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Metawise, what is the best and worst ship from Set IV

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Viewed in light of the meta (e.g. Regional Results, local tournament results), what do you say is the best and worst ship from Set IV?  I define best and worst ships based on utility - a ship that is used more often is better than one that is used less.

 

My take:

Best: TIE Phantom (used in many lists)

Worst: TIE Defender

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Best: Z-95

Call me mad, but I think the Phantom will die off slightly after people begin to adjust and bring varying levels of hate for it. Especially when Wave 5 hits and people start throwing Rebel Captive Decimators around. The Z-95, meanwhile, will continue to be an awesome little filler, an awesome little missile carrier, and an awesome little action provider long into the future.

 

Worst: TIE Defender

Though I'm calling i the worst, I don't think the Defender is bad per se. My experiments so far haven't been disastrous, but neither have they been spectacular. The basic models have applications, but the named pilots are a bit awkward. Vessery needs a more capable cheap-ish TL provider than what the Empire currently offers (note to FFG: the ZG-1 would be just the ticket here), while Rexler needs a way to get extra Focus tokens. Once those things arrive, though, they will be two very nasty pilots.

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Best: TIE Phantom

Worst: TIE Phantom

 

The TIE Phantom is a game changer.  Having played with and against it a few times, I've found that when played right it will dominate almost any list by it's sheer ability to stay out of arc whilst doing large amounts of damage.  As a result I suspect that people will start bringing some of the hard counters that stop the Phantom from doing this.  Once enough people start bringing lists that include anti Phantom deterrents, the Phantom will cease to be competitive and instead become a liability due to its high point cost.  As a result it earns the honour of being both the best and the worst ship around, it just happens to depend on whether your local meta has caught up to the fact.

 

Note: I fully expect that Wave V will see a huge drop in Phantom popularity as Decimators with Rebel Captive and YT-2400's with turreted HLC's become a more common sight.

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Worst: TIE Defender

Though I'm calling i the worst, I don't think the Defender is bad per se. My experiments so far haven't been disastrous, but neither have they been spectacular. The basic models have applications, but the named pilots are a bit awkward. Vessery needs a more capable cheap-ish TL provider than what the Empire currently offers (note to FFG: the ZG-1 would be just the ticket here), while Rexler needs a way to get extra Focus tokens. Once those things arrive, though, they will be two very nasty pilots.

 

Next time, try an academy TIE with the Target Lock upgrade.

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Next time, try an academy TIE with the Target Lock upgrade.

 

I've thought about it, but you only get 3 or 4 of them (depending on what you do with Vessery) and they're not going to do a whole lot on their own. Especially against the Navigating Falcons you keep playing.  :P

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Best: Z95

The Z95 swarm is giving our local meta a huge headache currently, especially when paired up with a falcon since they cover each other's weakness directly. The named pilots also have a lot of application, and has already proven themselves with some really sick combos. Things like Airen + Swarm and stick him in a bunch of Bwings/Ewings, have the B/E attack and do a barrel roll, sort of like a fake Turr

Phantoms were exceptionally strong when first revealed, but after much playtime, you pretty much realize that 4 agi dice is nothing, and they can be taken out with specific ghostbusting equipment, namely higher PS, ion weapons and turret weapons. HLC does help against them too.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Worst: TIE Defender

Too expensive for what they do, 6 hp protected by 3agi is extremely bipolar when it comes to "ability to tank", sometimes it dies in 2 shots, other times it flat out refuses to die. Lack of natural evade and boost actions also severely hamper its capabilities, and its main strength, the K4, is easily blocked and exploited since it is so predictable. The named pilots both suffer from problems, Vessery is unable to tap into his talent due to the lack of easy ways for the Imperial to get TLs on a cost efficient level, and Rexler really needs a 2nd focus token somehow, which is currently impossible to do on the Imperial side. All in all, you are sinking 30++ points into a single 3atk dice attack, that most likely would miss because you need to use your TIE Defender's focus token to stay alive.

I'm not saying avoid this like the plague. The Defender is really pretty good, being able to outclass nearly every other small ship with its white K4 and amazing stats. The problem is that you are really throwing out 30-40 points against his 1 ship that costs somewhere at the 21-25 point level, so if you dont win there's really something wrong. At full 100pts, I highly doubt 3 Defenders can fight off something along the lines of say 3 X 3 Z95s

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Best: Phantom

Though many people think the ship will "Fade Out" or people will start using there "Counters" but recentely I Used a 100 list with both Whisperer and Echo (Both with VI) at a small tournament (7 people) and was able to win. First game I Played against Wedge with VI and Jan with Ion Cannon Turret. I lost the the incitive roll so the firing was Wedge then Whsiperer then Jan then Echo. Not what i was hoping to play against with ACD on my phantoms, but I Ended up winning. The next I played against a list with Horton with VI and proton Torpedoes and ion cannon turret (with biggs to protect him), I won that game too. The final game was a list with only Han and Wedge (Beefed up quite a bit) and even though it was close (Until I blocked his ship a little so 5 hull Han fell off the board) I was able to win that game too. Of course I had some good luck in my games, but i also had Echo 2 shotted. But i shared this to tell people that the "Counters" are very helpful, but don't make them useless.

 

Worst: Defender

Not much to say on this one, the price is just too high for what your going to get. There very effective with HLC but that's at lowest 37 points (the same as Whisperer with VI and ACD).

 

 

That's just my two creds though.

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The guys have already kind of covered what I would say. Cool.

 

The E-Wings and TIE Phantom do their own stuff too but most of that was already in the game.

Sure the Phantom is cool and has cloak, but in my view it is really just an improved Interceptor.

The E-Wing is a souped up A-Wing more or less, with some cool extras, but it is not going to improve the entire game.

 

The Z-95 and the TIE Defender are the best game changing ships IMO.

:)

 

Rebels always had to deal with being outnumbered, and now they don't.

 

Imperials always had weaker ships, and now they have a monster.

 

Wave Four is all cool.

:D

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I'm a little torn on which I think is the best.  It is a TIE between the Phantom and Z-95.

 

On the one hand, the Phantom adds a new level to the destructive capability of a named trio (Echo, Fel, and Turr).  On the other hand, the Z-95 is an amazing Rebel Missile Swarm and can pack the firepower to take TIE swarms apart (Assault missiles out the afterburner).

 

The worse would have to be the Defender.  Sure, it's a cool little ship and I loved playing it in the video games, but the stats make it far overpriced.  Rexler has a great skill, but with that cost you should be getting a free wingman.  When the lowest level pilot is higher than all other named pilots (except for the named Phantoms and all Firespray’s), you know there is a problem.

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Firespray is the best wave IV ship for me, since after seeing the defender, I bought a 2nd Firespray.

 

Yeah the Defender is pointed high, and you can just go with another Firespray.

I still think that if we are using an imperial navy list, then you go Defenders for a cool heavy hitter.

:)

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Best: TIE Defender

 

More well-rounded than the Phantom and with some good upgrades to sustain it. It's pricey, but solid. My Defenders have only disappointed me when I've lost the skill advantage to other pilots. Overall 3 all the way down and some great attack options make this a well-needed fighter for the Empire that doesn't live and die by a complicated, risky mechanic. Engine upgrade brings out the best in this fighter.

 

Worst: Z-95

 

They might be cheap guns for the rebellion but they die like popcorn in a microwave when the enemy shoots at them. Blount is a good hard counter for large ships and swarms but seems very niche. Cracken at least has some utility after he's fired off his cluster missiles (because why would it be anything else?) Then he becomes a retainer to your ace with wingman. This ship is never going to make or break a list on its own apart from flying in swarms. And if that's the criteria which you judge fighters, then the TIE Fighter is still the best fighter in the game for it's higher agility and much, much better mobility and evasion.

 

If you're on the other end of a B-Wing or Firespray, each with heavy laser cannons, which one of these two ships above is likely to survive longer?

 

Judgement is still out on the E-wing because I haven't brought it to the table much, and I don't see other people commenting on it alot. 3/3/2/3 Barrel roll droid system cannon would make this an interesting ship but I've strangely never been motivated to fly it. My Z-95s have seen more action than the E-Wing.

 

And I'd still judge that the TIE Phantom is a tricky tool. Where it is on the best-worst track really depends on the skill of the one using it.

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Firespray is the best wave IV ship for me, since after seeing the defender, I bought a 2nd Firespray.

 

Yeah the Defender is pointed high, and you can just go with another Firespray.

I still think that if we are using an imperial navy list, then you go Defenders for a cool heavy hitter.

:)

 

 

 

Since Firesprays are Mercenaries, you can repaint them any color you want and not worry about them matching.  They let you get really creative with the large surface areas.

 

Or You could paint them up in the Standard

imperial gray/blue with loyal insignias and markings.  Evidence of either a long-term contract or the onorthodox elements of an Imperial fleet on campaign that replenishes its losses with whatever ships are available for purchase/requisition.

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Firespray is the best wave IV ship for me, since after seeing the defender, I bought a 2nd Firespray.

 

Yeah the Defender is pointed high, and you can just go with another Firespray.

I still think that if we are using an imperial navy list, then you go Defenders for a cool heavy hitter.

:)

 

 

 

Since Firesprays are Mercenaries, you can repaint them any color you want and not worry about them matching.  They let you get really creative with the large surface areas.

 

Or You could paint them up in the Standard

imperial gray/blue with loyal insignias and markings.  Evidence of either a long-term contract or the onorthodox elements of an Imperial fleet on campaign that replenishes its losses with whatever ships are available for purchase/requisition.

 

 

I agree. In fact it would be cool to see an Imperial version of this wonderful ship.

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I had two Es out for a test flight yesterday and they totally suited my playing style! First list: Ethan with ptl, advanced sensors and R2, 1 knave and 2 prototype pilots. This much mobility coupled with the fact that three out of four pilots had the same PS meant that I could maneuvre easily inside the asteroid field. Ethan's abilty really came through in this list when I got through my opponent's shields.

In my second battle I used Ethan with ptl, advanced sensors, R5-P9, stealth device and flechette torpedoes, coupled with Corran Horn with ptl, advanced sensors, R2-D2, stealth device and advanced proton torpedoes. I was able to stay alive and regenerate every shield I lost, but lacking the variation of green maneuvers that a vanilla R2 gives you really hampered my options when stressed from pushing the limit. In addition, Ethan's ability was of less use when I had only one additional ship.

To sum up: if you're like me and like flying 3-4 highly maneuvrable ships which have a certain degree of synergy without being totally dependent on it - E-wing might do the job.

Edited by riksawesome

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I ran a list with Echo with Stygium Particle Accelerator and Whisper with Advanced Cloaking Device.  Filled up the rest with a Lambda with Engine Upgrade and Advanced Sensors.

 

Echo died very early because I collided with Whisper and never got the chance to cloak.  He just started way out of position and I spent 3 turns keeping him out of crosshairs, finally to turn around at the right time, but I chose a maneuver that was too short and he ate all of Wedge's attacks.

 

Then Whisper decloaks, just barely skimming past some asteroids, to go full 4 forward, get Wedge into range 1, and roll a hit on all attack dice.  Wedge whiffed his defense roll and my Bro just then noticed that Phantoms at range 1 get 5 attack dice.  Felt really good to finally have an Imperial ship one-shot an X-wing.

 

The z-95 and E-wing kept taking chunks out of the Shuttle, but Whisper used space magic to always be just outside of a target lock for the rest of the game.  I did a lot of barrel rolling, but when you are rolling unmodified dice, it helps if you roll 5 of them.

 

The whole game I never once remembered to get a Focus token after scoring damage, but I never took a single shot to my last Phantom.

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a ship that is used more often is better than one that is used less.

 

I disagree. How much a ship is used in tournaments is usually based off people copying each other. A ship may be very good against some ships and squadrons but not against others. If the ones it is good against is what the sheep herd is currently flying then it will appear better.

Take the phantom. There are cries of overpowered right now because it's tearing up TIE swarms and XXBB squads. If the herd is flying turrets and high pilot skilled ships, it suddenly loses its appeal.

 

Given the much more rockpaperscissors meta FFG's created with W4, the herd's in for a beating no matter what it does. Yeah, you see XXBB, TIE swarms and HSF in the top 16 frequently, but how many copycat lists didn't? Make a solid, versatile squadron and learn to fly it. Copying the herd is probably going to end up with being hard countered by someone who didn't.

Edited by Lagomorphia

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Make a solid, versatile squadron and learn to fly it. Copying the herd is probably going to end up with being hard countered by someone who didn't.

 

 

That is why I am going to keep making list that have ships I love and the heck with what is popular. The exception being the disaster that is our glorious Lord Vader in a capitalistic TIE Advanced.

:)

 

I do not care about ever playing in tournaments at all.

:P

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Best Ship: E-Wing

Runner-Up: TIE Defender

Worst Ship: Z95 Headhunter

 

I know a few will be disagreeing on my assesment; Rebel players in my group sure are.

 

However I see that from an Imperial perspective the E-Wing is most dangerous new addition and the one most likely to stay the longest; it is an expensive ship but since it comes with both system and astromech slots (two slots of which we are sure to see more) it can be put in a good variety of roles to supplement other combatants. The catch of course is that every new system or droid also keeps the X- or B-Wing in the meta, which are cheaper to have. I'd be remiss not to mention that E'Than is also right up there with rest of the Rebel force multipliers, maybe the best yet.

 

Cheap Defenders with Ion Cannons are surely here to stay too; they are good flankers (good speed, good maneuvers, good durability) and lend the Imperials another option to control enemy squads without the problems of the Ion Shuttle or the Ion Spray have being big ships. More expensive Defenders can also work in specialized lists (e.g. Vessery with Bombers) but if those will be good as against all-comers opitions we will just have to see.

 

The Phantom has some openings that can easily exploited with enough practice and readily avalible tools; turrets and blockers are sure to minimize the Phantom threat, so is Action Denial via Stress. And since the Cloak-token is neither focus nor evade Opportunist will have its time to shine. Echo might mittigate some of it (esspeically the blockers) but it is still one ship with lowest durability of all Imperial craft.

 

The Z-95 however will leave no lasting marks except perhaps for Cracken; the need for cheap assault missile carrier will go away as soon as Imperial players adjust their list and move away from formation flying (the tools are already there; the TIE swarm will surive but it will be transformed) - and as for the Z-95 Swarm, I'm not so sure the Z-95 will be as effective as swarmer as the TIE Fighter is, it's action bar is more limited (even the "Holy Church of Focus" cannot deny that Barrel Roll and Evade have been integral to the T/F's success) as is it's choice of pilots. Another thing that is sure to bury the Z-95 long-term is the upcoming refit to the A-Wing which will get a faster, more maneuverable ship with better actions (and only rebel option for generic EPTs) back on the scene.

Edited by 0rph3u5

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Best Z-95. As people have said, and I've been saying since the beginning, the Phantom is too easy to counterbuild against. I don't understand the people who complain Z's die quick. X-wings die just as fast for 9 points more. If 4 X-Wings is competitive, and it is, along with bunches of the very fragile tie fighter, how does that make Z-95s too fragile. As far as I can tell they're as tough for the points as most anything in the game.

Worst. I'm betting it will be the generic E-Wings and Defenders. Etahn is amazing,and so is Rexler(Who is far more efficiently priced than the named Firesprays)

Edited by Aminar

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OK, let's get one thing straight here "best" and "worst" really are subjective terms in this game, and what's amazing in one game will quickly become a liability in the next.  All four ships have a great deal of potential, and all four have a niche.  So rather than talk in non-existent absolutes, I'm going to suggest an alternative approach to the discussion:

 

Which ship is the MOST useful, and which ship is the LEAST useful, in any given scenario, at any given time.

 

The winner would, of course, be the humble Z-95.  It may not have the tricks the rest of it's Wave 4 brethren can offer, but as the lowest-point Rebel ship in the game it can fill a gap in a lot of lists, and it's ability to carry missiles makes it a flexible little beastie as well.

 

The least useful?  Probably the E-Wing.  The Phantom and Defender both boast powerful stat lines and built-in mechanics that make their points value worthwhile, while the E-Wing almost requires further expenditure to fulfil it's potential.  this is further compounded by the fact that the Imperials have enough options and low-priced ships to be able to field a Phantom or Defender effectively in a range of formations, while taking a tricked-out E-Wing can often limit you to a three ship build.  Or it would, if it wasn't for those lovely Z-95's!

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Best: Z-95

Worst: Unnamed other wave 4 ships

 

Z-95 fills so many rolls with its points costs and pilot skills and I can see them all being run to fill different needs in lists. Cracken is the best named pilot with his support potential compared to his cost; for less than a rookie x-wing you get some of the best force multiplication going.

 

The flip side is while all the other wave 4 ships have strong role-playing named pilots that cover their points well when used correctly or properly supported the generic ships are just underwhelming or over costed for their points and every time I want to use one, the named pilot or another ship would be the superior choice in my opinion.

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