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Goknights12

A Real Answer for the Broken Smugglers?

45 posts in this topic

 

I think the biggest issue is Sleuths and Meta... A deck that plays against Meta probably isn't strong against Sleuths and Vice Versa. Smugglers have the two best ways to win, and to build against one, sets you up to lose to the other, unless Scum picks up the pace. I think there are ways to beat it, but overall I think maybe people complained about the LS not being able to win like the DS could. They made cards that have now shifted it to the LS is much stronger IMHO, and really makes you choose between two builds. Sleuths or Meta. Choose your game dominating build.

 

 

Again, my hope is that in the next force packs that changes, but I think the game relies too much on people wanting to change rather than the game allowing the change to happen.

 

 

I think this is close minded. Most decks I've seen that handle free-holders are actually pretty proficient against sleuths. They do have a weakness against mono jedi but they aren't unplayable against them. I think people are reading far too much into the recent regional results as to what can handle mono-smugglers. Why does scum have to pick up the pace to be able to handle both. There are viable navy and sith pods that help counter all the shenanigans as well.

Hida77 and Toqtamish like this

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Scum is a lot better than most people give them credit for. The problem is Sith became ingrained so quickly in everyone's minds as the end all and be all to the DS, right back to the core set only days, that it hampered creativity. 

GroggyGolem, Rogue 4 and 0Zidane0 like this

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Scum is a lot better than most people give them credit for. The problem is Sith became ingrained so quickly in everyone's minds as the end all and be all to the DS, right back to the core set only days, that it hampered creativity. 

 

Yup. And in Navy/Sith people need to look at the lesser used pods.

 

Serve the Emperor gives you two low cost units with a bonus ability. You can use them to empty your hand, or if playing against sleuths they can kill a sleuth with a heat of battle and help you pump up your hand for edge battles. It comes with a 3 icon edge card if you hold something back and a great event for shutting down a free-holder.

 

Lord Vader's command is a similar navy set. Two low cost units for dumping your hand, a bonus ability that can turn off Raise the stakes and some other powerful objectives. They work great against False report as well. The set itself comes with a counter to swindle/let the wookie win/sometimes holding all the cards, and a great edge card. Yeah you have the terrible officer but he's great for emptying your hand when you have the resources and draw him. He helps you chain your hand size to a low number.

 

Both of these sets are not terrible against other decks either. Those probe droids are great free damage in a Navy agro deck. And the weenies help sith control with card advantage versus rebel ships or Jedi.

doctormungmung likes this

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Similar to those sets the under used a Dark Time for the Rebellion and the MTV-7's in it helped my Navy deck out in beating off the Sleuth Scout decks at Halifax Store championships. 

dan.roettgen likes this

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It seems to me that there is a simple solution:

 

Restricted list.

Objectives on the list are:

 

Against All Odds

False Report

 

Neither set is broken by themselves, but in combination (mostly because of Holding all the Cards/Freeholder interaction) they are defining the environment in a negative way.

 

You could make an argument that some combination of Fall/Counsel/Web should also be on the list to break up the Sith shenanigans a bit.  I would say Fall/Counsel mostly since I think that least causes the least impact and forces an interesting choice, but I could also see leaving all three off the list.

 

I agree with what many have said and that that neither deck (Sith or Smuggler) are broken, but the new pods are definately more powerful in combination than many of the alternatives, and I do think that it is negatively impacting the environment and people's perception of the game on the whole..

Buhallin likes this

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I don't agree we need a restricted list. If they didn't restrict Sith last year I see no reason to restrict Smugglers this year. Certainly not with only 2 packs out of 6 out now. 

Edited by Toqtamish
GroggyGolem, Rogue 4 and 0Zidane0 like this

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We're reaching or have already reached the point where no one deck will beat every single other deck. Which is the way it should be. 

 

This. This is the idea of a balanced LCG/TCG. What people don't realize is that in order to make things interesting for a card game, not everything can always be 50/50. 

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We're reaching or have already reached the point where no one deck will beat every single other deck. Which is the way it should be. 

 

This. This is the idea of a balanced LCG/TCG. What people don't realize is that in order to make things interesting for a card game, not everything can always be 50/50. 

 

The issue is not a perfect 50/50, I think most people understand that, but new Smuggler Meta is more like 80/20.

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Talking about a restricted list for SW at this point is just ridiculous, in my opinion. 

Agreed. I don't think it needs to be banned. I guess I would just like to know why they released these cards back-to-back so early in the force cycle, and why continue to beef up Smugglers and not spread the love and level up each affiliation gradually rather than make one much more powerful than the other two.

0Zidane0 likes this

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Talking about a restricted list for SW at this point is just ridiculous, in my opinion. 

Agreed. I don't think it needs to be banned. I guess I would just like to know why they released these cards back-to-back so early in the force cycle, and why continue to beef up Smugglers and not spread the love and level up each affiliation gradually rather than make one much more powerful than the other two.

 

"The Dark Side clouds everything. Impossible to see, the future is."

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We're reaching or have already reached the point where no one deck will beat every single other deck. Which is the way it should be. 

 

This. This is the idea of a balanced LCG/TCG. What people don't realize is that in order to make things interesting for a card game, not everything can always be 50/50. 

 

The issue is not a perfect 50/50, I think most people understand that, but new Smuggler Meta is more like 80/20.

 

Quit playing the same old decks, and you'll see it can be 60/40 in your favor against Smugglers in certain matchups.

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Crix pod x2

Rebel fleet x2

Hit and run

Aldaraans promise

Rogue 3 pod x2

Red 5 pod x2

Try that. Very fast and soon to be even more effective

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Crix pod x2

Rebel fleet x2

Hit and run

Aldaraans promise

Rogue 3 pod x2

Red 5 pod x2

Try that. Very fast and soon to be even more effective

I run that with blue squad instead of Aldaraans promise. It runs really fast. 7 targets of opportunity, with a couple ways to expand that, secret informant or adaptive strategy. Lots of blast damage. Very solid.

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Gave a friend who'd never played before (he'd only seen tutorials on YouTube etc.) a Freeholder deck.

 

He beat everyone at the table in turn 2-5 for 4 games straight, against various decks. (this was before the restricted cards list mind you)

 

Please don't say it wasn't broken then.

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I think this discussion has changed drastically since the restricted list has been released. After the first two rounds of regionals worldwide, the astounding record of the Freeholders coupled with Dash made for a combination that was so good that, as Flip the Force has commented, "there is no reason not to play it." I am fairly certain that if the total number of tournament wins were tallied with them and compared to its tournament losses, there would be no question to this fact.

 

That being said, and to the baseline of the conversation, I love the game right now. There are so many options for decks that it is an exciting place to be. The new sets have inspired an entire crop of successful decks that do not need hard counters to beat but still win often enough to be tournament worthy. The Force struggle has become far more important than just a way to do a single damage or get an extra click of the dial. I believe FFG did it right by making it about resources and unit control; ensuring that players absolutely need to pay attention to it or suffer potential serious consequences.

GroggyGolem and jeeps like this

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