Leebo + Determination

[WWHSD 9,273]

 

If we are really going to nitpick Leebo's text, it never says that the second card is face-up and his ability only triggers when a card is dealt face-up. Also, there is nothing that indicates that the Leebo player gets to see what the card does before choosing to resolve it in lieu of the card that had been dealt face-up. The Leebo player is essentially making a gamble that whatever is on card number two is less bad than the original card. 

By that logic, I'm choosing whether to take this crit, or to take a facedown damage, and am therefore Chewbacca.

 

 

Chewbacca is a Wookie from the planet Kashyyk. But Chewbacca lives on the planet Endor. Now think about it; that does not make sense!

Edited November 26, 2014 by WWHSD

[Mace Windu 1,173]

It's not an infinite loop.  The situation is specifically mentioned in the FAQ under Leebo's entry.

 

the problem is that the FAQ entry still refers to the additional card as being drawn, not dealt. Franks Email says the second card counts as being dealt.

 

for the Determination interaction the card needs to be dealt to work, but in doing so "a face up damage card is being dealt" to Leebo, in theory triggering his ability again and again and again.

 

If determination works with Leebo, you have an infinite loop, if the FAQ works as worded then the determination ruling is incorrect.

 

You can have either 1 but you cant have both (with the current FAQ and Franks reply, that is not to say either wont be remidied at some point)

 

Now if the Text on Leebo was a replacement effect it would have all been fine, something like:

 

" If Leebo would be dealt a faceup damage card, instead draw 2 cards and choose 1, the chosen card is then dealt to Leebo" it really would have been that simple, no issues and it work with determination as intended rather than the mess we have now.

 

Edit: Additionally nothing in the wording on Leebo at all references any part of his ability as being optional, however the FAQ entry implies that you have the option of using his ability or not vs Maarek, not very clear at all.

Edited November 27, 2014 by Mace Windu

[dantop83 100]

First off I want to know the official ruling on Determination and Leebo.  Determination works with Chewie, because you choose which resolves first. Simple, because you choose to have determination discard the card BEFORE Chewie turns it face down. Chewie then goes to resolve and “FAILS” because there is no longer a card to turn facedown.

 

NOW

 

MY issue with Leebo is that they also trigger at the same time and you would choose which resolves first the SAME as Chewie, BUT if you choose Leebo’s abilty first then you need to resolve it completely. Only then will Determination go to check for its resolution, however it would “FAIL” because there is no longer a pending card for it to discard since Leebo’s text told you to RESOLVE the card you chose.

 

I want an official ruling on this, BUT I believe this means Determination is NOT going to let you look at two cards and chose the “Pilot” crit so Determination can discard it based on the wordings and the resolution of effects.

 

Of course they can still FAQ clarify that Leebo’s “choose 1 to resolve” wording allows Determination a window to do its job.

 

 

*Now on a side note to the “Infinite Loop” *

 

Leebo is worded differently from Stele in order to prevent Leebo from causing  a loop unto himself.

 

Stele’s wording is: “instead draw 3 Damage cards, choose 1 to deal, and discard the others.”

Leebo’s wording is: “draw 1 additional Damage card, choose 1 to resolve and discard the other.”

 

And of course Leebo triggers off: “When you are dealt a faceup Damage card” sooooo he isn’t being dealt the crit, but rather it is already resolving it, so “Resolve” doesn’t trigger his own “Dealt” trigger.

 

Of course they need to clarify the exact meaning of “Resolve it” to clarify the original Leebo question above..lol

[Parravon 5,217]

Leebo's ability says to choose 1 to resolve. It doesn't actually say to resolve it immediately, and that gives Determination the window to discard the Pilot crit.

Also in this case, drawing an additional damage card is considered the same as being dealt one. Frank has ruled on that somewhere else. I think he's also made a ruling on Determination being able to be used once you have chosen which damage card is "dealt".

But if you want an "official" ruling on Leebo and Determination, email Frank yourself.

[CitizenPrime 17]

So, it has been a few months now. What is the final determination, er, regarding, uh, Determination? 

 

Does Leebo with Determination mean you get to choose a Pilot card (if available) and discard it negating any damage?

[Boba Fatt 103]

Yes.  If you pull a pilot card just discard both.  Leebo's ability discards one and determination discards the pilot.  No damage.