VASSAL CW SWISS US

[VASSAL CW SWISS US]

Cael vs. Mala ends 400 - 234 to me.

We played Cael's Fleet ambush.

The rival Super Tactical Droids fought a violent scrum amid the asteroid cluttered ambush zone. What were they fighting over? Strategic disagreements? Mining rights?

We each traded off 2 Munificents and all our generic fighters over rounds 3 &4. In the last 2 rounds my remaining Muni was able to hunt down 2 Hardcells for the tabling.

Brawls between Kraken Munis are brutal - the salvos wrack up nearly as much damage as the actual shots!

[Where does the hard cell fit into a separatist list]

The battle refit seems like it could be cheap fire support if you just add a turbolaser. Perhaps rather than a dedicated flanker you can use several in a gunline or in support of your main ships?

Add slaved turrets for a 58 point ship that can confire for 5 red dice out the front. Kracken can provide a bit of dice correction.

LTT is tempting for consistency and to give you the capability to absolutely nuke a squadron that comes too close. 

Battle refit's advantages/disadvantages over a corvette appear to be:

• + tankier (brace)
• + better single arc firepower (front 3 red)
•  + excellent flak
• - poor maneuverability
• - poor double arc firepower

To me all of this seems to point to a ship that flies in formation directly supporting your larger ships.

[What If...]

On 12/10/2020 at 10:33 PM, BrickDaniels said:

I had an idea for Independence:

(Squad Command): You may exhaust this card. If you do, each squadron you activate may increase its speed to 4.

(Requires a Squad token to ready)

If this ends up being too powerful, perhaps a clause can be added that requires the activated squads treat their attacks as obstructed?

This sounds like an excellent fix.

I don't think it would be too powerful when compared to a card like All Fighters Follow Me. New Independence would be:

• Same cost to use per round. (1 squad token per round but 1 free use)
• 3 points more expensive
• A little stronger for speed 2 squads (the main squads you want it for). Equal for speed 3 & useless for speed 4.
• Affects less squads then AFFM
• Tied to a single ship in fleetbuilding (Pelta for AFFM vs. MC80H for Independence)

I think this would be fair for Independence.

I like your cluster bombs idea as well.

It really seems like the token rules from clone wars could bring a lot of too weak/too strong cards back into balance.

[Yavaris - Changes]

3 hours ago, Green Knight said:

IMO, Yav still good, less lame.

I think this really sums it up for me.

It is probably a testament to how ridiculously strong Yavaris was before that the 2 common takes on this change are “Yavaris is now way weaker” and “Yavaris is still good.”

I think both are true.

[Overview spoiled Upgrade Cards]

Admiral buffs look fun to try out! I was hoping for more buffs to other binder filler cards though.

Nerfs are less exciting but a lot of these cards either felt too much like auto-includes or were built also the focal point of entire lists (Yavaris, Demo, Avenger). 

I like the direction they went with gunnery team requiring confire to use and ECM required spending a token to ready. I would like to see that sort of design space explored more.

 

[Vassal Clone Wars Tournament]

Still space?

If yes, count me in.

[Home One & Quad Turbolaser Cannons Interaction]

Your upgrade combo would work as described as long as you are modifying the die of another ship (not Home One itself). You can even modify the dice further afterwards (for example re-roll one of the accuracies with a concfire token if you don't need both accuracies).

 

 

 

Home One can not affect its own dice rolls, only friendly ships. The key word in the text is "While another friendly ship." Another means the effect cannot be used on the ship the upgrade is equipped to.

 

[Clone Wars Pictures]

5 hours ago, Mad Cat said:

 

Compare the V-19 to the X-Wing.

• Same Hull, Speed, & Escort rule.
• Slightly less anti ship - Same expected damage but black is more predictable than red die bomber, but then you loose the crits and BCC doesn't help.
• Lost a blue dice against squadrons and one more blue dice replaced by a more swingy red dice.
• Gain Swarm - Partly making up for the previous point.
• One point cheaper. I think that's a good deal overall.

And swarm is really nice to enable reserve hangar deck. A resurrect-able escort for 12 points sounds really strong.

Looks like Offensive Retrofit is present on at least 1 version of each Republic ship as well.

[What changes would make Interdictor Combat Refit better?]

Losing an experimental upgrade slot hurts a ton when those upgrades are so undercosted and the price is baked into the base chassis.  When 2 points gives you something like Grav Shift Reroute of course you want to have a ton of those slots to fill! This initial design choice really makes the idea of a combat focused Interdictor pretty hard to pull off.

I wish both Interdictor base chassis had been cheaper and the experimental upgrades were much more expensive. It would give players more options if the Interdictor was priced so that base cruiser could be competitively run as a pure gunship saving points by neglecting to fill the experimental slots. Legends canon had this where both interdictor cruisers were modifications of a pure combat ship that still saw duty (Interdictor Star Destroyer from ISD & Immobilizer Cruiser from Vindicator Cruiser).  

It feels like a missed opportunity to design the unit in such a way that the base unit subsides the unique upgrades basically forcing players to take the unique gimmick or have a suboptimal build. The Onager feels similar: at 5 points why would you ever not take a superlaser? The Starhawk seems better - the superweapon is good but not an autoinclude.

[Frigates with Ackbar]

1 big advantage the Scout  Frigate MC30 has over the Torpedo Frigate is that you don't NEED expanded armament. This frees up room for a dice consistency turbolaser (probably TRC).

 

At long range a TRC Scout Frigate is consistently putting out at least 2 more damage than the Enhanced Armament Torpedo (assume both frigates roll the same on the first 3 reds and the Scout TRC's its extra red die to a double).

At medium range the damage is mostly equal (4 red modified by TRC vs. 3 red & 2 blue raw).

At close range the damage is still pretty equal but the Torpedo Frigate's blue dice give you a much higher chance of accuracy which weighs heavily in its favor.

 

I do see the arguments for the Torpedo Frigate but the Scout undoubtedly has a better damage contribution at long range making it a much more flexible skirmisher. Just find a way to make up for the lack of accuracy! (Intel Officer, or Home One?)

[Frigates with Ackbar]

Both work very well but they have different strengths & weaknesses. I enjoy playing both with Akbar.

 

AF - Much tankier if you can consistently use the brace. A very solid platform for gunnery team. Overall a consistent long range damage dealer. Gets more use out of some commands (repair, squadron). Struggles a lot when blocked by a ship in front.

 

MC30 - Much more maneuverable - small base helps a lot and allows for many opportunities to Akbar out both left & right side in 1 activation. Great flexibility to chip at long range OR move to close range for a huge 10 dice punch (5 side arc + 2 Akbar + 2 ex racks + 1 confire.) MC30 also has a much easier time clearing blockers in front & running away when wounded to deny your opponent scoring points. And running is important - the MC30 cannot stand up to sustained fire like the AF can.

 

Here are my favorite baseline builds for each:

Assault Frigate Mark II B (72 points)
-  Gunnery Team  ( 7  points)
-  Electronic Countermeasures  ( 7  points)
-  Linked Turbolaser Towers  ( 7  points)
= 93 total ship cost

Consistently pelts 2 targets for 5 red dice each with 1 re-roll. ECM greatly improves survivability. Officer can be used defensively (lando, Krysta, Walex, EST) or offensively (Intel Officer).

 

MC30c Scout Frigate (69 points)
-  Ordnance Experts  ( 4  points)
-  Turbolaser Reroute Circuits  ( 7  points)
-  External Racks  ( 3  points)
= 83 total ship cost

Can skirmish with 4 red dice at long range (TRC 1 to a double hit) for consistent damage. At an opportune time dive into the middle of the enemy fleet and Akbar slash for a total of 16 dice from one activation!

Defensive upgrades really help to make up for the lack of brace and hull points. Try Lando + Admonition to make this ship survive its time in the middle of the enemy fleet.

If you plan to stay at long range Caitken & Shollan can be subbed in place of Ordnance Experts & Foresight can help you shrug off long range attacks. 

 

Both these ships love extra dice fixing for increased consistency on their red dice (Home One, Intensify Firepower). Try flying both and see what fits your playstyle. Both can even work well in the same fleet. I recommend trying to fit at least 3 solid attackers in an Akbar fleet.

 

[Agate Admiral & Expert Shield Techs]

Thanks! I will keep that EST restriction in mind.

[Agate Admiral & Expert Shield Techs]

My group has a question on the interaction between Admiral Agate & Expert Shield Techs.

To me it seems like you can use Agate's ability to discard a redirect token for its normal effect AND spend a redirect for the Expert Shield Techs effect on the same attack. I  think I can even do both on the same token (spend then discard).

I think this wouldn't violate any rules:

 

Rules Reference Guide -  pg 4

"The defender cannot spend more than 1 defense token of each type during an attack" - Agate's ability is a discard not a spend

"A defense token cannot be spent more than one during an attack" - Again, Agate's ability is a discard not a spend

 

Admiral Agate's Ability

"You cannot resolve the effect of each type of defense token more than once per attack" - Expert Shield Techs does not "resolve the effect" of the redirect defense token. EST ends with "instead of resolving that token's effect."

 

Expert Shield Techs

"While defending, during the Spend Defense Token step, when you spend a [redirect] defense token you may reduce the total damage from the attack by 1 instead of resolving that token's effect."

 

Am I making any mistakes here? 

[When FFG OP prize support isn't doing it come up with your own. Midgard Winter 2020]

Just wanted to comment as a member of the New England Armada community since 2015 the events you organize are extremely appreciated and among the best we've ever had. 

 

This is undoubtedly the most unique & attractive prize offering we have had in the region. We've had a lot of interest in the Boston area about practicing for & attending this tournament and I've heard this cool prize pool has been motivating for many (myself included!) Hoping to fill my carpool for the drive up!

[Order of Operations: Brace & Expert Shield Techs]

I ran into this question while playing yesterday. Now, having a chance to look at the rules, I wanted some opinions on whether my reading of the rules is correct.

The situations: A 4 damage attack is rolled against a ship.

Can the defending ship use the brace effect and THEN the Expert Shields Tech effect to reduce the damage total to 1? (brace halves to 2, EST reduces 2 to 1)

My understanding is no based on the timing of the 2 effects:

 

Expert Shield Techs Timing: during the Spend Defense Tokens step when you spend a [Redirect] defense token you may reduce the total damage from the attack by 1 instead of resolving that token's effect. 

Based on the bolded text I would think the damage reduction happens at Step 4 of attack resolution (Spend Defense Tokens). [Rules Reference Guide Pg 16]

 

Brace Timing: When damage is totalled during the "Resolve Damage Tokens" step, the total is reduced to half, rounded up. [Rules Reference Guide Pg 4]

Since "Resolve Damage" is step 5 I think you need to apply Expert Shield Techs effect before the brace effect.

 

Is my reading correct or incorrect?

 

[A Rebel lacking knowledge.]

I agree the Scout Hammerhead is pretty niche - its main strength over the Cr90 is its titles.

A group of scouts using:

Scout Hammerhead [41]

- slaved turrets [6]

- Task Force Organa [1]

= 48 total ship cost

can equal or surpass a Cr90 in long range front-arc damage output. Ideally mix in some torpedo hammerheads as well.

 

The MC-75 has stronger close range firepower than the MC80's. MC-75 also has arc lines well set up for doubled arcing and you really need to be using 2 arcs as much as possible to get value from it. 

For a different playstyle the MC-75 can equip gunnery teams to make a versatile Akbar cruiser that avoids the Home One MC80's weakness to frontal blockers. It's become my new favorite Akbar flagship.

 

 

[TIE Bombing Fleet]

On 4/29/2018 at 6:50 AM, Touston said:

I took the ISD 1 because it seemed to be the cheapest way of getting the bruiser into the game while also giving the double offensive slots. Losing two squadron activations and the boosted comms is worthwhile?

ISD 1 is definitely viable in this build. I prefer longer ranged ISD's with tie bomber fleets to abuse your huge threat range and pop small ships but there is nothing wrong using ISD1 for more close range punch.

I agree with Broba - don't run ISD1 with gunnery team. If you want gunnery team you should be using Cymoon or ISD2.

I wouldn't be worried about losing a few squadron activations - I think your list overinvests in squad activations.

ISD (4+1) + Quasar (4+1) + Goz (2+1) = 13 squad activations for only 12 squads. I think you could get away with 10 squad activations easily and could save 15 points by dropping all the hangar bays. Simply bank 2 squad tokens early on for 1 turn of all 12 being commanded. You shouldn't need to command all the bombers except on the initial strike turn anyways. You have Thrawn to ensure every ship can squad command when needed so you don't need to worry about the Goz needing to nav instead of squad command or anything like that. Finally, don't forget bombers can often set up a shot simply by sitting in front of their target or being nudged into range by squall. 

Talking about it I'm excited to get this back on the table. I'll post back here when I do.

 

[Another Ackbar Gunline]

I  really like it. I think I'll try this out at a local game night when I get a chance.

The upgrades all look perfect to me. I guess the one thing you could play around with is activation count - the 2nd transport doesn't seem to do much besides provide a 6th activation. You could drop it and go down to 5 (points for bid?), or replace it with strat advisor to stay at 6.  In my meta (6 activations is very common) I would actually be tempted to keep both transports & go up to 7 activations by swapping lando -> strat advisor. 

I'd love to fit in coms net if possible to support the MC75.

[Rogue Sato vs Raddus builds]

Have you found Wide Area Barrage to be very useful? If so some examples of use or tips would be greatly appreciated.

I haven't been able to get much benefit out of it and always keep subbing it out for APT or ACM. I really want it to work though!

[Sato's whale and hammerhead sharks]

I've ran Sato APT Hammerheads in several games and while their their ~50 point cost might hold them back from being top-level competitive they are still a ton of fun. 

I find that targets with evade neuter their crit ability pretty badly but they are excellent when shooting against ships like ISD that lack evade. 

If you can get double black crits you can APT even evade-equipped ships from way downtown. Impossible you say? Well not with double rerolls. If you equip Ordnance experts AND Task Force Organa and reroll every non-crit each black die has a greater than 50% chance of landing on crit at the end. 3 TFO titles will drastically increase your chance of landing crits for a mere 3 points so I would really try to squeeze that in somehow.

If you find you like playing Sato long range APT's I'd recommend you try the Ordnance MC75 as well - in my opinion it's one of the best Sato ships currently.

[Neo-Ackbar]

I've ran several iterations of Akbar gunline using MC-75 as a lead ship. I prefer to run my MC-75's guns as:

MC75 Armored Cruiser 104

• Gunnery Team 7

• External Racks 3

• Leading Shots 4

• Quad Battery Turrets 5

Total Cost - 123

Then add on any officers, defensive upgrades. This comes to the same cost as your offensive upgrades: Caitken and Shollan (6) + Enhanced Armament (10) cost the same as Gunnery Team (7) + Leading Shots (4) + Quad Battery Turrets (5).

The beauty of this is that as long as you go slow you can get leading shots re-rolls on both shots which really ups the average damage of your red dice. You can afford to go slow with your gunline's long range firepower advantage - its your opponent that has to speed up to ensure a good attack angle.

This ship can pump big damage into 2 different targets or double arc one target for massive damage. That makes it very difficult for your opponent to deal with. Being in the Side Arc opens them up to gunnery team abuse but getting in front they risk a possible 15 dice double arc!

On 5/2/2018 at 5:06 PM, shmitty said:

It's really challenging to conga line with 3 ships in my experience. 

My experiences match Shmitty's: a Large, Med, Med gunline is very unwieldy and inflexible to maneuver. The 2 ship gunline has many more options for maneuvers.

Personally, I've replaced the 3rd AF with a Scout MC30. It CAN fly with the gunline but is happy to break out and do its own thing. It can really surprise your opponent if you fake the MC30 flying with the gunline and then jump forward to catch an exposed target by surprise.

 

 

[Rieekan Scout Gunline]

2 minutes ago, The Jabbawookie said:

It's indeed a tough fit, but I could try.  What makes them better? Double arcing seems a bit meh with the huge front arc and lackluster side arc...

Yeah the double arc doesn't come up often but 1 extra damage is nice when it does.

I most appreciate that spinals gives you an actual rear arc. When I ran slaved my Hammers became useless after the initial pass and could never turn hard enough to get another shot. With the spinal rear die and concentrate fire I can add a couple extra damage to ships as we pass by and my hammerheads would otherwise be doing nothing. It's not huge and kind of hard to quantify but its felt worth 3 points most times. That said, my first drop is Spinals -> Slaved when points get tight.

[TIE Bombing Fleet]

I've had fun with a similar idea. Not super competitive but works well enough in a casual game.

Thrawn Bombers 
Author: Mala

Faction: Galactic Empire
Points: 393/400  

Commander: Grand Admiral Thrawn

Assault Objective: Precision Strike
Defense Objective: Fighter Ambush
Navigation Objective: Superior Positions

 

[ flagship ] Imperial Star Destroyer Cymoon 1 Refit (112 points)
-  Grand Admiral Thrawn  ( 32  points) 
-  Strategic Adviser  ( 4  points) 
-  Gunnery Team  ( 7  points) 
-  Expanded Hangar Bay  ( 5  points) 
= 160 total ship cost

 

Quasar Fire II-class Cruiser-Carrier (61 points)
-  Squall  ( 3  points) 
-  Ruthless Strategists  ( 4  points) 
-  Boosted Comms  ( 4  points) 
= 72 total ship cost

 

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
-  Bomber Command Center  ( 8  points) 
= 31 total ship cost

 

8 TIE Bomber Squadrons ( 72 points) 
1 Dengar ( 20 points) 
1 Tempest Squadron ( 13 points) 
1 Gamma Squadron ( 10 points) 
1 "Mauler" Mithel ( 15 points) 
= 130 total squadron cost

Card view link

Fleet created with Armada Warlords

 

Some rationale on differences:

Cymoon + Bombers gives you great potential to pop small ships from long range and even up the activation count. 

Ruthless Strategist Quasar II + Mauler Mithel gives you 2 autodamage on each squad you target every turn. Gives this list a huge advantage against ace-heavy squad builds. Those become your best matchup.

Fighter Ambush sacrifices deployment advantage but can score a ton of points.

Still a couple points to play with for turbolaser on the cymoon, a fleet command, or something else.

[Rieekan Scout Gunline]

I'd be worried about lacking any squadron defense.

Dropping 1 scout for Tycho, Shara & a GR-75 to command can help a lot for a small reduction in firepower.

I've found Spinals much better than Slaved in these builds but it is always tough to find the extra points for it.

I'd 2nd the suggestion to mix in 1-2 Torpedo Hammers that fly behind the scout gunline. 

[Dual MC30 Regional List - Feedback appreciated]

I enjoy playing lists like this (dodonna, 2-3 combat ships + Yvaris & modest fighter wing). At its worst it does feel like it is trying to do too many things but at its best IT IS doing all those things: dominating the squadron fight and the ship battle.

Personally, I don't think you want Yavaris with relay in this type of list - you want Yavaris up in the enemy's face. I run it as a cruise missile carrying strong double-dice bombers along with it. If your opponent brings no squads to counter it you can kill big ships. If they do commit squads to it you can get huge value by fighting under toryn aa fire and Yavaris double tapping into their squads. Either way Yavaris suicidally trades up. I get more success running Yavaris like this - not trying to keep it safe with relay but throwing it right at the enemy ships and forcing them to deal with it. 

Your squad setup is really tanky but I don't see it as much of an immediate threat to the enemy. 

If you want to run Yavaris missile-style:

Take Out (54)

• - Luke (20)
• - Biggs (19)
• - VCX (15) - you don't need relay as much anymore and you only need 1 strategic for intel sweep anyway

Add In (46)

• + 2 B-Wings (28)
• + Gold Squadron (12)
• + Flight Commander (3), Fighter Coordination Team (3) on Yavaris - these upgrades make setting up Yavaris double taps 10 times easier; I never leave home without them. Also helps slow rebel squads stay with Yvaris as it speeds towards the enemy and lets you keep your squads cautiously tucked behind Yavaris' aa range until you're ready to strike.

That leaves you 8 extra points to play around with too. This is a very different style of playing Yavaris but I've found it really useful in this type of fleet. The Mc30's and Yav all can all threaten huge ship damage at the start of a round. Your fighters won't really be covering your MC30's but ... they don't really need the cover if they get into trouble they can just speed away