since he isn't of consequence whatsoever (as you say, N0-1_H3r3, it's one scenario, from one guy, in WHF, the same guy that created the "Chaos Gods of Order"-thing, so.. w/e).

Strictly speaking, Malal isn't the "God of Atheism" - it's Necoho, the God of Doubt who most closely fits the notion of "God of Atheism". His strictures were defined as basically being "don't bother me, don't worship me, I won't grant you gifts, I won't even acknowledge you". He shared a single temple in the northern steppe of Kislev with Zuvassin the Undoer, whose goal and nature was to screw up everyone else's plans (literally - he undid mutations and other Chaos Gifts, got in everyone else's way, and basically made a nuisance of himself).

Malal was more a God of anarchy and self-destruction, a Chaos God warring against the other Chaos Gods.

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Me and and a player got into a discussion on the nature of Chaos and the Warp, sparked by me declaring this compulsory reading due to now being canon in our game, where he questioned the existence of a God of Atheism (Malal), which is a bit of a moot argument since he isn't of consequence whatsoever (as you say, N0-1_H3r3, it's one scenario, from one guy, in WHF, the same guy that created the "Chaos Gods of Order"-thing, so.. w/e).

Strictly speaking, Malal isn't the "God of Atheism" - it's Necoho, the God of Doubt who most closely fits the notion of "God of Atheism". His strictures were defined as basically being "don't bother me, don't worship me, I won't grant you gifts, I won't even acknowledge you". He shared a single temple in the northern steppe of Kislev with Zuvassin the Undoer, whose goal and nature was to screw up everyone else's plans (literally - he undid mutations and other Chaos Gifts, got in everyone else's way, and basically made a nuisance of himself).

Malal was more a God of anarchy and self-destruction, a Chaos God warring against the other Chaos Gods.

 

 

Ah, right, I got the two mixed up. It doesn't change the discussion as such, but thanks for pointing it out, lest we keep making the mistake.

I had forgotten that Necoho even ever existed.

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I admit this whole Void Dragon idea isn't very well thought of from my part, but let me try my best

 

No worries, often a theory becomes more fleshed out the more you think about and discuss it. :)

 

Cult of Machine did (well: at least should, there's nothing specific in40k as we agree) create warp presence of Machine God, whos domain overlaps with Void Dragons, and who is belived to be - at best - present only as a rotti... I mean Emperor/Ommissah and, at worst, quite nowhere and everywhere - as a machine spirit bound to every bit of machinery.

 

Yeah, I guess that's where our interpretations differ fundamentally - I do not believe there really is a Machine God, either as an entity or as a little spirit inside any piece of technology in the universe. Partially because arguments for this seem conspicuously absent from GW's own material (which is what has formed my vision of the setting) and instead driven by other sources, but also because I consider it more grimdark if it was all "just a lie". In a way, you could say I take a very pragmatic approach to the setting, toning down the supernatural wherever I perceive it to be possible exaggeration.

 

Neither approach is incorrect, though, it just depends on what books you're looking at. Indeed, as far as this RPG is concerned, I believe your perspective would be more fitting than mine, so take the above comments with a grain of salt as far as application to Dark Heresy is concerned.

 

This bubble isn't centered on Mars or any other physical location - this bubble it is a warp construct of Machine God bounding Void Dragon. It is a soul-stuff forced into a Materium god to weaken it. Possesson by engineered faith.

On Mars there's only rotting carcass of Void Dragon sitting on the Silver Throne, bound forever in this undying state as the last remaining light of science, to whom thousand of purest servitors are sacrifieced daily. ;)

 

Ohh, gotcha. In that case .. who knows, the "imprisoned on Mars" thing could even just be some religious myth/half-truth, created by merging the idea of a Warp-bound soul imprisoned within the Immaterium by a Warp-powered bubble, with the understanding that this bubble is created by a religion borne from and centered on Mars? ;)

 

I'd still question how exactly the faith could be focused in this exact way (as it sounds like a very specific application of this potential energy), but it's an interesting idea that may well fit into the "miracles are real" version of the setting.

 

Maybe if you replace this bubble with an actual sentient entity powered by belief (similar to Celestine, I suppose) and have it subdue the Void Dragon for its own dark purposes? Like a sort of Living Saint of the Mechanicus, if you will. That way you would get rid of the need to explain the "why", and it'd be a neat tie-in with the legends about how the Eldar gods fought one another (assuming they were Warp entities, too).

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I've really been looking forward to that game.  Since you're working on it, how easy do you think it'd be to do a DH game in Mutant Chronicles?  I love Little's SW system but it doesn't really cover all the themes of 40k to do an easy port.

Mutant Chronicles 3rd Edition doesn't use the same system as WFRP3 or the FFG Star Wars games; it's a brand new system (which Modiphius Entertainment will be using on other licences moving forwards).

 

An early version of the game, as an open beta adventure, can be found at DriveThruRPG for free. The system's evolved somewhat since that was written, but the heart of the game is still there. It's built for quick cinematic action, and the adventure demonstrates how well it serves the pulpy action-horror that both Mutant Chronicles and 40k lend themselves to. Once the rulebook's out, you'd need to rebuild the character creation, armoury, and bestiary sections, and the various powers chapters would need reworking (the Arts of the Light and the Gifts of the Dark Symmetry don't entirely line up with 40k psychic powers), but the core rules should work fine.

 

Edit: But enough of that digression - I think I've managed to derail the thread long enough. Anyone else wanting to talk about Mutant Chronicles, feel free to message me privately.

 

 

You seem to have messaging disabled. Do I need to friend add you on here or something?

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And when exactly did he do that? He likely had the same opinion as any other religion. A waste of time and resources.

Right at the start of Mechanicum, in a flashback to pre-Crusade Mars. He mends a Knight Titan with his will alone, then sets about making peace with the Martian Mechanicum.

 

I've really been looking forward to that game.  Since you're working on it, how easy do you think it'd be to do a DH game in Mutant Chronicles?  I love Little's SW system but it doesn't really cover all the themes of 40k to do an easy port.

Mutant Chronicles 3rd Edition doesn't use the same system as WFRP3 or the FFG Star Wars games; it's a brand new system (which Modiphius Entertainment will be using on other licences moving forwards).

 

An early version of the game, as an open beta adventure, can be found at DriveThruRPG for free. The system's evolved somewhat since that was written, but the heart of the game is still there. It's built for quick cinematic action, and the adventure demonstrates how well it serves the pulpy action-horror that both Mutant Chronicles and 40k lend themselves to. Once the rulebook's out, you'd need to rebuild the character creation, armoury, and bestiary sections, and the various powers chapters would need reworking (the Arts of the Light and the Gifts of the Dark Symmetry don't entirely line up with 40k psychic powers), but the core rules should work fine.

 

Edit: But enough of that digression - I think I've managed to derail the thread long enough. Anyone else wanting to talk about Mutant Chronicles, feel free to message me privately.

 

You seem to have messaging disabled. Do I need to friend add you on here or something?

I'll check, but I think it does require friending to send messages on here.

Failing that, dowdell.nathan(at)gmail.com serves just as well.

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No the warp is that hell dimension from Event Horizon.

 

I think you could get a decent 40K read out of Prometheus. You have this strange black ooze that is both the beginning of human life, as shown at the start of the movie, and also serves as a corruption of life, creating daemonic beings who only destroy. Consider the giant ultra-muscular creator/engineer who ultimately feels indifference or hatred toward his children. These children look up to him as their god, wanting answers and meaning, and he ultimately ends up consumed by that same black ooze in the form of a daemonic being born of his creation (the human) and the ooze's influence.

 

Obviously you can't put Prometheus directly into the 40k timeline, but I think it could be seen as a more nuanced take on the idea of the emperor, chaos, and normal humanity's relationship to the two.

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Mmmm i dunno, they could be another race created by the Old Ones, who tried to emulate their creators. So why not set prometeus during the dark age of technology?

 

lord knows it will fit in better into 40k than into the Alien(s) series.

 

Speaking of outside influences in 40k: Some HH novels have introduced concepts from HP Lovecrafts Cthulhu mythos into 40k, the "Hall of Leng" in the Imperial palace for instance, thats just briliant! Or Fulgrim mentioning the events of "In the wals of Eryx"

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There's an old GW novel series called Dark Future* by Jack Yeovil (Kim Newman) called Route 666. It mentions Cthulhu, Nyarlathotep, Nurgle and Tzeentch... In the same sentence! (Implying they are the same type of entities)

 

 

 

* No longer canon but alternate history/ possible pre-unification terra

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