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Maelora

Hero & Monster collections disappointing?

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I know why they are doing them, and it seems a reasonable concept, with the way 1st edition stuff is selling for silly money now.

 

But does anyone else  feel the ones they have chosen are a bit disappointing?

 

(The monsters seem okay, but did we really need more spiders? Aren't two variants enough?)

 

 

The heroes chosen for the first two feel very generic to me.  And the gender balance in Descent 2 has been even, aside from Lair of the Wyrm.  But only one of the 8 Heroes and Monsters expansions is female.  And many of the others seem oddly bland to me. 

 

I'm not so much focusing on the powers, they may play differently, but the characters themselves.

 

Vol I

 

Shiver - okay, this one seems pretty different. Cool concept, but wish it had the dark magic/cryomancy class to go with it really.

 

Elder Mok - again, this one's cool, an old orc shaman, he feels different to the others.

 

Trenloe the Strong -  He seems really generic.  We already have two white, male, human warriors already - do we need a third when there are other combinations we lack?  He doesn't really feel different, if we had to have another how about Nanok, the guy who fights without armour?  I understand the generic white male human fighter is a fantasy staple, but you'd think they'd want to showcase some of the things that make the Runebound world unique? 

 

Laurel - we already have a female elf scout. Okay, we don't have an 'elf bow girl' but I'd sooner see a mage than yet another rogue.  And why is she the token female here?

 

Vol II - wow, no girls at all?

 

Corbin - another male dwarf with a big axe? Yes, I get he's supposed to be the 'tough' dwarf but I'd sooner see a female warrior first.  I get they may not want to do dwarf mages, but some variety would be nice.

 

Jaes the Exile - we already have a male elf mage in Quellen.

 

Gherinn - we already have a male human cleric type. Yes, I get he's supposed to be the 'darker' one, but again, he'll lack the Healer class to showcase that.

 

Lindel - we already have two elf scouts.  Classic, I know, but I'd sooner see a male warrior or female mage.

 

 

I'm really not sure why they went with such generic choices.  I'd have liked to have seen Andira, Mad Carthos or Astrarra, who feel iconic to Runebound me.

 

Or one of the unusual races, like the yeti, or pixie, or dragon hybrid or undead character.  Or one of the three heroes with familiars, or the wolf rider. 

 

I'm a bit baffled, considering the options they have to choose from, as to why they've gone for a bunch of characters we already have.

 

 

 

 

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I agree for the most part (not with the horribly sexist comment).

 

I think Shiver (one of my personal favorites), Elder Mok, Jaes the Exile (he seems a bit evil which fits in with Dezra and Tarha), and Gherinn are unique enough.

 

Trenloe is an acceptable choice only because there really isn't a classic warrior man-type so far... I mean, Reynhart is the closest thing we have to that.

 

Laurel is a strange choice since we already have a ton of elf women. If they picked a female elf mage (which I'm not sure if there are any?), it would've been fine, since we have a warrior, scout, and healer already and it'd be cool to see a team of elf women. But no, it's just another scout.

 

Corbin and Lindel could've easily been replaced with more unique characters, or female characters. Red Scorpion, Tahlia, or Nara the Fang would've made much better selections.

 

One of the reasons I really love Descent is the fact that there's so many strong female heroes (and LTs), unlike most board games where there's two or three female options. It's very strange IMO that they didn't pick any women for the second set. I highly doubt we'll ever see a collection with four female characters and no male.

 

As for the monsters, the Bane Spider makes complete sense to me. All the monsters in the first one do, but the second one has odder choices... particularly the Fire Beetle and the Chaos Beast. The Chaos Beasts are really cool, so I let that slide, but the Lava Beetle is kinda blah, I would've much preferred to see the Naga, Skeleton Archer, or Shade return.

 

 

Maelora likes this

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Well, another bunch of spiders is obviously redundant, as for the female characters... women are just weaker and there are simply more male heroes in the world :P

lol, come on that was funny!

Edited by Light Bright

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Well, another bunch of spiders is obviously redundant, as for the female characters... women are just weaker and there are simply more male heroes in the world :P

lol, come on that was funny!

 

 

Not really, no. It was the utter definition of trite: sarcastic or not, it's an overused sentiment lacking originality or freshness. Not funny, and anyone who thinks so is only encouraging blatant sexist behavior. Maybe you don't think so, but it sets an example that others may pick up on, and I personally feel that our community should hold itself to higher standards. If you want to make jokes, you're going to have to try harder to be actually funny instead of using a subset of the community as a target of the joke. Regardless of whether you personally agree or disagree with the sentiment of the joke, that type of joke creates an environment of alienation, and if you didn't realize that before, hopefully you do now and can hold yourself to a higher standard.

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Sexist comments feel particularly silly as four of the five expansion sets so far have an equal number of heroes and heroines.

 

I'd just like to see more unique stuff - Runebound games don't have to be generic fantasy, they have quite a few unique aspects.  

Ringskipper likes this

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Which is why I wish the second H&MC broke free from the "human/elf/dwarf/orc" tradition and added the more unique (racially) heroes, like Zyla, Lyssa, Varikas, or Ispher. But we still have quite a few collections to go through, and I'm sure we'll see more of the unique heroes pop up.

 

In the new expansions, it'd also be nice to see less of what we've already seen. How cool would a bird/human hybrid be in the new Manor or Ravens set?

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Look at it this way, if the opening collections are to 'generic' then the later ones will be filled with the weird and wonderful ones left. Swings and roundabouts.

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Yes, I don't mind if the generic guys are done, as long as we get the quirky stuff later.

 

I'd love to see all the 1st edition stuff with new sculpts in the new art style.  I'd gladly buy them all.  

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I deliberately skipped the conversion kit because I didn't own the figures from 1st edition, and I'm quite grateful for these products, especially since they are rebalancing them.

 

I understand the complaint about a lack of diversity in the characters and the lack of female characters, but it isn't something important to me in a game personally, it wouldn't matter to me if all the characters were female or all were male or all were gender neutral or some other gender or whatever. What interests me is the stats and abilities.

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Yes, I don't mind if the generic guys are done, as long as we get the quirky stuff later.

 

I'd love to see all the 1st edition stuff with new sculpts in the new art style.  I'd gladly buy them all.  

the problem here is only that we have far more red heroes then blue ones. and intsets are always one of every color.  but they can skip some of the red ones.....

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I like all the characters, really. I like how the Runebound universe adds on 'exotic' heroes like the Minotaur Steelhorns, the Cat-people with Tetherys and Lyssa, as well as Varikas the Dead, Zyla and Ispher. Okaluk and Rakash is probably one of the more creative ideas for 'a hero' that I've seen in a while. Now all they need is to make a brave Kobold hero so I can play him or her and use my hilarious "Kobold voice" for the entire campaign.

There's a few I probably wouldn't play (Eliam, Landrec the Wise, Swifty, etc), but that comes from a purely mechanical basis, rather than "lol I don't like Orcs or women because I'm sexist/racist/ageist/ableist" or whatever term Social Justice folks will label others to shame creators to change their artistic visions to better suit them. The only thing I have to say about that is simply this: The game is not a soapbox for any personal agenda, and conforming to the multi-cultural worldview is not a prerequisite for the makers of games like this to follow. It may be a 'missed opportunity' to some, but in the end it really is the artists' vision and should at least be respected.

I could definitely see Tahlia be revamped with more might. Right now, Syndrael is the only female hero with four might (and outclasses Tahlia in movement and fatigue as well). If FFG wants to take her in the direction of a 'mighty glacier' character build with her, I'd be all on board.

Edited by PlainWhiteBread
mm26 and Maelora like this

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Anyone know when these are coming out? More than just q2 1214

 

The first one, Oath of the Outcast, is "on the boat," which means we'll get it in around 6 weeks. Expect early to mid-May. I'd guess early May, since Crown of Destiny is also set for Q2, and they'd have to cram that in around June sometime.

 

 

 

Yes, I don't mind if the generic guys are done, as long as we get the quirky stuff later.

 

I'd love to see all the 1st edition stuff with new sculpts in the new art style.  I'd gladly buy them all.  

the problem here is only that we have far more red heroes then blue ones. and intsets are always one of every color.  but they can skip some of the red ones.....

 

 

When they have made all the healers, mages, and scouts, they can just start making new ones. :) I highly doubt they will get to the point where every first edition character is remade, though. I'm betting a lot of them will get left behind. I just hope all the monsters eventually get remade. I will cry tears of sorrow if my medusae don't get fantastic new figurines (I really hope they keep the freaky four-armed snake design, though, and don't make them sexy snake women instead).

 

 

I could definitely see Tahlia be revamped with more might. Right now, Syndrael is the only female hero with four might (and outclasses Tahlia in movement and fatigue as well). If FFG wants to take her in the direction of a 'mighty glacier' character build with her, I'd be all on board.

 

 

I think right now, Syndrael is the only female warrior (without CK), isn't she? We definitely need more female warriors if you ask me. Tahlia and Nara are the only other female warriors if I remember correctly.

Edited by Ringskipper

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I'm really not sure why they went with such generic choices.  I'd have liked to have seen Andira, Mad Carthos or Astrarra, who feel iconic to Runebound me.

 

Or one of the unusual races, like the yeti, or pixie, or dragon hybrid or undead character.  Or one of the three heroes with familiars, or the wolf rider. 

 

I'm a bit baffled, considering the options they have to choose from, as to why they've gone for a bunch of characters we already have.

 

I'm sure all of those choices will be considered for future H&M collections.  I'm sure there are a bunch of people saying "Why isn't Nanok the Blade in one of these sets?"  :lol:

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Well, another bunch of spiders is obviously redundant, as for the female characters... women are just weaker and there are simply more male heroes in the world :P

lol, come on that was funny!

Not really, no. It was the utter definition of trite: sarcastic or not, it's an overused sentiment lacking originality or freshness. Not funny, and anyone who thinks so is only encouraging blatant sexist behavior. Maybe you don't think so, but it sets an example that others may pick up on, and I personally feel that our community should hold itself to higher standards. If you want to make jokes, you're going to have to try harder to be actually funny instead of using a subset of the community as a target of the joke. Regardless of whether you personally agree or disagree with the sentiment of the joke, that type of joke creates an environment of alienation, and if you didn't realize that before, hopefully you do now and can hold yourself to a higher standard.

I'm pretty sure he meant it as a joke and I took it that way with how he wrote it. And no I don't agree with you. Griton it would be impossible to prove to me you laugh at anything your to busy trying to correct people all the time! If he intended it to actually be rude to woman then I'd agree but he clearly didn't. Crying and reporting it like kids is a little much.. Edited by Light Bright
bullseyetm, Cyberpuncur and Lilikin like this

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Light Bright just don't... some people clearly have some issues and have to be more saint than a Pope.

(There are to many white male warriors! We want women! WTH?)
Complains about comments on imaginary characters in an imaginary world of Terrinoth is just beyond my complehension.

 

Of course it was a joke (even if it was not funny at all, de gustibus...) and still it was not out of topic of this thread. 

 

I agree there should me more female chars, but for other reasons. I like painting nice minis, and for now

from all the females in Descent 2 there is only Dezra that I like.

Edited by Cyberpuncur

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My wife found it funny, I found it corny.  

 

I would like also like to see some female characters redone. Tahlia especially.  Her mini was pretty ordinary and we really like the character.  Red Scorpion and Silhouette could also do with a make over.  

 

It would be good to also start to think about some of these sets which don't repeat 1E stuff but add some new characters and beasties and it would be good to add some more variety with races, alignment and gender.

Light Bright and Silverhelm like this

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Light Bright just don't... some people clearly have some issues and have to be more saint than a Pope.

... because encouraging civil, mature, and respectful behavior clearly means that someone has "issues". *head shake*

 

 

(There are to many white male warriors! We want women! WTH?)

Complains about comments on imaginary characters in an imaginary world of Terrinoth is just beyond my complehension.

It's a matter of theme and is just as valid of a desire as someone saying "I'd love to see less wilderness and have them do an expansion in a city." These forums are read by FFG, and the desires of their customers are something that they take into consideration when designing and releasing expansions.

Maelora, Whitewing, zwara81 and 1 other like this

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well they could remake some heroes in a runebound 3rd edtion which will be coming sooner or later.  lets see. 

that is wishfull thinking.

Edited by guillaumetexas

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