Trizzo2
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Posts posted by Trizzo2
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People...people...it's blue/blue bomber for 12 points. What else do you need to know!
I dare say, the most experience that Rebel Players have had with Blue/Blue Bomber, was watching Firesprays pop at them at Medium Range with Rhymer after moving in the Squadron Phase...
... So they're mostly still fixated on Rogue and Rhymer, rather than what the Blue/Blue is doing to them...
After Wave and Wave of Firespray...
butttt I found they tappered off during Rebel MUS. And they have been replaced by a new toy for now
And not to mention a certain Ywing that likes Bomber Crits to go with Gold Squadron. -
Green Squads are probably the only unique i dont see any use for. Why would i want an Awing with bomber?Yeah its a black die but its also on a really squishy platform whos only real reason it stays alive is Counter2 - which Greens have Counter1.
That's my question with Gold Squadron. What makes it good? I guess blues are more reliable? But you also have less chance at a crit.
People...people...it's blue/blue bomber for 12 points. What else do you need to know!
coastcityo and Madaghmire reacted to this -
The most important aspect of anti air defense is early dectection and engaging with fighters. If you resort to using missle and other defense systems that comprise the inner layer you have partially failed because they have penetrated far into your defenses. We never see this today because US naval power/air is virtually unchallenged. When we look at WW2/history we can extrapolate the lessons, unless one is being deliberately obtuse.
Of course missles/AEGIS/electronic warfare are complications on top.
Funnily enough Star Wars fleet battles appead much closer to WW2 slug fest than modern warfare with its complicated multi tier attack/defense. Imperial point defense turbo lasers are manned!
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You clearly don't know what the Singapore Stratergy is and how it failed (Britains entire naval fleet destroyed by Japanese bombers). Because AA alone is never enough! I included the others because it's a general rule of combined arms/modern naval combat. You need air supremacy because AA capabilites of Naval forces is not enough to ward off attacks by aircraft.
We're talking about ships that are vast in size with armament designed for different layers of engagement. Technically, an ISD or MonCal cruisers blue dice should be their anti-squadron dice but instead it's rolled into ship combat.Each "squad" is just that. A squad made up of multiple fighters. It's perfect. It's meant to represent just what you are saying, taking damage from a large amount of fighters.
It makes sense defensively. Fleets with no air cover (extrapolate into space combat) get picked off by enemy bombers everytime.
This is true for armour, tanks, C1-30 gunship. Large units cannot effectively defend themselves from fighter/bomber attacks unsupported: ie Singapore Stratergy
You'll notice your validity for the mechanic chose to ignore naval ships, the closet comparison to Armada we have today....I'll go ahead and assume that was because you're aware of their anti-air capabilities, regardless of status of fighter screen.
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this list can obliterate elitist big ship lists-no surprise there, as swarmy lists are typicaly more powrful.
i fail to see HOW it can stand against a concentrated bomber wing.
you simply do not have enough antisquadron firepower.
you do NOT need to build full on squadrons, but if you want a "fighter screen", it must not be suited for "tanking" but for destroying escort and/or intel. intel squadrons are the gamechanger. if you face a bomber list and cannot take down the Intel, wou will most probably lose.
It fail to see how it "obliterates" big lists but I agree with everything else. And it hardly gives me cancer. The way you have described playing it will put you in horendous positions. Of course I have never played against this list but I have against other Sato lists.
1) Rapid Launch on Transports? Fine by me. You have described driving up ships with FC, dropping squadrons and shooting a ship at range one. Do that to me anytime you want. Now your Floatilla is in close range/bomber range and I didn't even have to work for it. If you want to play that style as second player it makes your stuff easier to kill. Not to mentioned Arquitens w/ Turbolaser/Phantoms/Rhymerballs stand a reasonable chance of killing your Floatilla with the set aside squadrons.
Your activation plan might not work as well as you think. If you move up to me (assuming you don't die on the way in) I move my ship out of range? If i have a 4 ship list, which is pretty standard, you can't utilise Sato fully because my ships can potentially move away after you drop your squadrons. It works against slow ships as I have discovered but if you can get 2 guppies and Salvation on the one target whilst ingnoring my threats...well you've done well.
2) Not enough bomber/squarons/speed. 1 Hawk stands a good chance of being one shot by Flight Controller Marek Stele, Mauler with anyone else. Now your entire squadron compliment can be tied down. You have 4 Black bomber dice in the list and even if you were running bomber command center you don't have enough dice to justify the cost. You have 18 points in Rapid Launch/FC more than half the cost of that is for a low impact 2 squadron drop, two black dice at most, a combo you use once.
3) I will pick Advanced Gunnery everytime and use Arquitens/Demo/Bombers to kill Salvation from the side arc and get lots of free points. If I am a 100-134 point Bomber list that can take yours, which should be pretty easy to do, I pick Superior positions. Besides the Lancers your fleet will not likey get lots of shots to rear. Once I gobble up the squadrons, who can scarcely defend themsevles with their low anti squadron batteries, I will rack up tokens for the rest of the game.
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Each "squad" is just that. A squad made up of multiple fighters. It's perfect. It's meant to represent just what you are saying, taking damage from a large amount of fighters.
It makes sense defensively. Fleets with no air cover (extrapolate into space combat) get picked off by enemy bombers everytime.
This is true for armour, tanks, C1-30 gunship. Large units cannot effectively defend themselves from fighter/bomber attacks unsupported: ie Singapore Stratergy -
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Random notable rule, too many to list but...on turn 5, 6 you can Hyperspace Jump out if battle in the status phase, provided you survive. However an interdictor with any experimental retrofit can stop this.
This right here!
They alluded to it in last week's article, but this is still my favorite part of the news. The Interdictor is an Interdictor, and not just some tanky ship.
If you hyperspace out do you lose? Do you still tally up points to determine the winner?
pg 9 "Ships that retreated are counted as destroyed when counting score". You save repair cost/scar. So it's a tough choice.
Pg 12 "Hypersapce Retreat", Ships can retreat turns 4-5 by discarding command dial, stay alive and status phase fly away.
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They are great against squadrons without Rogue. If you get attacked you can move either out of range of the next attack or move to block the movement of another/other squadrons. Whisper is good...move onto stations/into debris and that really helps get a good brace mitigation or scatter.
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Random notable rule, too many to list but...on turn 5, 6 you can Hyperspace Jump out if battle in the status phase, provided you survive. However an interdictor with any experimental retrofit can stop this.
Final Batlle is fought on 3x9 not 6 and you set aside ships up to even large to jump into battle for the first few turns.
Spy tokens allow you to redeploy your ships per objective token by spending it
And soooo much, it's crazy awesome! -
One sour person makes a thread. Everyone comments. Breathes life into non issue. Now it's a fire that sucks all the oxygen out of the room. Achievement unlocked: Journeymen Troll
Green Knight reacted to this -
Top dog for Imp is all up in the air. Maarek, Valen, Cinena are all insane in their own way. Rhymer and Mauler aren't going away. Jendon isn't top dog because he requires other people to combo with and doesn't have strategic.
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I use a Squadron Command 2 on a Gozanti. I decided to use a Relay Squadron well outside range 1-5.
Can I use Relay to move a Lambda Shuttle by using it's own Relay ability?
If yes can I move my Relay Squadron and then use the second command via relay to reach a squadron that is now in Range 1-3 post finishing movement?
For reference:
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This was the first battle of the war, a suprise attack. They were not anywhere need a heightened readiness (deploy the garrison! call the admiral!)You can see the ISD turn in you can see laser fire from all capital ships in the middle and end. It looks small because it's to scale. Did you see the twig ISDS in the death star shots?
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Coming from a huge player and fan of Imp squadrons I don't think they will amount to much.
3 Black point defense is good but not good enough at 22, speed 3 and heavy. Obviously they pair well with Valen but so does everything else that's heavy.
You can fit 6 in a list but against Flight Controllers they will be killed quickly, especially if you are relying on Rogue to push them around.
Moran Kee suffers from one Brace only requiring a Squadron command to activate her if she needs her Brace from the prior turn.
I love them and will play them but i don't expect great things from a swarm of them. I think you might have one, at most, hanging about to save on a squadron command or threaten a flanking ship. There are far better options for 44 points than two Decimators. Valen and 2 Defenders costs 45 for starters.
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Rewatched the movie and paid close attention in the space battle. There is tons of turbo laser fire in the middle and end. At the start the ISDs are not aligned with the Rebel fleet, you can see them start to turn in, and nor are the rebel ships shooting. When they do the Ion bombing run there is a fuckton of lasers firing from the ISD. Look out for the CR90 at the end as well. Lasers everywhere.
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Strategic is awesome! Took long enough for someone to get the discussion going, don't people like it or are not excited about it?!
Strategic Measured
Due to "At Distance" rules all we need is the most marginal edge of a Objective Token to touch the 1 Measurement Tool line. This allows the token to move almost 3 Distance due to the overhang and the Squadron Base itself. This is quite a generous distance. And you can see I didn't even try to squeeze out the maximum distance I could place it at.
First Token Position
Second Position
First vs Final Position
Red/Assault Objectives: Not a great deal of choice (yet).
Targeting Beacons: Move an Intel/Strategic Bomber ball around to assist carrier/support fire.
Yellow/Defense Objectives: Strategic starts to get pretty nuts when you consider the distance you can move tokens.
Firelanes: You could easily pull back the tokens one the first move because the First Player cannot move them far enough away to stop your Strategic ship getting in range. Even if they split the tokens appart from a full stack you could retrive most of them with either a second Strategic squadron or on turn two. You could even push them under enemy vessels to claim it by seemingly dubious means.
Hyperspace Assault: You can now conceivably deploy a Hyperspace token near your board with the intention to shepard it around to make precise Hyperspace jump that would make Thrawn himself proud. The flavor in me screams Interdictor/Tua/Targeting Scramblers for great justice!
Jamming Barrier: Seems tricky to use than previously mentioned objectives but your line could be moved around to provide a very disruptive or defensive barrier.
Planetary Ion Cannon: Move the Ion Cannon around and shoot the things. Strategic/PIC seem made with each other in mind.
Blue/Navigation Objectives: More awesome tricks and making old objectives that needed help far more interesting. Boom
Intel Sweep: Boom! Remember those times you had to change your nav and you wiffed the Intel Sweep collection with your ship? Not anymore. The major weakness of Intel Sweep is gone with Strategic. You no longer need to signal your entire Navigation course when you can bring the Intel to you.
Minefields: Would you like a mine tower or mine sweeper?
Sensor Net: Another designed with Strategic in mind Objective. It could be very punishing if you don't take a Strategic squad and pick this. As second you completely undermine the First players ability to move the token with your Strategic whilst you suck theirs away futher and futher away via the Objective.
Salvage Run: Move the Salvage with Strategic, get the scrap, profit? My least favorite of the Strategic choices thus far because it requires you to fly in a certian way which has it's pros and cons.
Which Strategic Squadron is "Better":
vs 
VCX-100 Freighter:
Pro:
Anti Squadron Battery is superior
+2 Hull
Con:
-1 Relay
Overall: Less Relay makes it less appealing as toolbox.
Lambda Class Shuttle:
Con:
-2 Hull
Slighy inferior anti squad (no acc outside of Flight Controllers)
Pro:
Relay 2 makes it very useful when paired with Goz activations
Overall: Better toolbox but less resiliant
Imperial vs Rebel Strategies/Builds:
There is quite a lot that could be said and most of it would be speculation so I'll make a few general comments.
Rebels: They have quite a few options to improve their Strategic squadron. Namely All Fighters Follow Me! and Adar Talon. Adars ability could let you move one token Roughly distance 6 you could also move two seperate tokens in the same turn via one Squadron. This seems efficent.
Imperial: Nothing besides Chiraneau interacts with the Lambda, not Vector or Corruptor but the former helps move contested tokens. However Imp stratergies/tactics, especially defensive/second player Objective punishment seem much stonger when built around Strategic. Blue Objectives were always the dearth of many second player Imperial stratergies. This could definitely shift now.
Conclusion: Strategic is cool. How powerful is it...well I don't know. Lets find out! I'm currently thinking two Strategic Squadrons seems a good starting place for the build. Make sure you have strength as first player in case they see your grand Strategic plans and make you First player.
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A big flaw it that it requires you to sit around until the squadron phase, poliety copping damage or dying, before you can do anything. Besides the occasionial YT2400 swarm Rogues aren't making waves.
As far the compaison goes. Rhymer/5 FS = 11 Bomber dice at Medium. Hera/Xwing/Lancer = 5 bomber dice at Range 1.
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Headhunter doesn't really have 'decent'ship battery. It has every weakness that a Tie does with less speed and a worse battery. Ties are better. Surely the average Tie anti squadron in genric vs genric is slight superior. I never look for max just the average.
Marinealver and eViL dAvE reacted to this -
Hehe yeah was thinking these are some Mujahideen looking mofos ;p
Also Rogue One drinking game, drink when somone says force. Pass out at Donnie Yens first scene.
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The CGI Tarkin/Leia was the best use of this technology ever put to screen. Knowing the characters are dead/total CGI adds to the Uncanny Valley feeling. It was well done.
I was deeply troubled by the first 15 minutes. I was getting very worried with the pacing, editing and the off feel in the post opening scene.
Once that passed it slowly ratcheted up and up and was mostly amazing fun. Finally death en mass! Even if it was totally safe for them to die due to where the film fits in the SW universe it was tense as ****. We knew the plans were going to get away but i was sweating buckets in the corridor scene.
Hammerhead corvette idea, best space battle since RoTJ. Those Tie Fighters getting deployed...
Even the awkward opening still had good moments and shades of grey. Yes rebel opertertives are actually shady assassin's cloaked in shades of grey, not the lovable do no wrong luck muppets of Rebels. Once the informant was shot in the back I started to go with it.
Pilot no55389 and Corellian Corvette reacted to this
And not to mention a certain Ywing that likes Bomber Crits to go with Gold Squadron.
The Wall: Development of an aspirationally competitive Interdictor list
in Star Wars: Armada Fleet Builds
Posted · Edited by Trizzo2
Yes I did. Pretty much Nav Dial/Eng token from Comms Net first turn. Nav Dial turns 1-2 to get in a great position, whilst using Projection Expert off the token as required.
It was a tank back Wave 3-4. What killed it was MUS the 2 Float and or Guppy/MC30/CR90/Yavaris mixes, with 10-12 squadron. But nowww it's Wave 5. I have the first iteration of the list as well but have since gone to develop my bomber list and now I have ideas from that list to put back into this list.
Essential changes:
+Tua/ECM onto Interdictor
+ Arquitens/Hand of Justice
+ Tarkin
Tarkin is really good with Tua because she takes up the Wulf/Arkeso spot you get the token onto the ship. Now that you can survive as second player due to ECM you can expect to be able to live and repair. Tarkin is really good right now. For Tua and 'other reasons' that will be forthcoming
Will post an update of the first thrown together list I tried.