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Everything posted by Truthiness

  1. I'm considering something very similar, but with only two AFIIs. Double ISD with gunnery teams and XI7s plus a Rhymer ball would be my main concern. Zero squadron support and no defensive upgrades means those AFIIs will go down faster than you would expect.
  2. Not possible. Slaved Turrets and Enhanced Armaments are both Turbolaser upgrades.
  3. Depends on the "friends." I'm not afraid of double ISDs and a glad. I'm just as fast and vastly outgun them at long range. I worry about a Rhymer ball more than anything actually. The list is very light on fighters to get that much firepower out of the capital ships. With Intel in the mix, the A-Wings will have a hard time with a good Rhymer ball.
  4. You nailed it. My perspective is predicated on Home One and long range. I've put my Ackbar Slash build in the fleet forum, so you can go see exactly what I'm trying to do. For that kind of build XI7s are the clear and superior choice. XI7s are painful to far too many ships, especially with Home One around. At the higher damage totals we are discussing, they are going to more consistently get through shields and kill ships faster when your ships are hitting the same target. However, you are exactly right. That is simply my perspective. I don't really understand the type of build Lyraeus is thinking. The idea of intentionally going into medium range with an ISD is anathema to me. But under those conditions maybe HTTs with those Ion Cannons will work better for what he has in mind.
  5. I haven't been a fan of the Gallant Haven for a while now. In general, the AFIIs do not synergize well with our fighters. AFIIs want to keep things at arm's reach and move quickly around the flanks. Our fighters want to get stuck in, but move somewhat slow (especially the B-Wing). For now it's workable. With the Gallant Haven, though, the lack of synergy is really telling. Either you get stuck in alongside your fighters and die a horrible death or you keep your fighters back, massively limiting their effectiveness. It honestly feels like something that belongs on the VSD. Imperial fighters are more comfortable keeping their distance, in large part because of Rhymer. Their bombers can hang back and still contribute damage while their fighters hang around the capital ships to keep other bombers off. Our fighters can't do that. We have to proactively go after the Imperial bombers to eliminate the threat and push in closer with our bombers to be threatening with them. Once the MC80 is on the scene, I'll be going with that behemoth instead of an AFII. Beyond what I think is going to be a good title card (Independence), the ship in general will be more comfortable going slower and getting stuck in. The Neb-B is, and will likely remain, a staple of my squadron heavy builds. They want to go slow and keep their front directed at the enemy. They work very well using B-Wings effectively as deterrents and then quickly accelerating beyond the threat. They're hard to use, but Yavaris and Salvation are such valuable tools that they are worth the trouble in my mind.
  6. At the levels of damage we've been discussing, the X17s shine when you're targeting the same zone with multie ships, especially over HTT. Again, please go see my post in the other thread. Once the brace is used, the HTTs become useless. At 5+ damage, the XI7s are back to forcing that damage onto the target hull zone. Grab Home One and just keep that Brace token pinned down. I WANT them to redirect as much damage as they can. The MOMENT they do so at the levels of damage we are talking about I have killed 2 defense tokens instead of 1. How many shields are left after 9 damage on an ISD 2 with AP? 3? Seems like they are going to take a beating from the tag along MC30 or Assault Frigate. in a single turn to 2 turns of damage I have neutered their capacity to survive much longer. They are taking more hull damage now then if they were over the same span of 2 turns of Xi7's. I think we're differing on an important point: what happens with that Brace token. You're envisioning someone not using the brace token because of the HTTs. I'm envisioning him not using the brace token because I'm almost certain to have an accuracy result to shut that Brace down. With Home One, it's guaranteed. If I can shut down that Brace with accuracy, I'm doing the exact same amount of shields damage as you are. The difference is I can force it into a more concentrated area at 5+ damage.
  7. I'd rather just take the hull damage with the largest number of damage braced unless you're pinning down contain. Because from then on that turn, I'm just redirecting everything else with impunity. HTTs are now useless. With multiple ships, I'm going to do more hull damage and remove more shields overall with the XI7s despite the advanced projectors.
  8. At the levels of damage we've been discussing, the X17s shine when you're targeting the same zone with multie ships, especially over HTT. Again, please go see my post in the other thread. Once the brace is used, the HTTs become useless. At 5+ damage, the XI7s are back to forcing that damage onto the target hull zone. Grab Home One and just keep that Brace token pinned down.
  9. I'm dying to see Ackbar's gunline added to this equation. With Slaved Turrets, you can (if Moff Zen is accurate) get XI7s on a AFII and have 6 red dice baseline from a broadside. Add concentrate fire to that equation, and you've got something that could conceivable one shot a gladiator. You'll almost certainly kill one with two volleys. I'm curious to see how Home One and 2 AFIIs would hold up against a glad rush like this when you've got Ackbar. I have a feeling it will be a brutally hard counter.
  10. If HTT is the heavy turbolasers I would rather field X-I7s especially with the MC-80 and space whales with all their shields.Personally I think devaluing the use of the Redirect is more important than the use of punching through a shield zone. Let's look at some numbers. Let's say you deal 9 damage (I have ECM's so brace is always active). With brace that is now 5 damage and I can redirect 1 point of each due to XI7's. That means my other zones take 1 and the defending zone takes 2. Now let's look at HTT. Same thing, 9 damage. So I can either take 5 damage to 1 hull zone OR, I can take 8 damage to all my hull zones. Which kills me faster? Go back and look at my response in the other thread. When you factor in teamwork, XI7s build on each other. Once a brace token is used, the HTT become useless. I can see bringing one HTT for that initial shot, but why bother when Home One can guarantee I'll be able to target that brace?
  11. By the same notion, XI7s are in the same boat with the 4 damage threshold. Advanced Projectors can spread the first 4 damage evenly, but as soon as you exceed that, it's all on the hull zone you're targeting. I mulled all the same points over and decided to stick with the XI7s in an Ackbar gunnery build. When you're throwing out 6 reds a turn and can guarantee an accuracy (Home One!!!), I see the XI7s as superior. You can target the brace and force him to take the full damage every time. It's all about the group mechanics here. In one shot, yes the HTT will force a choice between brace and redirect, causing the shields to weaken on one side. However, if you follow up with another HTT ship, I then just use the redirect that I couldn't use before. With XI7s, they build on each other when you get over 4 damage. Let's take two concentrate fire AFIIs with Slaved Turrets at long range with Ackbar hanging around against the only Imperial ship able to take Advanced Projectors: the ISD. That's 7 (oh man am I looking forward to this) red dice. Each die has a 25% chance at damage, 25% chance at crit, 25% of miss, 12.5% chance of double damage, and 12.5% chance of accuracy. Using that, let's assume a slightly above average roll of 1 double, 1 accuracy, 2 damage, 2 crit, and only 1 miss. We'll use this as a baseline for all our rolls. We'll even give the two ships shots at the same side arc. Right off the top, we have six damage and can cancel one token. Well with HTTs I'd probably let him brace it, so I target something inconsequential for this round of shooting (a contain?). He braces, taking the damage on the zone you targeted. Sweet! The shields are down on that side. However, the next AFII follows up, and the 6 damage are spread over the other shields. We can't stop the redirect because we only have one accuracy and he has two tokens. No hull damage. ****. Now let's look at the same scenario with XI7s. Six damage and I can target one defense token. Well I'm definitely going for the brace. 3 damage gets spread to other hull zones, but we force 3 shields down on the target hull zone. Sweet! Shields are down! The next AFII follows up. Once again, I'm targeting the Brace token. Again, 3 damage gets spread over the other shields, but BAM! I've got three hull damage as well (although no crits because of Contain). I will give you that Home One makes this a much much harder decision. Let's add Home One to the same examples. In this case, the The HHTs once again let the ISD brace, dropping the shields. The second volley is where things get interesting. This time you are able to target both redirects. Holy 6 hull damage batman! He's containing it, but you're now forcing a hard choice. That's half his hull value, so this probably forces the brace to get discarded. That takes it down to 3 damage, but he's in big trouble in following turns. The XI7s also starts the same way. 3 damage on other hull zones and shields on the targeted side. For the second volley, I would target the brace and the remaing redirect, just like the HHTs. Just like the HHTs, he's now looking at 6 hull damage. This probably forces a discard of the second redirect, with only 3 hull damage. As you can see, Home One makes the end state much closer. So what can we take away from this? Take whatever turbolasers you want, but you better freaking take Home One if you've got Ackbar.
  12. The more we're finding out, the more I'm thinking of dropping the Intel Officer and Enhanced Armaments. Slaved Turrets sounds like it's going to synergize well with Ackbar since you'll only be using one arc anyway. According to Moff Zen, the Slaved Turrets will be an offensive retrofit that allows you to move one die from one arc to another. That means I could ditch the Enhanced Armaments and grab XI7s for likely a similar cost and no loss in dice output. With the MC80 already pumping out 6 dice, I could see going down to XI7s on it as well. I am definitely nervous about the light fighter support as well as the number of points invested in Home One. I don't see a better place for Ackbar. Putting him on one of the Assault Frigates makes him more vulnerable and still makes for a 123+ flagship. I also can't pass up the double defensive retrofits or the engine techs in this build. It makes him tanky as hell, but lets him keep up with the other Assault Frigates. I'm not totally sold on the ECMs for 7 points, so maybe the new defensive retrofit will be more interesting (and cheaper). I've seen Tycho do well at tying up large numbers of fighters on his own, but that was prior to Intel getting added to the game. I would prefer to add at least another A-Wing. We'll see how things end up when we have all the details, but I've edited the original list to reflect the potential changes.
  13. That's the spirit. Even with engine techs, you'll be going just as fast as the ISD, but out turning it with the same commands.
  14. We now know enough about the MC80 for me to make my gunnery focused build. Based on Moff Zen's Intel, I'm estimating Ackbar at around 35 points. Chew on these tasty broadsides: 80 Assault Cruiser (114) Admiral Ackbar (~35) Home One (7) Enchanced Armaments (10) XI7 Turbolasers (6) ECMs (or maybe the new defensive retrofit) (7) Advanced Projectors (6) Engine Techs (8) Intel Officer (7) Assault Frigate Mark IIB (72) Enchanced Armaments (10) XI7 Turbolasters (6) Slaved Turrets (?) Advanced Projectors (6) Assault Frigate Mark IIB (72) Enchanced Armaments (10) XI7 Turbolasters (6) Slaved Turrets (?) Advanced Projectors (6) Tycho (16) 2x A-Wings (11 22) Objectives: Advanced Gunnery (I DARE YOU) Fire Lanes Dangerous Territory ~389 points before Slaved Turrets *Removed in strikes and additions in bold.
  15. boo I see no reason to go over the command variant with the stock of current cards (final judgement reserved for when I have that baby in my hands) I can see two right off the top my head: ECMs and Advanced Projectors. Can't do that together on the command variant. 8 points is a fair price to pay for that kind of synergy and another red die on the front and side. I know I'll be using it for sure.*Edit: Zen beat me to the punch*
  16. Still perfectly fine. It just confirms my belief this thing should be a cornerstone of a fleet, not something to be spammed. Take one that tanks the crap out of things and supports your other ships. Ackbar+Home One+Assault Frigates+Enhanced Armaments, here I come. What I need now are the upgrade cards. I have a feeling the command variant with some of the new upgrades will have the same support/tank role for squadron builds.
  17. Yeah, the more I'm looking at it, the more I'm thinking 114. That makes sense when you consider the dice upgrades and the double defensive retrofits.
  18. I agree, the command variant seems like it should be the cheaper of the two. Zooming in as well as I can, though, it definitely looks to be two digits. Maybe the glare is doing weird things. 104 to 114 seems like the more appropriate range.
  19. 1) Interesting, if not all that likely for me to use. 2) Can we get a more specific number? More than Vader seems a little silly, but 35 on the nose seems right. It also sounds like either a) he has similar limitations as Home One or b) they are mistakenly merging Ackbar and Home One. We already know that Home One requires distance 5. Seeing as every other commander does not have a range limitation, I'm guessing it's the latter. 3) Is this an offensive retrofit, or is this a title? From what we can see of the Independence title, it looks more likely to be that than the "Boosted..." Those are the only two that affect squadrons from what we can see in the "Here They Come" article. 4) Huh? I don't really understand what you mean here.
  20. Except that you can still move a significant chunk of damage even with XI7s. The FAQ clarified that you can still re-direct hits to multiple other hull zones. You just can't move more than one to each. No doubt about it, the MC80 assault cruiser is going to be one tough nut to crack. I'M SO EXCITED!!!
  21. Also, as much as we're bitching about speed 2, the fact that it has a support team instead of a weapons team means you can slap engine techs on this bad boy. Heck even an engineering team or a nav team would be pretty awesome.
  22. It's a perfect anchor to the line, especially with Ackbar. Can you imagine the assault variant with Ackbar and Enchanced Armaments?! It's 7 freaking red dice in your primary arc! God forbid you concentrate fire! That's probably why they didn't give it a gunnery team. That's just not fair. It's a big giant "come at my bro" sign. They essentially force any Imperial list to deal with it or else. That sets you up to have all kinds of shenanigans with the rest of your fleet. Pair it with Assault Frigates and/or MC30s and you've got the broadside fleet from hell.
  23. Looks like double digits for the assault variant. Looks like 98 to me. Called the speed 2 and the squadron 4 on the command variant!
  24. Since I already know everything I want to out of the Rogues and Villians pack (Jan), I'm dying for the MC80. I see it as the most critical to my builds from wave 2 on. I'd bring the MC30s along in a boardside focused build with Ackbar, but I don't see them in a squadron heavy build. The MC80 I see in both, therefore I need the MC80!!!
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