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TheGreedyMerchant

How Important is Engine Upgrade on the Defender?

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Title pretty much says it all, I'm wanting to take a break from the phantom (since its all I've played in the summer league at my LGS). So I'm polling the community for feedback, how important is engine upgrade on the the defender? 

 

It's not necessary, but if it's possible to spend the points on it I feel, anyway, that you probably should. More so for named pilots than the generics. The Defender is, obviously, really good at moving in straight lines, while turning is problematic. The Engine upgrade gives you more turning power when you don't want to take stress, and if you do end up taking stress, helps alleviate having to take a straight maneuver to clear it. 

 

It currently works best for Vessery, who doesn't need his own action to get a boost to his offense and can most afford to be using boost, though it's obviously really good on the others as well.

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I said it earlier today in another thread, and @trustybroom just said it too.  I would not COMPETE with a Defender with Engine Upgrade, BUT I am definitely glad that I put it on the Defender when I was learning with it.  That dial is new, weird, fast, and much less forgiving than most.  I recommend for your first few games with a Defender that you give it an Engine Upgrade, and then wean yourself off of it as you practice.  It helps correct grievous errors, but if in your third or fourth game, you find you haven't used it, then you can spend those points elsewhere.

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Would shield or hull be a better investment then to make him a bit more survivable?

 

http://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Galactic%20Empire&d=v3!c=150!71:57,23,-1:-1:3:;16::-1:-1:;58:27:-1:-1:;12:27:-1:-1:;12:27:-1:-1:;12:27:-1:-1:;12:27:-1:-1:

 

Edit: It is an escalation list by the way. Round 1 is Brath with predator and EU and dark curse, round 2 I add the HLC and a RGP with VI, Round 3 is two BSP with VI and the same for round 4.

Edited by TheGreedyMerchant

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FFG missed the boat when they didn't give the Defender a natural boost. Fluff wise its suppose to be one of the fastest starfighters behind the A-wing. In the game its not any faster than a Tie Fighter.

Edited by Jo Jo

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Maybe there will be a title in the future that gives a boost at the cost of an upgrade slot...  ;)

 

The Defender does not need a boost. You get used to not relying on the 1 and 2 turns. The hard 1 is an imperial crutch to begin with, and after flying rebels for a long time, I hardly think about using it. 

 

You will also find that the barrel roll is much more useful that a boost (with respect to the defender.) Boosting after a 1 bank is a wider turn that taking a hard 3, and it costs you an action. Whereas if you were to barrel roll after a 1 bank, you would find yourself in almost the same position as the hard 1 turn, but at a 45 degree angle from your original position. 

 

Brath absolutely does not want to waste his action on anything other that a focus, unless he can barrel roll out of an arc. Boosting to get a better shot isnt the best idea, especially with the HLC. If you need additional movement, barrel rolling to increase range to target is a better idea. 

 

Even Vessery, who is not dependent on actions at all (but dependent on a Rube Goldberg list) doesnt really need the boost. 

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...I am definitely glad that I put it on the Defender when I was learning with it.  That dial is new, weird, fast, and much less forgiving than most. I recommend for your first few games with a Defender that you give it an Engine Upgrade, and then wean yourself off of it as you practice.

Don't bother with the Engine Upgrade, the Defender don't need it. The ship already cost a lot so you are better to keep this 4 point for something else.

I agree with both of these points. I've flown Defender + Engine Upgrade a few times, and it is a nice trick to have in your pocket--but I eventually realized that I was only using it about once per game, and I haven't regretted spending those four points elsewhere.

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Would shield or hull be a better investment then to make him a bit more survivable?

 

 

Or something else entirely?

 

 

Really all you need is a focus token. You generally want a cannon on a Defender; either an Ion or an HLC. At range 3 that denies your opponent an additional evade. However, you still get your evade at range 3. A defender at range 3 with a focus is really, really hard to kill.

 

On top of that, a defender is a flanking machine.

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I don't know what else to spend the four points if I strip off the upgrade from Rex.

Hull Upgrade is a better investment on 3 Agility than elsewhere. I haven't run it on a Defender yet, although I've played with the idea.

Looking at your list, it might good to drop the points into your Royal Guard Pilot, who would very much like PTL, Predator, and/or some extra hp.

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Actually I may have just figured it out! I think this looks a little better from the previous interpretation.

 

http://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Galactic%20Empire&d=v3!c=150!71:57,23,-1:-1:-1:;16::-1:-1:;58:27:-1:-1:;15::-1:-1:;17:27:-1:-1:;14::-1:-1:;12:27:-1:-1:

 

Round 1: Rex with predator and Dark Curse

Round 2: RGP with VI and HLC added to Rex

Round 3: Backstabber and Mauler Mithel with VI

Round 4: Night Beast, BSP with VI

 

Seven Ships and none of them below PS 5.

 

Or another version  http://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Galactic%20Empire&d=v3!c=150!71:57,23,-1:-1:-1:;16::-1:-1:;58:18:-1:5:;15::-1:-1:;10::-1:-1:;17:57:-1:-1:;10::-1:-1:

 

 

 

I don't know what else to spend the four points if I strip off the upgrade from Rex.


Hull Upgrade is a better investment on 3 Agility than elsewhere. I haven't run it on a Defender yet, although I've played with the idea.

Looking at your list, it might good to drop the points into your Royal Guard Pilot, who would very much like PTL, Predator, and/or some extra hp.

 

 

You're probably right in that I should invest those points into the RGP and give him PTL. Now I just have to ween myself off engine upgrade.

Edited by TheGreedyMerchant

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With a white k-turn I am not sure why it would need an EU.

I like it because it makes turning easier, plus there have been times during my games that when I have k-turned I didn't have a shot due to the angle being off or something is out of range, being able to boost left or right 45 degrees after a k-turn is pretty cool.

Edited by TheGreedyMerchant

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HLC on Brath gets terribly expensive. 47 points is a lot (Brath doesnt leave the barn without Predator, Im actually going to laminate those two cards together.) 

 

But I have been thinking hard about an Ion Cannon. It denies RB3 defence dice while giving Brath the bonus defence, and thanks to his unique ability, he can flip those Ion damage cards into crits. It will probably happen a lot more often too, as all you need to land with an ion cannon is 1 hit. So if you roll 2/3 hits on a 1 agility ship, no need to spend the focus to make a third hit, spend that token to break something on the target! 

 

 

As for using the Defender as a flanker, Im not sure thats the best bet. When I did, he would get focused down. You are essentially giving your opponent the following option:

1) target the mini swarm and take out 13 point chunks of your list

2) target Brath and take out a 40 point chunk of your list. 

 

I have been flying him in formation with TIEs. Between Howlrunner and Predator on Brath, most of his attacks hit, without spending focus. Also, Howlrunner is the Empire's Biggs, so people focus on her, instead of the deadly ships in formation with her. 

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Is engine upgrade worth it on any small ship?  It never seems to be worth the action for me.  The only places I see it used are the shuttle, and Ibtisam.  (but I always play the same opponent, so maybe we just haven't been inspired yet)

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Is engine upgrade worth it on any small ship?  It never seems to be worth the action for me.  

 

It frequently is. For example, on an X wing it isn't there to be used every round, but there are times that using your action to boost will get you shots that you wouldn't have had otherwise.

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