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tapierscheisse

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  1. I would suggest something like that: … Lastly the unit may Move out of Formation miniatures, as detailed on p 32 to regain Unit coherency. that would be more to the Intention of the rule.
  2. Forget about the 5". It's bull. You have to stay within 6" of your leader and that's it.
  3. It’s always good to reread your rules Book, after you have a little bit of experience. A friend of mine found this little gem: Regroup The ordered unit removes all of its Suppression and Reaction markers (see “Reaction Markers” on page 35 and “Suppression Markers” on page 46). It may then have new Unit Leader designated. Lastly, every miniature that is not the Unit Leader may move up to 6”, following normal movement rules. Let’s analyse this order - Remove Suppression & Reaction marker - designate new Leader - Move every non Leader Miniature 6” The last sentence is what really makes that order shine It effectively makes the Regroup order a Blitzkrieg order, leaving the unit Leader behind. I guess this was not what the authors had in mind, but you can use this order to effectively move your unit 5” towards your enemy. Why 5”? Because, if you are not within 6” if your leader (which is 5” apart”) you have to regroup in the Unit phase and thus go back until you are in Command Range. True or did I miss something? Is Regroup the rich man’s version of Blitzkrieg? FAQ this one if I am correct, because it seriously breaks the game!
  4. p44: "…Because of this, vehicles do not suffer suppression like Soldier units do." p48: vehicles and suppression Vehicles cannot gain Suppression markers. Instead, when a vehicle is attacked, it may suffer other negative effects (see “Vehicle Damage Table” on page 44). If a situation arises in which a Suppression marker is to be placed on a Vehicle unit, it is ignored. I think this should clarify the question.
  5. Shadow4ce said: I respectfully disagree and think you are over analyzing it. Yes I did, see my last post ;-) Shadow4ce said: Re: Timing in your examples above, the first two happen at the end of movement, so there is a conflict there. I'd say the resolution order, absent specific rules, is up to the active player. The third example says at the end of its action, so that us obviously last. "End of its Action": please enter the action used: = "End of his Move Action", So they are all equal. Shadow4ce said: Now, your whole argument of not giving a Reaction Marker on the Army if One order, while well thought out, is made wrong by your own example that I should have considered earlier; namely the BlItzkrieg Order. Both orders involve a Move Action, which is the very definition of Take Action. Only one of these has additional text telling us to not place a Reaction Marker. An Army of One must therefore cause one to be placed. I've explained it clearly and feel you are just looking for a loophole advantage. I guess when you wrote this, when my last post was not yet online. I'll just repeat that one: 1/3 of the orders refer to the "Take Action" Order, 1/2 does not even mention reaction markers. If you want to see a clear trend, here it is. Reaction is not necessary for Orders. In 50% of the time it isn't even worth mentioning. (50% is not an accident, it is the norm) Shadow4ce said: As far as the other orders go, I think absent text otherwise, any order which involves an action by the unit receiving the order, requires a Reaction Marker, as it is in keeping with the stated purpose of the rule. (I'll quote the rule later, when I can look it up - I've got to go arrest somebody right now). Happy arresting ;-) I am sorry for the telegraph style answer, but as you said, and as I said in my last post, I am overanalyzing stuff. If I don't analyze and just follow the rules, I have the best chance of playing the game as intended. I cannot second guess why the authors entered the reference to the "take action" order, and I still think that they might have simply forgotten the reference in the "An Army of One" order, but I will never know unless Andy gives me a call. Both authors have left FFG (I heard that rumour, but I am nnot sure, please correct me), so probably no one will ever know. I will make it simple for me and the players around me by stop interpreting and trying to find out what the intention behind the rule might have been. I will just play the rules as they are in the book. And the book does not mention a reaction marker, so I will not read one into it. Unless there is a FAQ of course.
  6. I think the whole dilemma comes from over interpreting the rules. If you just stick to the rules, things are quite simple: there is no mentioning of gaining a reaction marker, so you don’t gain one. The reference in two of the six (33%) orders to the “Take Action” order are a nice addition, but as three out of six (50%) of the rules don’t mention anything about a reaction marker at all, and ther is no general rule for awarding reactin markers, we can safely assume, that this is the norm and reaction markers are therefore not awarded. By sticking to that simple way of playing the rules as they are presented in the book and not going into how they might or might not be intended, which we will never know, the orders make perfect sense and no problem ever arises.
  7. I’ve done some further pondering about the rule: What happens if said hero walks through some barbed wire before joining a new unit? P70: “…the unit suffers a S/1 attack once the movement has been resolved” P90: “…At the end of his Move action, the Hero may choose to take charge of another unit that he could normally join.” P30: “…When a unit is given a Take Action Order, it gains a Reaction marker at the end of its action” When are things resolved and in what order. Are they simultaneously? Do you join first and then resolve the rest, as Shadow4ce implied? This would result in a 6 Dice of damage (Infantry 2) to the whole Unit instead of 1 Dice to the hero. You would of course circumvent the difficult question of how a reaction marker due to the Order “An Army of One” is treated. But is the result satisfactory? Or even realistic? I think the Order leaves a lot of questions open and I really hope for a clarification in the near future, as it is a real asset to the allied forces. In the meantime I would rather not give it a reaction marker, as there is no rule in the book, telling us, that orders entail a reaction marker per se. The references to the “Take Action” Order within the special orders might indicate a system behind allocating reaction markers, but I don’t see it and there is no obvious pattern here, even though “Blitzkrieg” might indicate it. Yet another question arises from the mix of model and unit that comes from this rule: Is the original unit able to get an order and you split the hero afterwards? Effectively giving him two orders? Should the Order give you any advantages, either one has to be right. Otherwise it would be close to useless. I could imagine using it every other game, while I use every other special Order as often as I can spare the points. So balance wise I am rather set on - No reaction marker for the Unit OR - May be issued to a Hero in a unit which already received an Order
  8. Wow, at first let me thank you for your very detailed answer. Great work, I appreciate this. I especially liked the part on when a reaction marker is gained when using a “Take Action” Order. Missed that. You are correct with a single exception: Special actions are not special orders and thus your “Take Action” reference is flawed. You yourself mentioned that this might get a problem. Special Actions are things like reload ore disembark. Special Orders as detailed on p. 30: “Two basic Orders are available—”Take Action” and “Regroup,” but some units will make additional special Orders available“ So a special Order is not a special action. Else one could use them in the Unit phase as any other action, which you can obviously not. And following that logic (and the RAW) special Orders are not a „Take Action“ Order. But why did the writers insert the reference to the “Take action” Order in the first place? I reread every single special Order in the book: - fire for effect!¬: The unit receives a Reaction Marker. Then roll a single Combat Die,.. o Attack action o No Reference o Gains Reaction marker, but at the wrong time - smoke screen: This Order is not a “Take Action” Order and does not add a Reaction marker to the Command Section. o Neither Attack nor Move Action o Reference o Does not gain reaction marker - BlitzKrieg!: The unit does not gain a Reaction marker when given a “Blitzkrieg!” Order like it would when given a “Take Action” Order. o Move action o Reference o Does not gain reaction marker - taKe charge: Every unit within 12” that has not been given an Order already during the Command phase immediately receives a Regroup Order. o A very high form of the “Regroup” Order o No reference o Nothing on reaction markers (Another good rule Question here, will bring that up in the future) - wiederbelebungsserum failsafe: o again no refernce to markers Actually I cannot see a pattern here. I had the same ideas as you did concerning the “Take Action” Orders, but it just does not fit. Assuming “Regroup” and many special Orders have no reference at all to gaining a reaction marker, you only get a marker if the rules explicitly say so. But, I am still not sure, so keep on coming, perhaps we might find a solution. I am keen on getting all rules straight, because I am going to organize a tournament and only an airtight ruleset will survive in this surrounding. Hopefully FFG will come with a FAQ soon.
  9. oh, and I almost forgot: "..if being precise, is one cannot join a hero to a unit you already issued an order to this command phase. " There is absolutely nothing in the rules which might support this. At least of what I know. The newly joined unit can not get another order, because you can only receive an order once per Command Phase. Should the unit get another Order, the heroe inside it would have gotten two orders in this command phase, which is illegal. If rest of the unit got an order before the joining, every model in the unit had had an order, which is totally OK with the rules. Although… the rule mixes unit rules with individual model rules, which is not consistent with the rest of the rulebook and thus leads to my problem with the Order.
  10. Shadow4ce, normally you are right, so I should not argue :-) I'll do so anyway. I agree with you 80%. Just one little thing bothers me: "The Hero then takes a Move Action (Which is why the hero a gains a Reaction Marker - its a Move Action issued as an order in the Command Phase)." Please quote the corresponding rule, because it is not known to me. I explicitly named the "Take Action" order, which I would normally take as a reference and I also detailed the problems this would arise in the context. I feel that you might be right, but there is a lot of totally unexplored (Rule) territory resulting from that ruling. Like your last point "The joined unit may not be issued an order in this Command Phase (it's new leader has a Reaction Marker from the Move Action). " How do you merge markers? You make a good assumption, but as the order - An Army of One - explicitly states what to do with the markes on the original unit it lacks to tell us anything about the new reaction marker and how it is handled by the newly joined unit. Did they forget, or was there no need to tell, because there is no reaction marker involved? Your guess is a s good as anyones.
  11. I am very aware of the fact, that heroes can be issued orders, if they are on their own. I was referring to a scenario, where our hero is part of the unit. Than he is not a unit by himself, but an individual model in the unit. The reference to the "Take Action" order is due to the fact, that many special orders refer to the "Take Action" order to tell us, that you either get or get not a reaction marker, thus my reference. It was just to help you guys grasping the whole problem. But thanks for the answer anyway. I might have been a little unprecise. English is not my motherlanguage. However, I would love if you could wrap your mind on the main problem: Does the hero or the unit he joins get a reaction marker? I think this is not explicit in the rules. He might, he might not. I think he doesn't, but I play Allies and thus am a little prejudiced.
  12. Hi, I think this one is tricky, but I know we have got some guys here who know their rules by heart. Question is: does a Hero and the unit he might join in the process get a reaction marker for receiving the" an army of one" order? Here are the rules I found to this one: p90, An Army of One: "…The Hero immediately takes a Move action. If the Hero was with a unit, he leaves it. All Suppression and Reaction markers stay with that unit. That unit does not count as being issued an Order. At the end of his Move action, the Hero may choose to take charge of another unit that he could normally join. The new unit must have at least one miniature within 6” of the Hero. If the unit is retreating, it immediately stops retreating. The Hero becomes the unit’s new Unit Leader. The joined unit may not be issued an Order during this Command Phase." Generally, every orders explicitly states wether or not you get a reaction for it. Every single one, but this. One might argue it's a kind of a "Take action" Order and thus you might gain one. BUT, imagine this: our heroe starts in a unit and is issued the order. Well, he can't be issued a "Take action" Order, because a "Take action" Order can only be issued to UNITS, not individual models inside a unit. So it cannot really be a "Take action" Order. Also, if the Order is directed at the original Unit, which contained the hero, that Unit would receive the reaction marker. And as stated in the Order, all markers remain by the unit. So it would seem very unfair to give an individual heroe who was issued this order a reaction marker, if he wouldn't have one if he started inside a unit. Additionally, what happes to this marker, as he joins the new unit? There are no rules known to me for that case, so we had to improvise even more. On the other hand, the joined unit can not be issued an additional order. And what about the origianl unit? Can it still be issued another order? Very confusing. To me it seems, there is no reaction marker awarded for the order. As far as I see it, the "An Army of One" Order is kind of a "Blitzkrieg" Order for Allied heroes. But I am very unsure, as it would leave open a alot of shenanigans for allied forces. Should the hero get a reation marker for that order and if so, how should the unit be treated, if he joins afterwards? What do you think?
  13. Hi, another question was raised during last evenings game. P. 54 CARRY CAPACITY: "… To Disembark, the unit is placed, so that every miniature is within 3" of the TRANSPORT…" When it comes to range and Line of Sight (P 48) " Heavy Walkers treat their hull as the miniature's base. The hull includes the weapon mountings, legs, feet, and the central body. It does not include the barrels of weapons…." Rules as written, this means, I can disembark from a heavy walker within 3" of the barrels. giving me a huge advantage after an Air Drop (within flamer range, especailly with the large barrelled punisher). Rules as intended: Disembarking untis must be places within 3" of the BASE. Do I see this right, or am I missing something?
  14. There is nothing preventing you from targeting the medics Unit with the Heal action.
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