Manufactorum

[Notch 1]

Hi guys, newbie here! This is my first topic, so I apologize in advance if these questions have already been answered.

I wanted to ask you why the Manufactorum is listed as a cruiser component in Battlefleet Koronus. Is it a mistake or is there something I didn't read in that book? Because I can't find a good reason for it.

 

Also, how do you guys play it? I have a brilliant and eccentric Explorator in my group, and I guess he is going to craft a lot of stuff with that. The book says it is possible to manufacture few personal items, but in how much time? Is it reasonable to build lasguns and autoguns for our own troops in a moderate amount of time?
 

Edited May 18, 2014 by Notch

[Fgdsfg 1,017]

Apparently, it's Light Cruisers and Cruisers. Why a Light Cruiser or a Cruiser could have a Manufactorum, but not a Transport, Battlecruiser or Grand Cruiser, I have no idea.

I'd personally run it as "Standard Cruiser or above".

What he can exactly do is entirely up to the GM, but it's described as being a "small" workshop. And it's only Size 1, so it should indeed be rather small (relatively speaking, of course).

I'd say that it entirely depends on how good the Explorator is, what skills he has, how good he can roll, and how many troops we're talking about? A troupe of 10? Easy. 10,000? Lolno.

[Tenebrae 429]

Apparently, it's Light Cruisers and Cruisers. Why a Light Cruiser or a Cruiser could have a Manufactorum, but not a Transport, Battlecruiser or Grand Cruiser, I have no idea.

I'd personally run it as "Standard Cruiser or above".

IIRC, every Grand Cruiser and Battle Cruiser has the rule that says it can use Cruiser Components, so... irrelevant distinction.

[Sebastian Yorke 191]

I also usually open exceptions for Goliath Factory ships and Mass Conveyors.

[Amazing Larry 127]

So as for what the componant should be able to do I would go with the following guidelines:

 

Small Arms and Armor YES

Infantry Equipment MAYBE depends on how wierd it is and whether you have am STC template

Vehicles YES but at a less than amazing rate

Starship Componants No or at least not quickly or efficiently if you're willing to spend a year on it maybe

 

Also keep in mind unless you have this thing built into a dedicated mining/industry ship with the appropriate mining/refining cability you still need to aquire base materials to make the most of this. This is where I really see the benefit of a mass hauler, pile on mining and production capacity, beef it up with defenses and just park it places where it can chug out benefits for you while you do more interesting ****.

[Chaki 15]

So basically, a Goliath with a Mining Facility and Extended Vaults + Arboretum...could churn out tanks pretty much forever.

 

Oh don't mind me, i'm just writing down future endeavours.

[Notch 1]

Thanks for the answers.

Personally, I allowed my players to put it on their frigate because I didn't read "Light Cruisers, Cruisers" like a noob I didnt' find a good reason to not do that. I mean: it's not so big, doesn't require a lot of power and it can be useful for every ship, so why not?
I don't feel I'm unbalancing the game like putting, for example, Spacedock piers on a raider.
Or a Nova Cannon on an Aquila.
That would be nasty.

Mmm...

[Iku Rex 14]

The Manufactorum as written is not very useful.
 
It can only manufacture simple items, in small quantities. "The GM is final arbiter of what can and cannot be manufactured, but generally it should not be more than a few dozen of a Common item."
 
It's main purpose is to make simple parts for starship repairs. And it's more of a "workshop", than a "factory".
 
(OTTOMH fix:

• a +10 bonus to Tech-Use and Trade [Armourer] checks to build and repair items
• a character can build more advanced items if they have the necessary prefabricated components [slightly easier acquisition check than the real thing]
• difficulty and build time depends on availability and craftsmanship.)

[Sebastian Yorke 191]

I have no trouble in letting my player's pump out thousands of lasguns/autoguns/flak armor (whenever they have the material available in the cargo hold) from their Manufactorum, specially since they spend months in travel from system to system and their Dynasty's holds in Calixis are basically composed of trade routes coming an going from their homeworld - an industrialized rocky planet that can barely support human life, and survives on selling small arms and on paying their tributes in small IG regiments (and for this, they received/bought all STCs necessary for basic IG weaponry/equipments).

[Magellan 185]

So basically, a Goliath with a Mining Facility and Extended Vaults + Arboretum...could churn out tanks pretty much forever.

 

Oh don't mind me, i'm just writing down future endeavours.

A Goliath is a transport and cannot have a manufactorum.

[Chaki 15]

Rules, Schmules.

[Annaamarth 186]

I'm with Larry on the dedicated manufacturing/mining ship, but I've mentioned that I favor a combined-arms/fleet-based approach before, do that shouldn't come as a shock.

 

I'm with Yorke on the mass-manufacturing of cheap crap, because it means that the RT can outfit his new conscripts with laslocks.

 

I'm with Chaki re: rules.  It doesn't make sense that a Cruiser can be a manufacturing vessel and a large transport can't.

 

I also like the idea of allowing a bonus to tech-use or trade (armourer), but generally I assume that a manufactory can't produce vehicles, or at least not en masse. Rhinos or Chimera, maybe- Leman Russ Executioners or Land Raiders?  Not so much. Nothing that requires a machine spirit unless you have a very sophisticated Crew Reclamation Facility or Medicae Facility.

[Kasatka 157]

Yeah simple small items, no more than a few dozen Common items at a time screams to me of this being a well kitted out workshop, not a factory or production line. Producing some new charge-packs for the las weapons onboard your ship? No problemo!
Producing dozens of man-portable lascannon to drastically upgun your crew? Warp-damned no!

Allowing players to re-tool the workshop to aid in ship repairs and maintenance and get bonuses on Tech-Use makes sense too.

[Sebastian Yorke 191]

My group wants to set their manufactorum to rebuilding lost small craft (and to assist the Small Craft Repair decks).

 

I am allowing them to pump out 2 Starhawk/Fury/Guncutter each month as far as they also do regular acquisition checks for small components/parts that the manufactorum itself can't produce.

 

(Past Dynasty dealings with the Lathes has granted them the lease of STCs/Magos needed.)

 

Edit: But... In my games this component really stands for a Manufactorum and not just a workshop.

Edited May 22, 2014 by Sebastian Yorke

[Errant Knight 555]

The thing to keep in mind is that some industries are weight/bulk gaining while some are weight/bulk reducing.

 

Metallurgy is a weight/bulk reducing industry.  You start out with a mountain and wind up with a knoll.  What merchant would carry a bunch of ore around in a warp-capable ship, slowly turning that into metal ingots, and further refining those?  It would be far more efficient, and therefore profitable, to set up the smelter near the mines and transport the ingots after you'd rid yourself of all the useless rocks.  In other words, your PF would do better if you carried a manufactorum to the mining site and established a trade route to transport its products to the market that generates the most profit.  Don't waste precious cargo space.

 

Weight/bulk gaining industries locate near their markets.  The most common examples of those are soft drink and glass industries.  Every city and small town has its own soft drink bottling plant.  Water is ubiquitous, but heavy and difficult to transport.  Why pay those fees when you can simply transport the syrup and turn it into its finished product on the spot?  The same goes with glass.  Sand is common enough, even the right types of sand.  I've never driven past an automobile assembly plant that didn't have a glassworks down the road.

 

The question becomes one of, why do you want a factory aboard your ship?  Factories without wheels are cheaper than those with wheels, and those with wings are downright expensive.

[Notch 1]

You're right, but BFK introduced the Manufactorum to aid on-board repairs, rather than to create profit on a large scale. That's why it adds only 10 achievement points: it's supposed to be small and helpful in emergency situations or for personal crafting.

Besides, you are not forced to create mining endeavours to gather raw materials. You could, for example, gather them from starship graveyards or similar sources. Obviously you're not going to mine for profit, but it could be enough to fill some recently made holes in your ship hull.

[Errant Knight 555]

And yet every few months a thread pops up here with someone musing about how cool it would be to manufacture all their armies' needs while en route to the target planet.  And when the GM puts the brakes on that the next question becomes one of scale...well, how much of my armies' needs could this mini-fac produce?

 

I know what the thing is designed for.  It says so in the rules.  And still, people keep wanting to know from other peoples' past experiences if their GM let them exploit that component.

[Notch 1]

Yeah, that's the point of this forum, I guess.

 

By the way, I seriously searched for similar topics but I didn't find a clear answer, so.

[Errant Knight 555]

That's okay, Notch.  We have all run into problems interpreting rules.  We come here to get other peoples' perspectives on them.  We also come here to get peoples' inputs on gaming styles, character and player issues, and just to swap stories.  My opinion is just one other opinion.  If I bother to air my opinion, it's beacuse I happen to believe it in, but that doesn't mean it won't change, and several people here have changed my opinions before.

 

Heck, I recently dredged up a year-old thread because I didn't feel it answered the question I had, and the OP had the same question, so I resurrected it.