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Jekzer

Trouble in Tharbad spoilers at cgdb!

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Hmmm but there is nothing to say about ranger characters cannot participate him attack… qstrike have errata, other cards mention attack alone and so on. Here is nothing about… im also not sure about but sounds logical no?

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I guess they're putting a lot of support into the Scout keyword in this cycle then, since that's two heroes in two packs with the keyword. Good! Also nice to see a Haldir hero. In fact, I feel like all the cards in this pack are pretty good, with interesting possibilities to work out. And a 9 threat Lore hero is a big bonus, especially with stats that are well divided (good willpower, excellent attack). 

 

I think I'm most happy with the cost reduction attachment. It's good to see an option besides Steward that's cheap and actually gives great flexibility. Also, am I right in thinking it's not unique, so three can go down in one deck? I may have misread the card (looked at it on a tiny phone screen).

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I guess they're putting a lot of support into the Scout keyword in this cycle then, since that's two heroes in two packs with the keyword. Good! Also nice to see a Haldir hero. In fact, I feel like all the cards in this pack are pretty good, with interesting possibilities to work out. And a 9 threat Lore hero is a big bonus, especially with stats that are well divided (good willpower, excellent attack). 

 

I think I'm most happy with the cost reduction attachment. It's good to see an option besides Steward that's cheap and actually gives great flexibility. Also, am I right in thinking it's not unique, so three can go down in one deck? I may have misread the card (looked at it on a tiny phone screen).

 

It is unique.  

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Are we sure haldir ability allows an attack to staging area?

I interpreted that it did, and it seemed clear to me, altough at BGG site there is some debate that it may just mean that Haldir can attack a enemy engaged with another player or a previosly engaged enemy with you.

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Seems pretty clear to me that only Haldir gets to attack, he only gets this if you have not yet engaged an enemy this round, and he attacks alone.

 

Since he is attacking 3, he'll need some boosts against most of the enemies we see nowadays.  I think the idea is to have Haldir and a few other ranged characters in play.  Drop Rumil during staging to soften up an enemy, and then finish him off if needed with Haldir.  This is going to require keeping your threat low though.

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defender of the naith + elven mail, could be pretty good. Remember that Silvan Tracker heals a character when they ready, so you could use him to defend, then ready and heal him, then defend again at full health.

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Another cool aspect that I just realized about the Herald is that he can allow other players to put another ally into play. I love it when cards can be used to greater effect in multiplayer. That can help mitigate the fact that doomed affects everyone.

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defender of the naith + elven mail, could be pretty good. Remember that Silvan Tracker heals a character when they ready, so you could use him to defend, then ready and heal him, then defend again at full health.

Silvan Tracker effect only heals during the refresh phase. That's why Silvan Tracker itself more viable target for elven mail, rather than Defender of the Naith. Plus, Defender already has sentinel, so slapping mail on him is kinda waste from my point of view.

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Haldir could be good with Grave Cairn. When a defender dies, or even, important, when you use an ability to return a silvan to your hand (there are a lot of ways when we talk about silvans). Celebron + Haldir + Grave Cairn can be inside a good silvan deck.

 

Herald of Anorien can be used by yourselve? If you play him, can you chose to yourselve and play another ally for free? In solo, he is good also then. It would be as: you don't pay for him, only you raise 2 to play him. The Herald is very good for trisphere decks, when you must wait 2 rounds to play an ally. Herald avoid the delaying.

 

O Lorien can be used for another players? Even if you have it attached, the other players can use its hability, isn't?

Edited by Mndela

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Herald of Anorien can be used by yourselve? If you play him, can you chose to yourselve and play another ally for free? In solo, he is good also then. It would be as: you don't pay for him, only you raise 2 to play him. The Herald is very good for trisphere decks, when you must wait 2 rounds to play an ally. Herald avoid the delaying.

Wow!  Yes it can.   Totally misread that.

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defender of the naith + elven mail, could be pretty good. Remember that Silvan Tracker heals a character when they ready, so you could use him to defend, then ready and heal him, then defend again at full health.

Silvan Tracker effect only heals during the refresh phase. That's why Silvan Tracker itself more viable target for elven mail, rather than Defender of the Naith. Plus, Defender already has sentinel, so slapping mail on him is kinda waste from my point of view.

Yup. You're right. Forgot about that bit. I also agree about losing out in sentinel.

 

If it weren't for Celeborn's boost, he'd be like Orthanc Guard except more expensive and unable to quest. At least with the boost he's able to quest for one round, then he readies and is available to defend with 3 defense. After that though, he's even worse than Orthanc Guard because he can't quest, so he'd only ready after defending (assuming he doesn't die) and can contribute 1 attack. The only thing that makes him slightly better than Orthanc guard is that he has Sentinel.

 

I think we need to realize, though, that most enemies (not an overwhelming majority, but still a majority) still have 3 or less attack, meaning we can still get use out of this guy. Obviously, some shadows can end up killing him anyway, but in general, as an ally, it's not terrible for him to die. The issue is really that there are better defenders out there, especially for his cost.

 

Guthlaf can defend just as well, will have 1 permanent willpower, and will cost 1 less if you're using the right heroes. Defender of Rammas has 4 defense for 2 cost. As I mentioned, Orthanc Guard is comparable and costs less. Emery has better stats and can come into play for free. Watcher of the Bruinen is comparable and cheaper. Even White Tower Watchman is a better defender. Most of those don't have sentinel, but if you can only get 1 or 2 blocks out of the Defender of the Naith, then the 3 resources may not be worth it for defending other players. In general, though should be able to get their own chump blockers more easily.

Edited by joezim007

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Defender of Naith costs 3 because he's:

1) neutral;

2) silvan;

3) sentinel.

 

With O Lorien, he technically costs 2. With Grima 1, lol.

It would be hard, but possible to utilize him well, but I hope something that buffs him indirectly comes up until the end of the cycle.

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So along with all the very nasty threat gained from various encounter card effects for this quest I've taken special notice of the treachery card "Get that Dwarf!". The treachery doesn't seem so bad at first glance but upon closer inspection it seems that the enemy affected makes an attack not just against the first player but actually against Nalir which means that it is his defense and hit points the attack will be affecting and if he dies you lose the quest.

Now he only has 2 defense and 3 hit points so if you have a healer out and he takes two damage and only has 1 hit point left you can easily heal him back to full with one heal. However for the attack itself he can take on an attack which has attack power of 4 maximum which blocks 2 and puts him to 1 health, five attack power or higher and hes one dead dwarf and the quest is failed. Lets have a look at the various enemies that are actually featured in this quest and what would happen if they are indeed the enemy with the highest attack in staging and what their attack against Nalir would mean:

Bellach (Trouble in Tharbad): This unique enemy has 5 attack so with or without a shadow effect his attack from Get that Dwarf! would instantly kill Nalir and end the quest.....

Spy From Mordor (Trouble in Tharbad): This enemy has 3 attack which means that Nalir will defend 2 of that and only take 1 damage. Should you get a shadow card that boosts attack it will do 2 damage intead, now as long as your threat is above 20 there are NO SHADOW CARDS in this quest that give more than +1 attack, there are some that let the enemy attack again etc but nothing that gives more than +1 attack so long as your threat is over 20. This means as long as your threat is over 20 Nalir can safety take an attack from a Spy from Mordor and survive on 1 health.

Bellach's Marauder (Trouble in Tharbad): This nasty enemy also has 5 attack like its master Bellach so would instantly kill Nalir from Get that Dwarf! whether it gets a shadow effect/boost or not.

Orc Skirmisher (Misty Mountain Orcs): The skirmisher has an attack of 4 which means Nalir's defense stops 2 and he takes 2 which leaves him on only 1 hitpoint. Therefore so long as the shadow card dealt has no effect he can JUST survive an attack from this enemy from Get that Dwarf. If the shadow card gives even +1 attack and you can't cancel it with a hasty stroke or something else then he is dead and you lose the quest.

Orc Hunter (Misty Mountain Orcs): This guy is more or less the same as the Spies from Mordor and has 3 attack so would only do 1 damage/2 if a shadow card that gives +1 attack is revealed.

Orc Hound (Misty Mountain Orcs): The Orc Hound is the only enemy in the deck that Nalir can defend against and potentially take no damage, his 2 defense stopping the 2 attack power. Should the hound get a shadow card giving it one attack Nalir will just take the one damage. The one other thing however is that when engaged this enemy forces the player to exhaust a character, if you randomly had everyone exhausted except nalir you would have to exhaust him and the attack would be undefended which would do 2 damage to him or if there was a shadow effect giving +1 attack as well it would kill Nalir. I don't really see this ever happening as I really don't see anyone not leaving a single character for defense/emergencies except for Nalir but just wanted to state it is a possibility.

 

One last thing to note is the other treachery card "Cornered". It gives you a choice between removing a time counter or giving all enemies in staging +1 attack and -20 engagement cost. Should this card come out during staging and you choose to give all enemies higher attack values and then Get that Dwarf is subsequently revealed as the 2nd (or if playing with more than two the third or fourth) encounter card during staging you are more or less screwed....

 

I think its safe to say even if just to protect against Get that Dwarf; enemies should definitely NOT be left in the staging area with this quest. So long as you are able take those fools on, don't leave them in staging, especially not if they have a high attack value, they could very well (due to a single treachery) end the game for you instantly! Bellach and his Marauding Orcs kill Nalir in one hit and the Orc Skirmisher has a pretty decent chance of killing him straight up as well.

Another way around this is to simply keep a copy of A Test of Will in your hand especially for this treachery or to run Eleanor for this quest.

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You know you can declare defenders against those aimed attacks? It's the same as an attack "against the first player", with only difference that if attack from the first player is undefended - the damage goes to one of the heroes, while attack against Nalir if undefended - damages Nalir himself instead one of the heroes. You can still defend against it with any of your available characters.

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It does make sense... Was thinking it was a rather super nasty treachery considering you'd instantly lose if Bellach or one of his marauders were in the staging area...

Seems like it should be written as an attack against the first player that if undefended must be assigned to Nalir.

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