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Chaplain

Marine voidships

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OK, since I'm working around some endeavors in Jericho Reach where Astartes presence is considerable, it would have been nice to create stats for astartes voidships.

 

For now I'm aiming at 3 classes:

 

-Gladius-class frigate (probably similar to firestorm with superior maneuverability and turret rating 2?)

-Vanguard-class strike cruiser (Dauntless with small craft launch bay, teleportarium, bombardment macroartillery but tougher? IDK)

-Battle Barge (a hodgepodge of various weapon systems built into oversized and heavily armored grand cruiser hull)

 

Yes, their crews are most likely no less than Veteran, capital ships are equipped with teleportariums, drop pod launch bays and small craft bays, they will have hit and run/boarding bonuses similar to Eldar ships - what else could be important about them? Have anyone tried this in his games?

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One of the biggest things generally put out about Space Marine vessels is that they're superiorly armored.  I'd increase the armor for all of them from their Navy versions.  I haven't seen much to indicate they're maneuverability is any better then the Navy's though.  If anything I think they're less maneuverable.  They're built around one idea - fly at a planet, destroy it's orbital defenses, establish an orbit to launch an assault.  They're Space Marine Delivery Craft.

 

I haven't used one in any of my games (they've appeared, but never needed stats).  However that may change soon, as the Marines will be important to the next arc my characters are going to.

 

Edit: looked it up, I was wrong about the Gladius, they are more maneuverable & faster, at least then a Sword.  Huh.  Strike cruisers, however, are said to be lighter in tonnage & size then Navy Light Cruisers.

Edited by Quicksilver

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Gladius-class Frigate

 

Speed 10

Detection +15

Armor 20 

Space 45

Maneuvrability +28

Hull Integrity 36

Turret Rating 2

Weapon Capacity: Dorsal 2 

 

Lathe Pattern 2b "Escort" Drive

Markov 1 Warp Engine

Emergency Field

Repulsor Shield

Armored Command Bridge

Clemency-Pattern Life Sustainer

Voidsman Quarters

BG-15 Assault Scanners

Starbreaker Lance Weapon

Starbreaker Lance Weapon

 

Space Marine Ship: This ship is equipped with Astartes Drop Pod Launch Bay and Teleportarium. Power needs to be provided for those Components. Additionally, it gains +30 bonus for Hit-And-Run and Boarding-related Tests.

 

Tough Spine: This frigate can mount Lance weapons in Dorsal slots

 

Vanguard-class Strike Cruiser

 

Speed 6

Detection +20

Armor 25 

Space 45

Maneuvrability +15

Hull Integrity 60

Turret Rating 3

 

Weapon Capacity: Prow 1 Port 1 Starboard 1

 

Jovian Pattern Class 3 Drive

Strelov 2 Warp Engine

Emergency Field

Repulsor Shield

Armored Command Bridge

Vitae Pattern Life Sustainer

Voidsman Quarters

BG-15 Assault Scanners

Prow Stygies-Pattern Bombardment Cannons

Jovian-Pattern Escort Bay

Jovian-Pattern Escort Bay

Munitorium

Barracks

 

Space Marine Ship: This ship is equipped with Astartes Drop Pod Launch Bay and Teleportarium. Power needs to be provided for those Components. Additionally, it gains +30 bonus for Hit-And-Run and Boarding-related Tests.

 

Battle Barge

 

Speed 4

Detection +20

Armor 35 

Space 90

Maneuvrability +0

Hull Integrity 90

Turret Rating 5

 

 

Weapon Capacity: Prow 1 Port 2 Starboard 2 Dorsal 1

 

Saturine-Pattern Class 5 Drive

Strelov 2 Warp Engine

Warpsbane Hull

Triple Void Shield Array

Fleet Flag Bridge

Vitae Pattern Life Sustainer

Voidsman Quarters

Deep Void Augur Array

Jovian-Pattern Landing Bay

Jovian-Pattern Landing Bay

Godsbane Lance Battery

Godsbane Lance Battery

Dorsal Stygies-Pattern Bombardment Cannons

Prow Mars-Pattern Torpedo Tubes

Munitorium

Barracks

 

Space Marine Ship: This ship is equipped with Astartes Drop Pod Launch Bay and Teleportarium. Power needs to be provided for those Components. Additionally, it gains +30 bonus for Hit-And-Run and Boarding-related Tests.

 

Relic of the Adeptus Astartes: Those serving aboard this vessel gain +10 bonus to all Interaction tests with members of Imperial organisations, and +10 bonus to Intimidate tests with non-imperials.

Edited by Chaplain

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Just a minor note, which you can feel free to ignore, Space Marine ships traditionally don't use Lances. Lances are considered "ship to ship" weaponry and not "Ship to Shore" weapons.  It's also part of the political balance with the Imperial Navy, who are quick to point out the Adeptus Astartes are only supposed to have "the ships necessary to perform their function" as special forces.  There are, naturally,  some chapters that ignore this like everything else, but they're supposed to be few and far between.  (The Navy refitted the Ultramarine barge with lances during the battle of Macragge, but may have changed it back after.)

 

I'm also not sure the gladius normally has a teleportarium, but there's no reason why it couldn't.  I'd also consider lowering the H&R bonus for the Gladius and perhaps removing the boarding action bonus entirely - there are only 5-10 marines on board after all.

 

Otherwise, they all look pretty awesome.

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True, those stats can and should be modified according to specific chapter, theatre of war, etc. H&R bonus for Gladius in terms of efficiency could be realistically around +10 - marines aside, most of serf crew has extensive training and fanatical zeal, which Navy, let alone Rogue Trader vessels lack.

 

The need for teleportariums is evident, though - there are lots of situations when delivering marines to enemy's heart is complicated by means of drop pod assault or small craft operation.

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I think it mentions in BFK that Navy ships are often loaded with components of Good or even Best quality. I don't think I need to tell anyone where I'm going with this, to say that making pretty much everything on an Astartes ship at least Good quality is probably fair (Best might be something saved for weapons, and only on big ships, afterall).

 

That is, if you don't just plan to handwave points, power, and space, of course.

Edited by Blood Pact

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Just a minor note, which you can feel free to ignore, Space Marine ships traditionally don't use Lances. Lances are considered "ship to ship" weaponry and not "Ship to Shore" weapons.  It's also part of the political balance with the Imperial Navy, who are quick to point out the Adeptus Astartes are only supposed to have "the ships necessary to perform their function" as special forces.  There are, naturally,  some chapters that ignore this like everything else, but they're supposed to be few and far between.  (The Navy refitted the Ultramarine barge with lances during the battle of Macragge, but may have changed it back after.)

 

I'm also not sure the gladius normally has a teleportarium, but there's no reason why it couldn't.  I'd also consider lowering the H&R bonus for the Gladius and perhaps removing the boarding action bonus entirely - there are only 5-10 marines on board after all.

 

Otherwise, they all look pretty awesome.

 

 

Ok, time to jump in.

 

The lance thing has long since been retconned (really since Battlefleet Gothic Magazine gave us an 'all lances' Ultramarine battle barge, but really consolidated as of Planetstrike when SM use lances instead of Bombardment cannons because they're more accurate).  Further, SM very specifically HAVE a lance armed frigate (Nova).  As of BFG FAQ 2010, SM SC can swap a bombardment cannon for a lance, as well as their launch bays for torpedos.  They can also fit a 2 point shield, same as Secutor class monitors.

 

The Seditio Opprimere was NOT rebuilt by the Navy, but by the Ultramarines at their private shipyards at Calth.  (The lances got Retconned though with FAQ 2010 because too many of the testers threw fits and started threadnaughts because how DARE the authors make it 'canon'.)

 

However, instead, the Space Marines may now take Desolator Class battleships (the final word in lance goodness, and retconning the fact that none still existed in Imperial service) as Venerable Battle barges as sort of a massive middle finger to the people who whined about SM lances.

 

'Vanguard' is NOT the class name for a Strike Cruiser class, it is a modification of the base strike cruiser class, which is given as 'Olympia' class in the Horus Heresy books from FW.  (since they're never actualyl given a name besides 'strike cruiser' which is actually just a broad catqagory.  Hilariously, they and the 'standard' battle barge (Warspite class battle barge is one mentioned) were originally designed by Peturabo.

 

Assuming it is a Vanguard, they are actually more maneuverable compared to Dauntless and the base Strike cruiser, according to fluff, and are used as a 'scout' strike cruiser.

Edited by BaronIveagh

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I stand corrected.  I have to admit I didn't kept up very well with the later BFG material, and it's been a little while since I read what I have.  I'm glad this topic came up before the Space Marines made a big show in my game, I can build them accordingly.

 

(Note: not sarcasm)

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I stand corrected.  I have to admit I didn't kept up very well with the later BFG material, and it's been a little while since I read what I have.  I'm glad this topic came up before the Space Marines made a big show in my game, I can build them accordingly.

 

(Note: not sarcasm)

 

 

Sort of touchy subject for me, I had to weather waves of stupidity for 75 pages of people demanding their headcanon be made real canon, and excusing 'bad game design' in the name of 'fluff' from people who failed to understand that 'fluff' serves 'game design' not the other way around.

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Well...

 

 

Gladius, Nova, and Hunter are basically Sword, Firestorm, and Falchion with 24 armor and Speed 10.  Nova can fire it's prow lance F/P/S unlike other escorts.  They'ed probably be +10% HP, to make them a bit tougher than the standard escort.

 

Olympia class Strike Cruiser would be something like

 

Speed:7

Detection +20

Armor: 24

Space: 65

Hull: 65

Maneuver: +15

Turrets: 2

 

2 Prow, 1 Port, 1 Starboard

 

Ability to take 'cruiser only' shields and fit a str 2 LB in one prow slot.

 

As far as Weapon batteries, etc, that's up to the GM.  They have str 4 port/Starboard WB in BFG, but in RT that's a bit of an oddball. 

 

In fluff there have been examples with the equivalent of 3 prow slots, but those have been one offs with bombardment cannons, lbs, and torps.  (the Ultramarines Vae Victus being a prominent example of this variant). 

 

Battle barge I'm not sure on.  They're up into battleship class, so....

 

I'll dig around for the stats, but I did do the Charybdis class grand cruiser's stats, once, based on the Nicor from IA X, but it's on a storage drive someplace.

 

 

Quick and dirty example:

 

Olympia class Strike Cruiser  Wrath of Danu

TURRET RATING     2                

SHIELDS     Repulsor Dual Void Shield             

ARMOUR     25                  

SPEED 9  

HULL INTEGRITY     65            

MANOEUVRABILITY 28                  

DETECTION 25   

SPACE AVAILABLE     65 

POWER AVAILABLE:     65        

SPACE Left Over           0

POWER USED               63    

 

Skill Test Modifiers   

Ballistic Tests 10, Navigation/Warp 10, Navigation/Escape Combat -15, Social 10, Command  10, CMD/Hit&Run 30, CMD/Hit&Run (Def) 35, CMD/Boarding Action (Def) 15,   

 

Crew Disposition:   Fanatical              

Crew Max    100%    

Crew Quality  Competent (30)      

Morale Max  101% (Current)  100%            

Normal Operations (Morale)                         

 

Achievement Bonuses: Trade + 50  Crime + 100  Military + 25  Explore + 50                            

 

Essential Components                  

 

Jovian Pattern, Class 4.5 'Warcruiser' Drive (LC)  [Modified/Archeotech], Markov 2 Warp Engine (CL) , Warpsbane Hull, Bridge of Antiquity (CL,C, CB, CG) , Ancient Life Sustainer (Archeotech) (Reduce Non-Combat Crew Losses by 1) , Auto-Stabilized Logis Targeter , Clan-Kin Quarters (All morale loss reduced by 1, minimum 1)       

 

Supplemental Components                  

 

Augmented Retro Thrusters, Extended Supply Vaults (Extended Repairs add 1 additional HI point), Munitorium (Explodes if Damaged, 2d5 HI loss and 1 Component on Fire), Trophy Room, Teleportarium (Archeotech) (Can make H&R attacks without Piloting Test), Astropathic Choir-Chambers (+10 Focus Power Test, +5 VU Psychic Power Range), Empyrean Mantle (When 'Silent Running' it is 2 Degrees HARDER to detect this Vessel)(External),                           

 

Complications / Past Histories                  

Martial Hubris,  Wrested from a Space Hulk (For misfortunes GM rolls twice and picks the worst)            

 

Weapons                  

 

Jovian Pattern Landing Bay  [strength: 2, Damage:x+x, Crit Rating: --, Range: ]  Location:PROW            

 

Styges Pattern Bombardment Cannons  [strength: 3, Damage:1d10+7, Crit Rating: 2, Range: 4]  Location:PROW        

 

Mars Pattern Macrocannon Broadside  [strength: 6, Damage:1d10+3, Crit Rating: 5, Range: 7 >TURBO +5 on Ballistics Tests<]  Location:STARBOARD  

 

Mars Pattern Macrocannon Broadside  [strength: 6, Damage:1d10+3, Crit Rating: 5, Range: 7 >TURBO +5 on Ballistics Tests<]  Location:PORT

 

 

(yes, I left off drop pods)

Edited by BaronIveagh

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Something else to think about depending on what fluff you consider valid is that some chapters use ships that mirror how they fight. For example in the Horus Heresy books the White Scars use ships specifically built for speed (hit and run), and the Raven Guard had ships that were more stealthy. I imagine the Ultra Marines might have ships that are able to deal with different tactical situations. The Jericho Reach is mostly Death Watch of course so they may just use the sort of thing suggested by other posters which is basically heavily armoured killing machines.

Edited by dava100

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Something else to think about depending on what fluff you consider valid is that some chapters use ships that mirror how they fight. For example in the Horus Heresy books the White Scars use ships specifically built for speed (hit and run), and the Raven Guard had ships that were more stealthy. I imagine the Ultra Marines might have ships that are able to deal with different tactical situations. The Jericho Reach is mostly Death Watch of course so they may just use the sort of thing suggested by other posters which is basically heavily armoured killing machines.

Word on most of the ships the DW has is that they're small, fast, stealthy ships for insertions/extractions. Extremely well-armed for their size of course, probably around punching one or two sizes up from their nominal weightclass. And most, if not all, are capable of carrying out some form of Exterminatus.

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Word on most of the ships the DW has is that they're small, fast, stealthy ships for insertions/extractions. Extremely well-armed for their size of course, probably around punching one or two sizes up from their nominal weightclass. And most, if not all, are capable of carrying out some form of Exterminatus.

 

 

 

 

So, Mary Sue ships?  :P

 

I haven't read anything on ships from the DW RPG books, but it seemed like the Death Watch where often transported by navy vessel or Inquisitorial vessel.  Unlike standard marines, they don't even start planetary assaults and the like, so there's little point in them having any kind of heavy ships, much less exterminatus capable.

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Word on most of the ships the DW has is that they're small, fast, stealthy ships for insertions/extractions. Extremely well-armed for their size of course, probably around punching one or two sizes up from their nominal weightclass. And most, if not all, are capable of carrying out some form of Exterminatus.

 

 

 

 

So, Mary Sue ships?  :P

 

I haven't read anything on ships from the DW RPG books, but it seemed like the Death Watch where often transported by navy vessel or Inquisitorial vessel.  Unlike standard marines, they don't even start planetary assaults and the like, so there's little point in them having any kind of heavy ships, much less exterminatus capable.

 

Space Marines. Unless the writer hates you, you get the cool toys. And as far as I know, The-Abomination-That-Is-Ward hasn't had a shot at the DW yet. Pray he never does.

The DW is Space Marines+Inquisition - of course they get the good stuff. Basically, the only people who get better are the AdMech itself and the Grey Knights. Maybe the Officio Assassinorum has faster and stealthier ships, but the OA's ships aren't going to be combat ships.

 

How Exterminatus is carried out varies. I suspect that the forms that the DW ships can do are based around the older, more advanced forms, rather than something like a Base Delta Zero style Exterminatus.

That is, instead of prolonged orbital bombardment to flatten everything and pound through the bedrock, they employ rapidly self-replicating/expanding effects, either biological or nanotech in nature, or some of the older stuff where there were single warheads capable of shattering a planet's crust, and other things along that nature.

 

The Deathwatch in the Jericho Reach both borrows ships from friendly entities/organizations and has its own ships. Had to have its own ships, otherwise it wouldn't have been able to do anything while the Reach fell.

Really, it varies, but if they're based on Erioch itself, they're using DW ships or Inquisition ships, not Navy proper - they may once have been Navy ships/crews/officers, but not anymore. Navy's not allowed to know where Erioch is. If they're workings somewhere where the Crusade is allowed to know about, then they may well use Navy assets, if any are available to retask or are going their way.

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Rocks are NOT ‘free’, citizen.

 

Firstly, you must manoeuvre the Emperor’s naval vessel within the asteroid belt, almost assuredly sustaining damage to the Emperor’s ship’s paint from micrometeoroids, while expending the Emperor’s fuel.

 

Then the Tech Priests must inspect the rock in question to ascertain its worthiness to do the Emperor’s bidding. Should it pass muster, the Emperor’s Servitors must use the Emperor’s auto-scrapers and melta-cutters to prepare the potential ordinance for movement.

 

Finally, the Tech Priests finished, the Emperor’s officers may begin manoeuvring the Emperor’s warship to abut the asteroid at the prepared face (expending yet more of the Emperor’s fuel), and then begin boosting the stone towards the offensive planet.

 

After a few days of expending a prodigious amount of the Emperor’s fuel to accelerate the asteroid into an orbit more fitting to the Emperor’s desires, the Emperor’s ship may then return to the planet via superluminous warp travel and await the arrival of the stone, still many weeks (or months) away.

 

After twiddling away the Emperor’s time and eating the Emperor’s food in the wasteful pursuit of making sure that the Emperor’s enemies do not launch a deflection mission, they may finally watch the ordinance impact the planet (assuming that the Emperor’s ship does not need to attempt any last-minute course correction upon the rock, using yet more of the Emperor’s fuel).

 

Given a typical (class Bravo-CVII) system, we have the following:

Two months, O&M, Titan class warship: 4.2 Million Imperials

Two months, rations, crew of same: 0.2 MI

Two months, Tech Priest pastor: 1.7 MI

Two months, Servitor parish: 0.3 MI

Paint, Titan class warship: 2.5 MI

Dihydrogen peroxide fuel: 0.9 MI

Total: 9.8 MI

 

(From White Dwarf)

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Pretty sure ramming a rock is going to be a lot cheaper, albeit a lot slower, than pretty much any other form of Exterminatus. Not suitable when it's time sensitive, but when you have the time to spend on such an effort, it's effective.

Also, if you're willing to spend the fuel on it, you can calculate a course to just accelerate the rock you're using most of the way in, cutting down both the time needed and the minimum size of the rock required.

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Pretty sure ramming a rock is going to be a lot cheaper, albeit a lot slower, than pretty much any other form of Exterminatus. Not suitable when it's time sensitive, but when you have the time to spend on such an effort, it's effective.

Also, if you're willing to spend the fuel on it, you can calculate a course to just accelerate the rock you're using most of the way in, cutting down both the time needed and the minimum size of the rock required.

 

'Alas, allow me to remember you, that Rocks are not free, citizen.

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Rocks_Are_Not_Free!#.VBP562P6fIU

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As i keep mentioning - 40k canon isn't a hard and fast thing, but marine vessels are generally tougher and more maneuverable than naval vessels, but far fewer in number. I'd use comparable hulls we have stats for and modify as follows: +1 Turret rating, +2 Armour, components to be of at least Good Craftsmanship. Frigates function as normal. Strike Cruisers (using light cruiser hulls) can fit Light Cruiser/Cruiser components, while Battle barges (using grand cruiser stats) can fit Battlecruiser/Grand Cruiser components.

Marine vessels should always feature the following:

  • Drop Pod Bays
  • Frigates should have cargo-hold & Lighter bays so they might carry a few Thunderhawks, while Strike Cruisers and Battle barges should have at least a pair of Launch Bays and carry lots of Thunderhawks
  • Strike cruisers and Battlebarges should have Teleportarium
  • Bombardment cannons mounted in prow or dorsal slots with port and starboard slots utilizing mainly macrocannons with occasional lances.
  • All Crew Ratings should be 40 on Frigates and 50+ on larger ships as Astartes crew their ships with chapter serfs, advanced servitors and battle brothers.
  • All Astartes vessels should also have a Best Craftsmanship Storm Trooper Detachment, narratively renamed to Astartes detachment (ranging in size from as little as a squad on a Frigate up to a Company on a Strike Cruiser or more on a Battle-barge).

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Rocks are NOT ‘free’, citizen.
 
Firstly, you must manoeuvre the Emperor’s naval vessel within the asteroid belt, almost assuredly sustaining damage to the Emperor’s ship’s paint from micrometeoroids, while expending the Emperor’s fuel.
 
Then the Tech Priests must inspect the rock in question to ascertain its worthiness to do the Emperor’s bidding. Should it pass muster, the Emperor’s Servitors must use the Emperor’s auto-scrapers and melta-cutters to prepare the potential ordinance for movement.
 
Finally, the Tech Priests finished, the Emperor’s officers may begin manoeuvring the Emperor’s warship to abut the asteroid at the prepared face (expending yet more of the Emperor’s fuel), and then begin boosting the stone towards the offensive planet.
 
After a few days of expending a prodigious amount of the Emperor’s fuel to accelerate the asteroid into an orbit more fitting to the Emperor’s desires, the Emperor’s ship may then return to the planet via superluminous warp travel and await the arrival of the stone, still many weeks (or months) away.
 
After twiddling away the Emperor’s time and eating the Emperor’s food in the wasteful pursuit of making sure that the Emperor’s enemies do not launch a deflection mission, they may finally watch the ordinance impact the planet (assuming that the Emperor’s ship does not need to attempt any last-minute course correction upon the rock, using yet more of the Emperor’s fuel).
 
Given a typical (class Bravo-CVII) system, we have the following:
Two months, O&M, Titan class warship: 4.2 Million Imperials
Two months, rations, crew of same: 0.2 MI
Two months, Tech Priest pastor: 1.7 MI
Two months, Servitor parish: 0.3 MI
Paint, Titan class warship: 2.5 MI
Dihydrogen peroxide fuel: 0.9 MI
Total: 9.8 MI
 
(From White Dwarf)

 

 

 

Yeah, that comes up a lot, and there are some massive holes in it (not to mention more recent canon where they pretty much ignore this old chestnut.  It mentions doing warp jumps inside a stars gravity well, and the paint wouldn't chip because void shields wouldn't allow micrometeors through.)

 

Compare the cost of just one vortex torpedo acquisition to that 9.8 thrones, since the magna melta warheads listed barely damage the Citadel of Skulls.

Edited by BaronIveagh

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Rocks are NOT ‘free’, citizen.
 
Firstly, you must manoeuvre the Emperor’s naval vessel within the asteroid belt, almost assuredly sustaining damage to the Emperor’s ship’s paint from micrometeoroids, while expending the Emperor’s fuel.
 
Then the Tech Priests must inspect the rock in question to ascertain its worthiness to do the Emperor’s bidding. Should it pass muster, the Emperor’s Servitors must use the Emperor’s auto-scrapers and melta-cutters to prepare the potential ordinance for movement.
 
Finally, the Tech Priests finished, the Emperor’s officers may begin manoeuvring the Emperor’s warship to abut the asteroid at the prepared face (expending yet more of the Emperor’s fuel), and then begin boosting the stone towards the offensive planet.
 
After a few days of expending a prodigious amount of the Emperor’s fuel to accelerate the asteroid into an orbit more fitting to the Emperor’s desires, the Emperor’s ship may then return to the planet via superluminous warp travel and await the arrival of the stone, still many weeks (or months) away.
 
After twiddling away the Emperor’s time and eating the Emperor’s food in the wasteful pursuit of making sure that the Emperor’s enemies do not launch a deflection mission, they may finally watch the ordinance impact the planet (assuming that the Emperor’s ship does not need to attempt any last-minute course correction upon the rock, using yet more of the Emperor’s fuel).
 
Given a typical (class Bravo-CVII) system, we have the following:
Two months, O&M, Titan class warship: 4.2 Million Imperials
Two months, rations, crew of same: 0.2 MI
Two months, Tech Priest pastor: 1.7 MI
Two months, Servitor parish: 0.3 MI
Paint, Titan class warship: 2.5 MI
Dihydrogen peroxide fuel: 0.9 MI
Total: 9.8 MI
 
(From White Dwarf)

 

 

 

Yeah, that comes up a lot, and there are some massive holes in it (not to mention more recent canon where they pretty much ignore this old chestnut.  It mentions doing warp jumps inside a stars gravity well, and the paint wouldn't chip because void shields wouldn't allow micrometeors through.)

 

Compare the cost of just one vortex torpedo acquisition to that 9.8 thrones,

 

I had another post that apparent didn't happen, but it was basically in this same track.

 

A rock may not be 'free'. It is, however, vastly cheaper except in terms of time to implement than any other form of Exterminatus. And if you count in prep time ... it takes a lot less total time than the creation of the other forms of Exterminatus, it's just that device-based Exterminatus has that time used elsewhere, and much earlier, so it's not noticed on the implementation end of things.

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