Sounds like you've got the core set, a TIE expansion, and 2 TIE Advanced expansions, then? I forget exactly what comes in each box, but if you can, give this squad a try: Darth Vader, Swarm Tactics (31) Howlrunner, Swarm Tactics (20) Backstabber (16) Tempest Squadron Pilot (21) Academy Pilot (12) Forget the missiles. I'm not anti-missile/torpedo necessarily, but unless you've got some ability to improve their efficiency (like Wedge or Horton), I find that they add a lot of uncertainty to your squad for their point value. In my experience, dropping the missiles and upgrading to Howlrunner and Backstabber will net you the extra dice you would have gotten off the missiles over the course of a game, and you can do it without needing to waste actions on Target Locks for missiles. Howlrunner's ability doesn't affect secondary weapons, so taking named pilots with primary weapon abilities (like Backstabber) over missiles makes Howlrunner that much better. Also, with Howlrunner you afford yourself a second Swarm Tactics, which will bring the Tempest and Academy pilot up to the high end of pilot skill in combat, leaving your lowest at Backstabber with a 6. Swarm Tactics doesn't cost an action, either, which is one of the reasons it's so powerful. A successful strategy for this kind of squad will be to rush the Tempest Squadron and Academy pilot out front, attempting to get in the way of your opponent's movement, causing collisions and denying them their actions. Then, use Swarm Tactics to bring them up to the top of the firing order during combat. Ask Doug (aka Hothie) about this tactic if you want to know more. Make judicious use of Evades to protect your squad. You're only 5 ships; that's light for an Imperial squad, so every point of damage you take is going to hurt badly. Focus fire to the best of your ability, and try to keep everyone in range of Howlrunner (at the very least Vader and Backstabber). Good hunting!

godofcheese said: As soon as you have a Y-wing with an ion cannon, you can't run a 5 ship build - it just won't fit. Hence the lack of anything save 1 droid. Well, that's not entirely true. You absolutely can have an Ion Cannon and a 5 ship build. You can have 2, even. 5x Gold Squadron Pilot, 2x Ion Cannon = 100 points How viable is it? Well, I giggle just thinking about this squad and the term "viable" all in one sentence. I guess the one thing it's got going for it is there's a ton of shields and hull to go through. And I guess you could maybe, in theory, lock down a couple of ships with your Ions and get your other 3 Y-wings into Range 1 position behind them. That's a BIG maybe, though.

I like Maarek, though I prefer Cluster Missiles on him, as the Marksmanship applies to both rolls.

I dunno, I think the "equipping stuff for free" model is a slippery slope. They'd have to reword it a bit if they were going to use it. Something like this: "When equipped with a Pilot Upgrade costing 2 squad points or less, ignore the squad point cost of that Upgrade." The term "free" is a bit too vague. It could be construed to mean that you can ignore any prereqs that an Upgrade card may have (if such things exist in the future). I like the idea of adding Wraith Squadron as pilots; but alas, I think until they've exhausted all movie-related content, we won't see much in the way of EU pilots. I'd like to see some more of Rogue Squadron, though. "Hobbie" Klivian and Wes Janson, at the very least. They're both in the movies. And a generic "Rogue Squadron" pilot card.

Theterrainstudio said: Wedge, R2-F2, Swarm Tactics, Proton Torpedo Garven, R2, Proton Torpedo Dutch, R5-K6, Proton Torpedo Am I to assume the Ion Cannon to bring this list to 98 is missing? Yeah, forgot to type that in. In my head I can't imagine a Y-wing without an Ion Cannon, so… EDIT: Huh, that's weird. No, I see the problem now. I guess I didn't include the Ion in the list when I was piecing this together. I'd drop the Torp on Garven for it. I've run this squad before, but not everyone had Torps, so the points worked out a little differently.

Ugh, FFG forums have been choking on Firefox the past couple of days. Yay for double posts.

If you want to make Wedge truly silly, give this a try: Wedge, R2-F2, Swarm Tactics, Proton Torpedo Garven, R2, Proton Torpedo Dutch, R5-K6, Proton Torpedo 98 points, so chances are you'll have initiative. Dutch feeds Wedge Target Locks, Wedge Swarm Tactics up Garven, who then takes his combat phase before Wedge, feeding Wedge a Focus token. Wedge's Action is now free to R2-F2 every turn to give him some extra survivability. Forego Garven's Focus Action on the first round of combat in favor of getting his own Target Lock and dropping a 3 Torp alpha strike. Or, if you're okay with downgrading Wedge to Luke, you can do this: Luke, R2-F2, Swarm Tactics, Proton Torpedo Garven, R2-D2, Proton Torpedo Dutch, R5-K6, Proton Torpedo Same basic deal, but that extra free point allows you to drop R2-D2 on Garven for a total of 100 points. Luke gets great returns out of R2-F2. Same first-combat alpha strike, followed by good defensive combat. It's less crucial that Luke receive all of the Target Locks and Focuses from Garven and Dutch in this squad, so you've got a little more flexibility at the cost of Wedge's kickass ability.

Theterrainstudio said: Biggs + R5-K6 Wedge + R2-D2 + Proton Torpedo + Squad Leader Dutch +R2-D2 + Proton Torpedo + Ion Cannon Turret Just some thoughts - Biggs moves and chooses Target Lock/Focus as his intial action. Next Dutch moves, and uses the Target Lock Action (because he acquires target lock) he then gives one to Wedge/Biggs. Wedge is last to move, and depending on the situation (best case he has a target lock - and if he has the shots focuses - worse case he has to target/lock himself, however most cases he will have the target lock and would then be able to use squad leader to give Biggs a focus for his target lock, or dutch a focus for his). Great snergy to the list I think. Does require a 1-2 bubble, but with Biggs there he will be soaking up most of the shots round 1 with a potential to unleash and kill 2 ships in return with the two PT shots. Thoughts? You can't use R2-D2 twice (and even if you could, your squad would be 102 points). If you're going to put R5-K6 on anyone, put it on Dutch. His ability will activate off of it. I've never liked Squad Leader on Wedge. Wedge is typically the one you wanting getting as many Actions or Action-equivalents as possible; he shouldn't be giving his Action away to other pilots. R2-F2 is crazy good on Biggs. His life expectancy goes up dramatically. If you're dead set on using R2-D2, it works alright on him, but R2 can't keep up with the pounding he's going to take, not to mention the restriction to your movement to get those shields back.

ziggy2000 said: Tawnos said: That's 104 points. Try dropping Dutch for a second Rookie and give R2-F2 to Biggs. If you're dead set on having a Y-wing, try a Gold Squadron with an Ion Cannon and drop Wedge down to Luke, and then a Rookie and Biggs with R2-F2. In what universe? Unless I'm missing something (which is entirely possible) the three builds mentioned are 77, 80 and 96 points respectively, That's with no upgrades. Where did 104 come from? Personally I'd try to get 2 Y-wings in the mix - Biggs, Dutch, Rookie and Gold. The OP has been edited. Originally it was just one squad: Wedge, Biggs, Rookie, and Dutch with a R5 and Ion.

That's 104 points. Try dropping Dutch for a second Rookie and give R2-F2 to Biggs. If you're dead set on having a Y-wing, try a Gold Squadron with an Ion Cannon and drop Wedge down to Luke, and then a Rookie and Biggs with R2-F2.

magadizer said: Do not spread them out. This is only partially true. It's okay to create 2 or 3 groups of TIEs and split them up. It forces your enemy to make difficult choices. Do they likewise split up and fight a multiple front battle (a significant synergy disadvantage for Rebels; especially those running Biggs) or let one of your groups slip behind them? Of course, you don't want to have 8 TIES out there each doing their own thing. They'll get picked off too easily.

Hmm. I need to stop trying to quote these things from memory. I think I'm mashing up two of my squads. Either way, you get the idea. Howlrunner/Squad Leader and Maarek/Cluster Missiles/Marksmanship is the core of this squad. The rest is filler.

Thanks to their over-sized bases, these ships get much better distance returns out of the movement templates. Consider where the front of your ship is at the start of your movement to where it is at the end. Because X-wing uses a "front edge to back edge" alignment for movement, this means that large ships get more effective movement. That makes me think that, in terms of raw speed, getting the Boost action onto a YT-1300 would easily yield the fastest ship in the game, validating Han's boasting about his beloved Falcon. That Engine Upgrade card is looking better and better.

Okay, to be fair, you may be right with respects to how the TIE Bomber was portrayed in Rogue Squadron; it's been so long that I don't remember. But in that case, the game portrayed them inaccurately.

poloniumandrats said: I know, and I remember from the rogue squadron series of games that it had no lasers, only bombs and missiles You remember incorrectly. TIE Bombers had a pair of laser cannons.

If you're going to play Maarek, you have to build to maximize his ability's effectiveness. Give this a try sometime: Maarek Steele, Cluster Missiles, Marksmanship Howlrunner, Squad Leader Mauler Mithel (2 point Upgrade option) Backstabber Winged Gundark Or you can drop Mauler, Backstabber, and Winger for 4 Academy/Obsidian pilots. I like the named TIEs better in this case because Howlrunner makes them incredibly effective. In this setup, you'll use Marksmanship and Howlrunner rerolls to get Marrek enough crits to make his ability really shine (especially off those Cluster Missiles).

Theterrainstudio said: Taking into all what you have said about, why people will or will not shoot Wedge/Luke first. Thoughts about a power house set-up Wedge - marksmanship - R2D2 Luke - squad leader - protons - R5K6 Dutch - ion cannon This issue I see with this squad is that Luke's only valid target for Squad Leader is Dutch. And given the R2-D2 on Wedge and, well…Luke, in my mind that makes Dutch a tasty 30-point priority. And with no one to defend him, Dutch won't last long against a TIE swarm or Rebel torpedo barrage.

My favorite lists thus far are as follows: Rebel, 4 ship Biggs, R2-F2 Wedge Rookie x2 Imperial TIE All-stars, (Squad Leader on Howlrunner, Determination on Mauler)

DrUnK3n_PaNdA said: Howlrunner was already really overcosted at 18 points. She was only worth it in the first few turns' approach, and after that she'd basically let you reroll maybe one die or so a turn, which is not nearly as good as an extra attack die on Mauler or Backstabber for 1 or 2 points less respectively. So if you don't get your points out of her flying in formation in the first two turns, you won't get your points out of her for the rest of the game. I suspect you may not be playing Howlrunner correctly, then. It's not difficult to keep her in Range 1 of the majority of your swarm. Doug did it very well. I like her with Squad Leader, as I tend to keep her behind the rest of my formation and rely less on her personally attack roll then her reroll ability. I know other people (like Doug) use Swarm Tactics on her to great effect. As for the Assault Missiles, I'm not going to pass judgment until I've had a chance to play around with them. But in general, I'm all for anything that forces people to come up with new ways to modify old strategies to keep them viable. TIE Swarm's strength lies in its sheer overwhelming number of attacks, total defense, and the amount of hull it brings to the party. Assault Missiles has removed none of that; they just force you to fly a bit differently. Splitting your swarm up isn't necessarily a bad strategy. It forces your opponent to likewise split their force (which is a distinct advantage for TIE Swarm), or allow a portion of your squad to slip in behind them. Keeping your TIE grouped up may make it easier to focus fire, but it also guarantees your opponent a target rich environment. Personally, I'd rather split them up a bit.

Well, technically those "sonic charges" from Episode 2 were mines. I meant that I hated fighting the TIE Phantoms. That game was hard as hell.

No, no TIE Phantoms. I hated those damned things. The Firespray is going to have mines. I wouldn't be surprised if we saw some EU ships eventually, but not before they run out of movie ships to use. Hopefully we'll just skip right over the prequel ships.

Surtur said: This makes me hopeful that I'll see stuff from the old video game Tie Fighter. You mean like Maarek Steele?

If I had to pose a wild guess, I'd say that Wave 3 would look something like this: B-wing (Rebel) TIE Bomber (Imperial) Lambda-class Shuttle (Both) Yep, I'm putting my money on there being a ship that both factions get to play, with unique pilots for each side.

Again, this discussion wasn't meant to be about the point values of Total vs. Modified Victory, but rather the frequency with which the different factions seem to achieve Modified vs. Total Victory. For whatever reason, the discussion keeps getting dragged back over to the point values. I don't really feel that the specific point values are necessarily that important to this discussion, except to say that a Total Victory is (by necessity) worth more than a Modified Victory.

That may be. I don't know if it's come up yet. That does alleviate some concerns with it. So far, my observation is that a Modified Victory is like a half win. It generally only really qualifies you for Top 4 if you get another win to go with it, otherwise it's not really better than a loss. Two Modified Victories is only 1 point better than a Total Victory and a defeat, and you really need a Total Victory to go with them to have a shot at Top 4. But, like you said, my observation has been about factions and their respective likelihood of getting a Modified vs. Total Victory, not necessarily whether the exact point values are good or bad. That seems a separate (but related) discussion.