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Kenix

Rebel Answer to Firesprays

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Im heading to a tournament this weekend at a new local store that just opened up. Ive talked to many of the other players that will be in the tournament and know that there will be an abundance of 1, 2, and even 3 firespray lists. I normally play imps but since it seems that imps will be heavily represented i was thinking of trying my hand with the rebels.  

 

However, I have no idea what rebel lists are strong, especially in a firespray dominated meta.  Any advice on what to take and/or how to fly would be greatly appreciated.  

 

I have at least 1 of every rebel ship and 2-3 of the more popular ones.

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2 rookie X wings

2 Blue Squads with HLC

 

It's 26 hit points and 14 attack dice. If you focus on a ship you typically killed it and a B-wing's barrel roll is an excellent tool to keep you out of a firespray's firing arc.

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Hit it on the side. Their arc is huge but so is the base, giving you more of a target. And jammers on either a B or shuttle will negate Krasis' rerolls if he's packing secondary weapons.

Edited by Nickotine42

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Make them fly through the asteroids early and often. Start catty-corner if able, and don't be the first one to turn.

Edited by WonderWAAAGH
Hrathen likes this

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If you dealing with a lot of PS 3 Bounty hunters then playing a squad that's PS 4 or higher will be great for you.  Here's a squad that I ran recently and it did very well for me.

 

Biggs

Dagger

Red 

Tarn + R2-D6 + Opportunist 

 

Hits very hard and most of your ships will shoot before the PS 3 bounty hunter.

 

Another option is 

 

Garvin

Biggs

Chewbacca + EH + Gunner

 

All your ships will shoot first.  Chewie late game is tough to deal with and Biggs with Double focus is a lot harder to take down.  Chewie will also help against interceptor squads or squads that focus on arc dodging. 

 

I've played a lot of 2 and 3 firespray builds and one it's draw backs is that it can be hard to focus fire on a target after the first couple of exchanges.  Keep this in mind and you will do well against them.

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Thanks for all the feedback, its been most helpful. My original plan was to do something like mrfroggies suggested with the chewie and 2 xwings. It seems that Bwings are preferred though,

 

How important is it to run HLC on Bwings vs firesprays? 

 

Also, what about 2 bwings with adv sensors with a falcon? (probably chewie)

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Bwing + FCS murders Firesprays.

At Imdaar weekend i was playing with 2 Bounty Hunters and was matched against 4 bwings with fcs twice. It felt like there was nothing i could do. The repeated focus+TL shots was killer.

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Bwing + FCS murders Firesprays.

At Imdaar weekend i was playing with 2 Bounty Hunters and was matched against 4 bwings with fcs twice. It felt like there was nothing i could do. The repeated focus+TL shots was killer.

 

Did you have HLC on both your firesprays?

 

Even if you did, 4 b-wings is a lot of hp on the board to try to burn through

Edited by Kenix

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Bwing + FCS murders Firesprays.

At Imdaar weekend i was playing with 2 Bounty Hunters and was matched against 4 bwings with fcs twice. It felt like there was nothing i could do. The repeated focus+TL shots was killer.

B-Wings + FCS is fantastic against Big ships

 

Here's another option for you

 

Biggs

x2 Dagger + FCS

Red Squadron or Tarn

 

4 ship rebel builds will do well for you.

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Fcs are fantastic in general. I tend to leave hlc at home because it's quite costly and tends to limit you to a 3x ship build. And froggies is right. If your going against generic bh then your bid at ps 4 is well worth it.

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So far I haven't had much trouble with firesprays actually. I think a big thing is asteroid placement. If you put asteroids as close together as possible it really makes life hard for firesprays, especially multiples of them flying in formation.

 

Blocking their moves is relatively effective, though sometimes it just means they fire out the back at something else. Costing them their actions is always good news though.

 

It's generally just a question of throwing a lot of red dice at one until it stops working, then repeating on the next one. It helps to keep your own ships fairly close together to do this, and this also makes life a bit tricky for the firesprays as their size means they will get in each other's way.

 

If they have to make 90 degree turns to avoid flying off then you get to be in their side arc, which is a good place to be.

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To second (third, etc.) a couple of other suggestions:

(1) From a list-building standpoint, the biggest weakness of the Firespray is that it's tough on offense and defense, but it comes with a price tag to match. Accordingly, Firespray lists tend to have just 2-4 ships, or 2-5 if it's a Firespray with a mini-swarm. And a list with a few powerful guns is best opposed by a list that relies on hit points rather than evasion to survive--and that means B-wings are nearly ideal.

(2) FCS is a powerful weapon against a ship that requires multiple rounds of concentrated fire from multiple ships to bring down.

(3) When you go to place asteroids, use them to (a) force your opponent's Firespray(s) into a particular lane, and then (b) attack them from the flank.

DraconPyrothayan and LeoHowler like this

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To second (third, etc.) a couple of other suggestions:

(1) From a list-building standpoint, the biggest weakness of the Firespray is that it's tough on offense and defense, but it comes with a price tag to match. Accordingly, Firespray lists tend to have just 2-4 ships, or 2-5 if it's a Firespray with a mini-swarm. And a list with a few powerful guns is best opposed by a list that relies on hit points rather than evasion to survive--and that means B-wings are nearly ideal.

(2) FCS is a powerful weapon against a ship that requires multiple rounds of concentrated fire from multiple ships to bring down.

(3) When you go to place asteroids, use them to (a) force your opponent's Firespray(s) into a particular lane, and then (b) attack them from the flank.

Good advice all around.

 

 

The Firespray-31 boasts an incredible upgrade-suite, alongside extreme offense, and pairs them with a survivability unmatched in a 100 point scenario.

It's also damned expensive.

 

The HWK, Z-95, X-Wing, and Bomber are all in it's Agility-Die Weightclass. Of these, the Firespray has the best offensive options by far (2 arcs of 3 attack, + Bombs, + One of each secondary weapon type except Turrets, potentially), and is also the only one with the Evade action.

Ignoring all of that, though, we can now do a straight HP/Point ratio for these ships. I am counting the HWK as 23 points, as it requires Turret + Crew to be useful.

HWK :: 4.6 points per HP

X :: 4.2 points per HP

Firespray :: 3.3333 points per HP.

Z95 :: 3 points per HP

{-oO-}:: 2.6666 points per HP

 

So, for Points per HP in the 2-Agility class, the Firespray is actually the Median!

However, for 33+ points, even its great offense in a vacuum suffers.

It's danged tough to fit one in a fleet of 4 ships, wherein all 4 have 3+ Attack Dice, and 3 ships have a difficult time getting the DPR needed to trade better than 1 for 1.

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Wes Jansen with Veteran Instincts

Wedge with an R2, Advanced Torpedo and Opportunist

 

1: Target lock then fire lasers

2: Get to Range 1, focus, and enjoy the fireworks.

Edited by Sanchez

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Wes Jansen with Veteran Instincts

Wedge with an R2, Advanced Torpedo and Opportunist

 

1: Target lock then fire lasers

2: Get to Range 1, focus, and enjoy the fireworks.

Considering the overall beefiness of the Firespray(s) and the fact that you telegraph your attack in a rather obvious way with Wedge's Range 1 torpedo this puts him at a position where he'd likely be lead to crash and lose his action, and maybe his attack on said Firespray.

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Wes Jansen with Veteran Instincts

Wedge with an R2, Advanced Torpedo and Opportunist

 

1: Target lock then fire lasers

2: Get to Range 1, focus, and enjoy the fireworks.

Considering the overall beefiness of the Firespray(s) and the fact that you telegraph your attack in a rather obvious way with Wedge's Range 1 torpedo this puts him at a position where he'd likely be lead to crash and lose his action, and maybe his attack on said Firespray.

 

I've gotten it off.  Also I lead with an ion Ywing so the first thing the Firespray would crash into is him, Wes flies just behind. I'm going to keep playing that list because it's fun.

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To second (third, etc.) a couple of other suggestions:

(1) From a list-building standpoint, the biggest weakness of the Firespray is that it's tough on offense and defense, but it comes with a price tag to match. Accordingly, Firespray lists tend to have just 2-4 ships, or 2-5 if it's a Firespray with a mini-swarm. And a list with a few powerful guns is best opposed by a list that relies on hit points rather than evasion to survive--and that means B-wings are nearly ideal.

(2) FCS is a powerful weapon against a ship that requires multiple rounds of concentrated fire from multiple ships to bring down.

(3) When you go to place asteroids, use them to (a) force your opponent's Firespray(s) into a particular lane, and then (b) attack them from the flank.

Good advice all around.

 

 

The Firespray-31 boasts an incredible upgrade-suite, alongside extreme offense, and pairs them with a survivability unmatched in a 100 point scenario.

It's also damned expensive.

 

The HWK, Z-95, X-Wing, and Bomber are all in it's Agility-Die Weightclass. Of these, the Firespray has the best offensive options by far (2 arcs of 3 attack, + Bombs, + One of each secondary weapon type except Turrets, potentially), and is also the only one with the Evade action.

Ignoring all of that, though, we can now do a straight HP/Point ratio for these ships. I am counting the HWK as 23 points, as it requires Turret + Crew to be useful.

HWK :: 4.6 points per HP

X :: 4.2 points per HP

Firespray :: 3.3333 points per HP.

Z95 :: 3 points per HP

{-oO-}:: 2.6666 points per HP

 

So, for Points per HP in the 2-Agility class, the Firespray is actually the Median!

However, for 33+ points, even its great offense in a vacuum suffers.

It's danged tough to fit one in a fleet of 4 ships, wherein all 4 have 3+ Attack Dice, and 3 ships have a difficult time getting the DPR needed to trade better than 1 for 1.

I'd put the Hawk at 21, as it doesn't NEED crew to work.

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To second (third, etc.) a couple of other suggestions:

(1) From a list-building standpoint, the biggest weakness of the Firespray is that it's tough on offense and defense, but it comes with a price tag to match. Accordingly, Firespray lists tend to have just 2-4 ships, or 2-5 if it's a Firespray with a mini-swarm. And a list with a few powerful guns is best opposed by a list that relies on hit points rather than evasion to survive--and that means B-wings are nearly ideal.

(2) FCS is a powerful weapon against a ship that requires multiple rounds of concentrated fire from multiple ships to bring down.

(3) When you go to place asteroids, use them to (a) force your opponent's Firespray(s) into a particular lane, and then (b) attack them from the flank.

Good advice all around.

 

 

The Firespray-31 boasts an incredible upgrade-suite, alongside extreme offense, and pairs them with a survivability unmatched in a 100 point scenario.

It's also damned expensive.

 

The HWK, Z-95, X-Wing, and Bomber are all in it's Agility-Die Weightclass. Of these, the Firespray has the best offensive options by far (2 arcs of 3 attack, + Bombs, + One of each secondary weapon type except Turrets, potentially), and is also the only one with the Evade action.

Ignoring all of that, though, we can now do a straight HP/Point ratio for these ships. I am counting the HWK as 23 points, as it requires Turret + Crew to be useful.

HWK :: 4.6 points per HP

X :: 4.2 points per HP

Firespray :: 3.3333 points per HP.

Z95 :: 3 points per HP

{-oO-}:: 2.6666 points per HP

 

So, for Points per HP in the 2-Agility class, the Firespray is actually the Median!

However, for 33+ points, even its great offense in a vacuum suffers.

It's danged tough to fit one in a fleet of 4 ships, wherein all 4 have 3+ Attack Dice, and 3 ships have a difficult time getting the DPR needed to trade better than 1 for 1.

 

 

You guys are all smoking crack if you think its hard to fit Firesprays into lists with lots of bodies.

 

1 Firespray fits in with 5 PS3 tie fighters just fine.

1 Firespray with HLC with 5 PS1 Ties is also a thing. 

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Ewing + engine upgrade + PTL if you have. Simply use them like TIEints and dance around the firing arcs

Might want to put an r2 on their to get more green moves, trust me it comes in handy

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Fire spray is a heavily shielded ship. The answer to all heavy shielded ships is well lots of attack dice. X-Wings, B-Wings and E-Wings should be a good solution. 3 primary attack is your best bet.

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I second the HLC blues+rookies 2 HLCs should be able to strip 4 Shields so the X-wings can punch through the Hull.   ALWAYS shoot HLCs first at a target(general advice) because since they can't crit they are perfect for putting a high volume of dice down to strip shields allowing the X-wings (or if you are Imperials whatever Tie you are escorting your ship with) to be able to land crits if you roll any.

 

Side rant: I think that you should still deal flipped up damage cards when dealing crits (even if they would just hit shields) and then discard them when you discard your shield token (no change from current rules), but for direct hits you discard 2 shield tokens to cancel the card to represent hitting a vulnerable area in the shield such as one near the engines, (this would only be the real change from current rules)

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The problem with the HLC BBXX list is that it's all PS 2 and shoots after the PS 3+ Firesprays. You'll very frequently have situations where your damaged ship and a damaged Firespray are in arc of each other, but the Firespray kills your ship before it can fire. At PS 4+ you reverse the situation and start finishing of damaged Firesprays before they can shoot, which makes a huge difference in how much damage you're taking.

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Perhaps this is just me not getting it but in a Firespray heavy meta wouldn't an ORS be handy to bottle up the middle? Add some snipeie bwings and dinner is served.

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