A house rules for mobile asteroids

[DagobahDave 1,621]

Okay, I think I've got something that will work:

 

1. At the start of the first Activation phase of the game (after dials have been set, but before they have been revealed), before any other game effects occur, the players flip a coin, and the winner of the coin-toss gets a choice: (a) select the asteroid that will be moved this round, or (b) let the other player select.

 

2. The player chosen to select the asteroid now does so. The other player then places a 1 forward maneuver template somewhere in contact with the edge of the selected asteroid (using the maneuver template's short edge, long edge, corner, etc.). That player may then move the asteroid, with the option of rotating or flipping the token, and places it so that it is still in contact with the edge of the maneuver template but not overlapping any other asteroid, ship base, or the maneuver token, and remains within the boundaries of the play area.

 

3. The Activation phase resumes.

 

4. During the following round, the players do not flip a coin. Instead, they alternate between selecting and moving asteroids so that neither player selects or moves an asteroid on consecutive rounds.

 

Does that make sense?

 

Edit: The thread title should be "A house rule for mobile asteroids"

Edited July 30, 2014 by DagobahDave

[Joe Boss Red Seven 11,292]

I just roll a D4 at the end of the round. Asteroids move 1 to 3 inches in a random direction. On a roll of 4 they stay in place.

[aknorthroader 16]

There are several sets of directional dice out there...  roll that plus the attack dice. On a blank it stays, on a hit it moves one and on a critical it moves 2.  Use the movement gauges to have distance versus having a tape.  Have asteroids move after dials have been set but before any movement takes place. Any time two asteroids hit each other, they go 1 in the opposite direction.  

[aknorthroader 16]

This way all movement is random and not determined by either player.  movement of one or two isn't unrealistic and adds an element of surprise to the game.  

[Levi Porphyrogenitus 877]

I'd rather just have them move from side edge to side edge, in a straight line. It seems more realistic.

 

Start of game, each player places one asteroid on the "upstream" edge, not within range 1 of any other asteroid. At the beginning of the Movement phase, each asteroid on the board moves 3 in a straight line across the board. At the end of each End phase each player places one more asteroid on the edge of the board, not within range 1 of any other asteroid.

 

If you run out of asteroids, you wait until one runs off the board and then you place it again.

 

If an asteroid moves through or lands on a ship, the ship loses its action for that round (even with advanced sensors you'd lose your action) and rolls for a hit/crit.

[DagobahDave 1,621]

I'm trying to come up with rules that are airtight and elegant, and that use only the components that come with the game, so that they could be used in tournament play (or game nights at the store with strangers) without any debates over fairness. Ideally, asteroids would just move around randomly (or in perfectly straight lines) without any room for human error, but I don't think that's possible with this game.

 

In a game where millimeters matter, how do you minimize the margin of error in direction and placement of asteroids that move randomly? Does the asteroid have to stay in its original orientation (not rotated)? This sort of thing is quite fussy and prone to mistakes. When measuring the distance moved, what part of the asteroid's original position do you use, and what part of its final position do you use? Do you measure from center of original position to center of final position? Or from edge to edge -- and if so, how do you determine what edges are opposite each other, or where the center of an asteroid is, since the asteroid tokens are asymmetrical?

 

To avoid all of those complications, I think it's best if players have control over the movement and final orientation. By having one player choose which asteroid moves, and having the other player choose where it moves (within limits), those problems are eliminated and it adds some tactical depth to play. It's not random movement, but it's not entirely planned, either. What's likely to happen is that asteroids that are out of the immediate vicinity of the action will be moved, which will change the battlefield if ships move into that area. Meanwhile, the area being vacated will probably see some asteroid movement, so that it will be different if ships return there.

Edited July 30, 2014 by DagobahDave

[Spaceman91 805]

I tried rolling a scatter dice ( GW thing ) and a d6. D6 is how many inchs and scatter gives direction. At the end of each turn we would do it. Its a lot of messing about for not as much fun as we thought it would be.

Edited July 30, 2014 by Spaceman91

[Slugrage 5,007]

After dials set, before anything moves.

So use a green and a red die.

Someone picks an asteriod.

Whichever way the top point of the green die is pointing, is the direction the chosen asteroid moves.

Blank or Focus is 0, Hit is 1 straight, Crit Hit is 2 straight, in whatever direction the green is pointing.

Anyone that gets hit by one resolves normally with 1 attack die for possible damage.

Asteriods stop moving if they hit each other.

 

Some movement, but not an overload of everything bouncing around everywhere.

Edited July 30, 2014 by Slugrage

[Wayne Argabright 1,544]

[Joe Boss Red Seven 11,292]

 

I KNOW YOU DIDN'T!!!

:lol:

:wub:

 

I must of spent $100 on that game back in the day...in little gold token with a slice of pizza and a coke on the console and heavy pockets that gingled and chinked.

[Joe Boss Red Seven 11,292]

After dials set, before anything moves.

So use a green and a red die.

Someone picks an asteriod.

Whichever way the top point of the green die is pointing, is the direction the chosen asteroid moves.

Blank or Focus is 0, Hit is 1 straight, Crit Hit is 2 straight, in whatever direction the green is pointing.

Anyone that gets hit by one resolves normally with 1 attack die for possible damage.

Asteriods stop moving if they hit each other.

 

Some movement, but not an overload of everything bouncing around everywhere.

 

Yeah I do that top of the Di trick too for the direction determination. Also I move asteroids if a ship blew up within 1 inch of  it and have it move directly away from the center of the explosion .

[Forgottenlore 9,824]

Here are the ideas I have been kicking around for a while. Unlike DD, I prefer adding components and making it purely for casual play as I think it can be made to work easier that way, I want to photoshop some asteroids with move nubs on them. Like Swedge, my thoughts have been to basically set up a tabletop version of the old asteroids game, so I am working on 3 different sizes of asteroids.
 
Start with 2-3 big asteroids on the table. They move 1 straight each turn in a fixed direction. If one gets destroyed, it is replaced with 2 medium ones. The medium ones start 1 straight apart with a direction of movement at right angles to how the big one was moving. Medium rocks move 2 straight. Rinse and repeat for the small ones, which move 3 straight.
 
If a rock moves onto or over a ship, roll for damage just like a collision, but give the ship a stress as well (he wasn't expecting it). If a ship would overlap an asteroid, treat it like normal except the ship has an option to try and shoot the asteroid instead of colliding with it. The ship performs a primary weapon attack and if the rock is destroyed it splits as normal, the ship is not counted as overlapping for that turn but cannot perform an attack in the combat phase.
 
The map is a torus, so asteroids that exit the map reenter on the opposite side.
 
What I am not sure about is how tough to make the asteroids. Give them agility and "hull" based on their size, or just say that they get no agility dice and just need so much damage to destroy? Should they accumulate damage or do you have to inflict enough hits with a single attack to destroy them?
 
Also, I am worried that, outside of a solitaire mission, there isn't enough incentive to shoot the asteroids. I love the idea of destroying asteroids to make your opponent's flying harder, but why would you ever waste an attack on a rock if you could shoot an enemy ship instead?
 
Some other thoughts, should seismic charges (and other bombs?) automatically destroy an asteroid they hit? They were pretty devastating to rocks in Attack of the Clones.
 
Edit: Forgot to include when the rocks move. I was considering they move before the activation phase, before the combat phase, at the end of the turn, or possibly including a "pilot" skill number on each one so that the asteroids move interspersed with the ships.
 
Also forgot, if an asteroid collides with another asteroid, it stops, just like a ship overlapping a ship, then both rocks are rotated 90 degrees and will head off in new directions starting next time they move.

[Joe Boss Red Seven 11,292]

Here are the ideas I have been kicking around for a while...

 

I see you LOVE Asteroids... so do I.

 

I might have to be as ridiculous as you, and give the **** things their own numbers so they can be kept track of...

[Forgottenlore 9,824]

With some decent photoshopping skills it should be dead simple to make some asteroid tokens in various sizes that have move guides and a couple stats printed on them.

Unfortunately, my photoshopping skills suck.

[EmpireErik 176]

I just roll a D4 at the end of the round. Asteroids move 1 to 3 inches in a random direction. On a roll of 4 they stay in place.

What, random direction? Asteroids are rocks and have to move at a contstant rate in a constant direction...one of the laws of physics...

A rule should be players pick their direction at the start of the game and this remains constant, and possible roll the speed for each asteroid. I would recommend they move at the same tima as the PS as their speed. Damage as per regular rules.

Keep it simple. Damage on impact could equal speed of movement.

Edited July 31, 2014 by EmpireErik

[stuffedskullcat 1,132]

I like the idea of moving asteroids, but I don't see how/why they would change direction and speed over the course of a match. I'd say at the beginning of the match, each asteroid tile/model is randomly assigned a move speed and origin side of the map. They move that speed and you do your best to plan your ship maneuvers around that.

[Slugrage 5,007]

Star Wars space combat and Laws of Physics don't normally go in a sentence together except with a statement about how they don't go together.

[ziggy2000 169]

With some decent photoshopping skills it should be dead simple to make some asteroid tokens in various sizes that have move guides and a couple stats printed on them.

Unfortunately, my photoshopping skills suck.

Here's a link to a scenario I found quite a while ago over on BGG:

 

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/877011/mission-3-asteroid-ambush

 

I'm not sure about the rules, but there are some asteroid tokens with nubs that you might be able to use or adapt.

[EmpireErik 176]

Star Wars space combat and Laws of Physics don't normally go in a sentence together except with a statement about how they don't go together.

Ok, even in the movies, asteroids do not make random turns or changes in speed. Common sense has to rule.

[DagobahDave 1,621]

When it comes to asteroids, realism is totally boring. In reality, even in the relatively dense asteroid belt of our own star system, asteroids are many miles away from each other on average. Note that a really exciting meteor shower might produce one shooting star per minute. That's an enormous distance between rocks.

 

X-Wing is clearly taking its cue from Empire Strikes Back and its super-dense, super-exciting asteroid field chase scenes. Look at the way asteroids move in that scene. It's chaos.

 

Now, I don't think mobile asteroids in this game can work exactly the way they do in ESB. A compromise is needed. What you can do is attempt to capture the feel of roaming asteroids in a way that doesn't burden the players with too many duties or option. I think it's also important that mobile asteroid rules don't change the nature of the game in such a way that it makes asteroids more important than ships.

[UnfairBanana 2,251]

We just agree that if we bump an asteroid and it doesn't cause problems, leave it in the new spot and mark it up as asteroidal drift.

[DagobahDave 1,621]

A rule should be players pick their direction at the start of the game and this remains constant, and possible roll the speed for each asteroid. I would recommend they move at the same tima as the PS as their speed. Damage as per regular rules.

Keep it simple. Damage on impact could equal speed of movement.

 

Yes! Keep it simple!

 

I challenge you to write out concise rules for accomplishing what you just described, in a step-by-step fashion that can be implemented at the table without fuss or room for debate, and without adding more than 30 seconds to every round of play, using less than 200 words.

Edited July 31, 2014 by DagobahDave

[Joe Boss Red Seven 11,292]

 

I just roll a D4 at the end of the round. Asteroids move 1 to 3 inches in a random direction. On a roll of 4 they stay in place.

What, random direction? Asteroids are rocks and have to move at a contstant rate in a constant direction...one of the laws of physics...

A rule should be players pick their direction at the start of the game and this remains constant, and possible roll the speed for each asteroid. I would recommend they move at the same tima as the PS as their speed. Damage as per regular rules.

Keep it simple. Damage on impact could equal speed of movement.

 

 

Oh I agree for an asteroid belt or a planetary ring everything would move together until things get disturbed by explosions and so forth.

[EmpireErik 176]

proposed rules (as requested): these are something like what I have played with...

1. At the start of the game the players, place a small post-it on each asteroid with a directional arrow on it. This is the general movement vector of the moving asteroid.

2. When laying asteroids, the players agree to either one direction of movement for all asteroids or as assigned by the player. If movement vectors are assigned, the player that puts the asteroid on the map at startup, also points the arrow at the direction it is supposed to move. Roll a d3 (1d6/2) for the speed of the asteroid (and PS) for speeds 1, 2, or 3 - they move at that speed at that PS time. Asteroids are placed in alternate, keeping in mind the player placement order.

3. As the games is played, when it is time to move PS 3, 2, then 1, the asteroids move after all players move. Movement of an asteroid uses a straight movement template only. No turns or K-turns. Collision rules, if used, should be created as per house rules.

4. If the asteroid passes across a base or lands on the base, damage is as per the rules PLUS 1 red dice for each point of movement. PS 3 asteroids cause 4 red dice damage as they move faster and are more of a threat. PS2 asteroids roll 3 dice, PS1 asteroids roll 2 dice, and stopped asteroids roll the standard 1 dice. Damage can be reduced as follows: PS 3 = 3 dice, PS 2 = 2 dice, PS 1 equals 1 dice + stress, stationary as per game rules (1 dice). Players can also cap speeds at 1 max, or 1s and 2s.

5. When an asteroid goes off the map, the next person in line to place and asteroid (ref step 2), places the asteroid on the incoming edge. No attempt to intentionally aim the rock at a players ship is allowed. [End]

Here you go, my proposed rules. Simple, easy and fun. Enjoy.

Edited August 1, 2014 by EmpireErik

[DagobahDave 1,621]

I like a lot of the ideas there, EmpireErik. That could work for a casual game where there are lots of unwritten assumptions between the players, but it has a problem in common with many asteroid movement house rules: How do the players actually move the asteroids? Where do they place the templates, and how/where do they place the asteroid at the end of that template? How do they prevent the asteroids from rotating when being moved (or does it matter if they rotate)? How do they keep them going "straight" in the proper direction without changing angle slightly, since there are no template guides? Unless those sorts of things are accounted for, it's going to introduce human error into the movement of asteroids and open the possibility of abuse, or accidents, and debates. It also looks like it's going to add at least two minutes to each round of play, which could add up to a lot of time over the course of a match just for the novelty of moving asteroids.

 

If all of the asteroids are headed in the same direction, that means you're going to see one side of the battlefield empty out over the course of the match, unless you introduce new asteroids to the other side, and you'll need additional rules for their placement in that case.

 

I'm not trying to pick on you at all; I'm trying to point out that most house rules for asteroid movement tend to be more complicated and fussy than their designers intend them to be, and that can make them more trouble than they're worth.

Edited August 1, 2014 by DagobahDave