Look at maneuver dial during Activation phase?

[DarthJalapeno 32]

Hi

 

is a player allowed to look at all his maneuver dials, without turning them face up, during the Activation phase?

 

For example can the player check where all his ships are going to end up before choosing the order to execute the ships in?

 

 

Edit: Answer for anyone who comes looking.

 

 

You may look at your own maneuver dials at any time during the Planning or Activation phases. After the Planning phase, a player must inform his opponent if he is going to look at but not reveal his dial as manipulating dials will not be tolerated.

 

Thanks for playing,

 

Frank Brooks

Associate Creative Content Developer

Fantasy Flight Games

Edited July 14, 2014 by DarthJalapeno

[VanorDM 11,599]

Sure you can look at your dials pretty much any time you want.  Especially if you're moving a bunch at the same time because they're all the same PS.

[DarthJalapeno 32]

How about if I look at another ships dial that has a higher PS than the active one to decide if I should do a barrel roll action to get out of the way?

Edited July 11, 2014 by DarthJalapeno

[Forgottenlore 9,838]

The rulebook says a player may look at his own face down dials at any time.

[Buhallin 4,563]

The rulebook says a player may look at his own face down dials at any time.

Page 6

[StephenEsven 632]

Page 6 is about the planning phase. As soon as tou get to the Activation phase, you must first choose between the ships activating at a certain pilot skill, rhen activate one by flipping the dial. You arw not allowed to look first.

So you better plan ahead in the planning phase. Hence the name.

Edited July 11, 2014 by StephenEsven

[OuterRimJob 38]

Page 6 is about the planning phase. As soon as tou get to the Activation phase, you must first choose between the ships activating at a certain pilot skill, rhen activate one by flipping the dial. You arw not allowed to look first.

So you better plan ahead in the planning phase. Hence the name.

Paragraph #3, Page 6, Core Rulebook... Quote:

 

A player may look at his own facedown maneuver

dials at any time, but he cannot look at his opponent’s

facedown dials.

[ixdta39 80]

 

Page 6 is about the planning phase. As soon as tou get to the Activation phase, you must first choose between the ships activating at a certain pilot skill, rhen activate one by flipping the dial. You arw not allowed to look first.

So you better plan ahead in the planning phase. Hence the name.

Paragraph #3, Page 6, Core Rulebook... Quote:

 

A player may look at his own facedown maneuver

dials at any time, but he cannot look at his opponent’s

facedown dials.

 

 

Oh thank goodness, as I've been looking at my dials, but not flipping them up to decide whether or not to use adv sensors/help plot out my decloaking with "Echo."  I would've been in big trouble if that wasn't legal

[Plainsman 1,002]

It is on the page for the Planning Phase! In most rules that would literally mean any time during that phase only, not any time...

Is there an official clarification on that somewhere?

[OuterRimJob 38]

It is on the page for the Planning Phase! In most rules that would literally mean any time during that phase only, not any time...

Is there an official clarification on that somewhere?

Really?

[Plainsman 1,002]

Yes, rules specific to a section would be contained in that section, whereas a rule that is meant to be used throughout would be in a general section. This rule is contained within the Planning Phase, if they truly meant any time during the game, it wouldn't be written in one phase or would be written something like...

" A player may look at his own facedown maneuver dials at any time prior to be revealed during the Movement Phase."

Since it isn't in the general rules and doesn't have a stipulation as I've written, it must mean during the Planning Phase only.

[Aminar 1,949]

Yes, rules specific to a section would be contained in that section, whereas a rule that is meant to be used throughout would be in a general section. This rule is contained within the Planning Phase, if they truly meant any time during the game, it wouldn't be written in one phase or would be written something like...

" A player may look at his own facedown maneuver dials at any time prior to be revealed during the Movement Phase."

Since it isn't in the general rules and doesn't have a stipulation as I've written, it must mean during the Planning Phase only.

It says at any time without any other qualifier. That means it covers the whole game. You're 100% wrong. There is nothign saying the rules only apply during that phase. Corran Horn doesn't say, He may attack as though it were the combat phase at the start of the end phase. He just says he can attack during the end phase, and there are certainly no rules about attacking outside of the combat phase section. Players can 100% look at their dials any time at all.

[Parravon 5,217]

I think some of you are reading too much into this. Only in the Planning Phase? Really? A player can check any time. It's as simple as that.

[Vallador 2]

They're trolling.  Stahp.

[Rinehart 684]

I read the rules that you can look at your dials whenever you want.  But, Plainsman's interpretation isn't without merit.  He makes a good point about the rule section that the "look at your dials whenever you want" is located in the Planning section.  And second, when you flip over your dial to look at it, it could be interpreted as activating a ship during the activation phase, even if you are just looking at it yourself.

 

Like I said I read it that you can look at your dials whenever you want, and I really hope FFG wrote the rules mean that as well.  But let's not dismiss Plainsman's interpretation, I can see his point.  Clarification from FFG would be helpful and confirming.

[Plainsman 1,002]

I read the rules that you can look at your dials whenever you want. But, Plainsman's interpretation isn't without merit. He makes a good point about the rule section that the "look at your dials whenever you want" is located in the Planning section. And second, when you flip over your dial to look at it, it could be interpreted as activating a ship during the activation phase, even if you are just looking at it yourself.

Like I said I read it that you can look at your dials whenever you want, and I really hope FFG wrote the rules mean that as well. But let's not dismiss Plainsman's interpretation, I can see his point. Clarification from FFG would be helpful and confirming.

Exactly! So how do we get an official word from FFG?

The intent is extremely important with rules and the location of a specific rule within the rules helps one understand the author's intent.

My wargaming group has dissected dozens of rulesets over the years and this rule's intent is definitely in question!

Edited July 12, 2014 by Plainsman

[Vallador 2]

Yes, rules specific to a section would be contained in that section, whereas a rule that is meant to be used throughout would be in a general section. 

Where is this "general section" of the rules?  What other rules are phrased to appear to apply at any time, but only apply during a certain phase?  I'm not finding your alleged precedents.  

[DarthJalapeno 32]

It is on the page for the Planning Phase! In most rules that would literally mean any time during that phase only, not any time...

Is there an official clarification on that somewhere?

 

Aye, the rule being stated under the Planning Phase section is the reason I started this thread.

 

Is the ruling only valid during the Planning Phase or is it a general rule that is applicable during the activation phase?

It really isn't a question during the last two phases since all the dials are already revealed.

Edited July 12, 2014 by DarthJalapeno

[Forgottenlore 9,838]

It's stated in the planning phase because that is the first point when the use of the maneuver dial is explained. You will note that the rules are laid out sequentially, setup, planning, activation and so on. A given rule is presented the first time it becomes relevant in that sequence, but there is nothing in the entire book to suggest rules only apply in the sections they are first presented.

The definitions of the various bearings are also given in the planning phase. Does that mean those definitions only apply during the planning phase?

The rulebook says a player may look at his face down dials "at any time". Full stop. Not "at any time during the phase" which is how it would be phrased if it were meant to be limited. If you have a face down dial, you can look at it. Doesn't matter when.

[StephenEsven 632]

You are reading the sentence out of context. You can't just read the sentence alone.

The context is tgat you are putting dials face down next to your shios during the planning phase, and you can look at your own dials while planning.

Once yoy enter the Activation phase yiu follow the sequence fir activating ships in a specific order. For ships with the same PS initiative decides who goes first and rhe iwning player then activates his shios one at a time. He can't look at the dials, he can only activate a ship.

[OuterRimJob 38]

Three words... 'AT ANY TIME'

[Rinehart 684]

I think the point of all this is that there are two reasonable interpretations. I'd hate to be at a tournament, and believe that I can look at my maneuver dials, only to have the TO agree with my opponent that I cannot. Then be forced to have to deal with a ruling that I've activated my ship out if turn, and whatever penalty I'm assessed.

I do think the majority of the players believe that we can check our own dials a whenever and as often as we please, and I hope that is the correct ruling. I just think it would avoid bickering with your opponents over technicalities, which this game does a really excellent job of. This game's rules are simple and don't let the rules lawyers yell gotcha all the time, I hope it stays that way.

FFG, a 1 sentence statement in the next FAQ would be helpful and could prevent a confusing and argumentative situation in the future.

PS, please rule that we can look whenever.

[StephenEsven 632]

Three words... 'AT ANY TIME'

DURING THE PLANNING PHASE!

[StephenEsven 632]

Not being able to look at dials during the Activation phase also ensures that you do not get accused of fiddeling/changing the dial after the planning phase is over.

Edited July 12, 2014 by StephenEsven

[Sideslip 457]

 

Three words... 'AT ANY TIME'

DURING THE PLANNING PHASE!

 

 

These words are not in the rule book. Do not add words to the rule book.