Tawnos
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Posts posted by Tawnos
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It's generally accepted that the term "immediately" is mechanically irrelevant, using the FAQ ruling on the Vader upgrade as precedent that you can trigger effects between Gunner attacks. I don't think FCS/Gunner necessarily needs an explicit entry in the FAQ (especially since Vader and FCS use the exact same wording), though a generalization about Gunner would definitely put this issue to bed.
I've experimented with Recon Specialist and found that Gunner tends to be more effective, mostly because of the action economy it buys you. If you feel like if you need the defense, the Firespray still has Evade, which it can still use in conjunction with Gunner. And if I'm working out the math right, a ship with 2 Agility suffering two attacks will, on average, roll the same number of Evades (2.5, by my count) with 2 Focus tokens (one for each attack) as it will with a single Evade token and a naked defense roll (can anyone else crunch the numbers and back me up on that?).
It's possible that Focus gains an edge on Range 3 defense rolls, but those represent the minority of attacks in most games.
And in general, firepower trumps defense, especially in timed rounds.
As for Rebel Captive, that's something I intend to experiment with once the Rebel Transport is released and stress removal is a much bigger deal. But for the moment, while I don't deny it's a good upgrade, I'd think I'd rather have the Gunner.
@Hrathen: Yeah, I know where you're coming from with regards to the bombs. It definitely takes good predictions to lay them correctly with low PS pilots. But, sometimes just the threat of the bomb is worth 2 points.
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Here's what I'm probably running for the foreseeable future:
- OGP + FCS + Gunner + EU
- BH + Gunner + Seismic
- Backstabber
- Academy
Flown it a few times now, and while I've toyed with minor variations in the small ships, the Buzzsaw + Bounty Gunner that forms the core is solid. I like Backstabber as a wild card option; he's a pain in the butt that you can't afford to ignore, or he gets behind you and starts wrecking backsides.
Thoughts?
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I like it. Though, with stress being such a big deal in Rebel Transport, cards like Opportunist can be risky. I think I might like:
Hobbie, R2-D6, Opportunist
That way you can shed the Opportunist stress a little easier. Plus it frees up a few points. Still, it's hard to turn down Wedge's punching power.
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After reading the info on the Rebel Transport cards, some new ideas started banging around in my head.
- Wes Janson - 29
- Push the Limit - 3
- R2 Astromech - 1
- Flechette Torpedo - 2
- Ibtisam - 28
- Opportunist - 4
- Fire Control System - 2
- Flechette Torpedo - 2
- "Hobbie" Klivian - 25
- R3-A2 - 2
- Flechette Torpedo - 2
100 points.
I'm not typically a Rebel player, and I know that 3 ship squads are taboo these days, but the synergy between Wes and Opportunist is hard to deny.
I think this squad has some flexibility, too, without losing its core concept. For instance, you can save some points by dropping Ibtisam down to a Red Squadron Pilot with R2-D6, at the cost of the B-wing niceties.
You can also replace Hobbie with Biggs straight up if you're worried about Wes and Ibtisam's survivability in the early rounds.
- Wes Janson - 29
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Well, there's your "never before seen manuever". Red 1 turn.
You haven't seen the B-Wing dial?
Oh, yeah....B-wings. Forgot about those. Being a strictly Imperial player, B-wings usually die so fast I never see much of their dial.
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Well, there's your "never before seen manuever". Red 1 turn.
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If I were going to run multiple shuttles, I might go for something like this:
- OGP, FCS, Gunner, EU
- OGP, FCS, Gunner, EU
- OGP, Vader
- Academy
The Buzzsaws strip the shields fast, the Doom shuttle drops some sick crits on them, and the Academy pilot gets out front and does what he does best: be an action-denying pest. And probably die horribly and quickly.
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So let me get this straight. You want me to destroy these Gungan Soul Prisons, thus releasing their gibbering, eternal essences back into the material realm?
The only way to win is not to play.
Revanchist and Nyxen reacted to this -
Yub, yub, Aaron. Yub, yub.
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I just get fed by people calling a ship useless without it being useless. You are absolutely right EltNot, the Tie advance isnt meant as an every situation versatile ship.
lets even out the points a little.
Tie advance+missle vs 2 academy pilots 25 vs 24 points.
The tie advance has ps advantage,
Debatable. High PS does not automatically equal advantage. One of the crowning features of the Academy Pilot is their ability to move first and destroy your opponent's action economy.
and can barrel rollout of arcs when needed.
So can the TIE/lns.
so lets look at a scenario where the Tie advance vs the fighters fight each other dealing the absolute worst luck to each other. ties at range 3, tie advance blows up tie fighter. last tie fighter deals 2 crits to tie advance, but is absorbed by sheilds. ships get in range 1, pilot skill 2 vs pilot skill 1. tie advance has the first shot. You can drum up 100 different scenarios.
I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here. You can't look at a "worst-case scenario" to the exclusion of all other potential outcomes and then draw a conclusion. Also, all you're really proving here is that a missile has the potential to one-shot a TIE/ln. Which isn't really a proof that needs stating; we're all aware it's possible. Unlikely, but possible. Either way, it has nothing to do with the TIE Advanced.
One of the best games Ive witnessed was a newby flying 4 tie advances armed with concussion missiles destroy an experienced 8 tie fighter swarm.
One outcome does not indicate a trend.
There have been hundreds of games that people have analyzed and compared their data. No amount of hyperbole, supposition, or speculation can overturn the overwhelming amount of playtest data supporting the conclusion that the TIE Advanced falls short as a ship, with the potential exception of Darth Vader due to the extraordinary nature of his built-in.
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Soontir, like all interceptors, live and die by the dice.
I don't necessarily agree with this. The majority of an Interceptor's survivability is in its ability to maneuver out of firing arcs. It takes a skilled player to fly an Interceptor effectively; they're too much of a point investment to fly them head-to-head against the opponent.
Fel is particularly good at finding holes in firing arcs and still hitting hard in the process. And for those squads with 360 degree arcs, the best thing you can do is hang out at Range 3.
But all it takes is one shot and that's that. Yes, they're designed to flank and stay out of arcs, but the reality is that it's a rare match where they're never shot at. End game Soontir should be able to avoid 1-2 arcs without any real challenge, but when the opponent blankets the playfield in the first few rounds, he will get shot. And in that case, he'll want to keep a R3 behind an asteroid... but it's mighty hard to stay 100% out of arc. If you were confident in that ability, then spending 3 points on stealth is a waste and it should go elsewhere.
Maneuvering out of arcs isn't an "all or nothing" prospect; you don't have to stay out of 100% of arcs all the time for an Interceptor to be worthwhile. In fact, I think it's a bit foolish to assume that any Interceptor, even Fel, can avoid all firing arcs for an entire game. But Interceptors, in general, are better at slipping out of arcs than any other Imperial ship to date, and the majority of their defensive capability lay in that maneuverability.
That being said, I agree with your assessment that the 3 points on a SD is better spent elsewhere (or not at all).
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Soontir, like all interceptors, live and die by the dice.
I don't necessarily agree with this. The majority of an Interceptor's survivability is in its ability to maneuver out of firing arcs. It takes a skilled player to fly an Interceptor effectively; they're too much of a point investment to fly them head-to-head against the opponent.
Fel is particularly good at finding holes in firing arcs and still hitting hard in the process. And for those squads with 360 degree arcs, the best thing you can do is hang out at Range 3.
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Be sure to bring cash, though.
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Man, I'm having a hard time remembering. I played in the Inaugural tourney at GenCon 2012, and I think it was something like this:
- Darth Vader, Expert Handling, Concussion Missiles
- Maarek Steele, Marksmanship
- Tempest Squadron Pilot
- Mauler Mithel, Determination
I finished 5th, just missed Top 4 on tie breakers. And yes, I'm aware this squad is crap. Remember, the game had just been released the previous day, and I'd played it a grand total of once before that during a FF beta test.
The_Brown_Bomber reacted to this -
- Howlrunner + Determination
- Carnor Jax
- Mauler Mithel
- Winged Gundark
- Fel's Wrath
Wooooo, we love Range 1!
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Like determintion? That card is such a waste of points.
Oh, I don't think so. The damage deck has 8 Pilot trait cards in it, and there are precious few ways to ignore/discard damage in this game; fewer still that don't require an action. For 1 point, Determination's a good pick. I routinely see Howlrunners running Determination with that last squad point, and for the number of times I've seen it discard what would have otherwise been death for Our Lady of the Rerolls, it's well worth a point.
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One other thing to consider:
Fun vs. competitive aside (which, by the way, do not have to be mutually exclusive)...if this is your first tournament, I'd recommend you focus more on the tournament itself and less on the squad you're playing. By which I mean, play whatever squad you're most comfortable with, and focus on flying it in a tournament setting.
When playing with a time limit, you might find yourself adopting new tactics out of necessity, and it would be best to minimize the variables involved by holding your squad constant to something with which you're practiced and familiar.
DraconPyrothayan reacted to this -
The loss of total squad hull and attack value isn't worth 12 points of SD, in my opinion. The endgame point squad point difference should, on average, easily be in favor of more total victories with the extra AP over 4x SD. I have no hard data to back that up, other than to say that some of the best placing squads in major tourneys have always fielded more ships over more upgrades. Also, more firepower tends to yield less games going to time in the first place.
That being said, I say give it a go. I find SDs unreliable at best, especially once multiple enemy firing arcs have you bracketed; but maybe it could work out.
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The first list is clearly superior in my mind. If you run the A-wings, they're more than likely going to end up separated from Wedge and Biggs to utilize their greater manueverability, which devalues Bigg's ability a bit. Plus the loss of firepower and hull is tough to swallow.
Plus, I know from experience that Wedge, Biggs, 2x Rookie is a competitive list.
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You'd be better off dropping all those Stealth Devices and just running an extra AP.
berusplants and DraconPyrothayan reacted to this -
His built-in gives him a focus token when he receives a stress token. That isn't an action; you can have any number of focus tokens . You just can't take the Focus action more than once per turn.
That One Guy reacted to this -
I agree with Tawnos in a way. I agree that Dark Curse is unlikely to be attacked because of his annoying ability. As such, Stealth Device isn't that valuable on him. However, this is precisely why I think you shoudl take Dark Curse. Yeah, he may not be shot at until the end, but that means the entire game he is hounding your enemies, doing a point of damage here and there. For 16 points, that's a great deal.
I have the same concern. I'm looking at fielding a black squadron force, and the other two Black Squadron pilots - Backstabber and Mithel - instantly rate more attention due to their ability to rack up extra attack dice. Expose or Opportunist generic pilots the same.
I had a couple of games with basic TIEs versus X-wings last night and it underscored how little firepower a TIE seems to have; 2 attack v 2 defence is nowhere near as nasty as 3 attack v 3 defence, especially since a bonus defence die for any reason is proportionately a much bigger deal.
I dunno. I will be getting Royal Guard but at the same time I really want to master using a pure elite TIE fighter force (without resorting to "Howlrunner" and a shedload of academy pilots).
That said, there is some value to a pilot that people don't even bother shooting at because he's too hard a target for his cost.
Honestly, I don't think there's much difference between DC dying last as opposed to any other cheaper TIE/ln. Both have the same capacity to do a point of damage here or there until the game winds down. You just pay more for the privelege on DC, and it makes it easy for your opponent to decide where to focus their efforts early on.
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The problem with Dark Curse is that he can't make himself an offensive threat to leverage his defensive capabilities. If he's never shot at, then his ability is wasted points. DC with a Stealth Device is almost pointless. He just ends up being the last to die, nothing more.
The most effective defensive abilities are on those ships that have the capability to make themselves offensive threats and force a tough choice on your opponent. Purely defensive ships get ignored. Purely offensive ships get sploded. The smart money is on something in between.
Night Beast certainly can have his moments, but he has to make the choice between effectiveness and predictability, as the TIE/ln doesn't have all that many green manuevers. Now, if we could get him into an Interceptor, that'd be a whole other story...
Major Rhymer's empty EPT slot makes me twitch a little. Can't even make room for an AR, or maybe Determination?
I'll admit to having done very little testing with Proton Bombs. Bombs are usually something I add to fill the last few points in my squads, and I don't usually have 5 points to devote to them.
Not much to say about Soontir and PTL that hasn't already been said. It's expensive, but if you can keep him safe, he's a beast.
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How about a Scimitar Squadron Pilot and make it 5 ships?
If not, I'd go:
2x Tempest Squad /w Stealth Device
1x Tempest Squad /w Assault Missiles
1x Tempest Squad /w Homing Missiles
In theory, the Stealthed up pilots can block for the ones with missiles and give them the turn they need to get their TLs.
Probable Store Championship Squad
in X-Wing
Posted
@Englishpete: Hmm, that's an interesting thought. I've flown the shuttle with Adv. Sensors exactly once, and while I liked its maneuverability, I found that I was still mostly using its actions to get the thing aligned/turned around. Is that extra maneuverability worth the loss of free Target Locks? What's been your experience with that?
@Khyros: It's not that complicated at all. If you use one of your Recon Focus tokens on offense, then Evade emerges as the clearly superior defensive option. It's only when you have 2 Focus tokens that it draws even with an Evade token for 2 attacks. Any attacks beyond that are irrelevant, since the averages factor in the expenditure of all tokens in the first two attacks. Yes, it's possible that they may still be around for subsequent attacks given good rolls early on, but such scenarios are irrelevant when calculating averages; from a pure math standpoint, it doesn't matter when you spend the tokens, they still yield the same average Evades.