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Buhallin

Flechette Torpedo + Munitions Failsafe

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That was the first thing I thought of when I saw those two upgrades. Why do you think it slipped though testing and wasn't intentional? They are coming out around the same time roughly.

Because the idea of a missile that stresses its target even though it didn't fire is idiotic. Doesn't mean it's not intentional, of course, and I don't think I ever claimed it wasn't intentional. But it's still a very dumb interaction.

And before someone goes down the "Pilot is stressed about because of the lock even if it doesn't fire", explain why they're super-stressed about a Flechette Torpedo but not a Concussion or Homing Missile? Or an Advanced Proton Torpedo?

It makes just as much sense as swords of light, talking teddy bears and moving things with your mind. Lightsabers, ewoks and the force makes sense but not a missile that stresses out a pilot?

Mmmmmmm k..

Edited by Nataris

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I'm actually thinking Hobbie with the stress inducing R3-A2 and Flechette will work nicely together, but it doesn't really strike me as a win-all solution strategy. At all. Sure, two stress tokens on one ship is going to make things bad, but at the same time you also are forced to do a few things that can be worked around:

1, Hobbie needs to shed the stress he creates by either using Target locks, which makes him predictable and potentially ineffective unless aided by another pilot to get more actions.

2. The torpedo is either going to be used up by hitting the target, or you have to use Munitions Failsafe. These are both fine options, but it creates problems of itself in that you're forced to make a hard decision of either throwing the attack (so you can stress again) or attacking in a way you can hit. It's not terrible, but not especially effective.

3. It's going to cost you 30 (or 31 with Munitions Failsafe) points to field a PS5 X-Wing. While there is nothing wrong with this on it's own, it does make you question the use of points and whether it's really the best option.

 

That said, I'm going to try it, and I certainly do plan to have some fun with it.

 

Hobbie will shed the stress by using the target lock to activate the torpedo.  

 

1. Hobbie declares target lock on target.

2. Hobbie declares target of attack.

3. Hobbie declares R3-A2, and both ships receive stress.

4. Hobbie spends target lock to activate torpedo, and the stress is removed from his ship.

 

Then the target receives 2 stress, and with Munitions Failsafe, the torpedo may or may not be usable again.  Hobbie flies away with no penalties.

 

May not use this setup in a 100 point match, but sounds like fun for Furballs.

Edited by Engine25

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I agree with the folks who are saying that this is probably not a winning strategy in tournament settings.

 

That said, I also agree with the folks who are saying that this will be loads of fun to try, so why not give it a go?

 

I fully intend to try it at home playing with my wife and brothers, and I hope it is as funny/annoying as I am envisioning it in my head. 

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FFG is clearly trying to add additional strategy into the meta, which currently consists of, "How can I do the most damage possible as soon as possible?" The current options in the game promote this as the primary and most effective strategy.  The game could continue to go this way, but that shows that while the game is expanding, it is not developing.  Other strategies exist, such as Ion weapons that give you momentary control, but if you do nothing but do Ion damage, you could put yourself at a disadvantage.

 

Stress has, with a few exceptions, been a strategical hindrance that is most often caused by its own player at times when that player deems it necessary or less problematic.  By introducing all of these abilities that more directly manipulate stress and motion, such as

 

-Pilots that can avoid stress entirely

-Upgrades that can remove allied stress

-Pilots that can remove their own stress

-Pilots that turn stress into a benefit instead of a hindrance

-Upgrades and ordnance that cause stress to opponents

-Ordnance that causes ion damage

 

It seems to me that FFG is trying to add another strategic approach to the game.  Perhaps a squad that deals all stress all the time is weaker than one that focuses on damage, but the same can be said for a squad that focuses in Ion damage.  Stress can, at times quite seriously, affect a ship's contextual options and maneuvering possibilities, particularly with multiple stress tokens.  I welcome a change in the meta that more directly emphasizes board control as a viable competitive strategy in addition to firepower superiority.

 

You stress a ship a turn or two, allowing you to get that powerful final shot against it, or stress escort ships, forcing them to focus on clearing their own stress, allowing you to destroy your primary target without bother from the escorts.

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No surprise there. But is constantly stressing and not dealing any damage worth the cost?

 

Agreed,  tricking this out to purposely miss doesn't seem that great to me.  Trading doing damage for assigning a stress token?  I do like the idea that at least you get something if you miss but I'd never try to trick this out.

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Imperials:

Soontir Fel loves stress

The Interceptor dial was meant for stress

stress one tie fighter, there are probably 4 more pointing at you, you want that hit to land

I will say that the Tie Advanc- oh yeah no one runs it

 

This is a combo that isn't bad. But you will loose....a lot if you build the squad completely around it.

 

Minor correction, Interceptors can easily handle stress... as long as it's their stress. Getting stress from external sources tends to hamstring Interceptors as they suddenly find themselves with too much stress to use several critical upgrades that made them competitive (even Fel, he doesn't like not being able to push the limits).

 

Which means the meta might shift to less Interceptors, even more swarms. Not exactly a prospect I'm looking forward to.

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I truley bleive that stress inducing ships will be a big win for a number of reasons.

 

On the tie bomber...

Flechette, miss. Cause 2 stress *after the opponent has already shot

-The big note here is to put these missiles on PS 2 ships, it negates the enemies ability to shed stress via wingman or other abilities

The bomber can then k-turn 5 and be behind the ship it just shot. Assuming the ship has 1 stress left it is unable to K-turn the following round AND you are behind or in a good position to keep firing.

 

The bomber does a forward 2 and the ship again removes a stress. Rinse and repeat but now you are on their tail and can continue to keep the ship stressed while pinging away not getting shot at.

 

I wouldn't want to focus my entire squad on this tactic but having one ship keeping another locked down could easily cut out a good portion of an opponents firepower.

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Here is an ideal squad I would run

 

Schmictar Squadron Pilot

Flechette Missiles

Ion Torpedos

 

Captain Jonnus

Squad Leader

 

BSP w/ Wingman (to keep the Bomber unstressed after a Kturn to follow in pursuit)

 

Bounty Hunter w/ Gunner

 

100 points

 

Bounty Hunter just hunts down the other parts of the squad while the bomber and BSP keep a priority target busy.

-Or-

Use the bounty hunter to destroy set target, rinse and repeat down the line.

 

Jonus can give the BH a second action if needed (like a TL) or help the bomber actually land the Ion torps.

The Ion torps can be good against larger ships heading towards and asteroid field or off the board because of the limited movements due to the stress buildup.

Edited by macar

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- The big note here is to put these missiles on PS 2 ships, it negates the enemies ability to shed stress via wingman or other abilities

Wingman works at the start of the combat phase. So it works before anyone shoots. What exactly is the point regarding low PS and wingman?

 

Stressing Farlander or Ibtisam after they shoot is obviously better than before.

 

Edit:

You might want to stress enemy ships ASAP so they can no longer receive actions from squad leader, Lando, Cracken or their own ability (Phennir).

Edited by dvor

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Three pages of comments and I only saw 2 or 3 people that actually understand how the cards interact.

 

This is almost as bad as the Marksmanship + Cluster Missiles confusion stupidity.

Would you care to elaborate?  Seems a rather broadly insulting statement to throw out without at least trying to explain what you think everyone is doing wrong.

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Three pages of comments and I only saw 2 or 3 people that actually understand how the cards interact.

 

This is almost as bad as the Marksmanship + Cluster Missiles confusion stupidity.

Care to elaborate? What have people been getting wrong.

Basically, Munitions Failsafe allows you too stress a target and potentially keep your torpedo, because it doesn't have to hit for the stress effect to activate. Marksmanship+ cluster lets you turn one focus into a crit  and the rest in to hits on both attacks, because marksmanship isn't spent like a focus token, it maintains through the round. Same reason it works well with gunner.

Edited by Engine25

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Someone over on the Team Covenant boards caught this one, and it seems right.

 

Fire the Flechette Torpedo, miss your target, stress them without losing the torpedo.

 

That's just brilliant.

 

:(

This would work best on Blount with Assault Missiles firing at range three targets.

OR

Firesprays and YT-1300's where you can combine it with gunner so that you can still make a primary weapon attack at a different, preferably closer target.

If(when) the B-Wing gets a crew slot things will get ugly.

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If(when) the B-Wing gets a crew slot things will get ugly.

The minimum cost for a B-wing is 22 points. You're adding on to that:

Flechette Torpedoes - 2 points

Munitions Failsafe - 1 point

Gunner - 5 points

+Crew Upgrade - ? points

That's 8 points plus whatever the cost is to add the crew slot. So your B-wing costs 30+ points, for the same capabilities as a normal B-wing plus the ability to give your target a stress token and then make an unmodified primary attack--at least until you run into something you can't reliably miss with your torpedoes.

I just can't get any combination of excited or worried about combos that include Gunner on a B-wing, when for around the same cost, you can get:

  • Dagger Squadron Pilot + Advanced Sensors + Ion Cannon (30 points; better PS, more maneuverable, and arguably better control)
  • Blue Squadron Pilot + Fire Control System + Heavy Laser Cannon (31 points; much better firepower)
  • Ibtisam + Opportunist (32 points; better PS, much better firepower
Edited by Vorpal Sword

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I agree it's completely meta dependent. In an actual tournament scene, it's quite bad. Not as bad as gunner/autoblaster. If there ever comes a way to make b-wing cheaper or give y-wing crew without losing Torps it could get silly.

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So this game has been put for how long now? And is still extremely well balanced.

Enough with the "sky is falling" nonsense. FFG has proved they know what they are doing. Stop jumping to conclusions..

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The minimum cost for a B-wing is 22 points. You're adding on to that:

Flechette Torpedoes - 2 points

Munitions Failsafe - 1 point

Gunner - 5 points

+Crew Upgrade - ? points

FCS should add well to the above.

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So this game has been put for how long now? And is still extremely well balanced.

Enough with the "sky is falling" nonsense. FFG has proved they know what they are doing. Stop jumping to conclusions..

There's a fair argument to be made that the game as a whole is not actually well balanced.  The majority of pilots are binder fodder.  PS is dramatically overvalued in the cost, and abilities aren't factored in at all (or at least weren't prior to Wave 3).  Several ships are notably underpowered or overpriced, including the A-wing (pre Rebel Aces awesomeness, at least) and TIE Advanced (always and forever, it seems).  Expose costs more than Push the Limit, and the hands-down best unique X-wing pilot (Biggs) is the cheapest of them.  To date, every single major event except one has been won by the same basic build type (TIE Swarm).  Despite the B-wing showing up in the top 3 in count for Championship lists, Ten and Ibby make a combined 1 appearance, so we get Farlander who's two points cheaper than Ten, one PS lower, and has a stunningly good ability.

 

Don't get me wrong - there's enough in balance that the game still has more than enough variety to be enjoyable...  but that doesn't make the game balanced.  If you take a holistic look at the game, balance and costing are an absolute mess.

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